Knicks · Yes it’s early but here’s the 2020 NBA draft thread. (page 55)

rpknicks wrote:We're leaning PG with the our first pick this year because as much as vassell or okoro can help, the '21 draft class is wing heavy in the lottery and somewhat thin at PG. That's just enough to swing a tough choice and to break it down further, I think our pick is going to be kira lewis.

NBA is a wing league just as much as it’s a pg league. You cannot have enough 3 and D wingmen. RJ is more of a point forward anyway so let’s start stocking up on wings

ekstarks94 wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

martin wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

wargames wrote:It came out that Obi worked out for the Knicks so we now know they worked out both Kira and Obi.

I'd be surprised if Thibs had Obi ranked that high, but he might see enough to make him think his defense is workable. I'm having a hard time seeing it tho. Obi's defense is like Covid. Once it infects you're team defense, it corrodes it at every level.

I don't like Obi long term for the Knicks but here is another angle: At pick 8 Obi may be very good value. Think of the value that Channing Frye had for a hot minute when he was a rookie, only more athletic. Obi may be the most ready to contribute for all of the rookies and, given the chance, will put up offensive numbers.

Then, when value goes up, you trade him.

Good point. Channing was performing at a historic level for a stretch in his rookie year, during an era when centers had more value. Obi might catch fire like that. I can also see Obi becoming another Derrick Williams, a comp that isn't as far off as you might think, where he just ends up becoming a sunk cost. Obi could also end up becoming MPJ, another guy whose offense is negated by historically bad levels of defense. I'd be OK with that outcome, I guess. At pick 14 it's a good gamble. At pick 8, I might want a little a more stability from a prospect

We should of traded Frye to Phil and the Lakers...I think I recall Phil salivating for him...

Shoulda drafted Bynum but that dude also fizzled out

Uptown wrote:Are the Knicks locked-in on Lewis and or Vassell?

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Hopefully yes

Sangfroid wrote:

martin wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

wargames wrote:It came out that Obi worked out for the Knicks so we now know they worked out both Kira and Obi.

I'd be surprised if Thibs had Obi ranked that high, but he might see enough to make him think his defense is workable. I'm having a hard time seeing it tho. Obi's defense is like Covid. Once it infects you're team defense, it corrodes it at every level.

I don't like Obi long term for the Knicks but here is another angle: At pick 8 Obi may be very good value. Think of the value that Channing Frye had for a hot minute when he was a rookie, only more athletic. Obi may be the most ready to contribute for all of the rookies and, given the chance, will put up offensive numbers.

Then, when value goes up, you trade him.

If Obi is available when the Knicks come to the board, I take him and drop kick Randle to the moon.

I don’t think Obi makes it to us at 8

Uptown wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

Uptown wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:I think I pick up the phone if Orlando calls. We can swap Gordon for Randle.
https://nbadraft.theringer.com/#mock

League sources say the Magic are attempting to move up into the lottery by packaging this pick with Aaron Gordon. If they stay put, Maxey would potentially provide lottery value and immediately inject life as an energetic presence and a hard-nosed defender. Though Markelle Fultz’s resurgence makes for a nice story, he’s still yet to prove he can reliably shoot the ball. Maxey is further along as a scorer off the dribble, which could push Fultz into his ideal role as a supercharged Shaun Livingston.

Something to think about...Gordon is only the books for 2 more years. He would have a tradeable contract next year at the deadline it he doesn't work out. I think most people are still waiting for Gordon to blossom into a much better player but it just hasn't happened yet. I'm not much of a Randle fan, but he has put up better numbers than Gordon thus far...

With that said, if the Knicks pull the trigger it would be because of the potential Gordon still possesses and the ability to grab the player they covet @ 15. Okoro, Vassell and Nesmith will probably be off the board by then, but I think Maxey, Lewis and Terry will still be available.

The one thing Gordon clearly does better than Randle is move the ball. We'd average about 3 less spinovers a game. He's also a more versatile defender. His three point shooting is erractic, but the same goes for Randle. Randle isn't bad, but I'm just tired of his crap. Maybe Thibs reigns him in?

Spinovers (SIP Crush)...Agreed on the defensive end. Randle is undersized and plays defense as if he is disinterested. Trading Randle and 8 and for Gordon and 15 is something I would definitely consider....

I’d rather stay at 8 and try to use Randle as trade bait for Paul or Westbrook

I actually can see Randle and a Harden playing well together. Westbrook shoots all night and Randle can camp in the crease to get rebounds and put backs

Philc1 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

Uptown wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:I think I pick up the phone if Orlando calls. We can swap Gordon for Randle.
https://nbadraft.theringer.com/#mock

League sources say the Magic are attempting to move up into the lottery by packaging this pick with Aaron Gordon. If they stay put, Maxey would potentially provide lottery value and immediately inject life as an energetic presence and a hard-nosed defender. Though Markelle Fultz’s resurgence makes for a nice story, he’s still yet to prove he can reliably shoot the ball. Maxey is further along as a scorer off the dribble, which could push Fultz into his ideal role as a supercharged Shaun Livingston.

