Knicks · Who do u have 19-21-32. Be realistic! (page 7)

reub wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:July 11
19 Chris Duarte SG 6-6 200
21 Trey Murphy Sf 6-9 210
32 Jared Butler Pg 6-3 200
58 Jericho Sims 6-10 250

This would be my ultimate draft. But would Butler fall that far?

I wouldn’t be disappointed

I think these players just solidifies more important pieces to the teams long term success but no game changers.

reub wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:July 11
19 Chris Duarte SG 6-6 200
21 Trey Murphy Sf 6-9 210
32 Jared Butler Pg 6-3 200
58 Jericho Sims 6-10 250

This would be my ultimate draft. But would Butler fall that far?

Whats up reub? Im thinking his health can ride him to rd 2. Yeah nice combination of players from deep 1st early 2nd

BRIGGS wrote:

reub wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:July 11
19 Chris Duarte SG 6-6 200
21 Trey Murphy Sf 6-9 210
32 Jared Butler Pg 6-3 200
58 Jericho Sims 6-10 250

This would be my ultimate draft. But would Butler fall that far?

Whats up reub? Im thinking his health can ride him to rd 2. Yeah nice combination of players from deep 1st early 2nd

Hi, Briggs. I left this board after you were banned but I've been through a lot healthwise and I'm back now.

This is a draft where I actually wish that we had about 3 more number 2 draft picks. The talent seems to run very deep.

BRIGGS wrote:I think pick 32 is gonna be our highest value pick. Someone from rd 1 is gonna fall.

Lakers have offered #22 overall as part of a Dennis Shroder sign and trade. (They also want Kuzma gone.) Don't know what they want in return. My guess is they want 32 back, MRob ( cheap and solid defense, AD doesn't want to play center and Mark Gasol alone isn't getting it done for them) and something else.

It appears Pelinka wants the trade exception that would come back by dumping Schroder into the Knicks open cap space. They want to make a move for Kawhi Leonard. The idea of watching Leonard and LBJ argue all year long over who is more important only makes me laugh.

They've apparently pulled in Presti and OKC into the talks ( for Kuzma) . Expect the Knicks and Thunder to be the epicenter and usual suspects in any large 3-4 team trade.

Houston will literally give the Knicks all of John Wall right now. OKC will eat up just about any bad contract but even they are pushing away John Wall talks. From what I'm hearing, Fertitta has taken control and Stone is no longer running point on trade talks. If that happens and the Rockets trade back from #2, you might see a ripple effect of Houston taking some head scratching picks, causing some quality guys who might have gone five picks early to fall to the Knicks.

I'm not a huge Schroder guy. But Talen Horton-Tucker is interesting. Very interesting.

#32 might not be the highest value pick if it's moved in a trade. Second rounders are not required to get any guaranteed money at all and that's huge for those teams pressed hard up against the cap.

LeGM is an idiot, anything is possible from the Lakers. Think of any horrific trade scenario for the Lakers and it might happen. If you locked Michael Jordan, Zeke and LBJ in a kitchen with a box of minute rice, I think three hours later you'd find them fighting over how to best open the cardboard top. The NBA is incredible in how the dumbest fucking people get the most power possible.

I know a number of people have already mentioned this but...

A. Theres no way the Knicks are keeping all of these picks. They are either moving up in the draft or going after a player.
B. I love Tre Mann and he seems like a reasonable trade up target. He might be there at 19 but athletic PGs tend to fly off the board.

If the Knicks don't trade the farm for B. Roy, I could see them throwing money at a top FA point guard and moving up for Mann to back him up. It should still leave them with an opportunity to draft a young big to back up (develop behind) Robinson or a 3 and D forward and sign some depth, which was so critical to their playoff run this season.

Pepper wrote:I know a number of people have already mentioned this but...

A. Theres no way the Knicks are keeping all of these picks. They are either moving up in the draft or going after a player.
B. I love Tre Mann and he seems like a reasonable trade up target. He might be there at 19 but athletic PGs tend to fly off the board.

If the Knicks don't trade the farm for B. Roy, I could see them throwing money at a top FA point guard and moving up for Mann to back him up. It should still leave them with an opportunity to draft a young big to back up (develop behind) Robinson or a 3 and D forward and sign some depth, which was so critical to their playoff run this season.

I could see them moving up using a combination of 19 and cap space, still draft and 21 and 32 and 55. It only really feels unlikely they would draft two players in the #19 and #21 range. They need more help from the draft then they can reasonably expect at that point.

Pepper wrote:
A. Theres no way the Knicks are keeping all of these picks. They are either moving up in the draft or going after a player.

