Knicks · Rotation going forward (page 1)

With the injuries, thibs has had it easy in terms of rotation. Now quickley and rivers are back and Burks will be back soon.

Thibs won’t rock the boat so Mitch, Randle, Barrett, Bullock and Payton will continue to start for the foreseeable future. Quickley, Rivers and Burks will all be staples in the rotation for bigger minutes. That’s 8.

I think when Toppin comes back real decisions will be made. For now both Knox and Noel will serve as 9th and 10th men. But once Obi returns he likely takes both of their minutes as backup 4/5 and leaves both of them fighting for spot minutes.

Robinson (30 mpg) Randle (34) Barrett (36) Bullock (26) Payton (30)
Total bench minutes available 84: Burks (24) Toppin (22) Rivers (20) Quickley (18)

Rivers probably fights for more minutes and Barrett plays some small ball 4 to accommodate the wing depth. I don’t see a path for minutes from Frank or DSJ and Knox and Noel will really be pinched. Obviously that’s with everyone healthy which may not happen often. But Thibs will have to make some tough decisions soon as I don’t see him going with more than 9 on a regular basis given the heavy minutes he gives to Randle and Barrett.

Glad you wrote this. I agree somewhat but I am open to replacing Bullock with Burcks.

You add Quickley and Burks to the line up and it gives us more efficient firepower.

rotation

Robinson
Randle
Bullock/ Burks
Barrett
Payton
Noel
Burks/Bullock
Rivers
Quickley
Toppin

Knox is on the border right now

BRIGGS wrote:Glad you wrote this. I agree somewhat but I am open to replacing Bullock with Burcks.

You add Quickley and Burks to the line up and it gives us more efficient firepower.

rotation

Robinson
Randle
Bullock/ Burks
Barrett
Payton
Noel
Burks/Bullock
Rivers
Quickley
Toppin

Knox is on the border right now

IQ and Burks for me over Payton & Bullock. I don’t see Thibs giving the keys to IQ just yet tho...

BRIGGS wrote:Glad you wrote this. I agree somewhat but I am open to replacing Bullock with Burcks.

You add Quickley and Burks to the line up and it gives us more efficient firepower.

rotation

Robinson
Randle
Bullock/ Burks
Barrett
Payton
Noel
Burks/Bullock
Rivers
Quickley
Toppin

Knox is on the border right now

I completely agree. I hope rivers or Burks ends up replacing Bullock and Bullock becomes a low minutes reserve. Obviously my hope is quickley earns a bigger role as well. But my point is thibs will stay with what’s working for now and the foreseeable future even with a full roster. Knox is very much on the border. I’m still not writing him off by any means. He is 21 and may be in and out of the rotation this year but have an off-season with Payne and come back better. He’s showing progress, just not enough to secure his role in what appears to be a crowded rotation.

But hopefully eventually the starting lineup is Mitch, Randle, Barrett, Burks and Quickley but it could be next year until we see that.

I haven't really honed in on Burks' D but I'd guess that he is not starting - if his shooting and scoring prowess has been there from start (in practice) and continues - is that he becomes the offensive focal point for the bench squad. Starting Burks with RJ may also take away from what they want RJ to do and become as a starter.

Bullock may be the better wing defender too but I can't tell.

Knixkik wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Glad you wrote this. I agree somewhat but I am open to replacing Bullock with Burcks.

You add Quickley and Burks to the line up and it gives us more efficient firepower.

rotation

Robinson
Randle
Bullock/ Burks
Barrett
Payton
Noel
Burks/Bullock
Rivers
Quickley
Toppin

Knox is on the border right now

I completely agree. I hope rivers or Burks ends up replacing Bullock and Bullock becomes a low minutes reserve. Obviously my hope is quickley earns a bigger role as well. But my point is thibs will stay with what’s working for now and the foreseeable future even with a full roster. Knox is very much on the border. I’m still not writing him off by any means. He is 21 and may be in and out of the rotation this year but have an off-season with Payne and come back better. He’s showing progress, just not enough to secure his role in what appears to be a crowded rotation.

