fishmike wrote:Knixkik wrote:fishmike wrote:Knixkik wrote:Barrett will never be MIP because his counting stats won’t be different than they are now. The issue he’s had this year is he is behind 2 guys who are combining for 50 ppg. Elite 1-2 offensive punch. And then those 2 (Brunson and Randle) are surrounded by very good role players. Barrett is stuck in no-man’s land of not being a star and not adjusting to a role around stars. The hope is he learns and develops into a Wiggins type. But he is struggling to be the third guy on a team that has had 2 guys running the show.
how is the bold "an issue" as it's certainly not stopping RJ from getting almost as many shots as those two. They just dont go in as often
It’s only an issue for people who think Barrett can ever be a MIP. Not an issue other than in that context.
ah! yeah he's already had his 20ppg... it would have be something unprecedented
Yes, and the increase in volume is never going to be there. His improvements in the future would still have him putting up the same numbers, just better defense and better efficiency. But as a third option he’s pretty much reached his statistical ceiling.
Knickoftime wrote:Knixkik wrote:Since Randle is balling everyone just needs a new outlet and RJ is the punching bag for the year. Every year it has to be someone. It should be Obi but he’s too much of a fan favorite like Ntilikina was. And I’m not saying RJ concerns aren’t warranted, they are just overblown because everyone is hyper aware of when he does something wrong, myself included.
Knixkik wrote:Since Randle is balling everyone just needs a new outlet and RJ is the punching bag for the year. Every year it has to be someone. It should be Obi but he’s too much of a fan favorite like Ntilikina was. And I’m not saying RJ concerns aren’t warranted, they are just overblown because everyone is hyper aware of when he does something wrong, myself included.
Worth seeing again twice.
Its the intersection of the bogeyman syndrome and confirmation bias, which in turn accelerate one another into circular logic out of control.
This is absolutely not the case for me. You don't get frustrated with some of the bonehead plays he makes? Honestly? Yes, he scores points. But he's infuriating to watch. Mind you, I'm not saying trade him for a second rounder or a salary dump like others said about Randle, that's just not good asset management. I just think he's slow/plodding, not-creative/telegraphing, and low BBIQ. I would totally look for a sideways trade numbers wise for better fit.
In summary, I'm so loving watching the rest of the Knicks right now... except RJ. So yeah, the contrast stands out.
Panos wrote:Knickoftime wrote:Knixkik wrote:Since Randle is balling everyone just needs a new outlet and RJ is the punching bag for the year. Every year it has to be someone. It should be Obi but he’s too much of a fan favorite like Ntilikina was. And I’m not saying RJ concerns aren’t warranted, they are just overblown because everyone is hyper aware of when he does something wrong, myself included.
Knixkik wrote:Since Randle is balling everyone just needs a new outlet and RJ is the punching bag for the year. Every year it has to be someone. It should be Obi but he’s too much of a fan favorite like Ntilikina was. And I’m not saying RJ concerns aren’t warranted, they are just overblown because everyone is hyper aware of when he does something wrong, myself included.
Worth seeing again twice.
Its the intersection of the bogeyman syndrome and confirmation bias, which in turn accelerate one another into circular logic out of control.
This is absolutely not the case for me. You don't get frustrated with some of the bonehead plays he makes? Honestly? Yes, he scores points. But he's infuriating to watch. Mind you, I'm not saying trade him for a second rounder or a salary dump like others said about Randle, that's just not good asset management. I just think he's slow/plodding, not-creative/telegraphing, and low BBIQ. I would totally look for a sideways trade numbers wise for better fit.
In summary, I'm so loving watching the rest of the Knicks right now... except RJ. So yeah, the contrast stands out.
Question: If Barrett were a more efficient scorer. Followed up year 2 with a healthy three point % and became an above average scorer, you think the other stuff would "frustrate" you as much?
Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ for Jimmy Butler ?
Jimmy is not Jimmy anymore. No.
JHart is a facsimile of him. 3/4 of Jimmy at one third the price.
Nalod wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ for Jimmy Butler ?
Jimmy is not Jimmy anymore. No.
JHart is a facsimile of him. 3/4 of Jimmy at one third the price.
Not based on tonight's game
Nalod wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Nalod wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ for Jimmy Butler ?
Jimmy is not Jimmy anymore. No.
JHart is a facsimile of him. 3/4 of Jimmy at one third the price.
Not based on tonight's game
Not trading for Jimmy.
I wouldn't either for RJ that would be too short sighted. Yet, Butler is still great
Alpha1971 wrote:Nalod wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Nalod wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ for Jimmy Butler ?
Jimmy is not Jimmy anymore. No.
JHart is a facsimile of him. 3/4 of Jimmy at one third the price.
Not based on tonight's game
Not trading for Jimmy.
I wouldn't either for RJ that would be too short sighted. Yet, Butler is still great
did not say he sucked or lost it over night. That contract is huge. He is still one tough hombre.
Nalod wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ for Jimmy Butler ?
Jimmy is not Jimmy anymore. No.
JHart is a facsimile of him. 3/4 of Jimmy at one third the price.
I don’t like Jimmy but he’s still good player but I’d also reject this because he is going to be paid 50 mil on the last two years of his deal and will 100% be a much worse player.
Alpha1971 wrote:Nalod wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ for Jimmy Butler ?
Jimmy is not Jimmy anymore. No.
JHart is a facsimile of him. 3/4 of Jimmy at one third the price.
???