Something to think about...Gordon is only the books for 2 more years. He would have a tradeable contract next year at the deadline it he doesn't work out. I think most people are still waiting for Gordon to blossom into a much better player but it just hasn't happened yet. I'm not much of a Randle fan, but he has put up better numbers than Gordon thus far...

With that said, if the Knicks pull the trigger it would be because of the potential Gordon still possesses and the ability to grab the player they covet @ 15. Okoro, Vassell and Nesmith will probably be off the board by then, but I think Maxey, Lewis and Terry will still be available.

The one thing Gordon clearly does better than Randle is move the ball. We'd average about 3 less spinovers a game. He's also a more versatile defender. His three point shooting is erractic, but the same goes for Randle. Randle isn't bad, but I'm just tired of his crap. Maybe Thibs reigns him in?

Spinovers (SIP Crush)...Agreed on the defensive end. Randle is undersized and plays defense as if he is disinterested. Trading Randle and 8 and for Gordon and 15 is something I would definitely consider....

I’d rather stay at 8 and try to use Randle as trade bait for Paul or Westbrook

I actually can see Randle and a Harden playing well together. Westbrook shoots all night and Randle can camp in the crease to get rebounds and put backs

I don't understand the push for Westbrook. Houston would love to move that contract but why must we continue to be the franchise that other teams dump their garbage on? He's on the books for 3 more years 41, 44 and 47 mil! Other than selling a few jerseys and maybe putting a few more fans in the seats, he will not have much of an impact on winning. Maybe we compete for the 8th seed over the next 2 years or so and then we are right back here, in limbo, 3 years from now. The idea that he wants to leave Houston is an indication that he wants the ball in his hands because he wants his numbers. Not sure if winning is his number 1 priority right now. No Thanks to Westbrook!

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Uptown wrote:

Philc1 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

Uptown wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:I think I pick up the phone if Orlando calls. We can swap Gordon for Randle.
https://nbadraft.theringer.com/#mock

League sources say the Magic are attempting to move up into the lottery by packaging this pick with Aaron Gordon. If they stay put, Maxey would potentially provide lottery value and immediately inject life as an energetic presence and a hard-nosed defender. Though Markelle Fultz’s resurgence makes for a nice story, he’s still yet to prove he can reliably shoot the ball. Maxey is further along as a scorer off the dribble, which could push Fultz into his ideal role as a supercharged Shaun Livingston.

Something to think about...Gordon is only the books for 2 more years. He would have a tradeable contract next year at the deadline it he doesn't work out. I think most people are still waiting for Gordon to blossom into a much better player but it just hasn't happened yet. I'm not much of a Randle fan, but he has put up better numbers than Gordon thus far...

With that said, if the Knicks pull the trigger it would be because of the potential Gordon still possesses and the ability to grab the player they covet @ 15. Okoro, Vassell and Nesmith will probably be off the board by then, but I think Maxey, Lewis and Terry will still be available.

The one thing Gordon clearly does better than Randle is move the ball. We'd average about 3 less spinovers a game. He's also a more versatile defender. His three point shooting is erractic, but the same goes for Randle. Randle isn't bad, but I'm just tired of his crap. Maybe Thibs reigns him in?

Spinovers (SIP Crush)...Agreed on the defensive end. Randle is undersized and plays defense as if he is disinterested. Trading Randle and 8 and for Gordon and 15 is something I would definitely consider....

I’d rather stay at 8 and try to use Randle as trade bait for Paul or Westbrook

I actually can see Randle and a Harden playing well together. Westbrook shoots all night and Randle can camp in the crease to get rebounds and put backs

I don't understand the push for Westbrook. Houston would love to move that contract but why must we continue to be the franchise that other teams dump their garbage on? He's on the books for 3 more years 41, 44 and 47 mil! Other than selling a few jerseys and maybe putting a few more fans in the seats, he will not have much of an impact on winning. Maybe we compete for the 8th seed over the next 2 years or so and then we are right back here, in limbo, 3 years from now. The idea that he wants to leave Houston is an indication that he wants the ball in his hands because he wants his numbers. Not sure if winning is his number 1 priority right now. No Thanks to Westbrook!

