Knicks · Just swap Burks and RJ (page 1)

RJ moves to the Rose/IQ/Obi squad and is a better fit there. Burks is a much better half court player than RJ. Doesnt help the defense much but is a better fit with the Kemba/EF/Randle trio I think we should stick with for now

If RJ is having a good shooting night or just playing playing great you can ride for 30 minutes.

I dont think you need to change anything else. The starters need to play better and the bench needs to play longer. I think we are seeing more spirited play from Randle/Kemba/EF (even if not always effective) but we are also seeing Thibs playing the bench for extended minutes if the game dictates that.

Its 20 games. We have a lot of guys who should play better. The reason they usually do under Thibs is because he doesnt yank them around and trusts his guys. "To a fault" is an opinion of fans but I doubt his players think that and those are the guys who win the games.

RJ is a huge piece. He could really thrive in that unit and put even MORE pressure on Thibs to play them more which I know everyone will enjoy

RJ’s Defense and rebounding is considerable. Robbing peter to pay paul is a good idea, but what is the end game?

Can we enjoy OBI’s rise and kudo’s to the coach and his staff?

Deal! Or maybe move RJ to the bench and start Burke at PG and Grimes at SF. See how Kemba plays off the bench.

fishmike wrote:RJ moves to the Rose/IQ/Obi squad and is a better fit there. Burks is a much better half court player than RJ. Doesnt help the defense much but is a better fit with the Kemba/EF/Randle trio I think we should stick with for now

If RJ is having a good shooting night or just playing playing great you can ride for 30 minutes.

I dont think you need to change anything else. The starters need to play better and the bench needs to play longer. I think we are seeing more spirited play from Randle/Kemba/EF (even if not always effective) but we are also seeing Thibs playing the bench for extended minutes if the game dictates that.

Its 20 games. We have a lot of guys who should play better. The reason they usually do under Thibs is because he doesnt yank them around and trusts his guys. "To a fault" is an opinion of fans but I doubt his players think that and those are the guys who win the games.

RJ is a huge piece. He could really thrive in that unit and put even MORE pressure on Thibs to play them more which I know everyone will enjoy

RJ looks more comfortable and plays with more freedom with the 2nd unit. RJ thrives in an open court, fast pace game because he's an open court, downhill player. I love the idea of RJ getting more mins with IQ, Obi and Rose. With that said, the optics wont look too good; our 3rd pick and future star going to the bench. Also, would RJ's confidence take a hit as he may view this as a demotion?

Honestly Fish, if anyone needs to be removed from the SL, its Kemba. Kemba is a Bronxite like myself, and Knicks have been pushing the 'coming home' narrative for him, but his defense has been bad and on the offensive end, he is really struggling creating separation. It would help if he were more of a playmaker, but passing has never been a major strength of his. Kemba's strength is running the pick n roll, and for some reason, we don't allow him to run it too often. Regardless, he is a defensive liability and I am not sure how much longer we can cover for him on the defensive end.

Would love to see us hand the keys to IQ and run the offense through the guards...IQ is not a pure pg, but he is still developing and we have already seen growth in the playmaking department from last year to this year. His defense has improved as well..Rose doesn't want to start nor is he reliable due to injuries and Walker clearly aint the future. So why not give the ball to IQ?

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:RJ moves to the Rose/IQ/Obi squad and is a better fit there. Burks is a much better half court player than RJ. Doesnt help the defense much but is a better fit with the Kemba/EF/Randle trio I think we should stick with for now

If RJ is having a good shooting night or just playing playing great you can ride for 30 minutes.

I dont think you need to change anything else. The starters need to play better and the bench needs to play longer. I think we are seeing more spirited play from Randle/Kemba/EF (even if not always effective) but we are also seeing Thibs playing the bench for extended minutes if the game dictates that.

Its 20 games. We have a lot of guys who should play better. The reason they usually do under Thibs is because he doesnt yank them around and trusts his guys. "To a fault" is an opinion of fans but I doubt his players think that and those are the guys who win the games.

