Knicks haven't had a truly great PG since Michael Ray Richardson.
PhilinLA wrote:Knicks haven't had a truly great PG since Michael Ray Richardson.
We need to drop scoop of coke in Bakers Gatorade bottle
PhilinLA wrote:Knicks haven't had a truly great PG since Michael Ray Richardson.
J.Kidd was the biggest reason we won 54 games 4/5 years ago.
He was what was left of a great point guard. Had we had him earlier, many things would have been different.
What will they do?
Likely overspend in FA and/or the draft in assets to overpay for help.
What should they do?
Like the better run teams, they should accept PG is a low positional value slot and mine deep in UDFA and the back end of the 2nd round and see if they can unearth an Ish Smith type. Not going to set the world on fire, but can help a team for a fraction of the cost of a name brand player on the decline.
Can you get 75 percent of the production at 15 percent of the total cost?
Well run teams can do this, poorly run teams cannot.
PG help can be found all over the draft board, all over FA and all over UDFA. I'm not saying its simple, but the low positional value means ANY TEAM can mine this resource. Any team could have had Patrick Beverley. Or Ish Smith. Or even Robert Covington. Or even Isiah Thomas 2.
Cheeks, Harper, Rivers, Baron Davis.......all great, just past prime!!! Way past.
Knicks seek help, but that does not add to the foundation. Drafting the best player available does, and if its a pg, so be it.
With many guards in the draft, those on the free agent route this year might not have a banner salary year. Teague and Hill are nice players, but not big money guys.
What will knicks do? I hope have Melo solved by draft time. That would help.
Point guards rarely stay on the same team. Tony Parker is rare. Even Chris Paul has changed adresses a few times.
And why are we forgetting Mark Jackson, Rod Strickland, Mo Cheeks, Billups, Marbury.... we've had plenty of point guards come through. Problem is we've had bad teams and even worse management behind them.
Too much focus is on the point guard. We haven't had a good one since Raymond Felton. That was only a couple seasons ago. We're rebuilding. We need and we will probavly get new everything. We have to accumulate enough assets to to put us in position to make moves if need be. Everybody be cool
Well, my thought is that there's a high probability that the Knicks will acquire veteran PG.
That may be Rubio, or a Euro, or someone who is underperforming/undervalued somewhere who comes back in trade.
If that's the case, with Baker and Randle already in tow, I expect a second round PG pick or an undrafted, say - Kadeem Allen, Monte Morris.
This also opens the door for getting a SG or Big at 8.
The other alternative is drafting Frankie at 8 and looking for two-way prospects further down the mid-draft and trading for them.
They should have some idea how Holiday is leaning. If he's likely out the door, Monk at 8 and the first scenario is very likely.
Give me Frank Mason at PG. He's the same height as Lillard, CP3, Kemba, Conley. Probably stronger than all of them. Plus he's an elite 3 point shooter, better than all the rest, with a great vertical leap and a great motor. I'd grab him with our second pick and take the actual BPA at pick #8, even if its a big. And he's perfect for our system.
reub wrote:Give me Frank Mason at PG. He's the same height as Lillard, CP3, Kemba, Conley. Probably stronger than all of them. Plus he's an elite 3 point shooter, better than all the rest, with a great vertical leap and a great motor. I'd grab him with our second pick and take the actual BPA at pick #8, even if its a big. And he's perfect for our system.
More or less my position as well. I think there's Tony Parker quality players in the second round rather than picking a high-pressure PG pick at 8.
fwk00 wrote:reub wrote:Give me Frank Mason at PG. He's the same height as Lillard, CP3, Kemba, Conley. Probably stronger than all of them. Plus he's an elite 3 point shooter, better than all the rest, with a great vertical leap and a great motor. I'd grab him with our second pick and take the actual BPA at pick #8, even if its a big. And he's perfect for our system.
More or less my position as well. I think there's Tony Parker quality players in the second round rather than picking a high-pressure PG pick at 8.
I could see him starting for us as early as next season too. He shot 47% from three, has a 41 inch vertical leap, and is built like a tank. Plus he plays hard defense.
