MS wrote:Hes been disengaged this year, is struggling with his shot and isnt the same player is a big reason why we are out of the playoffs.
Big reason why we're out of the playoffs?
We're 1.5 games back of the 6th seed and also 1.5 games back of the NBAs 10th best record.
Was Julius Randle the reason we were out of the playoffs last year @ 25-27 and 2.0 games below .500 after 52 games?!?
Oh how quickly this fan base has already forgotten.
Knicks wouldn't even have 5 wins this year without Julius Randle. 7-9 max.
Panos wrote:Win 60 what?
That 60 win team of 1992 was only 21-14 after 35 games. Exactly 4.0 games ahead of this years team.
Ok. So we might fall short of 60 wins but we're going to without question win at least 50.
You'll see.
You wanna use win-loss metric because if you used any actual Jrandle stat you would have no leg to stand on.
Sambakick wrote:You wanna use win-loss metric because if you used any actual Jrandle stat you would have no leg to stand on.
No leg to stand on?
He became the 1st and only NBA player dating back to 1986's MVP Larry Bird to ever average 20+ points (24.1), 10+ rebounds (10.1) and 5+ assists (6.0) while @ over .400% from 3PT (.411%).
Sorry. But I'm not a fan who quits on our best and most DOMINANT player (not even 36 games into the season).
2020: 24.1 points, 10.1 rebounds, 6.0 assists and .411% from 3. 17-18 after 35 games.
2021: 19.3 points, 10.0 rebounds, 5.0 assists and .328% from 3. 17-18 after 35 games.
His numbers (despite 2.3 minutes fewer per game this year) outside of 3PT% are damn near identical to his All-Star and NY MVP season of last year.
I'm just not stupid enough to quit on him not even 36 games into the season.
NYKMentality wrote:The hatred for Julius Randle is disgusting. Led us to the playoffs for the 1st time since 2012-2013.
NBAs most improved player.
NBA All-Star.
But yet some of you guys are "celebrating" his covid protocol and quitting on him only 35 games into the season?
Some of you Julius Randle critucs are too clueless to comprehend NY was 17-18 after 35 games last year and also only 25-27 after 52 games last year.
(thnx God coach Thibs didn't quit on Julius Randle like you guys do).
Thankfully the only games we'll be without Randle are against 3 crap teams OKC/Toronto/Indiana/.
So even if we go 3-0 without Randle it means absolutely nothingness in regards to "proving NY doesn't need him".
Toronto and Indiana have had our number this season. We are 1-4 against them in 5 games.
I wouldn't say that Randle's absence over these games is determinative of anything - but it is an observation point to see if the ball movement improves in these games.
Not convinced that Obi will get the start, which would be his first.
Philc1 wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:Sambakick wrote:This is honestly something I've been anticipating. It was bound to happen and now we can see what we have without Randle. Kemba can finally own the offense. Fournier can cook. The black hole is gone.
Don't want to be too harsh, but you're right. Randle doesn't look right and the team seems to be suffering because of it. I wonder if it means RJ will see some time at "PF" as well. No Randle means less double teams, but I'm hopeful it will lead to crisper ball movement.
Doubt RJ moves to the 4. He’s only 6’6. Most likely we see full time Obi and more of Taj and Sims
Not saying RJ will be the starting four. I'm saying he may see some time there due to current depth issues. I mean, we saw Saddiq friggin Bet on Randle last night.
C: Mitchell Robinson.
PF: Obi Toppin.
SF: R.J. Barrett.
SG: Quentin Grimes.
PG: Kemba Walker.
C: Nerlens Noel.
PF: Taj Gibson.
SF: Alec Burks.
SG: Immanuel Quickley.
PG: Deuce McBride.
This should become our new 10 man rotation (until our All-Star leader Julius Randle returns).
I'm sorry, but our backup unit does not look as exciting/electric and as awesome; without Obi Toppin.
NYKMentality wrote:Sambakick wrote:You wanna use win-loss metric because if you used any actual Jrandle stat you would have no leg to stand on.
No leg to stand on?
He became the 1st and only NBA player dating back to 1986's MVP Larry Bird to ever average 20+ points (24.1), 10+ rebounds (10.1) and 5+ assists (6.0) while @ over .400% from 3PT (.411%).
Sorry. But I'm not a fan who quits on our best and most DOMINANT player (not even 36 games into the season).
2020: 24.1 points, 10.1 rebounds, 6.0 assists and .411% from 3. 17-18 after 35 games.
2021: 19.3 points, 10.0 rebounds, 5.0 assists and .328% from 3. 17-18 after 35 games.
His numbers (despite 2.3 minutes fewer per game this year) outside of 3PT% are damn near identical to his All-Star and NY MVP season of last year.
I'm just not stupid enough to quit on him not even 36 games into the season.
His numbers aren't damnnear identical.
Sambakick wrote:NYKMentality wrote:Sambakick wrote:You wanna use win-loss metric because if you used any actual Jrandle stat you would have no leg to stand on.