Again I’ll keep saying this. It’s the years and not the money that’s important. 3 years is actually not that bad. Forget about 2021 free agency the Knicks will strike out yet again. I have a better shot of getting Jessica Alba than the Knicks have of getting Giannis

Westbrook will be declining soon but he has about 2 years left playing at an elite level and one of those years is a shortened season. By year 3 Westbrook will be an expiring contract we could use as trade bait

smackeddog wrote:Yikes, I wonder what caused Cole to drop so far and fast and for the Knicks to not even bother having any contact with him:

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Maybe he’s there at 27

Philc1 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

Philc1 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

Uptown wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:I think I pick up the phone if Orlando calls. We can swap Gordon for Randle.
https://nbadraft.theringer.com/#mock

League sources say the Magic are attempting to move up into the lottery by packaging this pick with Aaron Gordon. If they stay put, Maxey would potentially provide lottery value and immediately inject life as an energetic presence and a hard-nosed defender. Though Markelle Fultz’s resurgence makes for a nice story, he’s still yet to prove he can reliably shoot the ball. Maxey is further along as a scorer off the dribble, which could push Fultz into his ideal role as a supercharged Shaun Livingston.

Something to think about...Gordon is only the books for 2 more years. He would have a tradeable contract next year at the deadline it he doesn't work out. I think most people are still waiting for Gordon to blossom into a much better player but it just hasn't happened yet. I'm not much of a Randle fan, but he has put up better numbers than Gordon thus far...

With that said, if the Knicks pull the trigger it would be because of the potential Gordon still possesses and the ability to grab the player they covet @ 15. Okoro, Vassell and Nesmith will probably be off the board by then, but I think Maxey, Lewis and Terry will still be available.

The one thing Gordon clearly does better than Randle is move the ball. We'd average about 3 less spinovers a game. He's also a more versatile defender. His three point shooting is erractic, but the same goes for Randle. Randle isn't bad, but I'm just tired of his crap. Maybe Thibs reigns him in?

Spinovers (SIP Crush)...Agreed on the defensive end. Randle is undersized and plays defense as if he is disinterested. Trading Randle and 8 and for Gordon and 15 is something I would definitely consider....

I’d rather stay at 8 and try to use Randle as trade bait for Paul or Westbrook

I actually can see Randle and a Harden playing well together. Westbrook shoots all night and Randle can camp in the crease to get rebounds and put backs

I don't understand the push for Westbrook. Houston would love to move that contract but why must we continue to be the franchise that other teams dump their garbage on? He's on the books for 3 more years 41, 44 and 47 mil! Other than selling a few jerseys and maybe putting a few more fans in the seats, he will not have much of an impact on winning. Maybe we compete for the 8th seed over the next 2 years or so and then we are right back here, in limbo, 3 years from now. The idea that he wants to leave Houston is an indication that he wants the ball in his hands because he wants his numbers. Not sure if winning is his number 1 priority right now. No Thanks to Westbrook!

Again I’ll keep saying this. It’s the years and not the money that’s important. 3 years is actually not that bad. Forget about 2021 free agency the Knicks will strike out yet again. I have a better shot of getting Jessica Alba than the Knicks have of getting Giannis

Westbrook will be declining soon but he has about 2 years left playing at an elite level and one of those years is a shortened season. By year 3 Westbrook will be an expiring contract we could use as trade bait

The sooner we get out of the fantasy speculation about the latest expiring superstar coming, the better. Westbrook is the bird in hand. Unless there are better options why spend time arguing about third tier free agents who work cheap?

fwk00 wrote:

Philc1 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

Philc1 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

Uptown wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:I think I pick up the phone if Orlando calls. We can swap Gordon for Randle.
https://nbadraft.theringer.com/#mock

League sources say the Magic are attempting to move up into the lottery by packaging this pick with Aaron Gordon. If they stay put, Maxey would potentially provide lottery value and immediately inject life as an energetic presence and a hard-nosed defender. Though Markelle Fultz’s resurgence makes for a nice story, he’s still yet to prove he can reliably shoot the ball. Maxey is further along as a scorer off the dribble, which could push Fultz into his ideal role as a supercharged Shaun Livingston.

Something to think about...Gordon is only the books for 2 more years. He would have a tradeable contract next year at the deadline it he doesn't work out. I think most people are still waiting for Gordon to blossom into a much better player but it just hasn't happened yet. I'm not much of a Randle fan, but he has put up better numbers than Gordon thus far...

With that said, if the Knicks pull the trigger it would be because of the potential Gordon still possesses and the ability to grab the player they covet @ 15. Okoro, Vassell and Nesmith will probably be off the board by then, but I think Maxey, Lewis and Terry will still be available.

The one thing Gordon clearly does better than Randle is move the ball. We'd average about 3 less spinovers a game. He's also a more versatile defender. His three point shooting is erractic, but the same goes for Randle. Randle isn't bad, but I'm just tired of his crap. Maybe Thibs reigns him in?

