Knicks · Noel needs some love (page 3)
knicks1248 wrote:ToddTT wrote:Annnnnnddd... hes out with a sore ankle.annnnnnd apparently it didn't even matter because we didn't miss a beat defensively without him or mitch..This teams chemistry on defense, and the defense philosophy is pretty damn good, and it looks like you can plug anyone in at the center position
Really. Is that what you think? Anybody can plug in at center?
How completely asinine.
KnickDanger wrote:That was some block tonight.
Incredible block and then the refs try to pull a fast one and call a flagrant on Noel next play to try to get the Mavs back in the game
Jimbo5 wrote:I think the knicks have finally found their center rotation with Mitch, Noel and Taj. These three players is a perfect match what Thibs is looking for the 5 spot. I hope the FO can find a way to keep atleast Mitch and Noel for the next 5 years atleast. When Mitch went down i thought thats the start of the knicks' decline for the season but Noel stepped up big time$
It'll be VERY interesting and telling to me how the Knicks FO handles these 2 guys. I think Taj (and Rose) will likely be back at min prices (at the minimum) dependent on trades/draft picks the Knicks make. I've been more impressed with Taj than Rose but both are great bench vets.
How much has Thibs SYSTEM been a factor in Noel/Mitch success as opposed to the talent of each. And does the FO think Mitch has enough potential (yes) and work ethic (TBD IMHO) combined to keep him at a substantial cost? It'll be interesting to see it play out
martin wrote:Jimbo5 wrote:I think the knicks have finally found their center rotation with Mitch, Noel and Taj. These three players is a perfect match what Thibs is looking for the 5 spot. I hope the FO can find a way to keep atleast Mitch and Noel for the next 5 years atleast. When Mitch went down i thought thats the start of the knicks' decline for the season but Noel stepped up big time$It'll be VERY interesting and telling to me how the Knicks FO handles these 2 guys. I think Taj (and Rose) will likely be back at min prices (at the minimum) dependent on trades/draft picks the Knicks make. I've been more impressed with Taj than Rose but both are great bench vets.
How much has Thibs SYSTEM been a factor in Noel/Mitch success as opposed to the talent of each. And does the FO think Mitch has enough potential (yes) and work ethic (TBD IMHO) combined to keep him at a substantial cost? It'll be interesting to see it play out
Why does Mitch's performance have to do with Thibs? Wasn't Mitch doing almost the same stuff last year?
Panos wrote:martin wrote:Jimbo5 wrote:I think the knicks have finally found their center rotation with Mitch, Noel and Taj. These three players is a perfect match what Thibs is looking for the 5 spot. I hope the FO can find a way to keep atleast Mitch and Noel for the next 5 years atleast. When Mitch went down i thought thats the start of the knicks' decline for the season but Noel stepped up big time$It'll be VERY interesting and telling to me how the Knicks FO handles these 2 guys. I think Taj (and Rose) will likely be back at min prices (at the minimum) dependent on trades/draft picks the Knicks make. I've been more impressed with Taj than Rose but both are great bench vets.
How much has Thibs SYSTEM been a factor in Noel/Mitch success as opposed to the talent of each. And does the FO think Mitch has enough potential (yes) and work ethic (TBD IMHO) combined to keep him at a substantial cost? It'll be interesting to see it play out
Why does Mitch's performance have to do with Thibs? Wasn't Mitch doing almost the same stuff last year?
Mitch wasn’t anchoring the #1 defense in the league. Mitch certainly has his own individual talent but being able to apply it in team environment to this degree hasn’t been there.
You PUNKED the guy who thought he surely had a poster dunk or easy shot, that's definitely deflating for him and his team, and your teammates are so pumped the start playing harder..
Noel definitely has a high IQ on the defense end, it's not just the effort, it's actually a skill with him
Panos wrote:martin wrote:Jimbo5 wrote:I think the knicks have finally found their center rotation with Mitch, Noel and Taj. These three players is a perfect match what Thibs is looking for the 5 spot. I hope the FO can find a way to keep atleast Mitch and Noel for the next 5 years atleast. When Mitch went down i thought thats the start of the knicks' decline for the season but Noel stepped up big time$It'll be VERY interesting and telling to me how the Knicks FO handles these 2 guys. I think Taj (and Rose) will likely be back at min prices (at the minimum) dependent on trades/draft picks the Knicks make. I've been more impressed with Taj than Rose but both are great bench vets.