No leg to stand on? He became the 1st and only NBA player dating back to 1986's MVP Larry Bird to ever average 20+ points (24.1), 10+ rebounds (10.1) and 5+ assists (6.0) while @ over .400% from 3PT (.411%).
Sorry. But I'm not a fan who quits on our best and most DOMINANT player (not even 36 games into the season).
2020: 24.1 points, 10.1 rebounds, 6.0 assists and .411% from 3. 17-18 after 35 games.
2021: 19.3 points, 10.0 rebounds, 5.0 assists and .328% from 3. 17-18 after 35 games.
His numbers (despite 2.3 minutes fewer per game this year) outside of 3PT% are damn near identical to his All-Star and NY MVP season of last year.
I'm just not stupid enough to quit on him not even 36 games into the season.
His numbers aren't damnnear identical.
Outside of 3PT% they are.
I've been very critical of Randles play and lack of effort this year. Gave him props last year but was critical of him game the season before last. My criticism of Randle has been fair, never personal. Covid is nothing to play with so I wish him nothing but good health and a healthy return.
With that said, I am curious to see if the offensive flow, ball and player movement will be more consistent with his absence. The starters will have decent ball movement on consecutive possessions then will interrupt the rhythm as if they are obligated to pass Randle the ball at the elbow every third possession or so and stand around, waiting for him to do something.
I am also curious to see the rotations. This is a time for Randle to observe, self evaluate and figure put the best way to imement himself back into flow when he returns.
Hope he’s okay- hopefully, he just has mild to no symptoms and will come back well rested and recharged. Think he needed a break anyways, whatever’s going on with his game.
Last years MVP Nikola Jokić is also having a down year.
This year?
Lower Points Per Game than last year.
Lower FG% than last year.
Lower 3PT% than last year.
Lower FT% than last year.
Lower Assists Per Game than last year.
I wonder if I'm allowed to give Nikola Jokić the same NY Julius Randle "treatment" and claim he's a fake MVP and blame his Nuggets mediocre 17-16 record ALL ON HIM? 😅🤣
Lets be honest here. Denver has regressed since last year (because of him) and Nikola Jokić himseld has regressed from his MVP season of last year.
Maybe Denver Nuggets would celebrate Nikola Jokić catching NBA covid protocol and maybe Denver Nuggets are frustrated about 17-16 and would like to see how Denver plays 3-5 games without Nikola Jokić? 😅
smackeddog wrote:Hope he’s okay- hopefully, he just has mild to no symptoms and will come back well rested and recharged. Think he needed a break anyways, whatever’s going on with his game.
Health aside, This break may actually do him some good...
NYKMentality wrote:Last years MVP Nikola Jokić is also having a down year. This year?
Lower Points Per Game than last year.
Lower FG% than last year.
Lower 3PT% than last year.
Lower FT% than last year.
Lower Assists Per Game than last year.
I wonder if I'm allowed to give Nikola Jokić the same NY Julius Randle "treatment" and claim he's a fake MVP and blame his Nuggets mediocre 17-16 record ALL ON HIM? 😅🤣
Lets be honest here. Denver has regressed since last year (because of him) and Nikola Jokić himseld has regressed from his MVP season of last year.
Maybe Denver Nuggets would celebrate Nikola Jokić catching NBA covid protocol and maybe Denver Nuggets are frustrated about 17-16 and would like to see how Denver plays 3-5 games without Nikola Jokić? 😅
Jokic leads the league in PER at 32.41. He can have lower in all those stats you listed and still be in the conversation for best in the league. Randle's PER is 16.32. He does not even deserve to be in the same conversation as Jokic. Try another strawman argument.
Clean wrote:NYKMentality wrote:Last years MVP Nikola Jokić; is also having a down year. This year?
Lower Points Per Game than last year.
Lower FG% than last year.
Lower 3PT% than last year.
Lower FT% than last year.
Lower Assists Per Game than last year.
I wonder if I'm allowed to give Nikola Jokić the same NY Julius Randle treatment and claim he's a fake MVP and blame his Nuggets mediocre 17-16 record ALL ON HIM?
Lets be honest here. Denver has regressed since last year (because of him) and Nikola Jokić; himseld has regressed from his MVP season of last year.
Maybe Denver Nuggets would celebrate Nikola Jokic catching NBA covid protocol and maybe Denver Nuggets are frustrated about 17-16 and would like to see how Denver plays 3-5 games without Nikola Joki&;
Jokic leads the league in PER at 32.41. He can have lower in all those stats you listed and still be in the conversation for best in the league. Randle's PER is 16.32. He does not even deserve to be in the same conversation as Jokic. Try another strawman argument.
And he's failed to improve his team this year.
17-16 overall.
I'll act like Knicks fans and blame their best player. It's ALL the jokers fault for his teams decline.
Doesn't deserve to be in the same conversation as Jokic? This year vs. Jokic and Denver Julius Randle put up 24 points, 8 assists and 7 rebounds with only 1 turnover and 50% from the field. And anyone who blames that Knicks loss on "Julius Randle" must not have watched the game.
