Knicks · there's a real chance for a title here (page 2)

Apples and oranges. Your plan can work and my plan can work. The difference is your plan is a 2-3 year window and my plan is to challenge for over a decade.

fishmike wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Knixkik wrote:It basically comes down to keeping the majority of this group in tact, continuing to build chemistry, continued development from Randle, Barrett, and Quickley as the core impact players, and adding the right star to take this team to the next level. Based on the versatility of the most important players on this team, that player can be either a PG, SG, or SF.

everything but the bold is pretty easy at this point. The pieces are in place, the FO has shown patience with players growth as has the coaching staff. Knox, SmithJr, Frank and Rivers all got great chances to play their way out of the rotation.

The critical thing is to not only add that next big gun but to do it in a way that doesnt cost future assets.

I think the best bet is procure a sub-max player. If Kawhi says "looks fun" ok he gets the max but assuming he's off the board. I like Conley/Derozan as impact vets and Schroder/Powell as another gun to put next to RJ/Randle as far as creating a group who can impose their will on the game on both ends.

The key is by getting a guy in $25mm range vs. max we are looking at a situation where we can bring back more guys Noel/Bullock/etc

I honestly have very high expectations. Leon has a feel for the league we havent seen in prior FOs for sure.

We might get TWO of those guys. We might get guys willing to sign for less because they think in 2-3 years under Thibs they will be max guys like Randle became. I think thats likely a stretch but Schroder/Powell are 27/28 next year. If we signed both on Randle type contracts both would be eligible for Gordan Haywood type paydays at that same age.

Another option is just give everything we have (capwise) to Powell and Schroder as we consider them finishing touches on Thib's crew. Two-way guys who get after it on both ends. Schroder lives in the paint and Powell with his sick wingspan, shooting and JYD style of play could really make us formidable for a few years, plus we keep all our draft assets and suppliment w / the Dallas picks moving forward.

If you gave Schroder/Powell both 4 year/$120mm starting at $28mm you lose Noel but could still bring Taj/Rose back on exceptions. Rose does because its Thibs and he wants to be here.

your 2021-22 Knicks would be:
PG Schroder
SG RJ
SF Norm Powell
PF Randle
C Mitch
Bench: IQ/Rose/Obi/Taj/Knox
Roster: Pelle, FRP, FRP, Det #2, Luca?

If Mitch has a reasonably healthy season and RJ keeps breaking out we got a real chance with that squad. I would love to see how that D performs under Thibs. Thats 08 Pistons grinding you down every night and every guy can score on you

Im not giving schroeder and powell 120 each????????? 60mm a year for those two?

Id like to draft Ayo Bougknight and a 2nd rd center. Im gonna let Knox go for a future 2. Im gonna let frank walk. I need to hold mitch to see what Noel wants but Id like to keep both.

My cap space Ill go 4 years 72 mm to Kendrick Nunn to play PG here. Want both Burcks and Bullock back Rose back

So
out
Payton
Knox
Frank
Gibson
in
Nunn
Ayo
Boughknight

so your plan to build a team that can win a title is spend your cap space on Kedrick Nunn, Burks, Bullock and of course your "draft this guy he will save the franchise" annual selections.

Do you watch the NBA? You dont win titles by procuring role players. You need impact guys. Schroder/Conley/Powell/Derozan are the impact FAs we can sign. If you dont use you cap space to sign impact players you just wasted it.

I liked you better when you thought we should max out Isaiah Thomas and Enes Kantor. '

Nunn is an RFA! He's restricted. Mia can match any offer.

Keep cap space in check
Add talent to team that fits the ages of our team.
Replace Payton with Nunn
replace Knox and Frank with two younger more athletci players who play both sides.
Adding good young players always helps

xblvdels3 wrote:the nets will go as far as their role players perform. If their role players don’t perform it will be one of the biggest failures in sports.

That's really the case with any contender...and to be honest, if they can stay healthy the NETS will be our biggest obstacle.

