Knicks · The 2019 Draft (page 11)
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Zion didn't lose many if any rebounds; he had a nose for the ball and if it was in his vicinity he seemed to lose [edit -- oops, win] every time. Played very confident and poised (for the most part; there were a few instances where he was clearly targeting highlight reel stuff)
I don't know his exact measurables but he is big in the lower body and clearly has a very strong core.
Some concerns (more because I can't help myself from trying to see both sides than that these are huge issues [which i dont think they are]). (1) He's not rock hard. Clearly powerful but definitely a layer of fat in there too. Would like to know the back story on that. There's clearly opportunity for improvement, and the issue is what is he doing via self-motivation to get there. (2) He's left handed (I didn't know that before). Again there may be an opportunity there too, as it's a different look, but we should also consider that especially with a college schedule (e.g., not seeing teams/players repeatedly) this gives him a slight advantage that may not translate as much to the pros, as teams and players get used to that. (3) man-child fears. Sometimes you have Shaq or Barkley, other times you get Robert Traylor.
off topic from Zion: Ky Bowman can play. Fast, strong for his size, under control etc. Major issue is his size, but whoever gets past him being 6'1" (who knows if he's truly that) might find themselves a player
Chandler wrote:I watched the Duke BC game last night (back and forth with Knicks). Admittedly, I am not a college hoops expert but some takeawaysZion didn't lose many if any rebounds; he had a nose for the ball and if it was in his vicinity he seemed to lose every time. Played very confident and poised (for the most part; there were a few instances where he was clearly targeting highlight reel stuff)
I don't know his exact measurables but he is big in the lower body and clearly has a very strong core.
Some concerns (more because I can't help myself from trying to see both sides than that these are huge issues [which i dont think they are]). (1) He's not rock hard. Clearly powerful but definitely a layer of fat in there too. Would like to know the back story on that. There's clearly opportunity for improvement, and the issue is what is he doing via self-motivation to get there. (2) He's left handed (I didn't know that before). Again there may be an opportunity there too, as it's a different look, but we should also consider that especially with a college schedule (e.g., not seeing teams/players repeatedly) this gives him a slight advantage that may not translate as much to the pros, as teams and players get used to that. (3) man-child fears. Sometimes you have Shaq or Barkley, other times you get Robert Traylor.
off topic from Zion: Ky Bowman can play. Fast, strong for his size, under control etc. Major issue is his size, but whoever gets past him being 6'1" (who knows if he's truly that) might find themselves a player
what did u think of barrett?
VCoug wrote:Nalod wrote:Picks have risk. Few are sure fire stars. Magic and LEbron were rare. Jordan was not expected to be a goat.
Zion is not a finished product. He’ll have to calm down and pace himself. No different. Zion will bet stronger too. NOt a finished product.
Can’t peg him as “the next....”You're saying nothing here. No one coming out of the draft is a finished product especially now that most players don't stay in college for 4 years.
Your correct, Im saying you can't compare Zion because he is not finished but he is being compared.
Marv wrote:Chandler wrote:I watched the Duke BC game last night (back and forth with Knicks). Admittedly, I am not a college hoops expert but some takeawaysZion didn't lose many if any rebounds; he had a nose for the ball and if it was in his vicinity he seemed to lose every time. Played very confident and poised (for the most part; there were a few instances where he was clearly targeting highlight reel stuff)
I don't know his exact measurables but he is big in the lower body and clearly has a very strong core.