Spinovers (SIP Crush)...Agreed on the defensive end. Randle is undersized and plays defense as if he is disinterested. Trading Randle and 8 and for Gordon and 15 is something I would definitely consider....

I’d rather stay at 8 and try to use Randle as trade bait for Paul or Westbrook

I actually can see Randle and a Harden playing well together. Westbrook shoots all night and Randle can camp in the crease to get rebounds and put backs

I don't understand the push for Westbrook. Houston would love to move that contract but why must we continue to be the franchise that other teams dump their garbage on? He's on the books for 3 more years 41, 44 and 47 mil! Other than selling a few jerseys and maybe putting a few more fans in the seats, he will not have much of an impact on winning. Maybe we compete for the 8th seed over the next 2 years or so and then we are right back here, in limbo, 3 years from now. The idea that he wants to leave Houston is an indication that he wants the ball in his hands because he wants his numbers. Not sure if winning is his number 1 priority right now. No Thanks to Westbrook!

Again I’ll keep saying this. It’s the years and not the money that’s important. 3 years is actually not that bad. Forget about 2021 free agency the Knicks will strike out yet again. I have a better shot of getting Jessica Alba than the Knicks have of getting Giannis

Westbrook will be declining soon but he has about 2 years left playing at an elite level and one of those years is a shortened season. By year 3 Westbrook will be an expiring contract we could use as trade bait

The sooner we get out of the fantasy speculation about the latest expiring superstar coming, the better. Westbrook is the bird in hand. Unless there are better options why spend time arguing about third tier free agents who work cheap?

It's not just the latest expiring superstar. You also need shooters, defenders and other role players. Also, you have to pay the prospects that do pop. A $50m black hole in the middle of the salary cap makes that difficult.

The Knicks might be seriously considering jumping up to the top 3. And the price for that is either RJ or Mitch!

Is Lamelo better than RJ? If i were to choose, id rather stick with RJ.i feel LaMelo can be the type of player that will be distracted by the bright lights of NY. Is Wiseman better than Mitch? For this one im still undecided i might be ok with this if only its a Mitch for wiseman deal but i think there is still a future unprotected or top 3 protected pick involved. The price is too high while the gains wont be much better.

A trade up is definitely being considered, for me this is a typical knicks move. I hope this doesn't happen.

Jimbo5 wrote:https://thespun.com/nba/new-york-knicks/...

The Knicks might be seriously considering jumping up to the top 3. And the price for that is either RJ or Mitch!

Is Lamelo better than RJ? If i were to choose, id rather stick with RJ.i feel LaMelo can be the type of player that will be distracted by the bright lights of NY. Is Wiseman better than Mitch? For this one im still undecided i might be ok with this if only its a Mitch for wiseman deal but i think there is still a future unprotected or top 3 protected pick involved. The price is too high while the gains wont be much better.

A trade up is definitely being considered, for me this is a typical knicks move. I hope this doesn't happen.

According to NBA insider Chad Ford

Jimbo5 wrote:I hope that is the case bigDaddyG. Not a fan of lateral moves

Even Chad Ford has backed away from the aggregated POS article.

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BigDaddyG wrote:

Jimbo5 wrote:I hope that is the case bigDaddyG. Not a fan of lateral moves

Even Chad Ford has backed away from the aggregated POS article.

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This one is somewhat reassuring. As expected Thibs is pushing for win now moves. As long as the price is right and we can still have some of our youth in the roster to be able to sustain a long term sustainable run. Being able to keep 1 first rounder each year moving forward is ideal. il be ok with some win now moves.

Im assuming thats trading for Westbrook for peanuts/cap space relief and maybe a sign and trade for Hayward. A sign and trade might be a cheaper option than trading for a second star.

Jimbo5 wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

Jimbo5 wrote:I hope that is the case bigDaddyG. Not a fan of lateral moves

Even Chad Ford has backed away from the aggregated POS article.

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This one is somewhat reassuring. As expected Thibs is pushing for win now moves. As long as the price is right and we can still have some of our youth in the roster to be able to sustain a long term sustainable run. Being able to keep 1 first rounder each year moving forward is ideal. il be ok with some win now moves.

Im assuming thats trading for Westbrook for peanuts/cap space relief and maybe a sign and trade for Hayward. A sign and trade might be a cheaper option than trading for a second star.

I hear you. But the reason they'll be cheaper is that their signings carry risk. I'm not onboard with going all out to sign FVV, but at least I have a degree of confidence that he'll last through his next deal at a consistent level of performance. Even Westbrook, whose contract is horrendous, should still be a top 10 PG in two years. Haywood and Oladipo are major gambles due to their injury histories. Sometimes the gamble pays off. Most times you're the Lakers scrambling to find a body because DeMarcus Cousins had his 30th major leg injury in an 8 month span. Do you think Haywood and Dipo are worth that gamble?