They are winning games basically hopping on one foot

BRIGGS wrote:

fishmike wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Knixkik wrote:It basically comes down to keeping the majority of this group in tact, continuing to build chemistry, continued development from Randle, Barrett, and Quickley as the core impact players, and adding the right star to take this team to the next level. Based on the versatility of the most important players on this team, that player can be either a PG, SG, or SF.

everything but the bold is pretty easy at this point. The pieces are in place, the FO has shown patience with players growth as has the coaching staff. Knox, SmithJr, Frank and Rivers all got great chances to play their way out of the rotation.

The critical thing is to not only add that next big gun but to do it in a way that doesnt cost future assets.

I think the best bet is procure a sub-max player. If Kawhi says "looks fun" ok he gets the max but assuming he's off the board. I like Conley/Derozan as impact vets and Schroder/Powell as another gun to put next to RJ/Randle as far as creating a group who can impose their will on the game on both ends.

The key is by getting a guy in $25mm range vs. max we are looking at a situation where we can bring back more guys Noel/Bullock/etc

I honestly have very high expectations. Leon has a feel for the league we havent seen in prior FOs for sure.

We might get TWO of those guys. We might get guys willing to sign for less because they think in 2-3 years under Thibs they will be max guys like Randle became. I think thats likely a stretch but Schroder/Powell are 27/28 next year. If we signed both on Randle type contracts both would be eligible for Gordan Haywood type paydays at that same age.

Another option is just give everything we have (capwise) to Powell and Schroder as we consider them finishing touches on Thib's crew. Two-way guys who get after it on both ends. Schroder lives in the paint and Powell with his sick wingspan, shooting and JYD style of play could really make us formidable for a few years, plus we keep all our draft assets and suppliment w / the Dallas picks moving forward.

If you gave Schroder/Powell both 4 year/$120mm starting at $28mm you lose Noel but could still bring Taj/Rose back on exceptions. Rose does because its Thibs and he wants to be here.

your 2021-22 Knicks would be:
PG Schroder
SG RJ
SF Norm Powell
PF Randle
C Mitch
Bench: IQ/Rose/Obi/Taj/Knox
Roster: Pelle, FRP, FRP, Det #2, Luca?

If Mitch has a reasonably healthy season and RJ keeps breaking out we got a real chance with that squad. I would love to see how that D performs under Thibs. Thats 08 Pistons grinding you down every night and every guy can score on you

Im not giving schroeder and powell 120 each????????? 60mm a year for those two?

Id like to draft Ayo Bougknight and a 2nd rd center. Im gonna let Knox go for a future 2. Im gonna let frank walk. I need to hold mitch to see what Noel wants but Id like to keep both.

My cap space Ill go 4 years 72 mm to Kendrick Nunn to play PG here. Want both Burcks and Bullock back Rose back

So
out
Payton
Knox
Frank
Gibson
in
Nunn
Ayo
Boughknight

so your plan to build a team that can win a title is spend your cap space on Kedrick Nunn, Burks, Bullock and of course your "draft this guy he will save the franchise" annual selections.

Do you watch the NBA? You dont win titles by procuring role players. You need impact guys. Schroder/Conley/Powell/Derozan are the impact FAs we can sign. If you dont use you cap space to sign impact players you just wasted it.

I liked you better when you thought we should max out Isaiah Thomas and Enes Kantor. '

Nunn is an RFA! He's restricted. Mia can match any offer.

Keep cap space in check
Add talent to team that fits the ages of our team.
Replace Payton with Nunn
replace Knox and Frank with two younger more athletci players who play both sides.
Adding good young players always helps

What does "Keep cap space in check" mean? If you add Nunn and resign Burks, Bullock, Rose, Noel and add in the draft picks, your cap space is gone.

Adding Nunn and draft picks is not a path to championship level.

I guess we have reached the stage where we gut the team to satisfy impatient casual Knick fans lol

Let’s do it!!

Trade everyone to get your favorite washed up old vets 😂

We can challenge the elites of the league for a ring with 1B talent lol

(Sarcasm)

Wining championships is not only having the top talent but when you have the top tier talent.

Choose your windows wisely to go championship hunting.

Only way we can get top tier talent in here is by cutting cost and finding gems for cheap (easier said than done)

Just hope luca is better than Payton and can contribute 14/5/3 with defense

The fact the Knicks tried this solution validates they are on the same page as me as far as roster construction !

fishmike wrote:

blkexec wrote:

jrodmc wrote:-MitchRob comes back for the playoffs and has a Willis Reed moment coming out the tunnel against the Nets!