Some concerns (more because I can't help myself from trying to see both sides than that these are huge issues [which i dont think they are]). (1) He's not rock hard. Clearly powerful but definitely a layer of fat in there too. Would like to know the back story on that. There's clearly opportunity for improvement, and the issue is what is he doing via self-motivation to get there. (2) He's left handed (I didn't know that before). Again there may be an opportunity there too, as it's a different look, but we should also consider that especially with a college schedule (e.g., not seeing teams/players repeatedly) this gives him a slight advantage that may not translate as much to the pros, as teams and players get used to that. (3) man-child fears. Sometimes you have Shaq or Barkley, other times you get Robert Traylor.
off topic from Zion: Ky Bowman can play. Fast, strong for his size, under control etc. Major issue is his size, but whoever gets past him being 6'1" (who knows if he's truly that) might find themselves a playerwhat did u think of barrett?
he and is it Cam(?), looked the part of NBA players, but honestly the two who stood out by a lot IMO was Zion and Ky for BC
Nalod wrote:VCoug wrote:Nalod wrote:Picks have risk. Few are sure fire stars. Magic and LEbron were rare. Jordan was not expected to be a goat.
Zion is not a finished product. He’ll have to calm down and pace himself. No different. Zion will bet stronger too. NOt a finished product.
Can’t peg him as “the next....”You're saying nothing here. No one coming out of the draft is a finished product especially now that most players don't stay in college for 4 years.
Your correct, Im saying you can't compare Zion because he is not finished but he is being compared.
He’s a generational talent, the last time the Knicks were great was with a generational talent in Ewing.
The scary part, zion isn’t a finished product yet not even close. We would be so lucky to get Zion and put him in a position to play with future hof players like Durant and kyrie.
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Lol, I was just coming here to post this. Dude is so fucking good.
Chandler wrote:I watched the Duke BC game last night (back and forth with Knicks). Admittedly, I am not a college hoops expert but some takeawaysI guess the main upside with Zion would eventually be the Phoenix version of Barkley. The downside would be if he ever gets unmotivated and lets the weight creep up on him and he becomes a shorter version of the Cleveland Shawn Kemp. The likely middle ground is probably some version of Blake Griffin (or a more athletic Draymond Green) and the question is does that move the needle for your franchise? Is he a guy who would just put up nice numbers or is he a franchise altering player?Zion didn't lose many if any rebounds; he had a nose for the ball and if it was in his vicinity he seemed to lose [edit -- oops, win] every time. Played very confident and poised (for the most part; there were a few instances where he was clearly targeting highlight reel stuff)
I don't know his exact measurables but he is big in the lower body and clearly has a very strong core.
Some concerns (more because I can't help myself from trying to see both sides than that these are huge issues [which i dont think they are]). (1) He's not rock hard. Clearly powerful but definitely a layer of fat in there too. Would like to know the back story on that. There's clearly opportunity for improvement, and the issue is what is he doing via self-motivation to get there. (2) He's left handed (I didn't know that before). Again there may be an opportunity there too, as it's a different look, but we should also consider that especially with a college schedule (e.g., not seeing teams/players repeatedly) this gives him a slight advantage that may not translate as much to the pros, as teams and players get used to that. (3) man-child fears. Sometimes you have Shaq or Barkley, other times you get Robert Traylor.
off topic from Zion: Ky Bowman can play. Fast, strong for his size, under control etc. Major issue is his size, but whoever gets past him being 6'1" (who knows if he's truly that) might find themselves a player
I've never been good at projecting college talent so I don't have a clue what the Knicks should do? Maybe go the Danny Ainge route and trade down and acquire extra assets? I don't know. I just don't see a "build your franchise around him" talent when I watched Zion play. He'll make some remarkable plays but would he win big for you?
Welpee wrote:Chandler wrote:I watched the Duke BC game last night (back and forth with Knicks). Admittedly, I am not a college hoops expert but some takeawaysI guess the main upside with Zion would eventually be the Phoenix version of Barkley. The downside would be if he ever gets unmotivated and lets the weight creep up on him and he becomes a shorter version of the Cleveland Shawn Kemp. The likely middle ground is probably some version of Blake Griffin (or a more athletic Draymond Green) and the question is does that move the needle for your franchise? Is he a guy who would just put up nice numbers or is he a franchise altering player?Zion didn't lose many if any rebounds; he had a nose for the ball and if it was in his vicinity he seemed to lose [edit -- oops, win] every time. Played very confident and poised (for the most part; there were a few instances where he was clearly targeting highlight reel stuff)
I don't know his exact measurables but he is big in the lower body and clearly has a very strong core.