Tier 1

Cunningham

Tier 2

Mobley
Jalen Green

Tier 3

Jalen Suggs

Tier 4
Jon Kuminga
Scottie Barnes

The the draft goes flat. Cunningham goes first overall no matter what. Whomever doesn't go 2nd overall of Green or Mobley gets picked third overall. Suggs is a virtual lock at 4th overall. Barnes might go 5th overall, but odds are it's Kuminga and if that's the case, it's close to a lock that Barnes goes 6th.

Then the draft goes very flat.

Tier 5 is 7th through 9th or 10th. Tier 6 could last another 12 picks.

The Knicks first pick is a Tier 6 pick, meaning it's pointless to trade up unless it's for the 7th through 9th selections. ( The methodology is to move up a tier, for example, the Warriors at 7th have a reason to trade up to 6th, but the Cavs have very little reason to trade up from 3rd overall to 2nd overall) NY doesn't have the trade capital to get into the top 6 picks of this draft. Tre Mann is projected via value for slot in the mid to late 20s.

Is there a convincing argument that the Warriors, Magic, Kings and Pelicans are apt to trade back?

If the Knicks want Tre Mann, odds are he'll be there at 19th, and if he's not, they are incentivized to move on and keep going down their target list instead of risking trading up in the same tier.

There is actually more incentive to TRADE BACK from 21 than to trade up. OKC owns 35 and 36. Toronto has 46 and 47. The Pelicans have four 2nd rounders. There will be some pretty damn interesting guys left even in the mid 40s.

If the Knicks are willing to fall back from 19, there is 23 and 24 from Houston. They could pick at 21 and 24 and try to trade 23. The difference of the guy you can pick at 24 and the guy you pick at 32 isn't that much of a gap.

reub wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

reub wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:July 11
19 Chris Duarte SG 6-6 200
21 Trey Murphy Sf 6-9 210
32 Jared Butler Pg 6-3 200
58 Jericho Sims 6-10 250

This would be my ultimate draft. But would Butler fall that far?

Whats up reub? Im thinking his health can ride him to rd 2. Yeah nice combination of players from deep 1st early 2nd

Hi, Briggs. I left this board after you were banned but I've been through a lot healthwise and I'm back now.

This is a draft where I actually wish that we had about 3 more number 2 draft picks. The talent seems to run very deep.

Sorry to hear youve havent been well. My guess is youre not alone here--many long timers are getting up there a bit and the check engine light comes on after 50!

TripleThreat wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:I think pick 32 is gonna be our highest value pick. Someone from rd 1 is gonna fall.

Lakers have offered #22 overall as part of a Dennis Shroder sign and trade. (They also want Kuzma gone.) Don't know what they want in return. My guess is they want 32 back, MRob ( cheap and solid defense, AD doesn't want to play center and Mark Gasol alone isn't getting it done for them) and something else.

It appears Pelinka wants the trade exception that would come back by dumping Schroder into the Knicks open cap space. They want to make a move for Kawhi Leonard. The idea of watching Leonard and LBJ argue all year long over who is more important only makes me laugh.

They've apparently pulled in Presti and OKC into the talks ( for Kuzma) . Expect the Knicks and Thunder to be the epicenter and usual suspects in any large 3-4 team trade.

Houston will literally give the Knicks all of John Wall right now. OKC will eat up just about any bad contract but even they are pushing away John Wall talks. From what I'm hearing, Fertitta has taken control and Stone is no longer running point on trade talks. If that happens and the Rockets trade back from #2, you might see a ripple effect of Houston taking some head scratching picks, causing some quality guys who might have gone five picks early to fall to the Knicks.

I'm not a huge Schroder guy. But Talen Horton-Tucker is interesting. Very interesting.

#32 might not be the highest value pick if it's moved in a trade. Second rounders are not required to get any guaranteed money at all and that's huge for those teams pressed hard up against the cap.

LeGM is an idiot, anything is possible from the Lakers. Think of any horrific trade scenario for the Lakers and it might happen. If you locked Michael Jordan, Zeke and LBJ in a kitchen with a box of minute rice, I think three hours later you'd find them fighting over how to best open the cardboard top. The NBA is incredible in how the dumbest fucking people get the most power possible.

TT--God I hope we steer clear of Scrhoeder. Hes good as a quality 16 minute back up--but he wants to play big minutes and command big money--no thanks. I dont think a 22# pick doesnt move the table for us--were loaded with later picks

Pepper wrote:I know a number of people have already mentioned this but...

A. Theres no way the Knicks are keeping all of these picks. They are either moving up in the draft or going after a player.
B. I love Tre Mann and he seems like a reasonable trade up target. He might be there at 19 but athletic PGs tend to fly off the board.

