Looks like if any deal is going to get done it’s a 3 way trade with the Lakers, Jazz and Knicks. A lot of posturing through the media point in this direction. Lebron has agreed to his extension and the Lakers have agreed to use two 1st rd picks to improve the team. Nets are not shipping Kylie and KD is going to run it back 1 more year. Lakers focusing on Beverly and Bogdanovic Utah wants 2 more unprotected picks then the Knicks are willing to give
Someone is leaking all this stuff through the media and I don’t believe that it’s the Knicks leaking.
Rookie wrote:Looks like if any deal is going to get done it’s a 3 way trade with the Lakers, Jazz and Knicks. A lot of posturing through the media point in this direction. Lebron has agreed to his extension and the Lakers have agreed to use two 1st rd picks to improve the team. Nets are not shipping Kylie and KD is going to run it back 1 more year. Lakers focusing on Beverly and Bogdanovic Utah wants 2 more unprotected picks then the Knicks are willing to giveSomeone is leaking all this stuff through the media and I don’t believe that it’s the Knicks leaking.
Jazz and Lakers don't need the Knicks for this particular deal. Utah could just get the deal done with LA and their demands for Spida wouldn't necessarily budge.
KnickDanger wrote:EwingsGlass wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:EwingsGlass wrote:shinmen wrote:Unprotected picks are an heresy. Protection 1-3 is a minimum. You can potentially lose generational talent like that.
Ainge is doing Ainge, he doesn't negotiate. I was intrigued by Mitchell on the Knicks at first but the price is too high. Let's improve organically. This is not our time yet.
I am pretty much here now. Would have loved to add Mitchell but the price is just too high. I am more intrigued by the 2023 draft than certain that Mitchell puts us over the top.
The problem with the 2023 draft is our picks are looking to be mid, maybe late lottery at best. Also, Thibs if he's still here. You think he's hesitant to play rooks now? Imagine him when he's truly on the hot seat.
Looking at the draft, it is pretty deep. I think they can get high caliber rotation 3&Ds in the 10-20 range and solid PFs in the 20-30. I think you could give Johnnie Bryant a lot to work with. Its a deep draft and if you get athletes and commit to developing them over a few years, you will end up with a team looking like the Raptors in about 3 years.
Trading away future #1's and young talent for the splashy move is what the Knicks did for many many years -- which created the hole they are trying to crawl out of. While nothing definite is in place, the general parameters of the "haul" the Jazz would receive would guarantee a mediocre to average maybe slightly above average team in the near future. Whereas staying the course could conceivably entail a higher ceiling (and probably lower floor). To me it's nuts to go down the same path and expect different results.
You have to pay to play. I'm not advocating for the Knicks to give up three or four unprotected picks. But the reality is that the '23 draft is as much of a crapshoot as the '24,'25 or '26 draft. This team would likely be picking in the on the back end of the lottery or lower. You factor in roster spots, future extensions etc. and I'm not as worried. I'm more worried about giving up unprotected picks in '27 and beyond. To far down the road to project.
BigDaddyG wrote:Rookie wrote:Looks like if any deal is going to get done it’s a 3 way trade with the Lakers, Jazz and Knicks. A lot of posturing through the media point in this direction. Lebron has agreed to his extension and the Lakers have agreed to use two 1st rd picks to improve the team. Nets are not shipping Kylie and KD is going to run it back 1 more year. Lakers focusing on Beverly and Bogdanovic Utah wants 2 more unprotected picks then the Knicks are willing to giveSomeone is leaking all this stuff through the media and I don’t believe that it’s the Knicks leaking.
Jazz and Lakers don't need the Knicks for this particular deal. Utah could just get the deal done with LA and their demands for Spida wouldn't necessarily budge.
The one thing that keeps going off in the back of my mind - from a Lakers point of view - is who is the big that is going to fill in as a starter and/or carry the scoring load when LeBron AND AD both miss upwards of 20+ games in the season.
Last 4 seasons for LeBron: 56, 45, 67, 55. Last 4 for AD: 40, 36, 62, 56.
The Lakers KNOW they need to plan for this scenario coming up. List of players 6'8" and above: LeBron, AD, Thomas Bryant (last 3 seasons he has played 27, 10, 46 games), Damion Jones, and some scrap heap dudes.
Randle has like zero trade value but he is a filler and minutes killer, no matter how awful his fit is with LeBron and AD and the fact you need to play him off bench.
This is the one scenario I think there is a path for 3 teams to satisfy each of their team needs. Utah will get Lakers picks, NY moves on from Randle, Lakers will get a big and a few shooters that are on the Utah roster.
