Knicks · Would you give up 2 Dallas Picks for Masai pre 2020 draft? (page 3)

off topic: does anyone know the deal with Mark Warkentien

He like Ujiri is a former Nuggets guy (where he won NBA executive of the year a decade back). How could we have someone so accomplished in our FO and be so lousy?

is he a President type? anyone know the scoop?

Chandler wrote:

djsunyc wrote:

Chandler wrote:

martin wrote:For reference, Knicks got 1 pick and $ for Riley going to Miami. Not same circumstance but Miami does that swap without thinking twice

If I'm not mistaken, Riley went as a coach -- not far removed from Doc Rivers and other coachs

Masai is good but he's made mistakes too. E.g., Jakob Poetl (our pick from Barg trade); delon wright, Caboclo ???

His second round picks have been meh and i would argue Perry has done a better job in second round in two years than Ujiri has done in his 5+ with Toronto

He certainly hit a home run with Siakim and assembling a roster based on results (rather than draft status). Also took gnads to fire (COY) Casey. Props for getting Kawhi and Gasol

That said, i don't think he totally has the Midas touch, and mixed feelings about whether he can turn around a dysfunctional organization.

If we're talking two firsts, i'd rather do that to get Budenholzer as a coach, which would be more in line with the Riley situation

the status of the raptors organization before ujiri came aboard was poor.

there is no other gm better thn ujiri in the league. you can find few gms in the same tier (ainge/morey) but nobody better.

i am not sure what your (or anybody's) hold up would be. ujiri's undrafted and 2nd round signings are better than many teams lotto picks including the knicks.

with all that said, this is more media hustle. don't get your hopes up.

I respect that you're a Raptors fan but this is his draft record with Toronto. So I'm not buying your statement about his second rounders being good. They weren't. He hit a home run with Siakim but keep in mind if he had the crystal ball vision that Siakim would turn out the way he has he would have drafted him with the 9 pick (Poltl).

2014: Caboclo
2d: DeAndre Daniels; Xavier Thames
2015: Delon Wright
2016: Poltl (Fishmike just posted the guys taken later than Poltl)
Siakim (one of the better ones after Poltl)
2017: OG Anunoby
2019: 2d Dewan Hernandez

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toronto_Raptors_draft_history

He's a very good GM and the sexy name but not worth big compensation. Denver has done a lot of what Raptors have done, e.g., success with second rounders etc. and is a top team (despite trading the draft slots that yielded Gobert and Donovan Mitchell). Ujiri is not a unicorn

Quick quesiton: who knows Denver's GM (without Googling). Exactly. That's the kind of GM i want. Unknown, boring but gets results (even though he too will make mistakes -- see Gobert and Mitchell)

i made a post a week ago in another thread about his drafting. after 2014, he's drafted, at the very least, quality nba rotation players. and every single one of his non lotto picks or undrafted signees have made nba rotations. you bring up delon wright - he was a top 8 rotation guy for the 50+ win raptors teams and is now a top rotation guy with the winning mavs.

og anunoby is a defensive beast - look at his advanced stats. he also lost a year of development last year with some personal tragedy and freak injuries.

dewan just got drafted. he's been hurt all year. he is part of our development system - give him another 2 years and he'll be a rotation big.

that's not to mention fleet and terance davis (who everyone says how the heck he wasn't drafted in the first round).

peoltl was very good for us his rookie year. believe it or not - the spurs hindered his development. we actually have a better development system - and he was part of the kawhi deal.

but regardless of that - i'm still a bit confused about "results". the nuggets haven't advanced in the playoffs yet. how is that results compared to a team that is 7-3 in the playoffs since 2016 with all 3 losses only to lebron?

every gm has blemishes but ujiri is cream of the crop. there's only like 3-4 gm's in that class. he brings immediate gravity and professionalism.

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/25...
Masai Ujiri "intends to maneuver his way to the Knicks" according to "two people in the league whom (Marc Stein) trust[s] deeply for their reads on this situation."

The Knicks removed Steve Mills as president of the team on Tuesday.

