Knicks · Dotson in year 2 (page 1)

I was disappointed in Dotson last year, just felt like he missed way too much for someone who was supposed to be a shooter, like when he was COMPLETELY wide open and missed, and was just all out of sorts on the court.

Seems to have made progress, and as a starter on a very bad team. Still can't believe how bad his off ball defense is, too many lapses, and I still can't figure out why he misses some wide open shots, feel like he should be automatic. Don't know how much his ball handling will improve but he may be a solid guy off the bench. Year 3 will be huge for him.

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Nice year over year development by this kid and our staff.
Mudiay also.
If the Knicks missed on Frank, we got Dotson, Mitch and trier as back filling value.
Whats different in the current scenario? Knicks in two years giving lots of young guys time on the court.
Opportunity. Some will thrived, some did not.
crazy as it sounds but Mario from the start of the season to the end has made progress on off the ball play.
Not sure I want to pay him but if his free agent value goes up and he leaves its a good look for the knicks.
Games are bloody awful to watch. The Toronto game was abysmal. Laker game not so.
Trier and Dotson are good values for on court or trade. Frank puts up some good play we can add him.
Its going to be an interesting summer.

Nalod wrote:Nice year over year development by this kid and our staff.
Mudiay also.
If the Knicks missed on Frank, we got Dotson, Mitch and trier as back filling value.
Whats different in the current scenario? Knicks in two years giving lots of young guys time on the court.
Opportunity. Some will thrived, some did not.
crazy as it sounds but Mario from the start of the season to the end has made progress on off the ball play.
Not sure I want to pay him but if his free agent value goes up and he leaves its a good look for the knicks.
Games are bloody awful to watch. The Toronto game was abysmal. Laker game not so.
Trier and Dotson are good values for on court or trade. Frank puts up some good play we can add him.
Its going to be an interesting summer.

For me, Mario has had a good game or 2 this whole season.

martin wrote:

Nalod wrote:Nice year over year development by this kid and our staff.
Mudiay also.
If the Knicks missed on Frank, we got Dotson, Mitch and trier as back filling value.
Whats different in the current scenario? Knicks in two years giving lots of young guys time on the court.
Opportunity. Some will thrived, some did not.
crazy as it sounds but Mario from the start of the season to the end has made progress on off the ball play.
Not sure I want to pay him but if his free agent value goes up and he leaves its a good look for the knicks.
Games are bloody awful to watch. The Toronto game was abysmal. Laker game not so.
Trier and Dotson are good values for on court or trade. Frank puts up some good play we can add him.
Its going to be an interesting summer.

For me, Mario has had a good game or 2 this whole season.

Off the ball progress is hard to quantify. If you block Lebrons shot at the buzzer, that's pretty obvious. Im just seeing less bone head blank defense staring in to space.
I said less, not eliminated!

Not surprised when rookies have trouble draining jumpers, like Frank and Dotson. They've played for big crowds before, but not like the ones they saw as rookies. Not to mention playing in the Garden can be intimidating. Takes time for some players to tune out the crowd.

Dotson has been in and out of the rotation since becoming a Knick. Im surprised he has been able to put together so many good games in spite of 2 coaches and many different teammates.

As for Frank, I never got the feeling that he understood the need for a sense of urgency. Believe it played a big part in how things turned out for him in NY.

The good news is that NY has another French import...... The French Taco!!! Read an article about them. If you look at one, might have a Seinfeld reaction. "Whats the deal with French Tacos? Tortillas arent French, and it isnt a Taco!" Any French Knicks fans have one of these?

Opened one in Brooklyn about a year ago.

http://brooklyn.news12.com/story/3677170...

I like him, and I like his cheap contract even more- his and Mitch's contracts are crucial this offseason as they help fill out the roster if we max out 2 players.

smackeddog wrote:I like him, and I like his cheap contract even more- his and Mitch's contracts are crucial this offseason as they help fill out the roster if we max out 2 players.

I like dot too, he’s pretty streaky but he’s got all the tools. He reminds me of Allen Houston before he came to the Knicks, and really took his game to the next level. I think dot has that ability esp with better players around him.

Having guys like Durant and kyrie on the floor will make the game so easy for Dotson. His open shot selection will sky rocket. With two max contracts our team instantly becomes a contender in the east.my guess is dot really comes into his own next year.

