Knicks · I seen it with my own 2 eyes (page 1)

Fiz actually attempted to put the ball in Frank's hands down the stretch. He missed the 2 shots he took, but looked decisive to take those shots. If the refs didn't look to take him out of the game with bogus foul calls in order to protect Luka he might have had a bigger night.

Smith when he was in played with composure and took control of the flow in true PG sense. His defense will always be a concern, but he did his thing last night. Smith's play took the ball out of Randle's hands who still managed to have 6 TOs and turned that into 8 assist. When he came back in the game late in the 4th it looked like they were about to run the offense through Randle again instead of Smith but got it together.

All in all there was better effort towards promoting guard play this game.

To have guard play you need capable guards on the team.
We have 3 of them learning and one hurt.
So no wonder its a mess.
Dot and Ellington are just pure shooters so it is no help there.
That's why Fis have to use forwards to run offense at times.
Unfortunately the dudes we have are not good in this too.
Roster is far away from balance. Years away.

arkrud wrote:To have guard play you need capable guards on the team.
We have 3 of them learning and one hurt.
So no wonder its a mess.
Dot and Ellington are just pure shooters so it is no help there.
That's why Fis have to use forwards to run offense at times.
Unfortunately the dudes we have are not good in this too.
Roster is far away from balance. Years away.

Late in the 4th there for a sequence of consecutive plays. There was a consentrated effort to put the ball in Frank's hands, use screen to free him up, and allow him to try and make a play at the PG position. That is all that has been asked. Frank got cleaner shot attempts based off what the defense gave him. Didn't turn the ball over which is an instant upgrade over Randle driving into triple teams or taking a fadaway contested midrange jumper over a taller defender.

Now next step is playng Smith and Frank together with a package and a plan. Ball may actually gravitate to Frank a lot cleaner more often with Smith paired with him.

newyorknewyork wrote:Fiz actually attempted to put the ball in Frank's hands down the stretch. He missed the 2 shots he took, but looked decisive to take those shots. If the refs didn't look to take him out of the game with bogus foul calls in order to protect Luka he might have had a bigger night.

Smith when he was in played with composure and took control of the flow in true PG sense. His defense will always be a concern, but he did his thing last night. Smith's play took the ball out of Randle's hands who still managed to have 6 TOs and turned that into 8 assist. When he came back in the game late in the 4th it looked like they were about to run the offense through Randle again instead of Smith but got it together.

All in all there was better effort towards promoting guard play this game.

I think PG is ultimately all about confidence (same with other positions but way more so with PG). He had some quotes that said up until this point his professional career has been all about comfort, like being comfortable with living in the USA. He said that's done with and now it's about basketball. Hopefully FIBA Frank is here to stay. If he ends up playing the point like Chris Childs he'll making all defensive teams... Frank is way effing longer than Chris. I mean holy fuck, Luka is one of the best players in the league, he played like that last night, EXCEPT in the 4th quarter. Frank went in with 9:28 to go in the game and Luka made one shot, which was with 5.8 seconds left.

newyorknewyork wrote:

arkrud wrote:To have guard play you need capable guards on the team.
We have 3 of them learning and one hurt.
So no wonder its a mess.
Dot and Ellington are just pure shooters so it is no help there.
That's why Fis have to use forwards to run offense at times.
Unfortunately the dudes we have are not good in this too.
Roster is far away from balance. Years away.

Late in the 4th there for a sequence of consecutive plays. There was a consentrated effort to put the ball in Frank's hands, use screen to free him up, and allow him to try and make a play at the PG position. That is all that has been asked. Frank got cleaner shot attempts based off what the defense gave him. Didn't turn the ball over which is an instant upgrade over Randle driving into triple teams or taking a fadaway contested midrange jumper over a taller defender.

Now next step is playng Smith and Frank together with a package and a plan. Ball may actually gravitate to Frank a lot cleaner more often with Smith paired with him.

Dennis Smith Jr., the former Mav who came to New York in the Porzingis trade, had 13 points, eight assists and six rebounds.

I would much rather see payton and DSJ pushing the pace and just use frank for defensive spurts, sort of like a utility player..

knicks1248 wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

arkrud wrote:To have guard play you need capable guards on the team.
We have 3 of them learning and one hurt.
So no wonder its a mess.
Dot and Ellington are just pure shooters so it is no help there.
That's why Fis have to use forwards to run offense at times.
Unfortunately the dudes we have are not good in this too.
Roster is far away from balance. Years away.

Late in the 4th there for a sequence of consecutive plays. There was a consentrated effort to put the ball in Frank's hands, use screen to free him up, and allow him to try and make a play at the PG position. That is all that has been asked. Frank got cleaner shot attempts based off what the defense gave him. Didn't turn the ball over which is an instant upgrade over Randle driving into triple teams or taking a fadaway contested midrange jumper over a taller defender.