But hopefully eventually the starting lineup is Mitch, Randle, Barrett, Burks and Quickley but it could be next year until we see that.

Also got to keep Noel in as the C back up. Hes done a very good job.

Starters : Payton, Bullock, RJ, Randle, Mitch

Second Unit : Rivers, Quick, Burks, Toppin, Noel

Out of rotation - Frank, Knox

Out of the league - DSJR

I know I’m in the minority here, but ideally I would like to see Burks start until he gets traded, Bullock moved for a second rounder and have Frank and Knox get 15 minutes a night. I loved what I saw from Knox driving to the basket vs Toronto.

I think with the defense and coaching this team we will hang in most games and win our fair share. It would be great to see us make the playoffs, but the team as currently constructed is likely going to need another lottery pick especially in this draft to get one more good young player to move in a bigger package or add long term depth.

Quickly and Rivers need to play together and we should keep Rivers for the entirety of his deal. Quick is playing 10 years in this league, he’s smart and just knows how to play.

It’s a good problem to have, 12 guys that can play minutes.

Moreso than the rotation, I'm curious how Thibs will distribute the minutes once the team is fully healthy. RJ played 42 mins yesterday and Randle is averaging 38 mins per game which is 1st or second in the league. Thibs has a history of running his starters into the ground and I thought I heard him mention a change in philosophy during one of his interviews before the season.

Once everyone is back, I'm sure those numbers will come down, at least slightly but hopefully his bench players aint on a short leash...

MS wrote:Starters : Payton, Bullock, RJ, Randle, Mitch

Second Unit : Rivers, Quick, Burks, Toppin, Noel

Out of rotation - Frank, Knox

Out of the league - DSJR

I know I’m in the minority here, but ideally I would like to see Burks start until he gets traded, Bullock moved for a second rounder and have Frank and Knox get 15 minutes a night. I loved what I saw from Knox driving to the basket vs Toronto.

I think with the defense and coaching this team we will hang in most games and win our fair share. It would be great to see us make the playoffs, but the team as currently constructed is likely going to need another lottery pick especially in this draft to get one more good young player to move in a bigger package or add long term depth.

Quickly and Rivers need to play together and we should keep Rivers for the entirety of his deal. Quick is playing 10 years in this league, he’s smart and just knows how to play.

It’s a good problem to have, 12 guys that can play minutes.

I can see Thibs going with your projected rotation, and I would be upset if Frank and Knox, 2 players still on rookie deals in need of development get pushed out of the rotation for a couple of journeymen on 1 year deals who will probably not be here next year.

BRIGGS wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Glad you wrote this. I agree somewhat but I am open to replacing Bullock with Burcks.

You add Quickley and Burks to the line up and it gives us more efficient firepower.

rotation

Robinson
Randle
Bullock/ Burks
Barrett
Payton
Noel
Burks/Bullock
Rivers
Quickley
Toppin

Knox is on the border right now

I completely agree. I hope rivers or Burks ends up replacing Bullock and Bullock becomes a low minutes reserve. Obviously my hope is quickley earns a bigger role as well. But my point is thibs will stay with what’s working for now and the foreseeable future even with a full roster. Knox is very much on the border. I’m still not writing him off by any means. He is 21 and may be in and out of the rotation this year but have an off-season with Payne and come back better. He’s showing progress, just not enough to secure his role in what appears to be a crowded rotation.

But hopefully eventually the starting lineup is Mitch, Randle, Barrett, Burks and Quickley but it could be next year until we see that.

Also got to keep Noel in as the C back up. Hes done a very good job.

literally no he has not. Noel has 90 minutes and is -10 this year. He's got b2b games where he was -8 and really outplayed. He's looked slow and stiff against faster guys. If Mitch is giving 30 minutes a night those back center minutes are going to go to Obi when he's back.

