I'm all-in for whoever KD wants to play with. :)
Kyrie is a better player now and I don't know if Russell will ever catch up. Statistically (at least based on year-4 numbers) are pretty even.
Russell is absolutely playing his best basketball now and is putting up strong numbers. He had his fair share of growing pains in his first 3 seasons, leading up to the first quarter of this season. He's really been turning it on and looks like the unquestioned leader of the Nets now. Earlier this season LeVert and Dinwiddie looked like on an even plane, or perhaps even better.
But he's an RFA - and is basically in the same contract situation as KP. The Nets probably would match any offer.
Be interesting to see if the Durant thing plays out who his "Huckleberry" will be.
For the money I'd just assume Dennis Smith than D'angelo and its price effeictive.
Im ok with Kyrie for Dennis to learn from and eventually be trade fodder. Good teams still develop assets!!!
Before any of this we know our draft status and who might be there. Durant gets a say in all this. Does he want to "win now" or is he patient to grow this team organically from to playoff contender, to title contender over 3 years?
Here are a couple of interesting comps. All per 100 possessions.
D-Lo as a 20 year old year 2 player:
.405 FG% .352 3FG% 5.1 FTA 5.9 RB 8.2 AST 2.3 STL 4.7 TO 26.5 PTS 101 ORTG 113 DRTG
D-Lo as a 21-year told year 3 player:
.414 FG% .324 3FG% 5.2 FTA 7.2 RB 9.8 AST 1.4 STL 5.8 TO 29.2 PTS 98 ORTG 111 DRTG
Player x as a 21 year old year 2 player:
.436 FG% .331 3FG% 5.4 FTA 5.0 RB 8.2 AST 2.3 STL 5.0 TO 22.9 PTS 98 ORTG 111 DRTG
Guess who player x is?
kyrie is a primadona. bad fit.
GoNyGoNyGo wrote:kyrie is a primadona. bad fit.
But friends with KD which is important
smackeddog wrote:GoNyGoNyGo wrote:kyrie is a primadona. bad fit.
But friends with KD which is important
Not important enough to give Irving a max contract, no way. Dont care what Durant wants, not worth bringing in Marbury, the sequel.
GustavBahler wrote:smackeddog wrote:GoNyGoNyGo wrote:kyrie is a primadona. bad fit.
But friends with KD which is important
Not important enough to give Irving a max contract, no way. Dont care what Durant wants, not worth bringing in Marbury, the sequel.
Irving has been to 3 finals, has a ring, and this year will be the 5th team he has been on that will go to the postseason.
If he’s a sequel he’s Wrath of Khan.
GustavBahler wrote:smackeddog wrote:GoNyGoNyGo wrote:kyrie is a primadona. bad fit.
But friends with KD which is important
Not important enough to give Irving a max contract, no way. Dont care what Durant wants, not worth bringing in Marbury, the sequel.
This - don't do it even if we don't get Durant because he will only play with his buddy. Letting his buddy dictate things will hamper the FO's ability to run the show. Don't like the idea of 2 non-Knick players coming in to run things for a few years and then age out. Can always not use the available money and keep options open for the unknown future. Maybe Davis doesn't go to the Celtics or next year Kawhi wants out of wherever he's playing. Point is you don't always have to spend money on whatever's available in the moment. Not a Kyrie fan and think the idea of taking him b/c he's the best available or b/c he's Durant's bud is not a wise decision.
jskinny35 wrote:GustavBahler wrote:smackeddog wrote:GoNyGoNyGo wrote:kyrie is a primadona. bad fit.
But friends with KD which is important
Not important enough to give Irving a max contract, no way. Dont care what Durant wants, not worth bringing in Marbury, the sequel.
This - don't do it even if we don't get Durant because he will only play with his buddy. Letting his buddy dictate things will hamper the FO's ability to run the show. Don't like the idea of 2 non-Knick players coming in to run things for a few years and then age out. Can always not use the available money and keep options open for the unknown future. Maybe Davis doesn't go to the Celtics or next year Kawhi wants out of wherever he's playing. Point is you don't always have to spend money on whatever's available in the moment. Not a Kyrie fan and think the idea of taking him b/c he's the best available or b/c he's Durant's bud is not a wise decision.
Whatever's available sounds like blowing all of our cap space on Amare Stoudamire, a player who we bid against ourselves for and who coulnd't get no-where near the money we gave him from any other team. Whatever's available just so happens to be the 2x finals MVP, and arguably the best player in the league in Durant. Kyrie is 26 years old and is a top 15 player in the league...Last season before he got hurt, he was in the running for league MVP....was the co-MVP in the finals when the Cavs beat the Warriors. On top of that, unlike Amare, Theri are teams that will give Kyrie the max including his own...