The assumption is with Mitchell we are not going to improve to 47 to 50 wins? I respect the "wait and see what happens".
How do we lose a trade we have not made?
Im down with Leon and Brock playing poker with Ainge. did the stare down. In the end its the knicks picks that I care about, and they should be protected at some level.
it should be conditional on how many games DM plays and if he resigns here. the worse the trade for us should not reward Utah for it.
BigDaddyG wrote:Rookie wrote:Looks like if any deal is going to get done it’s a 3 way trade with the Lakers, Jazz and Knicks. A lot of posturing through the media point in this direction. Lebron has agreed to his extension and the Lakers have agreed to use two 1st rd picks to improve the team. Nets are not shipping Kylie and KD is going to run it back 1 more year. Lakers focusing on Beverly and Bogdanovic Utah wants 2 more unprotected picks then the Knicks are willing to giveSomeone is leaking all this stuff through the media and I don’t believe that it’s the Knicks leaking.
Jazz and Lakers don't need the Knicks for this particular deal. Utah could just get the deal done with LA and their demands for Spida wouldn't necessarily budge.
They don’t, but Rose would be a much better fit for them over Westbrook
BRIGGS wrote:An unprotected pick is betting without a hedge. You can do that if you already have a base in place like the bucks did. There are things that can go wrong with 2/6-1 guards that we will only find out about after the fact. Assuming we’re gonna be good for 5-6 years based on no data is a recipe for disaster. Let’s wait and see what we have— we have many question marks to go outside the box. If we need picks to make a trade or we decide we need the picks —we have them in our safety deposit box.
Think the media is overstating what Rose is considering. Feel EF, Obi and three firsts plus a couple of seconds is what Rose is willing to do. Agree with the overall feeling that unless you are bringing in someone who can instantly make you a contender to get to the finals, Ie. Durant, KL, LBJ, you just can't give up what Jazz are rumoured to be asking. Feel both teams are hoping maybe a third team can facilitate assets to reach a compromise. Maybe turning guys like Rose, Cam or EF into more of what the Jazz want is the path for something to get done. But just don't see that happening until mid season when teams are aligning for playoffs and adding pieces.
Phoenix sports talk radio guy. Take with a grain of salt.
BigDaddyG wrote:Phoenix sports talk radio guy. Take with a grain of salt.
Beal, Kp with DM? Returns of Hachimora, Avanda, kuzma, etc. They should go after him.
Lakers? Centric on Westbrook and his salary?
Kings. Of course they are.
Charlotte? Send GH back to Utah plus plus…… Maybe Hornets take back some players too?
Clev. Sexton plus…….
Bkn…….Simmons plus?
BigDaddyG wrote:Phoenix sports talk radio guy. Take with a grain of salt.
Have to wonder at this point if the deal’s pretty much done- otherwise why would the Mets arrange a Knicks night at the end of the month? Daft planning if the deal isn’t done and rather than wait to see if it happens they blow such a good marketing opportunity by having an event prematurely
Can we move on already. Ainge trying to drain us of everything. If we make this trade we will be the same place we were last year. RK, one of our young and picks. Hell no.
Dont believe the PR dept is going to be the leading indicator, so to speak. More likely a Woj bomb. I agree that this second round of talks will probably end with a deal. Would be interesting to see if a Brunson/DM backcourt could work. If a deal was to happen. wish it had been during the first trade window, this season. Give Brunson time to connect with the rest of the squad first.
On the other hand, a deal at a later date might be more expensive. If the deal goes through, I hope the first two priorities are defense, and ball movement. Ranked 20th by ESPN will be accurate, if we cant defend, or share the rock.
The Warriors under Mark Jackson was a good team. He should be credited with making GS play D. But it was Kerr who emphasized ball movement over lots of ISOs.
I know Thibs can get them to play D, but his future with the team might be decided on wether or not he can get all these good to great one on one players to develop a free flowing offense.
smackeddog wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:Phoenix sports talk radio guy. Take with a grain of salt.
Have to wonder at this point if the deal’s pretty much done- otherwise why would the Mets arrange a Knicks night at the end of the month? Daft planning if the deal isn’t done and rather than wait to see if it happens they blow such a good marketing opportunity by having an event prematurely
GustavBahler wrote:Dont believe the PR dept is going to be the leading indicator, so to speak. More likely a Woj bomb. I agree that this second round of talks will probably end with a deal. Would be interesting to see if a Brunson/DM backcourt could work. If a deal was to happen. wish it had been during the first trade window, this season. Give Brunson time to connect with the rest of the squad first. On the other hand, a deal at a later date might be more expensive. If the deal goes through, I hope the first two priorities are defense, and ball movement. Ranked 20th by ESPN will be accurate, if we cant defend, or share the rock.