Anyway I see the rotation like this:
PG: Elf/IQ
SG: RJ/Rivers
SF: Bullock/Knox
PF: Randle/Obi
C: Mitch
And those are gonna be your 9 guys. I suspect Noel out soon. He has not looked good. On the flip side Mitch is looking like a star player. His ability to follow our slashers to the basket really changes how defenses collapse on our guys. You cant leave Mitch to help or your getting dunked on or giving up an offensive board/put back and Mitch is really showing a positive impact on offense because of that. If he can learn to set a screen or pick he'll be a god

Also because of this suddenly Randle/Mitch are not such a bad spacing combo.

BRIGGS wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Glad you wrote this. I agree somewhat but I am open to replacing Bullock with Burcks.

You add Quickley and Burks to the line up and it gives us more efficient firepower.

rotation

Robinson
Randle
Bullock/ Burks
Barrett
Payton
Noel
Burks/Bullock
Rivers
Quickley
Toppin

Knox is on the border right now

I completely agree. I hope rivers or Burks ends up replacing Bullock and Bullock becomes a low minutes reserve. Obviously my hope is quickley earns a bigger role as well. But my point is thibs will stay with what’s working for now and the foreseeable future even with a full roster. Knox is very much on the border. I’m still not writing him off by any means. He is 21 and may be in and out of the rotation this year but have an off-season with Payne and come back better. He’s showing progress, just not enough to secure his role in what appears to be a crowded rotation.

But hopefully eventually the starting lineup is Mitch, Randle, Barrett, Burks and Quickley but it could be next year until we see that.

Also got to keep Noel in as the C back up. Hes done a very good job.

Maybe he gets spot minutes and will always see an increase when Mitch gets in foul trouble or is hurt, but I see thibs sticking mostly to a 3 big man rotation of Mitch, Randle and Toppin.

fishmike wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Glad you wrote this. I agree somewhat but I am open to replacing Bullock with Burcks.

You add Quickley and Burks to the line up and it gives us more efficient firepower.

rotation

Robinson
Randle
Bullock/ Burks
Barrett
Payton
Noel
Burks/Bullock
Rivers
Quickley
Toppin

Knox is on the border right now

I completely agree. I hope rivers or Burks ends up replacing Bullock and Bullock becomes a low minutes reserve. Obviously my hope is quickley earns a bigger role as well. But my point is thibs will stay with what’s working for now and the foreseeable future even with a full roster. Knox is very much on the border. I’m still not writing him off by any means. He is 21 and may be in and out of the rotation this year but have an off-season with Payne and come back better. He’s showing progress, just not enough to secure his role in what appears to be a crowded rotation.

But hopefully eventually the starting lineup is Mitch, Randle, Barrett, Burks and Quickley but it could be next year until we see that.

Also got to keep Noel in as the C back up. Hes done a very good job.

literally no he has not. Noel has 90 minutes and is -10 this year. He's got b2b games where he was -8 and really outplayed. He's looked slow and stiff against faster guys. If Mitch is giving 30 minutes a night those back center minutes are going to go to Obi when he's back.

Anyway I see the rotation like this:
PG: Elf/IQ
SG: RJ/Rivers
SF: Bullock/Knox
PF: Randle/Obi
C: Mitch
And those are gonna be your 9 guys. I suspect Noel out soon. He has not looked good. On the flip side Mitch is looking like a star player. His ability to follow our slashers to the basket really changes how defenses collapse on our guys. You cant leave Mitch to help or your getting dunked on or giving up an offensive board/put back and Mitch is really showing a positive impact on offense because of that. If he can learn to set a screen or pick he'll be a god

Also because of this suddenly Randle/Mitch are not such a bad spacing combo.

You dont think Burks cracks the rotation when returns? I know it was only 2 games but he was averaging near 20 pts and was our best 3 ball shooter.

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Glad you wrote this. I agree somewhat but I am open to replacing Bullock with Burcks.

You add Quickley and Burks to the line up and it gives us more efficient firepower.

rotation

Robinson
Randle
Bullock/ Burks
Barrett
Payton
Noel
Burks/Bullock
Rivers
Quickley
Toppin

Knox is on the border right now

I completely agree. I hope rivers or Burks ends up replacing Bullock and Bullock becomes a low minutes reserve. Obviously my hope is quickley earns a bigger role as well. But my point is thibs will stay with what’s working for now and the foreseeable future even with a full roster. Knox is very much on the border. I’m still not writing him off by any means. He is 21 and may be in and out of the rotation this year but have an off-season with Payne and come back better. He’s showing progress, just not enough to secure his role in what appears to be a crowded rotation.

