Knicks · It’s time to fire fiz (page 2)

NYKBocker wrote:So when does the fire Fizdale chant start at the garden?

if we lose to the Kings

They are too insecure to admit they muffed it. And they don’t have a plan B

The next coach selection will be a bit like our roster selection. What do u do when all the top FAs pass you up

No PG
Only 2nd season etc..

A system is a plan and you fit guys in. NY has 3 PG's and they all bring somehting different. DSjr is playing like shit because Fiz is not naking him play within the system. He is free to do what he wants and that doesn't work.

Payton can play the system and has done a decnet job

Frank can play the system and has gotten no chance becasue ??

SO what aboutthe resto fhte sytem? Defense? Player movement? Ball MOvement? WHere are those pieces? Do we see the foundation of ANYTHING?

THe answer is now. Kenny atkinson did it, and the players learned and they play it. If you ar ein the NBA you have talent, no a coach needs to implement a system and coach his players to be better.

StarksEwing1 wrote:Like i said ive supported Fizdale and feel he needs time especially with so many new players. However he has no system to run or even set plays. If you are a head coach you need some type of structure otherwise its like the inmates running the asylym and you wont win. The funny thing is despite that we still should be 2-1..we have talent enough to makes things fun. But im starting to question if Fiz is really a head coach or not. There is no doubt that he gets players to not quit we have seen that but thats only a small part of being a head coach. When you let guys just do ISO and chuck threes all games that isnt structure. There needs to be at least ball movement. Like i said we have talent and depth but so far Fiz has failed to pull in the reigns and establish any type of system.

The ISO/chuck threes point is worth discussing.

As is the issue of team depth. While so many people argue Frank vs DSJ as if its a rivalry, I see it more on a pragmatic level that affects all positions. With a deep team such as ours, someone who is injured or not right should be working out their nits in practice until they are fixed. Period. *That* IMO is the issue with DSJ. Any decent coach worth their salt knows that.

Fizdale, by force-feeding DSJ into a rotation role, sends the message that Frankie specifically is inadequate [pretty much no matter what he proves]. Again, this is a mismatch of coach/system/team structure. If the FO puts together a moneyball team structure - in other words, competent but flawed players who all contribute something to a winning game - then why the hell keep a coach looking for nothing but complete players instead of managing incomplete players to take advantage of their strengths?

In the case of DSJ, why isn't he working out his issues in practice? And why isn't Fiz smacking him in the head for selfish play instead of rewarding him? What kind of idiot do we have managing these kids?

This team can shine as a team but not as a group of selfish individuals satisfying a bone-headed coach. That's what I'm booing.

Secondly systems are plug and play, they set expectations for what will happen next on the floor no matter who is on the floor. Anybody seeing that kind of action? I'm not.

nyknickzingis wrote:Hornachek was a much much better coach than Fizdale. I saw plenty of last season. I know a decent coach when I see one. Horny wasn't good, but decent.
Fizdale is flat out bad. There's a reason Memphis got rid of him quick.
Fiz is assistant coach material. Great assistant coach. Not a head coach.

... rj is gonna get run into the ground under fiz. You could see he was gassed in 4th q of a blowout on back to back, playing sloppy like Knox last year. But no, fiz had
To get him up to 37 min

... imagine if we played frank last year over Mudiay? Why did we waste all that time with Mudiay last year. It led to nothing. Fiz would now rather force dsj to stink up the joint than let frank develop.

anrst wrote:LET THE SEAN MILLER ERA BEGIN

... rj is gonna get run into the ground under fiz. You could see he was gassed in 4th q of a blowout on back to back, playing sloppy like Knox last year. But no, fiz had
To get him up to 37 min

... imagine if we played frank last year over Mudiay? Why did we waste all that time with Mudiay last year. It led to nothing. Fiz would now rather force dsj to stink up the joint than let frank develop.

If Dennis needs minutes to get his groove back and there is nothiong wrong then let him do it in the Gleague as "rehab" not "Development". 5 games.
When Frank was healthy he got minutes. If not now, then also send him down to Gleague and let hiim shoot all he wants.
In fact, send them both down.

fitzfarm wrote:How the F U C K do you lose to a terrible Celtics team they have no talent

StarksEwing1 wrote:Like i said ive supported Fizdale and feel he needs time especially with so many new players. However he has no system to run or even set plays. If you are a head coach you need some type of structure otherwise its like the inmates running the asylym and you wont win.
The funny thing is despite that we still should be 2-1..we have talent enough to makes things fun.
But im starting to question if Fiz is really a head coach or not. There is no doubt that he gets players to not quit we have seen that but thats only a small part of being a head coach. When you let guys just do ISO and chuck threes all games that isnt structure. There needs to be at least ball movement. Like i said we have talent and depth but so far Fiz has failed to pull in the reigns and establish any type of system.