I think fans are sleeping on mitch impact. And I wouldn't put a cap on this team. They will go as far as Thibs, Randle, and RJ can go. We have a solid team of role players around Randle, with a budding All star in RJ....Quickley adapting fast to the nba game. The success of a good team, is measure by player synergy. Role players that not only know their role....but embrace it. That's the advantages of having an old school coach. Thibs is consistent and he creates different roles for different players. It's like a chemical experiment 🤔 that's clicking at the right time. Momentum and Timing is key to everything. Anything is possible...When you have nothing to lose, the sky's the limit. Remember, we not suppose to make the playoffs.

Mitch is fantastic. You can tell who are watching and who are seeing. Some simply dont grasp the importance of defense, rebounding and rim protection. Remember the guy who thought Utah lost in the playoffs because Gobert doesnt shoot 3s? Mitch's impact is huge on both sides of the ball. NBA games are often close, its why analytics matter so much. Mitch gives you 8-10 points on 70% shooting. If you dont think that has a huge swing on the offense again... you are watching but not seeing. blkexec... I know you get it

Mitch gets me frustrated because he's not in the best shape I suspect has some maturity issues. Paying him makes me nervous. He's a revelation at $2mm... paying him $18 is gonna be a different feel.

I agree...paying mitch large money makes me nervous. But I believe the FO made a savy move by adding Noel. Without him, mitch would've gotten a lot more. Now mitch and others can see the system is bigger than the player. Hopefully that helps bring his value down.

To me, Mitch is a younger Noel, with more impact on offense with lobs and put backs. Plus mitch is a good inch or 2 taller than Noel.. especially his standing reach.

Not sure why trading any of them is even an option. There are so many other moves we can do before we start selling our fruits. Let mitch learn from Noel. Let obi learn from Randle. I don't believe we are a trade away from a championship team. If anything, making the wrong trade could also impact team chemistry...and team synergy is why we are good. Why mess that up....its still early in our development.

blkexec wrote:

fishmike wrote:

blkexec wrote:

jrodmc wrote:-MitchRob comes back for the playoffs and has a Willis Reed moment coming out the tunnel against the Nets!

I think fans are sleeping on mitch impact. And I wouldn't put a cap on this team. They will go as far as Thibs, Randle, and RJ can go. We have a solid team of role players around Randle, with a budding All star in RJ....Quickley adapting fast to the nba game. The success of a good team, is measure by player synergy. Role players that not only know their role....but embrace it. That's the advantages of having an old school coach. Thibs is consistent and he creates different roles for different players. It's like a chemical experiment 🤔 that's clicking at the right time. Momentum and Timing is key to everything. Anything is possible...When you have nothing to lose, the sky's the limit. Remember, we not suppose to make the playoffs.

Mitch is fantastic. You can tell who are watching and who are seeing. Some simply dont grasp the importance of defense, rebounding and rim protection. Remember the guy who thought Utah lost in the playoffs because Gobert doesnt shoot 3s? Mitch's impact is huge on both sides of the ball. NBA games are often close, its why analytics matter so much. Mitch gives you 8-10 points on 70% shooting. If you dont think that has a huge swing on the offense again... you are watching but not seeing. blkexec... I know you get it

Mitch gets me frustrated because he's not in the best shape I suspect has some maturity issues. Paying him makes me nervous. He's a revelation at $2mm... paying him $18 is gonna be a different feel.

I agree...paying mitch large money makes me nervous. But I believe the FO made a savy move by adding Noel. Without him, mitch would've gotten a lot more. Now mitch and others can see the system is bigger than the player. Hopefully that helps bring his value down.

To me, Mitch is a younger Noel, with more impact on offense with lobs and put backs. Plus mitch is a good inch or 2 taller than Noel.. especially his standing reach.

Not sure why trading any of them is even an option. There are so many other moves we can do before we start selling our fruits. Let mitch learn from Noel. Let obi learn from Randle. I don't believe we are a trade away from a championship team. If anything, making the wrong trade could also impact team chemistry...and team synergy is why we are good. Why mess that up....its still early in our development.

I agree