The only strawman argument are for the fans already forgetting about his All-Star season last year (top 10 in MVP votes) and quitting on him not even 36 games into 2021's season and straight up trashing our best player.
Knicks = 17-18.
Denver = 17-16.
Wow. Some difference.
NYKMentality wrote:The hatred for Julius Randle is disgusting. Led us to the playoffs for the 1st time since 2012-2013.
NBAs most improved player.
NBA All-Star.
But yet some of you guys are "celebrating" his covid protocol and quitting on him only 35 games into the season?
Some of you Julius Randle critucs are too clueless to comprehend NY was 17-18 after 35 games last year and also only 25-27 after 52 games last year.
(thnx God coach Thibs didn't quit on Julius Randle like you guys do).
Thankfully the only games we'll be without Randle are against 3 crap teams OKC/Toronto/Indiana/.
So even if we go 3-0 without Randle it means absolutely nothingness in regards to "proving NY doesn't need him".
I'm expecting time needed to adjust as the offense will be totally different. Everyone aside from the 2nd unit has been standing around trying to play off of Randle - now it will have to shift somewhat. Good ball movement, faster switching on defense, increased tempo, more cutting and passing would be my way of evaluating the difference. Will RJ assume Randle's roll or will Thibs allow a more free-flowing type of offense?
3 games probably won't say too much IMO. And despite not being a Randle fan - we will likely miss him when the game slows down and against higher quality opponents. Best case is Randle stays well/healthy but needs 2-3 weeks to test negative so we can see what the neighbor's lawn actually looks like. Randle then returns off the bench and wins 6th man of the Year :)
Thankfully covid protocol has been reduced from 10 days to only 6.
Today = 1 day.
Tomorrow @ OKC = 2 days.
Saturday = 3 days.
Sunday @ Toronto = 4 days.
Monday = 5 days.
Tuesday vs. Pacers = 6th (and final) day.
Thankfully Julius Randle will only miss 3 games vs. 3 below .500 teams and will be back into our starting lineup for our home/away games vs. Boston (next Thursday and Saturday).
BMart wrote:Not convinced that Obi will get the start, which would be his first.
It appears thibs is listening to his analytics team. That alone will force thibs to start Obi just like it forced thibs to drop Kemba.
I think the measuring stick for these next 3 games is not wins or losses. But the chemistry in the 1st unit. It doesn’t matter who we play, the starting unit with Randle has been atrocious and sometimes embarrassing. Let’s see how we start with Randle out, as a team. Let’s see if Obi impacts the game more with more playing time.
I doubt RJ plays the 4 but I can see him doing it with no problem, depending on the matchups. Green is 6’7 playing center for GS and dude from Miami Tucker? is 6’6 playing PF. So It’s not about the height, it’s about defensive IQ. But that doesn’t matter right now cause Obi will start.
Thibs could get tricky and don’t want to mess with 2nd unit. But thibs and FO needs to see how Obi handles the starter roll in case they want to pull the trigger on a Randle blockbuster trade.
NYKMentality wrote:Sambakick wrote:You wanna use win-loss metric because if you used any actual Jrandle stat you would have no leg to stand on.
No leg to stand on?
He became the 1st and only NBA player dating back to 1986's MVP Larry Bird to ever average 20+ points (24.1), 10+ rebounds (10.1) and 5+ assists (6.0) while @ over .400% from 3PT (.411%).
Sorry. But I'm not a fan who quits on our best and most DOMINANT player (not even 36 games into the season).
2020: 24.1 points, 10.1 rebounds, 6.0 assists and .411% from 3. 17-18 after 35 games.
2021: 19.3 points, 10.0 rebounds, 5.0 assists and .328% from 3. 17-18 after 35 games.
His numbers (despite 2.3 minutes fewer per game this year) outside of 3PT% are damn near identical to his All-Star and NY MVP season of last year.
I'm just not stupid enough to quit on him not even 36 games into the season.
NYKMentality/Julius Randle :)
We need to be somewhat objective. Let me offer myself as an example. As an RJ fan/supporter let me say that while I have defended his play - he has also struggled/regressed this season. I have more hope he can improve as he is younger and less set in his ways. But right now I think I could outshoot him in a contest and I'm 51 y/o. Randle has simply not played close to where he was last year. I believe he overachieved last year and will always believe you don't run an offense around 1 player unless he offers most of the following qualities...
athletically superior (eg Giannis)
possesses excellent court vision (eg Jokic, Luka)
unreal shotmaking ability (eg Durant, Curry)
leads the team by example (eg no whining, defensive effort matches offensive effort).
We tried this around Melo who was a better offensive player than Randle and it doesn't work for high level success. This is more about Thibs than Randle but nobody here objectively will agree that Randle is performing anywhere near last season. Let's both hope he uses this medical break to be well and re-evaluate his ball holding tendencies - b/c IMO that is the one characteristic that changes how effective he plays, as well as the rest of the Knicks/Bricks this year.