Some concerns (more because I can't help myself from trying to see both sides than that these are huge issues [which i dont think they are]). (1) He's not rock hard. Clearly powerful but definitely a layer of fat in there too. Would like to know the back story on that. There's clearly opportunity for improvement, and the issue is what is he doing via self-motivation to get there. (2) He's left handed (I didn't know that before). Again there may be an opportunity there too, as it's a different look, but we should also consider that especially with a college schedule (e.g., not seeing teams/players repeatedly) this gives him a slight advantage that may not translate as much to the pros, as teams and players get used to that. (3) man-child fears. Sometimes you have Shaq or Barkley, other times you get Robert Traylor.
off topic from Zion: Ky Bowman can play. Fast, strong for his size, under control etc. Major issue is his size, but whoever gets past him being 6'1" (who knows if he's truly that) might find themselves a playerI've never been good at projecting college talent so I don't have a clue what the Knicks should do? Maybe go the Danny Ainge route and trade down and acquire extra assets? I don't know. I just don't see a "build your franchise around him" talent when I watched Zion play. He'll make some remarkable plays but would he win big for you?
Barkley was better in Philly, he just had a better team in Phoenix. Blake is not a bad comparison because like Zion, he was a man amongst boys in college. Zion is a generational athlete and you do not want to be the team that passed on him. This draft is not very deep and after 3, it's a crap shoot so no way am I trading down especially if we land in the top 3.
Uptown wrote:Welpee wrote:Chandler wrote:I watched the Duke BC game last night (back and forth with Knicks). Admittedly, I am not a college hoops expert but some takeawaysI guess the main upside with Zion would eventually be the Phoenix version of Barkley. The downside would be if he ever gets unmotivated and lets the weight creep up on him and he becomes a shorter version of the Cleveland Shawn Kemp. The likely middle ground is probably some version of Blake Griffin (or a more athletic Draymond Green) and the question is does that move the needle for your franchise? Is he a guy who would just put up nice numbers or is he a franchise altering player?Zion didn't lose many if any rebounds; he had a nose for the ball and if it was in his vicinity he seemed to lose [edit -- oops, win] every time. Played very confident and poised (for the most part; there were a few instances where he was clearly targeting highlight reel stuff)
I don't know his exact measurables but he is big in the lower body and clearly has a very strong core.
Some concerns (more because I can't help myself from trying to see both sides than that these are huge issues [which i dont think they are]). (1) He's not rock hard. Clearly powerful but definitely a layer of fat in there too. Would like to know the back story on that. There's clearly opportunity for improvement, and the issue is what is he doing via self-motivation to get there. (2) He's left handed (I didn't know that before). Again there may be an opportunity there too, as it's a different look, but we should also consider that especially with a college schedule (e.g., not seeing teams/players repeatedly) this gives him a slight advantage that may not translate as much to the pros, as teams and players get used to that. (3) man-child fears. Sometimes you have Shaq or Barkley, other times you get Robert Traylor.
off topic from Zion: Ky Bowman can play. Fast, strong for his size, under control etc. Major issue is his size, but whoever gets past him being 6'1" (who knows if he's truly that) might find themselves a playerI've never been good at projecting college talent so I don't have a clue what the Knicks should do? Maybe go the Danny Ainge route and trade down and acquire extra assets? I don't know. I just don't see a "build your franchise around him" talent when I watched Zion play. He'll make some remarkable plays but would he win big for you?
Barkley was better in Philly, he just had a better team in Phoenix. Blake is not a bad comparison because like Zion, he was a man amongst boys in college. Zion is a generational athlete and you do not want to be the team that passed on him. This draft is not very deep and after 3, it's a crap shoot so no way am I trading down especially if we land in the top 3.