I'm a Monte Morris fan but I get the Mason admiration as well.
fwk00 wrote:I'm a Monte Morris fan but I get the Mason admiration as well.
Will he still be there at pick #44? He might be because of his age. He's 23.
I would be happy with baker if we get isaac
newyorker4ever wrote:PhilinLA wrote:Knicks haven't had a truly great PG since Michael Ray Richardson.
J.Kidd was the biggest reason we won 54 games 4/5 years ago.
J Kidd was a 3&D SG when he played for us. He brought a ton of intangibles and clutchness (until playoffs)though. He was more of a Manu Ginobli at that point in his career.
EnySpree wrote:Point guards rarely stay on the same team. Tony Parker is rare. Even Chris Paul has changed adresses a few times. And why are we forgetting Mark Jackson, Rod Strickland, Mo Cheeks, Billups, Marbury.... we've had plenty of point guards come through. Problem is we've had bad teams and even worse management behind them.
Too much focus is on the point guard. We haven't had a good one since Raymond Felton. That was only a couple seasons ago. We're rebuilding. We need and we will probavly get new everything. We have to accumulate enough assets to to put us in position to make moves if need be. Everybody be cool
Parker routinely took less money than market vakue and somewhat of a reduced role. Probably didn't want to get exposed as a franchise player. He was almost moves for J Kidd though and when Hill came on in the playoffs Parker was almost moved then as well but they choose to move Hill instead. Duncan I believe saved him those times.
Monte Morris sounds like and idea prospect for us as well. I know we worked him out. His scouting report seems like exactly what we need at the PG position.
So in the case Minny decides to trade out for a veteran feeling they want some win now help and another team looking for a PG or big man takes their spot allowing Isaac to fall to 8. Then I would be ecstatic landing Isaac and Morris.
Another scenario I would be fond of is doing a draft day deal with Kings. Swapping 8 for 10. This can allow the Kings to take Smith at 5 and still have the pickings of the best big man in the draft. They can skip ahead of Dallas who would be a threat. We can pry pick #34 and a future 2nd rounder or right to swap future 2nd rounders. Key is to jump ahead of Philly in that 2nd round who has to have an eye on Hart with their need for guard help. We can snatch up Mitchell and Hart and Morris with our 2nd 2nd rounder. This would completely rebuild our back court and create great competition between Baker, Morris, Randell. With out need for quality guards we need comp like that to create a diamond. If Baker and Randell step up to the plate great. If they get beat out be superior talent then so be it. With Mitchell and Baker being more combo guards though. Morris brings a needed the true floor general presence in this scenario and most.
Mitchell/Baker/Morris,
Lee/Hart/ Mitchell or Baker
Would lock up our guard play with young talent while KP & Willie lock up the big man spots. We could use next draft to target forwards &/or go after some veterans with our 19 mil in cap space. But we would have way less holes with guards and bigs positions locked up and can key in on pieces going forward.
Well the Knicks have a lot of options.
Draft one at 8.
Re-sign Rose if you can get him on a good short deal.
Trade for Rubio. Or maybe trade for Dunn if they've given up on him.
Or my personal favorite, trade KP in some of package deal that lands the #1 pick and draft Fultz. Start building with Fultz, WHG, #8 pick and what ever draft picks you can get for Melo.
reub wrote:fwk00 wrote:I'm a Monte Morris fan but I get the Mason admiration as well.
Will he still be there at pick #44? He might be because of his age. He's 23.
Well, there's that. He will probably drop through just because he put his time in.
For Phil and co., the upside is that you're drafting a mature, well-known asset. Chances are he gets up to speed sooner. The fact that his attitude about defense perfectly complements Baker and Randle makes that a nice fit. And assuming the Knicks pick up Rubio, the position is deep and flexible - lots of competent guards for Horny to deploy.
AND, as the astute observe, Knicks are free to draft BPA at 8 without deferring to need-first.
And I don't get hung up on Morris. There are five or six second-rounders for scouting to sort out. And you absolutely know one or two of them will be stars that no one anticipated.