You know, it's not the record that bothers me. I can accept the fact that luck plays a huge role in a team's record, especially this early in the season. But it's the way we're losing. I understand that we played against three of most highly regarded coaches in the league. But Fiz is looking like a rook. He looked noobish last year and I gave him pass, like everyone else. We got vets now. Put in some solid plays! If they were going to experiment like we did last year, they shouldn't have bothered wasting money on free agents.

Is it possible that Fizdale's ego is such that he wants to be BFF with the Kemba's and Kyrie's of the NBA social set?

Playing Frankie might be a case of shutting them both down in embarrassing fashion. That won't get Fizdale invited to any swinging party anytime soon.

He could be saving Frankie for the unwinnable games so he could say, "See, told you so. Frankie does nothing to win games."

Stay woke.

fwk00 wrote:I also have a theory that's unorthodox and probably too wild for anyone here to believe.

Is it possible that Fizdale's ego is such that he wants to be BFF with the Kemba's and Kyrie's of the NBA social set?

Playing Frankie might be a case of shutting them both down in embarrassing fashion. That won't get Fizdale invited to any swinging party anytime soon.

He could be saving Frankie for the unwinnable games so he could say, "See, told you so. Frankie does nothing to win games."

Stay woke.

Its not too wild for me to believe, its sophmoric.
Fiz is trending to Rambis territory but more likable.

Nalod wrote:

fwk00 wrote:I also have a theory that's unorthodox and probably too wild for anyone here to believe.

Is it possible that Fizdale's ego is such that he wants to be BFF with the Kemba's and Kyrie's of the NBA social set?

Playing Frankie might be a case of shutting them both down in embarrassing fashion. That won't get Fizdale invited to any swinging party anytime soon.

He could be saving Frankie for the unwinnable games so he could say, "See, told you so. Frankie does nothing to win games."

Stay woke.

Its not too wild for me to believe, its sophmoric.
Fiz is trending to Rambis territory but more likable.

Fizdale's coaching decisions border on the quality of dialogue in the Geico commercial about a chainsaw murderer being loose and the girl says, "why don't we just get in the running car and go?" [for example *use Frankie for defense*] and the boyfriend says, "No, let's hide behind the chainsaws in the barn!" [let's thrown DSJ out there one more time}.

I mean how can even the dumbest fan make sense of this coaching?

anrst wrote:LET THE SEAN MILLER ERA BEGIN

... rj is gonna get run into the ground under fiz. You could see he was gassed in 4th q of a blowout on back to back, playing sloppy like Knox last year. But no, fiz had
To get him up to 37 min

... imagine if we played frank last year over Mudiay? Why did we waste all that time with Mudiay last year. It led to nothing. Fiz would now rather force dsj to stink up the joint than let frank develop.

StarksEwing1 wrote:Like i said ive supported Fizdale and feel he needs time especially with so many new players. However he has no system to run or even set plays. If you are a head coach you need some type of structure otherwise its like the inmates running the asylym and you wont win. The funny thing is despite that we still should be 2-1..we have talent enough to makes things fun. But im starting to question if Fiz is really a head coach or not. There is no doubt that he gets players to not quit we have seen that but thats only a small part of being a head coach. When you let guys just do ISO and chuck threes all games that isnt structure. There needs to be at least ball movement. Like i said we have talent and depth but so far Fiz has failed to pull in the reigns and establish any type of system.

Exactly, if you don’t move the ball then you get benched. You don’t get benched just cause you are French.

Chandler wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

fwk00 wrote:

CleaverGreene wrote:Don't like him as a coach so far...but he probably deserves to keep his job the rest of the season, unless we start hearing about him losing player support.

On the other hand, I was about to say that with so many new players, they have to learn his offensive system, before I realized there is no identifiable "system" to learn, so its possible that what we see now from the Knicks, is pretty much what we're going to look like, latter.

Some of us were saying this since the middle of last season. Why is no system being established even at the baby step level? Something/anything.

Okay so last season was a tankfest joke. Haha. Ok.

But what was this preseason about? Still no system AND the whole "win your role" bit was just another throw away line. Still no system.

Three ever more humiliating losses into the season we're wondering about not even a system but something a s humble as some plays being called for the players on the court.

NADA.

AND. AND. Ntilikina is benched *because of HIS offense!!!!!!*

Pinch me.

When you have no starting quality PG, it's very hard for a coach to install and run a system- probably why nearly all of our coaches have looked like they have no system for the past few years. Honestly who was the last coach we had that managed to install a system and who was their PG? Probably D'Antoni with Felton?

Fair point. Fire the FO too. They had 100 million and KP as a trade chip and gave us this lineup

I actually agree

smackeddog wrote:

fwk00 wrote:

CleaverGreene wrote:Don't like him as a coach so far...but he probably deserves to keep his job the rest of the season, unless we start hearing about him losing player support.