RJ is a huge piece. He could really thrive in that unit and put even MORE pressure on Thibs to play them more which I know everyone will enjoy

RJ looks more comfortable and plays with more freedom with the 2nd unit. RJ thrives in an open court, fast pace game because he's an open court, downhill player. I love the idea of RJ getting more mins with IQ, Obi and Rose. With that said, the optics wont look too good; our 3rd pick and future star going to the bench.

Honestly Fish, if anyone needs to be removed from the SL, its Kemba. Kemba is a fellow Bronxite like myself, and Knicks have been pushing the 'coming home' narrative for him, but his defense has been bad he is really struggling creating separation. It would help if he were more of a playmaker, but passing has never been a major strength of his.

Would love to see us hand the keys to IQ and run the offense through the guards...IQ is not a pure pg, but he is still developing and we have already seen growth in the playmaking department from last year to this year...Rose doesn't want to start nor is he reliable due to injuries and Walker clearly aint the future. So why not give the ball to IQ?

IQs playmaking is apparent when he is paired with Obi. Those fast breaks are here to stay. Then there are the lobs. Obi give more than Mitch Rob does here as he moves without the ball and also can take advantage of his post position when catching the ball under the hoop. Robinson can only alley oop and cannot do anything with the ball otherwise.
Without IQ Obi will not have those same opportunities and IQ would not have a target like Obi.

ramtour420 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:RJ moves to the Rose/IQ/Obi squad and is a better fit there. Burks is a much better half court player than RJ. Doesnt help the defense much but is a better fit with the Kemba/EF/Randle trio I think we should stick with for now

If RJ is having a good shooting night or just playing playing great you can ride for 30 minutes.

I dont think you need to change anything else. The starters need to play better and the bench needs to play longer. I think we are seeing more spirited play from Randle/Kemba/EF (even if not always effective) but we are also seeing Thibs playing the bench for extended minutes if the game dictates that.

Its 20 games. We have a lot of guys who should play better. The reason they usually do under Thibs is because he doesnt yank them around and trusts his guys. "To a fault" is an opinion of fans but I doubt his players think that and those are the guys who win the games.

RJ is a huge piece. He could really thrive in that unit and put even MORE pressure on Thibs to play them more which I know everyone will enjoy

RJ looks more comfortable and plays with more freedom with the 2nd unit. RJ thrives in an open court, fast pace game because he's an open court, downhill player. I love the idea of RJ getting more mins with IQ, Obi and Rose. With that said, the optics wont look too good; our 3rd pick and future star going to the bench.

Honestly Fish, if anyone needs to be removed from the SL, its Kemba. Kemba is a fellow Bronxite like myself, and Knicks have been pushing the 'coming home' narrative for him, but his defense has been bad he is really struggling creating separation. It would help if he were more of a playmaker, but passing has never been a major strength of his.

Would love to see us hand the keys to IQ and run the offense through the guards...IQ is not a pure pg, but he is still developing and we have already seen growth in the playmaking department from last year to this year...Rose doesn't want to start nor is he reliable due to injuries and Walker clearly aint the future. So why not give the ball to IQ?

IQs playmaking is apparent when he is paired with Obi. Those fast breaks are here to stay. Then there are the lobs. Obi give more than Mitch Rob does here as he moves without the ball and also can take advantage of his post position when catching the ball under the hoop. Robinson can only alley oop and cannot do anything with the ball otherwise.
Without IQ Obi will not have those same opportunities and IQ would not have a target like Obi.

IQ and Obi definitely have great synergy...But, moving IQ into the starting lineup will help the starters more than it will hurt Obi. IQ will improve our defense at the point of attack and he will increase our pace which will help the starters get a few more easy baskets. IQ has been doing a good job of running the pick n roll as well and maybe he can get Mitch involved a little more...

As a starter, IQ can still get some minutes on the floor with Obi, if Thibs staggers the minutes...Ultimately, I would love to see IQ, Obi and RJ get some extended minutes together as well.

Benching R.J. Barrett and putting him into the backup unit?

Is this a joke?

- He's a 3rd year player.

- Drafted #3 overall.

- Helped LEAD US TO THE PLAYOFFS as only a 2nd year player last year (alongside of Julius Randle and Derrick Rose).

- Has All-Star potential as a two way player.

And we're talking about benching him and removing him from the starting lineup? That's a JOKE.