D Jordan, Mitch,kornet
Durant,vonleh,ellenson
Number1,Knox, 2nd round pick
Dotson,trier,Frank
Kyrie,DSJR, Allen

Wow

fitzfarm wrote:

smackeddog wrote:I like him, and I like his cheap contract even more- his and Mitch's contracts are crucial this offseason as they help fill out the roster if we max out 2 players.

I like dot too, he’s pretty streaky but he’s got all the tools. He reminds me of Allen Houston before he came to the Knicks, and really took his game to the next level. I think dot has that ability esp with better players around him.

Having guys like Durant and kyrie on the floor will make the game so easy for Dotson. His open shot selection will sky rocket. With two max contracts our team instantly becomes a contender in the east.my guess is dot really comes into his own next year.

D Jordan, Mitch,kornet
Durant,vonleh,ellenson
Number1,Knox, 2nd round pick
Dotson,trier,Frank
Kyrie,DSJR, Allen

Wow

Would be hard pressed to sign DJordan to a contract with Durant/Kyrie. Realistically, in the very least, you would need to trade 2 of 3 of DSJr, Frank, Trier.

martin wrote:

fitzfarm wrote:

smackeddog wrote:I like him, and I like his cheap contract even more- his and Mitch's contracts are crucial this offseason as they help fill out the roster if we max out 2 players.

I like dot too, he’s pretty streaky but he’s got all the tools. He reminds me of Allen Houston before he came to the Knicks, and really took his game to the next level. I think dot has that ability esp with better players around him.

Having guys like Durant and kyrie on the floor will make the game so easy for Dotson. His open shot selection will sky rocket. With two max contracts our team instantly becomes a contender in the east.my guess is dot really comes into his own next year.

D Jordan, Mitch,kornet
Durant,vonleh,ellenson
Number1,Knox, 2nd round pick
Dotson,trier,Frank
Kyrie,DSJR, Allen

Wow

Would be hard pressed to sign DJordan to a contract with Durant/Kyrie. Realistically, in the very least, you would need to trade 2 of 3 of DSJr, Frank, Trier.

True, and man I’ve been super impressed with d Jordan we are basically running our offense through him... he’d be a real weapon and great mentor for this team long term.

I’d hate to see him go.

I could see him taking less to stay if Durant and kyrie come, but I’m not holding my breath. D jordan could still get a big pay day and rightfully so, he’s still a top center in this league.

The only disappointing aspect for me is that I thought he’d be more of an force on defense.

Deandre is tough for me to see fit in if he wants to be paid at his market. Its not that high but still he is a 10mm type player. Obviously we in "Win now mode" he is more important but offensively a liability to some degree.
I suppose we'll deal with how he fits based on draft and how we fair in FA mode.

Nalod wrote:

martin wrote:

Nalod wrote:Nice year over year development by this kid and our staff.
Mudiay also.
If the Knicks missed on Frank, we got Dotson, Mitch and trier as back filling value.
Whats different in the current scenario? Knicks in two years giving lots of young guys time on the court.
Opportunity. Some will thrived, some did not.
crazy as it sounds but Mario from the start of the season to the end has made progress on off the ball play.
Not sure I want to pay him but if his free agent value goes up and he leaves its a good look for the knicks.
Games are bloody awful to watch. The Toronto game was abysmal. Laker game not so.
Trier and Dotson are good values for on court or trade. Frank puts up some good play we can add him.
Its going to be an interesting summer.

For me, Mario has had a good game or 2 this whole season.

Off the ball progress is hard to quantify. If you block Lebrons shot at the buzzer, that's pretty obvious. Im just seeing less bone head blank defense staring in to space.
I said less, not eliminated!

Mario would look awesome if we had KD & some other big name.

But, not if he is looking to get paid $8m, because he hasn't been that good - I like him but the best I can say is he's been decent to below average with very few flashes of better than blah.

To me, there is value in continuity - keeping Mario, Mudiay and adding a top 3 pick and KD would be a great off season and give me something to look forward to next season.

GustavBahler wrote:Not surprised when rookies have trouble draining jumpers, like Frank and Dotson. They've played for big crowds before, but not like the ones they saw as rookies. Not to mention playing in the Garden can be intimidating. Takes time for some players to tune out the crowd.

Dotson has been in and out of the rotation since becoming a Knick. Im surprised he has been able to put together so many good games in spite of 2 coaches and many different teammates.

