Knicks · If Kanter opts out, what do you do about the front court? (page 1)

We have a few options:-

sign KOQ to a hugely inflated 1 year deal.

Use the $18mil cap space to take on a contract for sweetners- Denver (Faried) would be a nice idea, as would OKC with Melo (if we send out Lee and buyout Melo).

Take a shot at Nerlens Noel- one year $18mil deal for him to redeem himself.

Sign any old vet PF/C with good character- Ed Davis, Amir Johnson, that type of player

I'd also see if the Kings are willing to part with one of their PF/Cs- they're way over loaded with Bagely, WCS, Giles, Koufos, Labissiere and Zach Randolph. I'd love to get WCS, but we'd probably have to settle for Koufos

smackeddog wrote:Noah can't last a season or full minutes- we'll have lost KP, Koq, Willy and Kanter. We need to fill in the front court not for wins but mainly to protect our other players from getting too badly man-handled or injured.

We have a few options:-

sign KOQ to a hugely inflated 1 year deal.

Use the $18mil cap space to take on a contract for sweetners- Denver (Faried) would be a nice idea, as would OKC with Melo (if we send out Lee and buyout Melo).

Take a shot at Nerlens Noel- one year $18mil deal for him to redeem himself.

Sign any old vet PF/C with good character- Ed Davis, Amir Johnson, that type of player

I'd also see if the Kings are willing to part with one of their PF/Cs- they're way over loaded with Bagely, WCS, Giles, Koufos, Labissiere and Zach Randolph. I'd love to get WCS, but we'd probably have to settle for Koufos

Agree with this for the most part. Think KOQ will be back on a 1 year deal regardless.

Also, for those dudes you want to sign to a 1 year deal, make sure it's properly allotted so that you can possibly trade them. $18M for Noel is just waaayyyy too high

smackeddog wrote:Noah can't last a season or full minutes- we'll have lost KP, Koq, Willy and Kanter. We need to fill in the front court not for wins but mainly to protect our other players from getting too badly man-handled or injured.

We have a few options:-

sign KOQ to a hugely inflated 1 year deal.

Use the $18mil cap space to take on a contract for sweetners- Denver (Faried) would be a nice idea, as would OKC with Melo (if we send out Lee and buyout Melo).

Take a shot at Nerlens Noel- one year $18mil deal for him to redeem himself.

Sign any old vet PF/C with good character- Ed Davis, Amir Johnson, that type of player

I'd also see if the Kings are willing to part with one of their PF/Cs- they're way over loaded with Bagely, WCS, Giles, Koufos, Labissiere and Zach Randolph. I'd love to get WCS, but we'd probably have to settle for Koufos

smackeddog wrote:Noah can't last a season or full minutes- we'll have lost KP, Koq, Willy and Kanter. We need to fill in the front court not for wins but mainly to protect our other players from getting too badly man-handled or injured.

Hard to see Kanter opting out.

If he does not, you start Kanter and Noah together. You simply play Noah until you drive him into the ground. He will get injured. Nothing you can do to stop that. Might as well happen fast and dirty so you can shelve him for the season and get him away from the locker room.

If Kanter, oddly and rarely, opts out, you wait until Tier 5 of free agency takes full swing and see what's out there.

Here's where it's just gonna get ugly. I think you'll see Tier 2 guys just up and ring chase. The long term money won't be out there, so why not win and get a ring and raise your profile for next offseason? Some dudes are also going to get bought out and be floating on the market.

Paying more than Tier 5 money at this point would be kind of insane for a pivot fill in.

The "market correction" will likely be a Tier slide effect. Tier 4 guys will have to settle for Tier 5 money ( basically the minimum ) and Tier 3 guys will have to take Tier 4 money ( Room Exception, etc) Market just looks primed to collapse. The league has never seen anything quite like this before. Michele Roberts has to be one of the dumbest people on the entire planet. Everyone warned her this would happen. This is not just about owners greed but also about preventing another extended labor war in the future.

That fiscal bump also makes contract's like Noah's quite manageable when the Knicks will need it to be.

TripleThreat wrote:

smackeddog wrote:Noah can't last a season or full minutes- we'll have lost KP, Koq, Willy and Kanter. We need to fill in the front court not for wins but mainly to protect our other players from getting too badly man-handled or injured.

Hard to see Kanter opting out.

If he does not, you start Kanter and Noah together. You simply play Noah until you drive him into the ground. He will get injured. Nothing you can do to stop that. Might as well happen fast and dirty so you can shelve him for the season and get him away from the locker room.

If Kanter, oddly and rarely, opts out, you wait until Tier 5 of free agency takes full swing and see what's out there.

Here's where it's just gonna get ugly. I think you'll see Tier 2 guys just up and ring chase. The long term money won't be out there, so why not win and get a ring and raise your profile for next offseason? Some dudes are also going to get bought out and be floating on the market.

Paying more than Tier 5 money at this point would be kind of insane for a pivot fill in.