But hopefully eventually the starting lineup is Mitch, Randle, Barrett, Burks and Quickley but it could be next year until we see that.

Also got to keep Noel in as the C back up. Hes done a very good job.

literally no he has not. Noel has 90 minutes and is -10 this year. He's got b2b games where he was -8 and really outplayed. He's looked slow and stiff against faster guys. If Mitch is giving 30 minutes a night those back center minutes are going to go to Obi when he's back.

Anyway I see the rotation like this:
PG: Elf/IQ
SG: RJ/Rivers
SF: Bullock/Knox
PF: Randle/Obi
C: Mitch
And those are gonna be your 9 guys. I suspect Noel out soon. He has not looked good. On the flip side Mitch is looking like a star player. His ability to follow our slashers to the basket really changes how defenses collapse on our guys. You cant leave Mitch to help or your getting dunked on or giving up an offensive board/put back and Mitch is really showing a positive impact on offense because of that. If he can learn to set a screen or pick he'll be a god

Also because of this suddenly Randle/Mitch are not such a bad spacing combo.

You dont think Burks cracks the rotation when returns? I know it was only 2 games but he was averaging near 20 pts and was our best 3 ball shooter.

knew I was forgetting someone... he's the 10th guy I was thinking of but not 10th in the rotation. He's OK defensively but yes he's been great scoring and will get good minutes at the 3 behind Bullock (I suspect one those guys cannibalizes the other's minutes). Obi will be the big behind Randle/Mitch and Knox is going to have to fight for minutes. He may be the odd man out. Noel is depth only IMO... Mitch is in foul trouble or turns an ankle

I think if he could stay healthy eventually it would be Frank over Bullock. Anyway, injuries and maybe Covid will be at play. Good to have some decent depth.

Let’s pretend nobody gets hurt no reset after each wind.
What happened to the “Randle off the bench” crowd?

But nalod, you ave to add something?
Yes, let Thibs do this thing with what he got and then judge how he does his job.
Surprised at Randle/Mitch spacing? Do you realize Randle brings the damn ball up quite often. Gets the ball on the elbow quite often? And if you double him by moving Mitch, his guy helps. Or When Payton penetrates and Randle clears out, Mitch is there for something. But IM not the coach. I’m just a fan enjoying this shyt. And if it turns bad, well then someone is not sleeping well.
Its a tough business.

I can see us starting Burks soon. I think having Rivers back is the key to the reshuffling some here seem to want.

Burks had been a key to our bench scoring, but Rivers brings that and shot creation. Can’t see Thibs not valuing the shooting from Burks as a more traditional SG with R.J. playing a more traditional SF. Burks also held his own on D. He was used as a PG out of necessity, but with Quick and Rivers back, he doesn’t have to. Frank coming back would further help this issue.

I think Bullock is better off on the bench, where his inconsistency can hurt less when you also have Rivers, Quick, Knox and Frank to bring. But Burks has been a constant good performer when he plays.

Another variable is starting Rivers at the 1, but I don’t think that happens.

Does not matter who starts. For me it's more important who finishes. And Thibs has shown thus far that he trusts who ever is playing well in crunch time. Last night he went with MR, Randle, RJ, Rivers, Payton. The 5 that were playing the best. That will change depending on who has it going. The way it should be. He will stay with same starting line up. No reason to change a good thing. Once healthy and if their good play continues, I think Burks and Rivers make a case to crack the starting line up or will probably be finishing games replacing Bullock and Payton. Although Payton has responded strong recently, I would like to see a Rivers, RJ, Burks, Randle, MR lineup. Think that may be our best. With Quick, Payton, Knox, Obi as reserves. Noel will need to back up MR depending on opposing big matchups. However, I for one trust Thibs. Who ever he picks is probably the one that has earned it.