One of the sources also said he believes Larry Tannenbaum of MLSE would ultimately allow Ujiri out of his contract.

Ujiri joined the Toronto Raptors in 2013 and helped lead them to a title in 2019. Ujiri's contract runs through the 20-21 season.

I don't get all the love for this guy, but whatever!

fishmike wrote:https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/25...
Masai Ujiri "intends to maneuver his way to the Knicks" according to "two people in the league whom (Marc Stein) trust[s] deeply for their reads on this situation."

The Knicks removed Steve Mills as president of the team on Tuesday.

One of the sources also said he believes Larry Tannenbaum of MLSE would ultimately allow Ujiri out of his contract.

Ujiri joined the Toronto Raptors in 2013 and helped lead them to a title in 2019. Ujiri's contract runs through the 20-21 season.

he referred to them as ujiri-watchers lololol

Ok why not go after the guy that build the warriors, drafted well , good freeagency, good system, won a few championships, or go after the folks in the Spurs drafted really well and an awesome system been in the mix for years and won a few championships, but we run with media driven guy from Toronto who just won one and couldn't convince the guy who helped them win it to stay? Really. S guy who said now clap for this I really hate the Knicks in an interview. But according to the media Zion, kd and Kyrie were a lock.
Honestly I dunno

djsunyc wrote:

fishmike wrote:https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/25...
Masai Ujiri "intends to maneuver his way to the Knicks" according to "two people in the league whom (Marc Stein) trust[s] deeply for their reads on this situation."

The Knicks removed Steve Mills as president of the team on Tuesday.

One of the sources also said he believes Larry Tannenbaum of MLSE would ultimately allow Ujiri out of his contract.

Ujiri joined the Toronto Raptors in 2013 and helped lead them to a title in 2019. Ujiri's contract runs through the 20-21 season.

he referred to them as ujiri-watchers lololol

Yeah, I went on a Ujiri watch on a boat in Maine once.

dacash wrote:Ok why not go after the guy that build the warriors, drafted well , good freeagency, good system, won a few championships, or go after the folks in the Spurs drafted really well and an awesome system been in the mix for years and won a few championships, but we run with media driven guy from Toronto who just won one and couldn't convince the guy who helped them win it to stay? Really. S guy who said now clap for this I really hate the Knicks in an interview. But according to the media Zion, kd and Kyrie were a lock.
Honestly I dunno

Spurs drafted Duncan. It makes one look smart. Not taking anything away form them. But that was along time ago. You can’t but another’s past.
Just remember before these guys were somebody, somebody had faith in their ability. Ujiri in Denver. I’m not sure why they let him go. Was it the money? Or the Challange for him? He pulically said “F-NY”? He did that to get media off his ass?
Let’s put it this way if the man wants to come, he needs to maneuver it. He has cred. Thats important.
As for Spurs? Great owner who made it happen. Denver, Kronke’s got their act together when the recognized the hit the ceiling with Melo. Thats not a slight on him. Knicks won 54 games a few years later. They won 57. neither sustained but Denver had a plan longer term.
Dolan can get his act together. But it will take time. No matter how much fans want it, we still a few seasons away. Ujiri or not.

Nalod wrote:

dacash wrote:Ok why not go after the guy that build the warriors, drafted well , good freeagency, good system, won a few championships, or go after the folks in the Spurs drafted really well and an awesome system been in the mix for years and won a few championships, but we run with media driven guy from Toronto who just won one and couldn't convince the guy who helped them win it to stay? Really. S guy who said now clap for this I really hate the Knicks in an interview. But according to the media Zion, kd and Kyrie were a lock.
Honestly I dunno

Spurs drafted Duncan. It makes one look smart. Not taking anything away form them. But that was along time ago. You can’t but another’s past.
Just remember before these guys were somebody, somebody had faith in their ability. Ujiri in Denver. I’m not sure why they let him go. Was it the money? Or the Challange for him? He pulically said “F-NY”? He did that to get media off his ass?
Let’s put it this way if the man wants to come, he needs to maneuver it. He has cred. Thats important.
As for Spurs? Great owner who made it happen. Denver, Kronke’s got their act together when the recognized the hit the ceiling with Melo. Thats not a slight on him. Knicks won 54 games a few years later. They won 57. neither sustained but Denver had a plan longer term.
Dolan can get his act together. But it will take time. No matter how much fans want it, we still a few seasons away. Ujiri or not.