If the Knicks don't trade the farm for B. Roy, I could see them throwing money at a top FA point guard and moving up for Mann to back him up. It should still leave them with an opportunity to draft a young big to back up (develop behind) Robinson or a 3 and D forward and sign some depth, which was so critical to their playoff run this season.

Tre Mann is also on my list. I can see the Knicks preferring butler because of the D. Either Mann or bUtler could easily be had 19 through 32 possibly so trading up might not be best idea to acquire him. If theres a team in front of us who want Mann theres no incentive to move back anyway--they can leverage their position to simply draft him.

TripleThreat wrote:

Pepper wrote:
A. Theres no way the Knicks are keeping all of these picks. They are either moving up in the draft or going after a player.

Tier 1

Cunningham

Tier 2

Mobley
Jalen Green

Tier 3

Jalen Suggs

Tier 4
Jon Kuminga
Scottie Barnes

The the draft goes flat. Cunningham goes first overall no matter what. Whomever doesn't go 2nd overall of Green or Mobley gets picked third overall. Suggs is a virtual lock at 4th overall. Barnes might go 5th overall, but odds are it's Kuminga and if that's the case, it's close to a lock that Barnes goes 6th.

Then the draft goes very flat.

Tier 5 is 7th through 9th or 10th. Tier 6 could last another 12 picks.

The Knicks first pick is a Tier 6 pick, meaning it's pointless to trade up unless it's for the 7th through 9th selections. ( The methodology is to move up a tier, for example, the Warriors at 7th have a reason to trade up to 6th, but the Cavs have very little reason to trade up from 3rd overall to 2nd overall) NY doesn't have the trade capital to get into the top 6 picks of this draft. Tre Mann is projected via value for slot in the mid to late 20s.

Is there a convincing argument that the Warriors, Magic, Kings and Pelicans are apt to trade back?

If the Knicks want Tre Mann, odds are he'll be there at 19th, and if he's not, they are incentivized to move on and keep going down their target list instead of risking trading up in the same tier.

There is actually more incentive to TRADE BACK from 21 than to trade up. OKC owns 35 and 36. Toronto has 46 and 47. The Pelicans have four 2nd rounders. There will be some pretty damn interesting guys left even in the mid 40s.

If the Knicks are willing to fall back from 19, there is 23 and 24 from Houston. They could pick at 21 and 24 and try to trade 23. The difference of the guy you can pick at 24 and the guy you pick at 32 isn't that much of a gap.

Just because this is more likely and certain to happen doesn’t make it the right move.

Four picks wouldn’t cost us 5 million combined per year. We definetly have roster spots and g league and two wAy spots to find a place for them.

Let’s just call it how it is. Thibs won’t play them and the front office has to make a splashy move to validate they are doing their job. Still doesn’t make it the correct move.

At this point with 2 weeks left we should really separate this draft by players who will be solid pieces for us long term vs players we want to “hope” turn into a star and complete player.

This is a deep draft. I had last years draft figured out 2 months earlier to draft day. Only player I was wrong about was haliburton. I wanted iq a month before the draft. But this draft has so much potential talent I have no clue. I’d like 8 picks lol

If we are staying in our draft slots trey Murphy III should be one of our picks.

Off the bench or starter he needs to be in the rotation for his defense and shooting ability

Great size. We could match defensively with shorter/taller talented wings.

It’s One pick I’m sure of so far.

The question is which pg/cg will we pick

Cooper
Tre mann
Miles McBride
Bones hyland
Jaden Springer
Ayo dosunmo

Or we are trading up…

Possible third pick

Jared butler
Vrenz
Ayo
Insert your fav center

If we are trading up
It’s

Mitchell
Bouknight
Keon Johnson
Moody
Barnes

Possibly keep third pick and get Jared butler ayo dosunmo vrenz

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I've been back and forth on Cooper and his FT% has sold me that he can become a league average shooter with time. If that's the case he's worth a gamble. He just has a skillset that is so unique. I had a hard time looking passed the shooting but i'm there now.

My ideal scenario would be packaging 19 and 32 to move up slightly for Cooper, as i believe his stock is climbing. Then taking Duarte or Murphy at 21. I don't see us drafting 3 players (not included 58) and having all of those rookies plus Vildoza on the active roster. If we deal Toppin, Knox, and 19 for Sexton (or some variation of that trade) I'll go Murphy or Duarte at 21 and grab a backup big at 32 like Bassey, Sharpe, or Sims.

So basically i think we end up with Sexton, a safe backup wing, and developmental backup big or no Sexton trade and land a high level prospect PG and a backup wing. That's just my feeling 2 weeks before the draft as the dust is starting to settle. Walk away from the draft with Sexton, Murphy or Duarte, and either Bassey or Sharpe. Or option 2 walk away with Cooper and either Murphy or Duarte.