I can agree with Immanuel Quickley becoming our starting PG but benching R.J.? wow.

Just wow.

I’m for whatever it takes to get the starting unit to play like they give a crap

Just swap Burks for Kemba

This wouldn’t be my first move. But it’s an interesting conversation over 🍻 at a bar or on UK 😊. But there are a zillion moves you can and should make b4 you move your future All Star youngster and risk scrambling his confidence even more? That’s why we have Leon Rose led FO and old school Thibs.
Let’s start with the easier moves and less political route, without messing up the second unit too much or messing with last years chemistry between Randle and RJ. There’s always a pecking order when making high risk changes. Start thinking about moving 1 of the 2 guards in Kemba and EF for either IQ, Burks or Rose. Some combination of those 5 players would be my first tuneup. Or take EF out and some combination of those 4. Burks, IQ, Rose, Kemba

On the flip side, there’s lots of PROs in RJ coming off the bench and Burks starting. So I think it’s an interesting discussion but not a realistic approach based on the FO and Thibs history.

Rookie wrote:Just swap Burks for Kemba

+1 seems like the obvious solution to me.

JesseDark wrote:

Rookie wrote:Just swap Burks for Kemba

+1 seems like the obvious solution to me.

But how will you use Walker, Rose and Quickley all off the bench ? I say swap Walker with Quickley if anything. It speeds up the first unit and allows Walker, Rose and Burks to absolutely cook 2nd units. Quickley brings speed, off the ball movement and defense to the first unit that Walker doesn’t. Starting Burks makes sense if the team isn’t healthy but at full strength it really jumbles up the 2nd unit. Walker can replace Quickley off the bench. None of these guys can replace Burks.

JesseDark wrote:

Rookie wrote:Just swap Burks for Kemba

+1 seems like the obvious solution to me.

I bet the obvious solution is to play Burks with sone combination of starters and see which combination plays well together. Collect data and let the analytics employees earn their pay. The data will drive which combination of players work and don’t work. I’m sure thibs is and will continue to shuffle rotation but leave the starting unit alone. Depending on who’s struggling more between EF and Kemba….will be subbed out for Burks. I think he likes having a Swiss arm knife to use whenever Burks is needed at 3 positions.

Why? This is one of those small sample size ideas. Remember Burks starting as PG last year and not amounting to anything permanent. Also, remember him going 10 for 32 in a three-game stretch vs Atlanta in the playoffs. Including 4 for 16 from three. Which is the reason why we got him. I like Burks and think he is needed. But feel he is best off the bench sparking quick offensive production. Think you limit him in the starting lineup. Why try to make him gel with others when he is a Lou Williams type of player. In terms of benching RJ, wont happen. Knee jerk move NO coach will make. Especially one that is playing him over 30 minutes a game?

Rookie wrote:I’m for whatever it takes to get the starting unit to play like they give a crap

I second that remark. Starters are poop right now and dragging the team down. If they can't find the energy and focus, we have a problem. Nobody should get a break...all that matters is what advances the interests of the team...i.e., winning!

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:RJ moves to the Rose/IQ/Obi squad and is a better fit there. Burks is a much better half court player than RJ. Doesnt help the defense much but is a better fit with the Kemba/EF/Randle trio I think we should stick with for now

If RJ is having a good shooting night or just playing playing great you can ride for 30 minutes.

I dont think you need to change anything else. The starters need to play better and the bench needs to play longer. I think we are seeing more spirited play from Randle/Kemba/EF (even if not always effective) but we are also seeing Thibs playing the bench for extended minutes if the game dictates that.

Its 20 games. We have a lot of guys who should play better. The reason they usually do under Thibs is because he doesnt yank them around and trusts his guys. "To a fault" is an opinion of fans but I doubt his players think that and those are the guys who win the games.

RJ is a huge piece. He could really thrive in that unit and put even MORE pressure on Thibs to play them more which I know everyone will enjoy

RJ looks more comfortable and plays with more freedom with the 2nd unit. RJ thrives in an open court, fast pace game because he's an open court, downhill player. I love the idea of RJ getting more mins with IQ, Obi and Rose. With that said, the optics wont look too good; our 3rd pick and future star going to the bench. Also, would RJ's confidence take a hit as he may view this as a demotion?