How much has Thibs SYSTEM been a factor in Noel/Mitch success as opposed to the talent of each. And does the FO think Mitch has enough potential (yes) and work ethic (TBD IMHO) combined to keep him at a substantial cost? It'll be interesting to see it play out
Why does Mitch's performance have to do with Thibs? Wasn't Mitch doing almost the same stuff last year?
Good point and perhaps could be a cause of discontent with him. Mitch posts MIGHT demonstrate his frustration with not being given more offensive looks which come contract time will hurt him. I’m just guessing. Remember when agents go into negotiations with teams they are both loaded with stats to demonstrate value and likely use comps as guides. That Gobert got the money he did might up upset some teams and added glee to Mitch’s case. Capella as discussed is another.
Mitch two injuries come at an awful time for him as this team is kicking ass without him. Nalod has discussed trading him not because of my prediction of injury but his contract was so valuable. This was before our rise in standings which I did not see. The idea was a contending team could use him and be cap friendly. How this plays out because of his foot injury is an issue. Was it the type of injury thats a freak one off or the type that might be recurring. If so thats a problem for everyone. This is where his potential upside becomes a matter of importance and no body here is really capable beyond guessing.
As for Noel I’d be happy to resign him to a 4 year deal under 15mil per with the idea of trading Mitch at some point, draft another young player to develop and an understanding that Noel could be a trade asset providing he can be healthy enough. We need players that are tradable always!! He has peaked talent wise. When you have center by committee you reduce injuries, give them time to heal when nicked up, and they can go hard when they do play!
Tom Thibodeau credits Noel’s shot blocking to “great anticipation, great timing, great feet.’’
Third in the league in blocks.
Hope Mitch's latest agent is keeping him humble. 
jrodmc wrote:Tom Thibodeau credits Noel’s shot blocking to “great anticipation, great timing, great feet.’’Third in the league in blocks.
Hope Mitch's latest agent is keeping him humble.
Might be his Podiatrist or Orthopedist that is dishing out reality humble pie.
Foot fracture not from contact is not a joke. I’m not dr Callahan but foot fractures are no joke to pro players. Ask Bill Walton and Yao Ming. Mitch’s hops are is his money.
martin wrote:Panos wrote:martin wrote:Jimbo5 wrote:I think the knicks have finally found their center rotation with Mitch, Noel and Taj. These three players is a perfect match what Thibs is looking for the 5 spot. I hope the FO can find a way to keep atleast Mitch and Noel for the next 5 years atleast. When Mitch went down i thought thats the start of the knicks' decline for the season but Noel stepped up big time$It'll be VERY interesting and telling to me how the Knicks FO handles these 2 guys. I think Taj (and Rose) will likely be back at min prices (at the minimum) dependent on trades/draft picks the Knicks make. I've been more impressed with Taj than Rose but both are great bench vets.
How much has Thibs SYSTEM been a factor in Noel/Mitch success as opposed to the talent of each. And does the FO think Mitch has enough potential (yes) and work ethic (TBD IMHO) combined to keep him at a substantial cost? It'll be interesting to see it play out
Why does Mitch's performance have to do with Thibs? Wasn't Mitch doing almost the same stuff last year?
Mitch wasn’t anchoring the #1 defense in the league. Mitch certainly has his own individual talent but being able to apply it in team environment to this degree hasn’t been there.
Been reading similar posts about Randle's improvement. Mostly giving the credit to Thibs. Downplaying the work Randle put in. Have no problem with Thibs getting some credit. But not
that much.
And I have no doubt that he will get even more out of Mitch, if Mitch stays on the team of course. If this was one of the former FOs, I would say that I expect some clumsy moves and eventually Mitch leaving due to some small difference in amount or due to some "technical" mistake of our FO. But this Rose-led FO is finally seems to know what is doing.
xavier wrote:Mitch was good last season as well, but the rest of the team was not defensively oriented, which of course made his job a lot harder. That’s pretty much the reason why Noel and Taj look quite OK too, and that’s of course Thibs’credit.And I have no doubt that he will get even more out of Mitch, if Mitch stays on the team of course. If this was one of the former FOs, I would say that I expect some clumsy moves and eventually Mitch leaving due to some small difference in amount or due to some "technical" mistake of our FO. But this Rose-led FO is finally seems to know what is doing.
HOw many players “left” due to those reasons? KP wanted out which in part for all his character flaws there was some elements of truth to it. Melo was asked to leave. Who came and left that we wanted to stay?