Knixkik wrote:I've been back and forth on Cooper and his FT% has sold me that he can become a league average shooter with time. If that's the case he's worth a gamble. He just has a skillset that is so unique. I had a hard time looking passed the shooting but i'm there now.

My ideal scenario would be packaging 19 and 32 to move up slightly for Cooper, as i believe his stock is climbing. Then taking Duarte or Murphy at 21. I don't see us drafting 3 players (not included 58) and having all of those rookies plus Vildoza on the active roster. If we deal Toppin, Knox, and 19 for Sexton (or some variation of that trade) I'll go Murphy or Duarte at 21 and grab a backup big at 32 like Bassey, Sharpe, or Sims.

So basically i think we end up with Sexton, a safe backup wing, and developmental backup big or no Sexton trade and land a high level prospect PG and a backup wing. That's just my feeling 2 weeks before the draft as the dust is starting to settle. Walk away from the draft with Sexton, Murphy or Duarte, and either Bassey or Sharpe. Or option 2 walk away with Cooper and either Murphy or Duarte.

I wouldn't mind taking Vrenz as a possible draft and stash at #32. That be a temporary solution for at least one roster spot. I worry that he might not be there. He reportedly had a good showing at the pro day in Minnesota and is drawing more interest. I like Murphy over Duarte if the decision comes down to those 2. People assume that a prospect will be more prepared because he's older, but that not always the case. I like Murphy's upside and utility more, bit I worried more teams are starting to feel the same way. I'm starting to lean more towards Cooper at #19 if he's still there.

BigDaddyG wrote:

Knixkik wrote:I've been back and forth on Cooper and his FT% has sold me that he can become a league average shooter with time. If that's the case he's worth a gamble. He just has a skillset that is so unique. I had a hard time looking passed the shooting but i'm there now.

My ideal scenario would be packaging 19 and 32 to move up slightly for Cooper, as i believe his stock is climbing. Then taking Duarte or Murphy at 21. I don't see us drafting 3 players (not included 58) and having all of those rookies plus Vildoza on the active roster. If we deal Toppin, Knox, and 19 for Sexton (or some variation of that trade) I'll go Murphy or Duarte at 21 and grab a backup big at 32 like Bassey, Sharpe, or Sims.

So basically i think we end up with Sexton, a safe backup wing, and developmental backup big or no Sexton trade and land a high level prospect PG and a backup wing. That's just my feeling 2 weeks before the draft as the dust is starting to settle. Walk away from the draft with Sexton, Murphy or Duarte, and either Bassey or Sharpe. Or option 2 walk away with Cooper and either Murphy or Duarte.

I wouldn't mind taking Vrenz as a possible draft and stash at #32. That be a temporary solution for at least one roster spot. I worry that he might not be there. He reportedly had a good showing at the pro day in Minnesota and is drawing more interest. I like Murphy over Duarte if the decision comes down to those 2. People assume that a prospect will be more prepared because he's older, but that not always the case. I like Murphy's upside and utility more, bit I worried more teams are starting to feel the same way. I'm starting to lean more towards Cooper at #19 if he's still there.

I'm pretty much locked-in at 19...Tre Man is my first choice and if he is gone, Cooper would be my choice. I've been going back and forth on 21, but as of right now, I like Murphy as well. Love his length on the wing, 6'9 with a 7'1 wingspan. Very good shooter from 3, can defend and could even play small ball PF.

xblvdels3 wrote:If we are staying in our draft slots trey Murphy III should be one of our picks.

Possibly keep third pick and get Jared butler ayo dosunmo vrenz

I'd love to get him but Jonathon Wasserman was on a recent Knicks fan TV and said he's racing up the boards and could be mid 1st round or higher at this point- he's interviewing phenomenally and having great workouts, and teams are describing him as a longer Mikal Bridges

BRIGGS wrote:July 11
19 Chris Duarte SG 6-6 200
21 Trey Murphy Sf 6-9 210
32 Jared Butler Pg 6-3 200
58 Jericho Sims 6-10 250

Staying with sane 4 but moving Murphy to 19

19 Trey Murphy
21 Chris Duarte
32 Jared Butler
58 Jericho Sims

19) Trey Murphy or Chris Duarte
21) Miles McBride
32) Vrenz Bleijenberg

I think the front office by wanting to trade up is looking for a home run impact starter player in day one. I hope they can pivot well and be open to using 19, 21, 32 on 3 players that can solidify the knicks 2nd unit. I think this is the perfect draft to do so.

19. Murphy
21. Cam thomas
32. Vrez