Now next step is playng Smith and Frank together with a package and a plan. Ball may actually gravitate to Frank a lot cleaner more often with Smith paired with him.

Dennis Smith Jr., the former Mav who came to New York in the Porzingis trade, had 13 points, eight assists and six rebounds.

I would much rather see payton and DSJ pushing the pace and just use frank for defensive spurts, sort of like a utility player..

Rainman............once you see Frank not push pace, its all you need to know.

SupremeCommander wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:Fiz actually attempted to put the ball in Frank's hands down the stretch. He missed the 2 shots he took, but looked decisive to take those shots. If the refs didn't look to take him out of the game with bogus foul calls in order to protect Luka he might have had a bigger night.

Smith when he was in played with composure and took control of the flow in true PG sense. His defense will always be a concern, but he did his thing last night. Smith's play took the ball out of Randle's hands who still managed to have 6 TOs and turned that into 8 assist. When he came back in the game late in the 4th it looked like they were about to run the offense through Randle again instead of Smith but got it together.

All in all there was better effort towards promoting guard play this game.

I think PG is ultimately all about confidence (same with other positions but way more so with PG). He had some quotes that said up until this point his professional career has been all about comfort, like being comfortable with living in the USA. He said that's done with and now it's about basketball. Hopefully FIBA Frank is here to stay. If he ends up playing the point like Chris Childs he'll making all defensive teams... Frank is way effing longer than Chris. I mean holy fuck, Luka is one of the best players in the league, he played like that last night, EXCEPT in the 4th quarter. Frank went in with 9:28 to go in the game and Luka made one shot, which was with 5.8 seconds left.

At some point gotta have to be able to build players up. Comfort and confidence comes with reps. Doing exactly what Fiz did last night for that sequence has a higher probablity of building that and seeing long term results than what he was doing previously.

I think he will always give Luka fits while Fox may always give Frank problems.

knicks1248 wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

arkrud wrote:To have guard play you need capable guards on the team.
We have 3 of them learning and one hurt.
So no wonder its a mess.
Dot and Ellington are just pure shooters so it is no help there.
That's why Fis have to use forwards to run offense at times.
Unfortunately the dudes we have are not good in this too.
Roster is far away from balance. Years away.

Late in the 4th there for a sequence of consecutive plays. There was a consentrated effort to put the ball in Frank's hands, use screen to free him up, and allow him to try and make a play at the PG position. That is all that has been asked. Frank got cleaner shot attempts based off what the defense gave him. Didn't turn the ball over which is an instant upgrade over Randle driving into triple teams or taking a fadaway contested midrange jumper over a taller defender.

Now next step is playng Smith and Frank together with a package and a plan. Ball may actually gravitate to Frank a lot cleaner more often with Smith paired with him.

Dennis Smith Jr., the former Mav who came to New York in the Porzingis trade, had 13 points, eight assists and six rebounds.

I would much rather see payton and DSJ pushing the pace and just use frank for defensive spurts, sort of like a utility player..

Except Smith didn't push the pace last night. He controlled it with a measured approach.

Frank Ntilikina is NOT a point guard. Point guards drive and dish. Point guards stop and pop. Point guards manufacture assists "making guys better". Frank throws no lobs for dunks. He doesn't even pass the ball forward (i swear to god half his passes are side to side, even before passing halfcourt) he dribbles to advance the rock and his dribble is (improved but) still not that good. He is a NON-shooting SG because he is NOT a gifted passer or ball handler. His assists come within the flow of the offense ... he isn't a playmaker himself.

In short, he displays almost NONE of the qualities you would want in a starting PG. Even as a backup PG he is wanting.

Sambakick wrote:Frank Ntilikina is NOT a point guard. Point guards drive and dish. Point guards stop and pop. Point guards manufacture assists "making guys better". Frank throws no lobs for dunks. He doesn't even pass the ball forward (i swear to god half his passes are side to side, even before passing halfcourt) he dribbles to advance the rock and his dribble is (improved but) still not that good. He is a NON-shooting SG because he is NOT a gifted passer or ball handler. His assists come within the flow of the offense ... he isn't a playmaker himself.

In short, he displays almost NONE of the qualities you would want in a starting PG. Even as a backup PG he is wanting.

Except for the ability to actually guard the position at an elite level.

Smith does things on the court that Frank doesn't do. Frank does things that Smith doesn't do. Which is why the call for them to play together is there. Frank's defense is so vital for the success of the Knicks that keeping him on the court is nessesary. Same could be said for Smith if plays the way he did last night. So how do you maximize both of thier skills while covering and developing their weaknesses? Frank allowing Smith to defend the lesser offensive threat in the backcourt would help him on that side of the ball. Smith taking over lead guard responsibilities and setting Frank up for easier shots better than what Randle and Morris would be cappable of doing would help Frank on that side of the ball. But Frank also should get features and plays set up for him offensively because he needs the reps. All in all would mold him into a better 2ndary ball handler.