As for Frank, I never got the feeling that he understood the need for a sense of urgency. Believe it played a big part in how things turned out for him in NY.

The good news is that NY has another French import...... The French Taco!!! Read an article about them. If you look at one, might have a Seinfeld reaction. "Whats the deal with French Tacos? Tortillas arent French, and it isnt a Taco!" Any French Knicks fans have one of these?

Opened one in Brooklyn about a year ago.

http://brooklyn.news12.com/story/3677170...

Agree about the lack of roster consistency. Dotson has been pulled in and out the lineup the past few seasons. It's hard too build consistency in that scenario. Disagree with you about Frank. I always bring up Diaw, but the dude was shooting nearly as bad as Frank his first two seasons in Atlanta. His TS% hovered around 48%. Maybe Frank needs a different environment to thrive like Diaw. Frank brings intensity on defense. His confidence shooting took a dump, but I don't think it's lack of fire. Who knows? But if rumors are true, and I hope they are, I'm not banking on many of these guys to be back next season. Maybe Mitch. But as hyped as I am about Mitch, I'm not sure I let that get in the way of a potential AD deal if it's on the table.

martin wrote:I was disappointed in Dotson last year, just felt like he missed way too much for someone who was supposed to be a shooter, like when he was COMPLETELY wide open and missed, and was just all out of sorts on the court.

Seems to have made progress, and as a starter on a very bad team. Still can't believe how bad his off ball defense is, too many lapses, and I still can't figure out why he misses some wide open shots, feel like he should be automatic. Don't know how much his ball handling will improve but he may be a solid guy off the bench. Year 3 will be huge for him.

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I like him and think he's a nice piece in between someone like Irving and KD. Ideal 3&D SG as a role player alongside stars. I agree about his off-ball defense though. He could have Danny Green type upside though.

martin wrote:

fitzfarm wrote:

smackeddog wrote:I like him, and I like his cheap contract even more- his and Mitch's contracts are crucial this offseason as they help fill out the roster if we max out 2 players.

I like dot too, he’s pretty streaky but he’s got all the tools. He reminds me of Allen Houston before he came to the Knicks, and really took his game to the next level. I think dot has that ability esp with better players around him.

Having guys like Durant and kyrie on the floor will make the game so easy for Dotson. His open shot selection will sky rocket. With two max contracts our team instantly becomes a contender in the east.my guess is dot really comes into his own next year.

D Jordan, Mitch,kornet
Durant,vonleh,ellenson
Number1,Knox, 2nd round pick
Dotson,trier,Frank
Kyrie,DSJR, Allen

Wow

Would be hard pressed to sign DJordan to a contract with Durant/Kyrie. Realistically, in the very least, you would need to trade 2 of 3 of DSJr, Frank, Trier.

I'll move Frank and Smith for extra picks to free up that extra 9 mil for D Jordan.

C Jordan/Robinson
F Knox/Thomas
F Durant/Barrett or Reddish
G Dotson/Trier
G Irving/Allen

franco12 wrote:

Nalod wrote:

martin wrote:

Nalod wrote:Nice year over year development by this kid and our staff.
Mudiay also.
If the Knicks missed on Frank, we got Dotson, Mitch and trier as back filling value.
Whats different in the current scenario? Knicks in two years giving lots of young guys time on the court.
Opportunity. Some will thrived, some did not.
crazy as it sounds but Mario from the start of the season to the end has made progress on off the ball play.
Not sure I want to pay him but if his free agent value goes up and he leaves its a good look for the knicks.
Games are bloody awful to watch. The Toronto game was abysmal. Laker game not so.
Trier and Dotson are good values for on court or trade. Frank puts up some good play we can add him.
Its going to be an interesting summer.

For me, Mario has had a good game or 2 this whole season.

Off the ball progress is hard to quantify. If you block Lebrons shot at the buzzer, that's pretty obvious. Im just seeing less bone head blank defense staring in to space.
I said less, not eliminated!

Mario would look awesome if we had KD & some other big name.

But, not if he is looking to get paid $8m, because he hasn't been that good - I like him but the best I can say is he's been decent to below average with very few flashes of better than blah.

To me, there is value in continuity - keeping Mario, Mudiay and adding a top 3 pick and KD would be a great off season and give me something to look forward to next season.

what do you like about Mario? I can't find 1 thing about him that he does well or points to doing well.