Yeah, this isn't 2017 where there was a debate on 1 and the top prospects all had major questions marks. Zion is far and away better than everyone else in this draft; trading out of 1 for anything less than a haul of picks or Anthony Davis is a fireable offense and I don't think there's a realistic trade package that I would accept.
VCoug wrote:Here's the question, Andrew Wiggins was clearly the top player when he came out. Doesn't mean he's a franchise player. Being the clear #1 player in a draft doesn't make you a player a team should build around. Is Zion a player you build around? Do you really see Zion being on AD's level coming out of college in terms of their NBA potential? I just don't know.Uptown wrote:Welpee wrote:Chandler wrote:I watched the Duke BC game last night (back and forth with Knicks). Admittedly, I am not a college hoops expert but some takeawaysI guess the main upside with Zion would eventually be the Phoenix version of Barkley. The downside would be if he ever gets unmotivated and lets the weight creep up on him and he becomes a shorter version of the Cleveland Shawn Kemp. The likely middle ground is probably some version of Blake Griffin (or a more athletic Draymond Green) and the question is does that move the needle for your franchise? Is he a guy who would just put up nice numbers or is he a franchise altering player?Zion didn't lose many if any rebounds; he had a nose for the ball and if it was in his vicinity he seemed to lose [edit -- oops, win] every time. Played very confident and poised (for the most part; there were a few instances where he was clearly targeting highlight reel stuff)
I don't know his exact measurables but he is big in the lower body and clearly has a very strong core.
Some concerns (more because I can't help myself from trying to see both sides than that these are huge issues [which i dont think they are]). (1) He's not rock hard. Clearly powerful but definitely a layer of fat in there too. Would like to know the back story on that. There's clearly opportunity for improvement, and the issue is what is he doing via self-motivation to get there. (2) He's left handed (I didn't know that before). Again there may be an opportunity there too, as it's a different look, but we should also consider that especially with a college schedule (e.g., not seeing teams/players repeatedly) this gives him a slight advantage that may not translate as much to the pros, as teams and players get used to that. (3) man-child fears. Sometimes you have Shaq or Barkley, other times you get Robert Traylor.
off topic from Zion: Ky Bowman can play. Fast, strong for his size, under control etc. Major issue is his size, but whoever gets past him being 6'1" (who knows if he's truly that) might find themselves a playerI've never been good at projecting college talent so I don't have a clue what the Knicks should do? Maybe go the Danny Ainge route and trade down and acquire extra assets? I don't know. I just don't see a "build your franchise around him" talent when I watched Zion play. He'll make some remarkable plays but would he win big for you?
Barkley was better in Philly, he just had a better team in Phoenix. Blake is not a bad comparison because like Zion, he was a man amongst boys in college. Zion is a generational athlete and you do not want to be the team that passed on him. This draft is not very deep and after 3, it's a crap shoot so no way am I trading down especially if we land in the top 3.
Yeah, this isn't 2017 where there was a debate on 1 and the top prospects all had major questions marks. Zion is far and away better than everyone else in this draft; trading out of 1 for anything less than a haul of picks or Anthony Davis is a fireable offense and I don't think there's a realistic trade package that I would accept.
Welpee wrote:VCoug wrote:Here's the question, Andrew Wiggins was clearly the top player when he came out. Doesn't mean he's a franchise player. Being the clear #1 player in a draft doesn't make you a player a team should build around. Is Zion a player you build around? Do you really see Zion being on AD's level coming out of college in terms of their NBA potential? I just don't know.Uptown wrote:Welpee wrote:Chandler wrote:I watched the Duke BC game last night (back and forth with Knicks). Admittedly, I am not a college hoops expert but some takeawaysI guess the main upside with Zion would eventually be the Phoenix version of Barkley. The downside would be if he ever gets unmotivated and lets the weight creep up on him and he becomes a shorter version of the Cleveland Shawn Kemp. The likely middle ground is probably some version of Blake Griffin (or a more athletic Draymond Green) and the question is does that move the needle for your franchise? Is he a guy who would just put up nice numbers or is he a franchise altering player?Zion didn't lose many if any rebounds; he had a nose for the ball and if it was in his vicinity he seemed to lose [edit -- oops, win] every time. Played very confident and poised (for the most part; there were a few instances where he was clearly targeting highlight reel stuff)
I don't know his exact measurables but he is big in the lower body and clearly has a very strong core.