Him standing in the corner waiting for the one pass out of 20 possesions to reach him isn't developing that or much of anything.

newyorknewyork wrote:

Sambakick wrote:Frank Ntilikina is NOT a point guard. Point guards drive and dish. Point guards stop and pop. Point guards manufacture assists "making guys better". Frank throws no lobs for dunks. He doesn't even pass the ball forward (i swear to god half his passes are side to side, even before passing halfcourt) he dribbles to advance the rock and his dribble is (improved but) still not that good. He is a NON-shooting SG because he is NOT a gifted passer or ball handler. His assists come within the flow of the offense ... he isn't a playmaker himself.

In short, he displays almost NONE of the qualities you would want in a starting PG. Even as a backup PG he is wanting.

Except for the ability to actually guard the position at an elite level.

Smith does things on the court that Frank doesn't do. Frank does things that Smith doesn't do. Which is why the call for them to play together is there. Frank's defense is so vital for the success of the Knicks that keeping him on the court is nessesary. Same could be said for Smith if plays the way he did last night. So how do you maximize both of thier skills while covering and developing their weaknesses? Frank allowing Smith to defend the lesser offensive threat in the backcourt would help him on that side of the ball. Smith taking over lead guard responsibilities and setting Frank up for easier shots better than what Randle and Morris would be cappable of doing would help Frank on that side of the ball. But Frank also should get features and plays set up for him offensively because he needs the reps. All in all would mold him into a better 2ndary ball handler.

Him standing in the corner waiting for the one pass out of 20 possesions to reach him isn't developing that or much of anything.

Exactly they both do different things. I like both kids and felt both played a huge part in the win. However I hate the narrative some have had that Frank can’t dish or can’t push. This year I’ve seen him do both better. Sure he might get “fast break” points like one poster seems obsessed about but I have seen him use more speed

The big hope is that Frank can develop into a 3 and D player. He's got the 2nd part already. If he doesn't develop a shot 1248 is right. If he does he could be really good with a good penetrating point guard giving him open looks. Can DSJ become that? We will see.

SupremeCommander wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:Fiz actually attempted to put the ball in Frank's hands down the stretch. He missed the 2 shots he took, but looked decisive to take those shots. If the refs didn't look to take him out of the game with bogus foul calls in order to protect Luka he might have had a bigger night.

Smith when he was in played with composure and took control of the flow in true PG sense. His defense will always be a concern, but he did his thing last night. Smith's play took the ball out of Randle's hands who still managed to have 6 TOs and turned that into 8 assist. When he came back in the game late in the 4th it looked like they were about to run the offense through Randle again instead of Smith but got it together.

All in all there was better effort towards promoting guard play this game.

I think PG is ultimately all about confidence (same with other positions but way more so with PG). He had some quotes that said up until this point his professional career has been all about comfort, like being comfortable with living in the USA. He said that's done with and now it's about basketball. Hopefully FIBA Frank is here to stay. If he ends up playing the point like Chris Childs he'll making all defensive teams... Frank is way effing longer than Chris. I mean holy fuck, Luka is one of the best players in the league, he played like that last night, EXCEPT in the 4th quarter. Frank went in with 9:28 to go in the game and Luka made one shot, which was with 5.8 seconds left.

I can't believe how good Doncic is already. Dude is 20 years old. I have seen oe other player this good this young and that was Lebron James. Lebron has an edge because of his athletic ability but its close

Sambakick wrote:Frank Ntilikina is NOT a point guard. Point guards drive and dish. Point guards stop and pop. Point guards manufacture assists "making guys better". Frank throws no lobs for dunks. He doesn't even pass the ball forward (i swear to god half his passes are side to side, even before passing halfcourt) he dribbles to advance the rock and his dribble is (improved but) still not that good. He is a NON-shooting SG because he is NOT a gifted passer or ball handler. His assists come within the flow of the offense ... he isn't a playmaker himself.

In short, he displays almost NONE of the qualities you would want in a starting PG. Even as a backup PG he is wanting.

I have bee saying this sice we drafted him. He would fit really well on a team that had a point forward like Dallas. If Frank could just become a league average spot up shooter he would be very valuable

Jmpasq wrote:

Sambakick wrote:Frank Ntilikina is NOT a point guard. Point guards drive and dish. Point guards stop and pop. Point guards manufacture assists "making guys better". Frank throws no lobs for dunks. He doesn't even pass the ball forward (i swear to god half his passes are side to side, even before passing halfcourt) he dribbles to advance the rock and his dribble is (improved but) still not that good. He is a NON-shooting SG because he is NOT a gifted passer or ball handler. His assists come within the flow of the offense ... he isn't a playmaker himself.

In short, he displays almost NONE of the qualities you would want in a starting PG. Even as a backup PG he is wanting.

I have bee saying this sice we drafted him. He would fit really well on a team that had a point forward like Dallas. If Frank could just become a league average spot up shooter he would be very valuable

We are getting there........