That end-year run must have been pretty good last season for him to be getting looks at $6+M per last summer.

Can't shoot or score consistently, defense looks awful.

martin wrote:

franco12 wrote:

Nalod wrote:

martin wrote:

Nalod wrote:Nice year over year development by this kid and our staff.
Mudiay also.
If the Knicks missed on Frank, we got Dotson, Mitch and trier as back filling value.
Whats different in the current scenario? Knicks in two years giving lots of young guys time on the court.
Opportunity. Some will thrived, some did not.
crazy as it sounds but Mario from the start of the season to the end has made progress on off the ball play.
Not sure I want to pay him but if his free agent value goes up and he leaves its a good look for the knicks.
Games are bloody awful to watch. The Toronto game was abysmal. Laker game not so.
Trier and Dotson are good values for on court or trade. Frank puts up some good play we can add him.
Its going to be an interesting summer.

For me, Mario has had a good game or 2 this whole season.

Off the ball progress is hard to quantify. If you block Lebrons shot at the buzzer, that's pretty obvious. Im just seeing less bone head blank defense staring in to space.
I said less, not eliminated!

Mario would look awesome if we had KD & some other big name.

But, not if he is looking to get paid $8m, because he hasn't been that good - I like him but the best I can say is he's been decent to below average with very few flashes of better than blah.

To me, there is value in continuity - keeping Mario, Mudiay and adding a top 3 pick and KD would be a great off season and give me something to look forward to next season.

what do you like about Mario? I can't find 1 thing about him that he does well or points to doing well.

That end-year run must have been pretty good last season for him to be getting looks at $6+M per last summer.

Can't shoot or score consistently, defense looks awful.

I'd bring Mario back on a vet's minimum for this play alone. Does he suck? Yeah, no doubt. But the man is responsible for two of the biggest highlight plays of this season. That's enough for an end of the bench role in my honest opinion.

Honestly, the single biggest thing that gives me hope about the new management regime and coaching staff is Dotson. It was very clear out of the gate that Dotson was not in anyone's plans at all - he's Phil and Clarence's guy. Well, Dot has proven himself and the coaches and managers have adjusted their plans to the personnel on hand. Dotson can play. I think teams were scared from him because of backstory, which appears to be bullshit. Lucked out on that one, and lucked out on Robinson and Trier. If those three aren't on the roster I don't think anyone would feel good about our roster at all and we've got some lotto picks

BigDaddyG wrote:

martin wrote:

franco12 wrote:

Nalod wrote:

martin wrote:

Nalod wrote:Nice year over year development by this kid and our staff.
Mudiay also.
If the Knicks missed on Frank, we got Dotson, Mitch and trier as back filling value.
Whats different in the current scenario? Knicks in two years giving lots of young guys time on the court.
Opportunity. Some will thrived, some did not.
crazy as it sounds but Mario from the start of the season to the end has made progress on off the ball play.
Not sure I want to pay him but if his free agent value goes up and he leaves its a good look for the knicks.
Games are bloody awful to watch. The Toronto game was abysmal. Laker game not so.
Trier and Dotson are good values for on court or trade. Frank puts up some good play we can add him.
Its going to be an interesting summer.

For me, Mario has had a good game or 2 this whole season.

Off the ball progress is hard to quantify. If you block Lebrons shot at the buzzer, that's pretty obvious. Im just seeing less bone head blank defense staring in to space.
I said less, not eliminated!

Mario would look awesome if we had KD & some other big name.

But, not if he is looking to get paid $8m, because he hasn't been that good - I like him but the best I can say is he's been decent to below average with very few flashes of better than blah.

To me, there is value in continuity - keeping Mario, Mudiay and adding a top 3 pick and KD would be a great off season and give me something to look forward to next season.

what do you like about Mario? I can't find 1 thing about him that he does well or points to doing well.

That end-year run must have been pretty good last season for him to be getting looks at $6+M per last summer.

Can't shoot or score consistently, defense looks awful.

I'd bring Mario back on a vet's minimum for this play alone. Does he suck? Yeah, no doubt. But the man is responsible for two of the biggest highlight plays of this season. That's enough for an end of the bench role in my honest opinion.