What inept act of money, negligence or the implied “Technical mistake FO” do you speak of?
Knicks record speaks for itself and I’m not trying to defend any FO. We failed to draft into a developing team. Our “Luck” changed with Randle and RJ as our two pilars. Both were pre Leon but again both were opportunities built on circumstance we all know very well.
As for Mitch, he has a history of from the time he left high school of not sticking to a plan or with an agent. He is on his 6th. He either gets bad advice or is ignorantly gullible. I don’t know. In contrast we have seen Randles passion over 6 years since college grow. He took a long view. His rise was not about one off season or one coach, it was process of maturity both physical and mental, a man at peace at home, and a mature man who is married with a kid and loves that role.
Part of “Mamba mentality” for Kobe was egocentric and he hurt his family along the way. IN fact, the tragic ending is in part of the story too.
My point is we don’t know Mitch’s story, his work ethic, and if he has the make up to really progress. I’m going to guess Perry did his homework and saw the potential and siezed the opportunity. Did he really think Randle would evolve year two as he did? I don’t know but its a good look never the less.
Coming together as he has under Thibs is part of it all but not the full story for Randle, and perhaps for mitch. But his injures are a probelem now. Extend him or potentially let him walk. Again, what is the prognosis for his foot fracture? No two are alike.
Nalod wrote:xavier wrote:Mitch was good last season as well, but the rest of the team was not defensively oriented, which of course made his job a lot harder. That’s pretty much the reason why Noel and Taj look quite OK too, and that’s of course Thibs’credit.And I have no doubt that he will get even more out of Mitch, if Mitch stays on the team of course. If this was one of the former FOs, I would say that I expect some clumsy moves and eventually Mitch leaving due to some small difference in amount or due to some "technical" mistake of our FO. But this Rose-led FO is finally seems to know what is doing.
HOw many players “left” due to those reasons? KP wanted out which in part for all his character flaws there was some elements of truth to it. Melo was asked to leave. Who came and left that we wanted to stay?
What inept act of money, negligence or the implied “Technical mistake FO” do you speak of?
Knicks record speaks for itself and I’m not trying to defend any FO. We failed to draft into a developing team. Our “Luck” changed with Randle and RJ as our two pilars. Both were pre Leon but again both were opportunities built on circumstance we all know very well.
As for Mitch, he has a history of from the time he left high school of not sticking to a plan or with an agent. He is on his 6th. He either gets bad advice or is ignorantly gullible. I don’t know. In contrast we have seen Randles passion over 6 years since college grow. He took a long view. His rise was not about one off season or one coach, it was process of maturity both physical and mental, a man at peace at home, and a mature man who is married with a kid and loves that role.
Part of “Mamba mentality” for Kobe was egocentric and he hurt his family along the way. IN fact, the tragic ending is in part of the story too.
My point is we don’t know Mitch’s story, his work ethic, and if he has the make up to really progress. I’m going to guess Perry did his homework and saw the potential and siezed the opportunity. Did he really think Randle would evolve year two as he did? I don’t know but its a good look never the less.Coming together as he has under Thibs is part of it all but not the full story for Randle, and perhaps for mitch. But his injures are a probelem now. Extend him or potentially let him walk. Again, what is the prognosis for his foot fracture? No two are alike.
OK, I was a little too critical. I didn’t mean anyone would literally leave because of a technical error in the way that someone “forget” to pick an option or something. I meant more in the way that the FO concludes that he’s not that much valuable and that we can easily replace him (which some people here think for some reason).
But even Mitch has so far not proved to be exactly like someone who is “with both feet on the ground”, that absolutely stands. We don’t even need to go beyond constantly changing agents for which there was no reason because none of them could change anything for him. Also, as you wrote, even before coming here, Mitch showed that he sometimes makes problematic decisions.
Of course, it is more important to me that the team does well and that's why I say that I believe FO will make the right decision.
As for the injuries, I have to admit I’m not as worried as some here and I believe it’s just bad luck for him this season and I wouldn’t characterize him as an “injury prone”.
GustavBahler wrote:martin wrote:Panos wrote:martin wrote:Jimbo5 wrote:I think the knicks have finally found their center rotation with Mitch, Noel and Taj. These three players is a perfect match what Thibs is looking for the 5 spot. I hope the FO can find a way to keep atleast Mitch and Noel for the next 5 years atleast. When Mitch went down i thought thats the start of the knicks' decline for the season but Noel stepped up big time$It'll be VERY interesting and telling to me how the Knicks FO handles these 2 guys. I think Taj (and Rose) will likely be back at min prices (at the minimum) dependent on trades/draft picks the Knicks make. I've been more impressed with Taj than Rose but both are great bench vets.