Perry and Mills are in the business to win championships...If they have the opportunity to add 2 champions who are still in the prime of their careers, AND, they actually want to come here, you have to do it!
Uptown wrote:jskinny35 wrote:GustavBahler wrote:smackeddog wrote:GoNyGoNyGo wrote:kyrie is a primadona. bad fit.
But friends with KD which is important
Not important enough to give Irving a max contract, no way. Dont care what Durant wants, not worth bringing in Marbury, the sequel.
This - don't do it even if we don't get Durant because he will only play with his buddy. Letting his buddy dictate things will hamper the FO's ability to run the show. Don't like the idea of 2 non-Knick players coming in to run things for a few years and then age out. Can always not use the available money and keep options open for the unknown future. Maybe Davis doesn't go to the Celtics or next year Kawhi wants out of wherever he's playing. Point is you don't always have to spend money on whatever's available in the moment. Not a Kyrie fan and think the idea of taking him b/c he's the best available or b/c he's Durant's bud is not a wise decision.
Whatever's available sounds like blowing all of our cap space on Amare Stoudamire, a player who we bid against ourselves for and who coulnd't get no-where near the money we gave him from any other team. Whatever's available just so happens to be the 2x finals MVP, and arguably the best player in the league in Durant. Kyrie is 26 years old and is a top 15 player in the league...Last season before he got hurt, he was in the running for league MVP....was the co-MVP in the finals when the Cavs beat the Warriors. On top of that, unlike Amare, Theri are teams that will give Kyrie the max including his own...
Perry and Mills are in the business to win championships...If they have the opportunity to add 2 champions who are still in the prime of their careers, AND, they actually want to come here, you have to do it!
Word is bond? Kyrie said he would be back in Boston. I was for bringing Kyrie to NY before his last major injury. Not like I have an agenda. Im looking at the player right now.
The numbers are good, but his relationship with his teammates is lousy. Not someone I would call a candidate to stay healthy,.or mentor our recent draft picks. Too much drama with Irving. No max contract for a PG. Not a good move for the Knicks, or historically.
The numbers are good, but his relationship with his teammates is lousy. Not someone I would call a candidate to stay healthy,.or mentor our recent draft picks. Too much drama with Irving. No max contract for a PG. Not a good move for the Knicks, or historically.
The Celtics have played better without him this year, he has been injury-prone and doesn't play defense. I'm biased toward 2 way players so the Knicks don't have to construct rosters around flawed max stars like Carmelo, Amare (and Kyrie). Why is it so unreasonable to only give a player over 20/25 million a year and expect them to play defense as hard as the guy making the minimum. I get it's an offensive-focused league these days, but why not save the big bucks for the 2 ways guys. Kawhi, Klay, Durant, J.Butler all play both sides... Kyrie just doesn't
How many beefs has he had before this season?
What is the true cause of this Celtic team to underperform.
Sometimes people learn from experience. Kid can play. I don’t want just him to lead a young team but to build “With” him is a different story.
This kid is far from being Marbury.
Timeline...
A lot of fans are too optimistic and they should be.
But I am not.
Irving is not a generational talent as KD or AD...
He is great player but window with him is short.
Margin of error is too high.
If KD will put him as a must piece to come here (and i doubt KD is so stupid) we may need to agree.
Otherwise Russel is better fit.
D'angelo break out season and big money all to coincidental and it speaks to maturity, developing yoot, and potential.
He has the talent, but does he have the heart and work ethic outside the motivation for this contract?
I don't know. Doubt anyone here can say. His coaches perhaps. its not easy to look into a young mans soul.
What is so hard to determine is we are talking about the best 1% of players world wide and still teams still have to guess as to how much more these kids have in them.
Im in my 50' and materially and financially in a real good place. I wrestle with my apathy after I achieve a goal/milestone. It becomes the new norm and effort to just tread water in the same place. These kids are young and the money becomes the norm and the comfort is there but the grit that got them there is one thing, the grit to sustain it and perhaps move forward is not easy when your rolling in cash and all your dreams fulfilled.
Nalod wrote:D'angelo break out season and big money all to coincidental and it speaks to maturity, developing yoot, and potential.
He has the talent, but does he have the heart and work ethic outside the motivation for this contract?
I don't know. Doubt anyone here can say. His coaches perhaps. its not easy to look into a young mans soul. What is so hard to determine is we are talking about the best 1% of players world wide and still teams still have to guess as to how much more these kids have in them.
Im in my 50' and materially and financially in a real good place. I wrestle with my apathy after I achieve a goal/milestone. It becomes the new norm and effort to just tread water in the same place. These kids are young and the money becomes the norm and the comfort is there but the grit that got them there is one thing, the grit to sustain it and perhaps move forward is not easy when your rolling in cash and all your dreams fulfilled.