The "market correction" will likely be a Tier slide effect. Tier 4 guys will have to settle for Tier 5 money ( basically the minimum ) and Tier 3 guys will have to take Tier 4 money ( Room Exception, etc) Market just looks primed to collapse. The league has never seen anything quite like this before. Michele Roberts has to be one of the dumbest people on the entire planet. Everyone warned her this would happen. This is not just about owners greed but also about preventing another extended labor war in the future.

I think Kanter would be silly to opt out, but everything he's said has indicated he will (said he wants a multi year deal in case he gets injured. If he does opt out I don't see him getting more than $10mil per year, considering he'll make $18mil if he opts in, if I were him I'd opt in. A lot of big men went in the draft, plus there are Kanter-esq 20min C's in free agency (Monroe, Okafor), and not that much cap space available. Plus these are the teams with possible cap space:

1. Lakers (saving money for big name FAs)
2. Sixers (doesn't fit at all)
3. Bulls (saving space for 2019)
4. Hawks (more likely to use space to take on a bad contract with picks)
5. Kings (overloaded at front court as is)
6. Nets
7. Mavs
8. Pacers (not a good fit)
9. Suns (no need for a C)

So really his only options are the Nets (you never know- they have nothing! Plus he seems to like NY) and Mavs. Mavs are after a big name FA like Cousins or DeAndre Jordan.

Here's a good breakdown of our cap situation:

Guaranteed Salaries: $70,753,926

Non-Guaranteed Salaries: Trey Burke ($1,795,015); Troy Williams ($1,544,951)

Expected Free-Agent Holds: Enes Kanter's player option ($18,622,514); Ron Baker's player option ($4,544,400); Kyle O'Quinn's player option ($4,256,250)

First-Round Pick Holds: No. 9 ($3,708,120)

Dead Money: $0

All-Inclusive Total: $105,225,176

Starting Cap Space: -$4,225,176

It says a lot about this summer that a team operating above the salary cap has one of the 10 best sheets.

Either the Orlando Magic or Utah Jazz could technically go here, but the Knicks potentially have more flexibility. The Magic can only waive non-guaranteed deals for Khem Birch and Shelvin Mack, and they still would barely be under the cap after the fact. The Jazz need to gut their roster of Dante Exum (restricted), Derrick Favors (unrestricted), Jonas Jerebko (non-guaranteed), Thabo Sefolosha (non-guaranteed) and Ekpe Udoh (non-guaranteed) to maximize their space.

New York's path to substantive breathing room is cleaner. Everything hinges on Enes Kanter's player option. They'll have more than $14 million at their disposal if he declines it. And while he won't match his $18.6 million salary on the open market, he sounds like he intends to test the waters.

"You could say that, yes [I'm leaning toward opting out]," he said, per the New York Daily News' Stefan Bondy. "I'm not saying I'm in or out 100 percent. I'm just saying I want to stay here long-term because it's always weird just having one year and then leave and come back. I'd rather stay long-term."

Carrying Kanter's cap hold won't help the Knicks' bottom line. They'll have to renounce him if he hits free agency. They will open up more room from there if Kyle O'Quinn opts out, and they could always circle back to stretching Joakim Noah. Spreading the final two seasons on his contract over the next half-decade would save them close to $11 million this summer.

This discussion becomes moot if Kanter plays out the last year of his agreement. The Knicks could still duck beneath the cap if O'Quinn opts out, but waiving Noah isn't close to worthwhile when it wouldn't bring them within spitting distance of max room. If Kanter sticks around, look for New York to stand relatively pat on the margins and work the market with its non-taxpayer mid-level exception.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/27762...

NardDogNation wrote:Throw $3 million at the Charlotte Hornets to bring Willy Hernangomez home! He never should've been traded to begin with; maybe Fizdale's program might help him improve defensively. It's worth a try, since we'd have ample minutes at the 5 and are in developmental mode.

I think he will get major minutes this year now that Howard is gone. Don't worry at least we have Mudiay.

Jmpasq wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:Throw $3 million at the Charlotte Hornets to bring Willy Hernangomez home! He never should've been traded to begin with; maybe Fizdale's program might help him improve defensively. It's worth a try, since we'd have ample minutes at the 5 and are in developmental mode.

I think he will get major minutes this year now that Howard is gone. Don't worry at least we have Mudiay.

It's quite possible but that roster has always fared well when Cody Zeller is healthy and playing major minutes. I expect minutes to still be tight with Mozgov and Kaminsky in the fold as well. Mozgov is owed too much money not to pay and they still don't know what Kaminsky is to pay him appropriately, so expect both to get time.

He is 26 though and may not fit our timeline. But he could be something that a team can sign for cheaper deal than his actual worth due to his numbers.

newyorknewyork wrote:Derek Favors is an underrated piece. He got injured 2 yrs ago and looked like he was falling off. Then he healed up and looked back to normal toward the end of last season. He has played alongside of Gobert majority of the time. He will sign with a team that can offer him better spacing as the main PNR big.