How much has Thibs SYSTEM been a factor in Noel/Mitch success as opposed to the talent of each. And does the FO think Mitch has enough potential (yes) and work ethic (TBD IMHO) combined to keep him at a substantial cost? It'll be interesting to see it play out
Why does Mitch's performance have to do with Thibs? Wasn't Mitch doing almost the same stuff last year?
Mitch wasn’t anchoring the #1 defense in the league. Mitch certainly has his own individual talent but being able to apply it in team environment to this degree hasn’t been there.
Been reading similar posts about Randle's improvement.Mostly giving the credit to Thibs. Downplaying the work Randle put in. Have no problem with Thibs getting some credit. But not
that much.
Quite the non sequester. And I don't agree with it.
GustavBahler wrote:martin wrote:Panos wrote:martin wrote:Jimbo5 wrote:I think the knicks have finally found their center rotation with Mitch, Noel and Taj. These three players is a perfect match what Thibs is looking for the 5 spot. I hope the FO can find a way to keep atleast Mitch and Noel for the next 5 years atleast. When Mitch went down i thought thats the start of the knicks' decline for the season but Noel stepped up big time$It'll be VERY interesting and telling to me how the Knicks FO handles these 2 guys. I think Taj (and Rose) will likely be back at min prices (at the minimum) dependent on trades/draft picks the Knicks make. I've been more impressed with Taj than Rose but both are great bench vets.
How much has Thibs SYSTEM been a factor in Noel/Mitch success as opposed to the talent of each. And does the FO think Mitch has enough potential (yes) and work ethic (TBD IMHO) combined to keep him at a substantial cost? It'll be interesting to see it play out
Why does Mitch's performance have to do with Thibs? Wasn't Mitch doing almost the same stuff last year?
Mitch wasn’t anchoring the #1 defense in the league. Mitch certainly has his own individual talent but being able to apply it in team environment to this degree hasn’t been there.
Been reading similar posts about Randle's improvement. Mostly giving the credit to Thibs. Downplaying the work Randle put in. Have no problem with Thibs getting some credit. But not
that much.
I put less stock in Posts then Blogs which tells you I don't bank on them as much as the core media that follows the team. Even then some of its fluff.
Its why I push back so much on posters that make up shit. Its ok to state an opinion but another to state as knowledge.
As far as I see Randles ascent has taken a few years and his talent converged with the roster, and it being coached by Thibs matters but not the talent growth.
Posters see this team and think "Wow, what if we add.......". That's not accurate. A guy like Westbrook needs the ball to create those stats and that means less for Randle.
"What if's" by most of us should include the thought that not everying can be repeated. By that, you can't keep the roster intact with the thought we should have traded for CP3 or Westbrook.
THat Drose gives us so much after we gave up so little is the beauty of the deal.
martin wrote:GustavBahler wrote:martin wrote:Panos wrote:martin wrote:Jimbo5 wrote:I think the knicks have finally found their center rotation with Mitch, Noel and Taj. These three players is a perfect match what Thibs is looking for the 5 spot. I hope the FO can find a way to keep atleast Mitch and Noel for the next 5 years atleast. When Mitch went down i thought thats the start of the knicks' decline for the season but Noel stepped up big time$It'll be VERY interesting and telling to me how the Knicks FO handles these 2 guys. I think Taj (and Rose) will likely be back at min prices (at the minimum) dependent on trades/draft picks the Knicks make. I've been more impressed with Taj than Rose but both are great bench vets.
How much has Thibs SYSTEM been a factor in Noel/Mitch success as opposed to the talent of each. And does the FO think Mitch has enough potential (yes) and work ethic (TBD IMHO) combined to keep him at a substantial cost? It'll be interesting to see it play out
Why does Mitch's performance have to do with Thibs? Wasn't Mitch doing almost the same stuff last year?
Mitch wasn’t anchoring the #1 defense in the league. Mitch certainly has his own individual talent but being able to apply it in team environment to this degree hasn’t been there.
Been reading similar posts about Randle's improvement.Mostly giving the credit to Thibs. Downplaying the work Randle put in. Have no problem with Thibs getting some credit. But not
that much.Quite the non sequester. And I don't agree with it.