Some concerns (more because I can't help myself from trying to see both sides than that these are huge issues [which i dont think they are]). (1) He's not rock hard. Clearly powerful but definitely a layer of fat in there too. Would like to know the back story on that. There's clearly opportunity for improvement, and the issue is what is he doing via self-motivation to get there. (2) He's left handed (I didn't know that before). Again there may be an opportunity there too, as it's a different look, but we should also consider that especially with a college schedule (e.g., not seeing teams/players repeatedly) this gives him a slight advantage that may not translate as much to the pros, as teams and players get used to that. (3) man-child fears. Sometimes you have Shaq or Barkley, other times you get Robert Traylor.
off topic from Zion: Ky Bowman can play. Fast, strong for his size, under control etc. Major issue is his size, but whoever gets past him being 6'1" (who knows if he's truly that) might find themselves a playerI've never been good at projecting college talent so I don't have a clue what the Knicks should do? Maybe go the Danny Ainge route and trade down and acquire extra assets? I don't know. I just don't see a "build your franchise around him" talent when I watched Zion play. He'll make some remarkable plays but would he win big for you?
Barkley was better in Philly, he just had a better team in Phoenix. Blake is not a bad comparison because like Zion, he was a man amongst boys in college. Zion is a generational athlete and you do not want to be the team that passed on him. This draft is not very deep and after 3, it's a crap shoot so no way am I trading down especially if we land in the top 3.
Yeah, this isn't 2017 where there was a debate on 1 and the top prospects all had major questions marks. Zion is far and away better than everyone else in this draft; trading out of 1 for anything less than a haul of picks or Anthony Davis is a fireable offense and I don't think there's a realistic trade package that I would accept.
I don't think Wiggins was the clearcut #1 that year and he definitely wouldn't have gone first if Embiid had been healthy.
I absolutely believe Zion is a player to build around. He's going to be a dominant scorer and rebounder with good to great handles, passing ability, and help defense in the NBA. He's absolutely the best prospect since AD and I have no doubts about his ability to succeed in the pros.
VCoug wrote:I hope you're right because I think the fix will be in for the Knicks to get that first pick.Welpee wrote:VCoug wrote:Here's the question, Andrew Wiggins was clearly the top player when he came out. Doesn't mean he's a franchise player. Being the clear #1 player in a draft doesn't make you a player a team should build around. Is Zion a player you build around? Do you really see Zion being on AD's level coming out of college in terms of their NBA potential? I just don't know.Uptown wrote:Welpee wrote:Chandler wrote:I watched the Duke BC game last night (back and forth with Knicks). Admittedly, I am not a college hoops expert but some takeawaysI guess the main upside with Zion would eventually be the Phoenix version of Barkley. The downside would be if he ever gets unmotivated and lets the weight creep up on him and he becomes a shorter version of the Cleveland Shawn Kemp. The likely middle ground is probably some version of Blake Griffin (or a more athletic Draymond Green) and the question is does that move the needle for your franchise? Is he a guy who would just put up nice numbers or is he a franchise altering player?Zion didn't lose many if any rebounds; he had a nose for the ball and if it was in his vicinity he seemed to lose [edit -- oops, win] every time. Played very confident and poised (for the most part; there were a few instances where he was clearly targeting highlight reel stuff)
I don't know his exact measurables but he is big in the lower body and clearly has a very strong core.