He is 26 though and may not fit our timeline. But he could be something that a team can sign for cheaper deal than his actual worth due to his numbers.

I'm always dubious of players who are always injured, suddenly getting healthy in a contract year

smackeddog wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:Derek Favors is an underrated piece. He got injured 2 yrs ago and looked like he was falling off. Then he healed up and looked back to normal toward the end of last season. He has played alongside of Gobert majority of the time. He will sign with a team that can offer him better spacing as the main PNR big.

He is 26 though and may not fit our timeline. But he could be something that a team can sign for cheaper deal than his actual worth due to his numbers.

I'm always dubious of players who are always injured, suddenly getting healthy in a contract year

Does he carry that injury prone rep? He got seriously injuried and took all of 16/17 and half of 17/18 to recover.

smackeddog wrote:Another option could be Alex Len, who the Suns might let walk now they've drafted Ayton.

Here's a good breakdown of our cap situation:

Guaranteed Salaries: $70,753,926

Non-Guaranteed Salaries: Trey Burke ($1,795,015); Troy Williams ($1,544,951)

Expected Free-Agent Holds: Enes Kanter's player option ($18,622,514); Ron Baker's player option ($4,544,400); Kyle O'Quinn's player option ($4,256,250)

First-Round Pick Holds: No. 9 ($3,708,120)

Dead Money: $0

All-Inclusive Total: $105,225,176

Starting Cap Space: -$4,225,176

It says a lot about this summer that a team operating above the salary cap has one of the 10 best sheets.

Either the Orlando Magic or Utah Jazz could technically go here, but the Knicks potentially have more flexibility. The Magic can only waive non-guaranteed deals for Khem Birch and Shelvin Mack, and they still would barely be under the cap after the fact. The Jazz need to gut their roster of Dante Exum (restricted), Derrick Favors (unrestricted), Jonas Jerebko (non-guaranteed), Thabo Sefolosha (non-guaranteed) and Ekpe Udoh (non-guaranteed) to maximize their space.

New York's path to substantive breathing room is cleaner. Everything hinges on Enes Kanter's player option. They'll have more than $14 million at their disposal if he declines it. And while he won't match his $18.6 million salary on the open market, he sounds like he intends to test the waters.

"You could say that, yes [I'm leaning toward opting out]," he said, per the New York Daily News' Stefan Bondy. "I'm not saying I'm in or out 100 percent. I'm just saying I want to stay here long-term because it's always weird just having one year and then leave and come back. I'd rather stay long-term."

Carrying Kanter's cap hold won't help the Knicks' bottom line. They'll have to renounce him if he hits free agency. They will open up more room from there if Kyle O'Quinn opts out, and they could always circle back to stretching Joakim Noah. Spreading the final two seasons on his contract over the next half-decade would save them close to $11 million this summer.

This discussion becomes moot if Kanter plays out the last year of his agreement. The Knicks could still duck beneath the cap if O'Quinn opts out, but waiving Noah isn't close to worthwhile when it wouldn't bring them within spitting distance of max room. If Kanter sticks around, look for New York to stand relatively pat on the margins and work the market with its non-taxpayer mid-level exception.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/27762...

I kind of like Len....think he’s a very solid rebounder and surpised his offense hasn’t progressed more. Wonder if we could grab him on a 1 yr deal for change of scenery if Kanter goes.

smackeddog wrote:Noah can't last a season or full minutes- we'll have lost KP, Koq, Willy and Kanter. We need to fill in the front court not for wins but mainly to protect our other players from getting too badly man-handled or injured.

We have a few options:-

sign KOQ to a hugely inflated 1 year deal.

Use the $18mil cap space to take on a contract for sweetners- Denver (Faried) would be a nice idea, as would OKC with Melo (if we send out Lee and buyout Melo).

Take a shot at Nerlens Noel- one year $18mil deal for him to redeem himself.

Sign any old vet PF/C with good character- Ed Davis, Amir Johnson, that type of player

I'd also see if the Kings are willing to part with one of their PF/Cs- they're way over loaded with Bagely, WCS, Giles, Koufos, Labissiere and Zach Randolph. I'd love to get WCS, but we'd probably have to settle for Koufos

N.Noel would be perfect for a one year prove yourself contract. If he's looking for a big multi year contract then he's gonna need to prove he's worth it after a couple of disappointing years and to prove himself he's gonna need minutes which he can get with us if Kanter opts out. Your idea of giving him $18 for that one year is ridiculous though. Give him a one year $10 mil at most.

NardDogNation wrote:Throw $3 million at the Charlotte Hornets to bring Willy Hernangomez home! He never should've been traded to begin with; maybe Fizdale's program might help him improve defensively. It's worth a try, since we'd have ample minutes at the 5 and are in developmental mode.

They just traded Dwight Howard away so they aren't gonna trade Willy now.

Allanfan20 wrote:I would offer both Kanter and O’Quinn very inflated 1 year deals if they both opt out.

Ummmmmmm why would Kanter opt out of his one year $18 mil deal only to sign another one year deal with us?