I don't think he sucks, he definitely has talent, I just think he needs to play around High IQ players, who play winning basketball.

knicks1248 wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

martin wrote:

franco12 wrote:

Nalod wrote:

martin wrote:

Nalod wrote:Nice year over year development by this kid and our staff.
Mudiay also.
If the Knicks missed on Frank, we got Dotson, Mitch and trier as back filling value.
Whats different in the current scenario? Knicks in two years giving lots of young guys time on the court.
Opportunity. Some will thrived, some did not.
crazy as it sounds but Mario from the start of the season to the end has made progress on off the ball play.
Not sure I want to pay him but if his free agent value goes up and he leaves its a good look for the knicks.
Games are bloody awful to watch. The Toronto game was abysmal. Laker game not so.
Trier and Dotson are good values for on court or trade. Frank puts up some good play we can add him.
Its going to be an interesting summer.

For me, Mario has had a good game or 2 this whole season.

Off the ball progress is hard to quantify. If you block Lebrons shot at the buzzer, that's pretty obvious. Im just seeing less bone head blank defense staring in to space.
I said less, not eliminated!

Mario would look awesome if we had KD & some other big name.

But, not if he is looking to get paid $8m, because he hasn't been that good - I like him but the best I can say is he's been decent to below average with very few flashes of better than blah.

To me, there is value in continuity - keeping Mario, Mudiay and adding a top 3 pick and KD would be a great off season and give me something to look forward to next season.

what do you like about Mario? I can't find 1 thing about him that he does well or points to doing well.

That end-year run must have been pretty good last season for him to be getting looks at $6+M per last summer.

Can't shoot or score consistently, defense looks awful.

I'd bring Mario back on a vet's minimum for this play alone. Does he suck? Yeah, no doubt. But the man is responsible for two of the biggest highlight plays of this season. That's enough for an end of the bench role in my honest opinion.

I don't think he sucks, he definitely has talent, I just think he needs to play around High IQ players, who play winning basketball.

Agreed

In the pre-game show of the next game, Wally & Alan Hahn were talking about this and showing a replay of Hezonja's block on Lebron. Jordan pushed him in the back to put him into position to make the block. (Hezonja technically did the right thing by jumping straight up)

Pretty great. And great instincts by Jordan. (SKIP to the 50 second mark where you can see the push)

Any time you have an opportunity to inflict a crushing defeat on another team's superstar player (especially someone like Lebron) is a moment to be celebrated.

ekstarks94 wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

martin wrote:

franco12 wrote:

Nalod wrote:

martin wrote:

Nalod wrote:Nice year over year development by this kid and our staff.
Mudiay also.
If the Knicks missed on Frank, we got Dotson, Mitch and trier as back filling value.
Whats different in the current scenario? Knicks in two years giving lots of young guys time on the court.
Opportunity. Some will thrived, some did not.
crazy as it sounds but Mario from the start of the season to the end has made progress on off the ball play.
Not sure I want to pay him but if his free agent value goes up and he leaves its a good look for the knicks.
Games are bloody awful to watch. The Toronto game was abysmal. Laker game not so.
Trier and Dotson are good values for on court or trade. Frank puts up some good play we can add him.
Its going to be an interesting summer.

For me, Mario has had a good game or 2 this whole season.

Off the ball progress is hard to quantify. If you block Lebrons shot at the buzzer, that's pretty obvious. Im just seeing less bone head blank defense staring in to space.
I said less, not eliminated!

Mario would look awesome if we had KD & some other big name.

But, not if he is looking to get paid $8m, because he hasn't been that good - I like him but the best I can say is he's been decent to below average with very few flashes of better than blah.

To me, there is value in continuity - keeping Mario, Mudiay and adding a top 3 pick and KD would be a great off season and give me something to look forward to next season.

what do you like about Mario? I can't find 1 thing about him that he does well or points to doing well.

That end-year run must have been pretty good last season for him to be getting looks at $6+M per last summer.

Can't shoot or score consistently, defense looks awful.

I'd bring Mario back on a vet's minimum for this play alone. Does he suck? Yeah, no doubt. But the man is responsible for two of the biggest highlight plays of this season. That's enough for an end of the bench role in my honest opinion.

I don't think he sucks, he definitely has talent, I just think he needs to play around High IQ players, who play winning basketball.

Agreed

Didn't say he didn't have talent. But he's never put it together for a stretch that is substantial enough to be recognized as an NBA player. The overall results paint the picture of a guy who sucks.