Greatness has no boundaries... and this hunger is never satisfied.
I heard a lot of talk from modern day NBA stars including KD and Irving.
And all this talk about their personal greatness, about them being the best players they can be and so on.
The true greats were all about the Team. And they still are... but it is few of them in NBA our days.
GoNyGoNyGo wrote:kyrie is a primadona. bad fit.
Yeah, it's kind of funny how many Knicks fans are ignoring this. Dude demanded a trade off of the best team in the East because he didn't want to play in Lebron's shadow. Now, on his current team is can't stop bitching and moaning because the young team that's probably going to win 50 games in back to back seasons isn't quite good enough to win a title. And we're going to try and sign him to be a 2nd banana on a team that won't be quite good enough to win a title for at least a couple of seasons? He also has a ridiculously long history of knee injuries.
VCoug wrote:GoNyGoNyGo wrote:kyrie is a primadona. bad fit.
Yeah, it's kind of funny how many Knicks fans are ignoring this. Dude demanded a trade off of the best team in the East because he didn't want to play in Lebron's shadow. Now, on his current team is can't stop bitching and moaning because the young team that's probably going to win 50 games in back to back seasons isn't quite good enough to win a title. And we're going to try and sign him to be a 2nd banana on a team that won't be quite good enough to win a title for at least a couple of seasons? He also has a ridiculously long history of knee injuries.
To be fair, everyone knew he was leaving. Heck, even this forum knew. You can't blame him for wanting to leave that train before it crashed.
Kyrie is a talent that would be hard to pass up. I just don't like what I am seeing team wise with him. Maybe being the sidekick to KD and a top 3 pick along with the youth NY already has, he will embrace the leadership role and be the right player...and maybe not. We have seen him perfrom great with a top alpha before, so maybe he and KD works enough.
He does have a history of injury too, so another concern.
I am still in the KD, Kawhii camp. If not Kawhii, Kyrie is proably my 2nd choice but with DSj already here, he is a bit redundant. Also a lot depends on who the pick is. Zion or Barrett or OTHER.
GoNyGoNyGo wrote:Kyrie is a talent that would be hard to pass up. I just don't like what I am seeing team wise with him. Maybe being the sidekick to KD and a top 3 pick along with the youth NY already has, he will embrace the leadership role and be the right player...and maybe not. We have seen him perfrom great with a top alpha before, so maybe he and KD works enough. He does have a history of injury too, so another concern.
I am still in the KD, Kawhii camp. If not Kawhii, Kyrie is proably my 2nd choice but with DSj already here, he is a bit redundant. Also a lot depends on who the pick is. Zion or Barrett or OTHER.
I agree. Thing is if he comes here as Durants Duputy he is upfront agreeing to it.
He was drafted by a Lebronless Cav's team and was relegated to be his little brother. At some point it got old for him. As defacto "leader" of Celtic team he is vocal but it may be pushback by others. Roziers has lost minutes in his contract year. Whats up with that? Is it on Kyrie or not? Big investment on Haywood and he has to play to get back. That on Kyrie? does Tatum have the patience and maturity to digest this or he wanting out? is he destined for Nola? Brown is up next and perhaps he wants to get paid too next year! Celts a victim of own success? I don't know, the expectations were super high last year and guys want to get paid. Boston promised to max him? Will they honor that or might they want him gone?
GoNyGoNyGo wrote:Kyrie is a talent that would be hard to pass up. I just don't like what I am seeing team wise with him. Maybe being the sidekick to KD and a top 3 pick along with the youth NY already has, he will embrace the leadership role and be the right player...and maybe not. We have seen him perfrom great with a top alpha before, so maybe he and KD works enough. He does have a history of injury too, so another concern.
I am still in the KD, Kawhii camp. If not Kawhii, Kyrie is proably my 2nd choice but with DSj already here, he is a bit redundant. Also a lot depends on who the pick is. Zion or Barrett or OTHER.
I like the idea of the Knicks having Kawhi & Durant & Zion to start the 2019-20 season to make a strong effort at getting to the ECF.
Kyrie & Durant are only good to make the playoff next season.
I would like to keep Kadeem, Frank, and DSJ next season, plus sign a veteran PG Rondo
I would pass on Kyrie. Injury prone and now team destroyer. Simply not the winner everyone think he is. If not for Draymond and LeBron he is still a loser. Celtics are worse now then they were before. LeBron and Kyrie weren’t good enough to win a title what make people think Durant and Kyrie will win a title.
Only thing I could think of is grabbing assets to flip for a future trade. What ever the Knicks do probably blows up in their face. It’s happened to often not to think it will.