Some concerns (more because I can't help myself from trying to see both sides than that these are huge issues [which i dont think they are]). (1) He's not rock hard. Clearly powerful but definitely a layer of fat in there too. Would like to know the back story on that. There's clearly opportunity for improvement, and the issue is what is he doing via self-motivation to get there. (2) He's left handed (I didn't know that before). Again there may be an opportunity there too, as it's a different look, but we should also consider that especially with a college schedule (e.g., not seeing teams/players repeatedly) this gives him a slight advantage that may not translate as much to the pros, as teams and players get used to that. (3) man-child fears. Sometimes you have Shaq or Barkley, other times you get Robert Traylor.
off topic from Zion: Ky Bowman can play. Fast, strong for his size, under control etc. Major issue is his size, but whoever gets past him being 6'1" (who knows if he's truly that) might find themselves a playerI've never been good at projecting college talent so I don't have a clue what the Knicks should do? Maybe go the Danny Ainge route and trade down and acquire extra assets? I don't know. I just don't see a "build your franchise around him" talent when I watched Zion play. He'll make some remarkable plays but would he win big for you?
Barkley was better in Philly, he just had a better team in Phoenix. Blake is not a bad comparison because like Zion, he was a man amongst boys in college. Zion is a generational athlete and you do not want to be the team that passed on him. This draft is not very deep and after 3, it's a crap shoot so no way am I trading down especially if we land in the top 3.
Yeah, this isn't 2017 where there was a debate on 1 and the top prospects all had major questions marks. Zion is far and away better than everyone else in this draft; trading out of 1 for anything less than a haul of picks or Anthony Davis is a fireable offense and I don't think there's a realistic trade package that I would accept.
I don't think Wiggins was the clearcut #1 that year and he definitely wouldn't have gone first if Embiid had been healthy.
I absolutely believe Zion is a player to build around. He's going to be a dominant scorer and rebounder with good to great handles, passing ability, and help defense in the NBA. He's absolutely the best prospect since AD and I have no doubts about his ability to succeed in the pros.
VCoug wrote:Cartman718 wrote:Javascript is not enabled or there was problem with the URL: https://twitter.com/BarstoolHubbs/status/1094397898769469440
Click here to view the TweetLol, I was just coming here to post this. Dude is so fucking good.
That is unreal. Reminds me of Vince Carter in college. Yeah, that extra weight is slowing him down, lol.
Not sure what this kid is. I get AD is great but its the "What ifs" that spin in my head. "What if" he is better than AD in two years? Does it make sense to sign Durant if Durants timeline is to win a chip right away? our core won't be ready so fast.
Nalod wrote:Wow!!!!
Not sure what this kid is. I get AD is great but its the "What ifs" that spin in my head. "What if" he is better than AD in two years? Does it make sense to sign Durant if Durants timeline is to win a chip right away? our core won't be ready so fast.
Agree 100% - if we land a Zion or a really good/possibly centerpiece player in the draft - that probably won't mix well with adding 2 max vets that are here to team up for a championship run. They will be the focus of the team and likely conclude they need more experienced vets to help them win. So we'll end up giving away much of our young players for Shumperts and similar-type players as a result.
Why not draft smart and develop these young guys? I'm not even a fan of Knox as an example, but think he deserves a chance to see what he can be. Durant and Kyrie or another max guy probably gives us a window of 2-3 years before then having to start over. What happens with our 4-5 talented young guys who don't play that much and are up for new contracts? I suggest we pass on anybody over 29 (so Kawhi could work if he was interested) and keep developing our young guys. I'd rather see what Mitch Robinson becomes in two years simply because we never actually do that. We always sacrifice the young guys to go after the older players.
GustavBahler wrote:But you generally don't become more athletic as you age. The extra weight may not be a problem at 19, may be a different story at 29. He definitely has to stay on top of it. A laundry list of overweight players who couldn't stay in the league long due to weight issues. But if we get a great 10 years from him who would care anyway?VCoug wrote:Cartman718 wrote:Javascript is not enabled or there was problem with the URL: https://twitter.com/BarstoolHubbs/status/1094397898769469440
Click here to view the TweetLol, I was just coming here to post this. Dude is so fucking good.
That is unreal. Reminds me of Vince Carter in college. Yeah, that extra weight is slowing him down, lol.