Honestly Fish, if anyone needs to be removed from the SL, its Kemba. Kemba is a Bronxite like myself, and Knicks have been pushing the 'coming home' narrative for him, but his defense has been bad and on the offensive end, he is really struggling creating separation. It would help if he were more of a playmaker, but passing has never been a major strength of his. Kemba's strength is running the pick n roll, and for some reason, we don't allow him to run it too often. Regardless, he is a defensive liability and I am not sure how much longer we can cover for him on the defensive end.

Would love to see us hand the keys to IQ and run the offense through the guards...IQ is not a pure pg, but he is still developing and we have already seen growth in the playmaking department from last year to this year. His defense has improved as well..Rose doesn't want to start nor is he reliable due to injuries and Walker clearly aint the future. So why not give the ball to IQ?

I think everyone sees and agrees with the bold. The discussion is why its not happening and that is because we still need him and what he brings. Maybe its that simple and Kemba is relegated to bench shooter. Feels like he's got more in the tank and can still be a useful piece. I would like to salvage that somehow.

Knixkik wrote:

JesseDark wrote:

Rookie wrote:Just swap Burks for Kemba

+1 seems like the obvious solution to me.

But how will you use Walker, Rose and Quickley all off the bench ? I say swap Walker with Quickley if anything. It speeds up the first unit and allows Walker, Rose and Burks to absolutely cook 2nd units. Quickley brings speed, off the ball movement and defense to the first unit that Walker doesn’t. Starting Burks makes sense if the team isn’t healthy but at full strength it really jumbles up the 2nd unit. Walker can replace Quickley off the bench. None of these guys can replace Burks.

oh wait... there's more to figure out? Its like not even chess vs. checkers, these guys are thinking tic tac toe

You simply cant play Rose/Kemba/IQ off the bench together, so if bench Kemba for Burks he's pretty much out of the rotation. 20 games seems a bit premature from what I have seen. The guy can still light it up. We need to find ways to use all these guys like we did last year. It took some time then also (unless you are ready to call Kemba this year's Dennis Smith Jr)

Its tough for Walker but good for the team

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/nba-q...

Thibs isn't gonna jump threw hoops to try to accomodate 3 small guards.

Looks like Burks starting at pg rest of the season.

fishmike wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

JesseDark wrote:

Rookie wrote:Just swap Burks for Kemba

+1 seems like the obvious solution to me.

But how will you use Walker, Rose and Quickley all off the bench ? I say swap Walker with Quickley if anything. It speeds up the first unit and allows Walker, Rose and Burks to absolutely cook 2nd units. Quickley brings speed, off the ball movement and defense to the first unit that Walker doesn’t. Starting Burks makes sense if the team isn’t healthy but at full strength it really jumbles up the 2nd unit. Walker can replace Quickley off the bench. None of these guys can replace Burks.

oh wait... there's more to figure out? Its like not even chess vs. checkers, these guys are thinking tic tac toe

You simply cant play Rose/Kemba/IQ off the bench together, so if bench Kemba for Burks he's pretty much out of the rotation. 20 games seems a bit premature from what I have seen. The guy can still light it up. We need to find ways to use all these guys like we did last year. It took some time then also (unless you are ready to call Kemba this year's Dennis Smith Jr)

The rookies have been looking effective off the bench. We will see IQ, Grimes coming off the bench at both Guard spots until Rose comes back

It’s a long season, eventually Kemba will be back in the rotation thanks to injuries

NYKMentality wrote:Benching R.J. Barrett and putting him into the backup unit?

Is this a joke?

- He's a 3rd year player.

- Drafted #3 overall.

- Helped LEAD US TO THE PLAYOFFS as only a 2nd year player last year (alongside of Julius Randle and Derrick Rose).

- Has All-Star potential as a two way player.

And we're talking about benching him and removing him from the starting lineup? That's a JOKE.

I can agree with Immanuel Quickley becoming our starting PG but benching R.J.? wow.

Just wow.

RJ fans are funny .. Putting RJ Barrett on the 2nd unit lineup would turn the 2nd unit lineup performance inconsistent & confuse like the starters lol