On the other hand, I was about to say that with so many new players, they have to learn his offensive system, before I realized there is no identifiable "system" to learn, so its possible that what we see now from the Knicks, is pretty much what we're going to look like, latter.

Some of us were saying this since the middle of last season. Why is no system being established even at the baby step level? Something/anything.

Okay so last season was a tankfest joke. Haha. Ok.

But what was this preseason about? Still no system AND the whole "win your role" bit was just another throw away line. Still no system.

Three ever more humiliating losses into the season we're wondering about not even a system but something a s humble as some plays being called for the players on the court.

NADA.

AND. AND. Ntilikina is benched *because of HIS offense!!!!!!*

Pinch me.

When you have no starting quality PG, it's very hard for a coach to install and run a system- probably why nearly all of our coaches have looked like they have no system for the past few years. Honestly who was the last coach we had that managed to install a system and who was their PG? Probably D'Antoni with Felton?

Malcolm Brogdon
Kyle Lowry/Van Fleet
Simmons
Kyrie
Russell
Darren Collison
DJ Augustin
Reggie Jackson
Curry
Lillard
Mitchell
Paul
Jamal Murray
Westbrook
Beverly/Shai
Derrick White

None of our PGs come close.

wargames wrote:

Chandler wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

fwk00 wrote:

CleaverGreene wrote:Don't like him as a coach so far...but he probably deserves to keep his job the rest of the season, unless we start hearing about him losing player support.

On the other hand, I was about to say that with so many new players, they have to learn his offensive system, before I realized there is no identifiable "system" to learn, so its possible that what we see now from the Knicks, is pretty much what we're going to look like, latter.

Some of us were saying this since the middle of last season. Why is no system being established even at the baby step level? Something/anything.

Okay so last season was a tankfest joke. Haha. Ok.

But what was this preseason about? Still no system AND the whole "win your role" bit was just another throw away line. Still no system.

Three ever more humiliating losses into the season we're wondering about not even a system but something a s humble as some plays being called for the players on the court.

NADA.

AND. AND. Ntilikina is benched *because of HIS offense!!!!!!*

Pinch me.

When you have no starting quality PG, it's very hard for a coach to install and run a system- probably why nearly all of our coaches have looked like they have no system for the past few years. Honestly who was the last coach we had that managed to install a system and who was their PG? Probably D'Antoni with Felton?

Fair point. Fire the FO too. They had 100 million and KP as a trade chip and gave us this lineup

I actually agree

100 mil is good pile of cache… for you an me. And for everyone.
For NBA star player it is a little bit different.
It is not a lottery win one of the million chances for you and me. Its a given.
Given when he signs with any NBA team.
Why would any star PG this summer choose Knicks if they would get same money elsewhere?
Why they need to be apart of rebuild in its very beginning? Are they idiots?
Why team will trade star PG or any good NBA starter for injured diva center with fragile body and questionable character plus annoying snake in his brother?
Are the FO people of NBA teams a bunch of morons?
Knicks FO made something from nothing and created an opportunity... which will most likely end up with nothing like most of the opportunities are.
This crying about KP getting old. Let it go. It is not anyone's fault. Just a regular unfortunate obstacle among many others.

fwk00 wrote:

Nalod wrote:

fwk00 wrote:I also have a theory that's unorthodox and probably too wild for anyone here to believe.

Is it possible that Fizdale's ego is such that he wants to be BFF with the Kemba's and Kyrie's of the NBA social set?

Playing Frankie might be a case of shutting them both down in embarrassing fashion. That won't get Fizdale invited to any swinging party anytime soon.

He could be saving Frankie for the unwinnable games so he could say, "See, told you so. Frankie does nothing to win games."

Stay woke.

Its not too wild for me to believe, its sophmoric.
Fiz is trending to Rambis territory but more likable.

Fizdale's coaching decisions border on the quality of dialogue in the Geico commercial about a chainsaw murderer being loose and the girl says, "why don't we just get in the running car and go?" [for example *use Frankie for defense*] and the boyfriend says, "No, let's hide behind the chainsaws in the barn!" [let's thrown DSJ out there one more time}.

I mean how can even the dumbest fan make sense of this coaching?

Fiz is in NY not to coach this team to win a chip or even get to the playoffs.
His job is to guide the group of misfits on team coming up from the NBA sht-holl.
He should be a communicator and evaluator.
But most of all he have to put players we evaluating into setting which will provide for very clear picture of what this player are capable of and made up from.
Also he must build up the value of all assets we have for future trade opportunities.
Of course this will lead to bunch of losing and collecting more assets as a result.
After we will get a balanced team of capable NBA players Fiz can be let go and capable experienced winning coach who is matching the personal in place can be hired.
Building winning NBA team is a long task and need specific people at every stage.
I think we get a good one for what we need now.
And forget about he winning. Not happening this season for sure.