The Warriors under Mark Jackson was a good team. He should be credited with making GS play D. But it was Kerr who emphasized ball movement over lots of ISOs.
I know Thibs can get them to play D, but his future with the team might be decided on wether or not he can get all these good to great one on one players to develop a free flowing offense.
Agree with you 100%. The consistent characteristics of the great or very good teams are defense and ball movement.
Talk now is about the Knicks potentially including RJ in the trade- which maybe is OK. We love RJ but his shooting at the line and at the rim are pretty big red flags. RJ will hit RFA next season and we might get into a Collin Sexton type situation where his value is highly determined by his usage and as the team improves it makes it difficult to justify taking shots away from more efficient players.
The thing that always shocks me is how young RJ still is. You expect that efficiency to improve with age. He's 4 years younger than DM so that gives NY a longer time period to put a team around him but if RJ s ceiling is as a 3rd banana, you can't really build a team around him.
Ever since Leon Rose got hired we have been hearing about the DM connection. I think the path in the East is going to go through Embiid and Giannis for the next few years and DM is a counter for those two in a way that RJ isn't. So as much as it hurts, I think it's OK to sell high on RJ.
gradyandrew wrote:Talk now is about the Knicks potentially including RJ in the trade- which maybe is OK. We love RJ but his shooting at the line and at the rim are pretty big red flags. RJ will hit RFA next season and we might get into a Collin Sexton type situation where his value is highly determined by his usage and as the team improves it makes it difficult to justify taking shots away from more efficient players.The thing that always shocks me is how young RJ still is. You expect that efficiency to improve with age. He's 4 years younger than DM so that gives NY a longer time period to put a team around him but if RJ s ceiling is as a 3rd banana, you can't really build a team around him.
Ever since Leon Rose got hired we have been hearing about the DM connection. I think the path in the East is going to go through Embiid and Giannis for the next few years and DM is a counter for those two in a way that RJ isn't. So as much as it hurts, I think it's OK to sell high on RJ.
We would not be selling high on RJ. They want RJ, 1 of the 3 young players and still the picks(Assuming its the 4 unprotected they always wanted from the start). All they are looking for is a Wolves type overpay.
Clean wrote:Can we move on already. Ainge trying to drain us of everything. If we make this trade we will be the same place we were last year. RK, one of our young and picks. Hell no.
Thought this might happen (them suddenly wanting RJ)- seems a standard negotiating pitch, pretending you have zero interest in a player, to drive down their value in the trade value, the opposing team then has to offer a high priced alternative, then once that's roughly in place, suddenly pivot and demand the player you pretended you didn't want as a 'deal breaking extra'.
Fit wise, personally, I think it makes more sense to trade RJ and keep Grimes, Cam, IQ and Obi. I'm not sure if RJ fits next to D-Mitch and Brunson (and especially not with Randle too), and I'm still not sure the kind of role RJ should have on a team especially coming up for a big pay day- happy to be proved wrong though!
So the media now has the DM price at RJ, Obi (or Grimes /IQ) and 5 first rounders (3 unprotected)? Ainge must really be working his media back-channels.
Can't wait for the season the start.
foosballnick wrote:So the media now has the DM price at RJ, Obi (or Grimes /IQ) and 5 first rounders (3 unprotected)? Ainge must really be working his media back-channels. Can't wait for the season the start.
Brock Aller just needs to walk away for the time being. Danny still wants to play games in the off-season. Let's revisit after Donovan Mitchell turns on the team "cancer" switch at the start of the season.
I can see Cleveland being a solid competitor for Donovan, they've got all their picks but no extra picks like NY.
I'm assuming their lineup could be: Garland, DM, ?, Mobley, Jarrett. Bench: Rubio, Sexton, LaVert, Lauri.
Trade fodder: Okoro, Ochai Agbaji, Love (for salary)
How about we DO NOT trade for Donovan Mitchell.. I would be concerned with his future availability. Believe he had some concussion issues in the past. A player at his size playing as hard as he does can be concerning. RJ at least has the body type to withstand the pounding. Also Mitchell seems to be redundant to Brunson (especially in size) Mitchell is almost like a a rich man’s Colin Sexton which is unnecessary or just trade for Colin Sexton himself who will be much cheaper. My 2 cents…