They let him go in Denver because he really did nothing.
And the Spurs drafted alit more than Duncan and put in a great system.
I'm not saying ujiri us a scrub but why not go after guys that have doing it longer. Hell everything Jerry west touches makes it deep in the playoffs. Why not him?

I’m probably on board with 1 protected pick. Those Dallas picks are looking like 2nd rd picks anyway. Taking Masai from Toronto is a benefit to us and a huge loss to them. Can’t see Toronto really considering it, honestly. I’d want him out of my conference if I have rights to restrict where he goes. If they would let him go, it’s because he did so much for Toronto, including a chip, and they just want good karma. At which point, doesn’t really matter what the compensation would be.

dacash wrote:

Nalod wrote:

dacash wrote:Ok why not go after the guy that build the warriors, drafted well , good freeagency, good system, won a few championships, or go after the folks in the Spurs drafted really well and an awesome system been in the mix for years and won a few championships, but we run with media driven guy from Toronto who just won one and couldn't convince the guy who helped them win it to stay? Really. S guy who said now clap for this I really hate the Knicks in an interview. But according to the media Zion, kd and Kyrie were a lock.
Honestly I dunno

Spurs drafted Duncan. It makes one look smart. Not taking anything away form them. But that was along time ago. You can’t but another’s past.
Just remember before these guys were somebody, somebody had faith in their ability. Ujiri in Denver. I’m not sure why they let him go. Was it the money? Or the Challange for him? He pulically said “F-NY”? He did that to get media off his ass?
Let’s put it this way if the man wants to come, he needs to maneuver it. He has cred. Thats important.
As for Spurs? Great owner who made it happen. Denver, Kronke’s got their act together when the recognized the hit the ceiling with Melo. Thats not a slight on him. Knicks won 54 games a few years later. They won 57. neither sustained but Denver had a plan longer term.
Dolan can get his act together. But it will take time. No matter how much fans want it, we still a few seasons away. Ujiri or not.

They let him go in Denver because he really did nothing.
And the Spurs drafted alit more than Duncan and put in a great system.
I'm not saying ujiri us a scrub but why not go after guys that have doing it longer. Hell everything Jerry west touches makes it deep in the playoffs. Why not him?

The logo is old. He also get a bit more credit Post Memphis gig with being a “exult I’ve board member” in GS and with Clippers. I think there were efforts to get him to NY but I recall he was not interested. The logo is 81. We like Jerry. MSG will kill him.

Time for a new man to pave his own path to glory. Or get rich trying!! LOL

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You can only hope the names being banded about are an attempt to make ujiri sweat and force his way out, but I’m worried we’re not going to wait until the offseason when we might have a shot at Presti or morey. Mills firing now has me worried we already have made up our minds

I know i'll get ridiculed for this but NY is still a prime destination for GM or President

Can pay $$$ -- doesn't impact cap

NYC is a great place to be, especially if you have $$$ (see above)

If you win, you will be a hero.

Biggest issue is you will need to show some improvement to the organization fairly immediately and continue to improve, or Dolan's loyalty (which he has shown at points) will evaporate.

I don't want an agent-turned-GM because i am fundamentally opposed to using FA to build a team -- if your team stinks. Losers game

ad hoc tuning -- fine use a FA; getting a FA when his value is way down, sure I'd consider. But chasing wins by overpaying for a player (not FA but Russel is exhibit A) is the kiss of death to stay mediocre or worse

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Jesus

Represents Towns. Obviously Dolan seems to think free agency and signing big FAs is the key rather than developing talent and drafting wisely. same crap over and over again.

Represented old favorites, Eddy Curry, Balkman, mardy Collins, Melo, JR Smith, so has a relationship with Dolan.