Not really. Thibs is getting a lot of credit not only for the team's improvement, but also the improvement of individual players. I dont see it to the extent that others do.
Not suggesting that its not possible. Dont see Mitch fouling less as a result of anything more than Thibs maybe suggesting that Mitch do a better job of staying in the game. And Mitch putting in the work.
I see the assistant coaches having more of a role in that dept, on most teams. Thibs focusing more on the big picture.
GustavBahler wrote:martin wrote:GustavBahler wrote:martin wrote:Panos wrote:martin wrote:Jimbo5 wrote:I think the knicks have finally found their center rotation with Mitch, Noel and Taj. These three players is a perfect match what Thibs is looking for the 5 spot. I hope the FO can find a way to keep atleast Mitch and Noel for the next 5 years atleast. When Mitch went down i thought thats the start of the knicks' decline for the season but Noel stepped up big time$It'll be VERY interesting and telling to me how the Knicks FO handles these 2 guys. I think Taj (and Rose) will likely be back at min prices (at the minimum) dependent on trades/draft picks the Knicks make. I've been more impressed with Taj than Rose but both are great bench vets.
How much has Thibs SYSTEM been a factor in Noel/Mitch success as opposed to the talent of each. And does the FO think Mitch has enough potential (yes) and work ethic (TBD IMHO) combined to keep him at a substantial cost? It'll be interesting to see it play out
Why does Mitch's performance have to do with Thibs? Wasn't Mitch doing almost the same stuff last year?
Mitch wasn’t anchoring the #1 defense in the league. Mitch certainly has his own individual talent but being able to apply it in team environment to this degree hasn’t been there.
Been reading similar posts about Randle's improvement.Mostly giving the credit to Thibs. Downplaying the work Randle put in. Have no problem with Thibs getting some credit. But not
that much.Quite the non sequester. And I don't agree with it.
Not really. Thibs is getting a lot of credit not only for the team's improvement, but also the improvement of individual players. I dont see it to the extent that others do.
Not suggesting that its not possible. Dont see Mitch fouling less as a result of anything more than Thibs maybe suggesting that Mitch do a better job of staying in the game. And Mitch putting in the work.
I see the assistant coaches having more of a role in that dept, on most teams. Thibs focusing more on the big picture.
You got some web cams into practice that no one else does?
martin wrote:GustavBahler wrote:martin wrote:GustavBahler wrote:martin wrote:Panos wrote:martin wrote:Jimbo5 wrote:I think the knicks have finally found their center rotation with Mitch, Noel and Taj. These three players is a perfect match what Thibs is looking for the 5 spot. I hope the FO can find a way to keep atleast Mitch and Noel for the next 5 years atleast. When Mitch went down i thought thats the start of the knicks' decline for the season but Noel stepped up big time$It'll be VERY interesting and telling to me how the Knicks FO handles these 2 guys. I think Taj (and Rose) will likely be back at min prices (at the minimum) dependent on trades/draft picks the Knicks make. I've been more impressed with Taj than Rose but both are great bench vets.
How much has Thibs SYSTEM been a factor in Noel/Mitch success as opposed to the talent of each. And does the FO think Mitch has enough potential (yes) and work ethic (TBD IMHO) combined to keep him at a substantial cost? It'll be interesting to see it play out
Why does Mitch's performance have to do with Thibs? Wasn't Mitch doing almost the same stuff last year?
Mitch wasn’t anchoring the #1 defense in the league. Mitch certainly has his own individual talent but being able to apply it in team environment to this degree hasn’t been there.
Been reading similar posts about Randle's improvement.Mostly giving the credit to Thibs. Downplaying the work Randle put in. Have no problem with Thibs getting some credit. But not
that much.Quite the non sequester. And I don't agree with it.
Not really. Thibs is getting a lot of credit not only for the team's improvement, but also the improvement of individual players. I dont see it to the extent that others do.
Not suggesting that its not possible. Dont see Mitch fouling less as a result of anything more than Thibs maybe suggesting that Mitch do a better job of staying in the game. And Mitch putting in the work.
I see the assistant coaches having more of a role in that dept, on most teams. Thibs focusing more on the big picture.
You got some web cams into practice that no one else does?
Geez. I could ask you the same. Assistant coaches have traditionally worked with individual players on their game. Since before webcams. Why they brought in Payne no?