Clyde said tonite “Thibs said Jhart reminds him of Jimmy”.
Im not saying they agree with Nalod or clyde steals my stuff.
I alluded Jhart plays a good role for us and its obvious he a Thibs type of player.
Nalod wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Nalod wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ for Jimmy Butler ?
Jimmy is not Jimmy anymore. No.
JHart is a facsimile of him. 3/4 of Jimmy at one third the price.
???
Clyde said tonite “Thibs said Jhart reminds him of Jimmy”.
Im not saying they agree with Nalod or clyde steals my stuff.
I alluded Jhart plays a good role for us and its obvious he a Thibs type of player.
Jimmy is still Jimmy, he is having his best season of his career. Trading RJ for him seems like a Strickland for Cheeks vibes. But if we could trade for Jimmy using picks and expiring contracts to match I'd do it. If they wanted RJ, and picks and we keep Grimes and IQ I'd do it, sadly. Mitch, Julius, Jimmy, Grimes, Brunson Bench I Hart, Obi, J Hart, IQ, Deuce, Simms and mle,vet mins, two ways and whoever we trade for
Knixkik wrote:KnickDanger wrote:joec32033 wrote:Something from the Post article on the front page...But Barrett still has given the team a third 20-point scorer (20.1 ppg) since Dec. 4, with a 44.4/37.0/73.0 slash.
Grimes is contributing 11.5 points on average over that stretch (44.7/37.1/80.0), including 6-for-9 from long range and 22 points Wednesday against Brooklyn. Sixth man Immanuel Quickley also has played in all but one of the past 41 games, netting 14.6 points per appearance while shooting 46.1/38.0/80.6.
For all the shit Barrett is getting, and all the praise IQ and Grimes are getting about their shooting....All 3 players are shooting are pretty close percentage wise. Not saying it to be a schmuck, but it really surprised me they were so close.
I saw this article too and was surprised to see RJ’s percentages in the last 41 games essentially equal to the much loved IQ and Grimes. And averaging 20 points a game. Not saying there aren’t other issues such as consistency on defense, but it is interesting.
Since Randle is balling everyone just needs a new outlet and RJ is the punching bag for the year. Every year it has to be someone. It should be Obi but he’s too much of a fan favorite like Ntilikina was. And I’m not saying RJ concerns aren’t warranted, they are just overblown because everyone is hyper aware of when he does something wrong, myself included.
RJ is a solid player I just don't know if he is the ideal fit. I think a long wing defender that can spread the floor might be a better fit overall. Hart duplicates a lot of what RJ does. He is also a better defender, finisher, and rebounder. This would open up more shots for Quckley as the 3rd scorer. Say you swap RJ with OG. Is the team better?
I don’t know what this is
martin wrote:I don’t know what this is
I don’t know Martin? We all saw the game and players makes mistakes and look bad.
Thibs calls time out, and its addressed.
Tweeter is a waste. “Since 12pm on December 5th Randle been shooting 52 % from the left side when he has no braids and wears dark socks”.
Innocuous shit like this just be popping up. It can cute, or toxic. Politics, sports, you name it.
Nalod wrote:martin wrote:I don’t know what this is
I don’t know Martin? We all saw the game and players makes mistakes and look bad.
Thibs calls time out, and its addressed.
Tweeter is a waste. “Since 12pm on December 5th Randle been shooting 52 % from the left side when he has no braids and wears dark socks”.
Innocuous shit like this just be popping up. It can cute, or toxic. Politics, sports, you name it.
Even guys at the Sunday morning Y league would only tolerate this level of play so much, especially when the rest of the team is taking a giant step forward.
I don’t know, what do you think? Seems to happen more than once a game, the baffling level of stuff.
You think it’ll be tolerated much more now that Knicks are set to be playoff bound? The games are now getting serious.
martin wrote:Nalod wrote:martin wrote:I don’t know what this is
I don’t know Martin? We all saw the game and players makes mistakes and look bad.
Thibs calls time out, and its addressed.
Tweeter is a waste. “Since 12pm on December 5th Randle been shooting 52 % from the left side when he has no braids and wears dark socks”.
Innocuous shit like this just be popping up. It can cute, or toxic. Politics, sports, you name it.
Even guys at the Sunday morning Y league would only tolerate this level of play so much, especially when the rest of the team is taking a giant step forward.
I don’t know, what do you think? Seems to happen more than once a game, the baffling level of stuff.
You think it’ll be tolerated much more now that Knicks are set to be playoff bound? The games are now getting serious.
Its not to the detriment of the team is it?
Would we have seen it if “RIT” Did not point it out? Was Thibs wanting a foul?
YOu think the team is not addressing it BEFORE its a problem?
Seems RJ get the green light and if the outside shot is not working he stops.
At some point it seemed that they wanted him to shoot thru it but he is not, then he starts going to the rim.
The playmaking? When he is not fucking up he setting up more than just getting it down hill and shooting.
Its a process. Thats what I see. Im not 100% right, but I don’t see its to the detriment of the team.
Evident by the teams record and his minutes.
Im ok with him playing less.
I recall Quick also going thru a phase where he was over dribbling. If the shot was not there, he came out.
With an improved defense he is an asset and his decisions with the ball are better.
Im seeing similar with Grimes. His defense has taken a bit of a step back and his passing is not developing.
None of this is permanent. They are developing them which offers inconsistencies back and forth. They are young.
IQ has stepped up and its not about “Being rewarded”, its about contributing.
Rit’s tweeta about RJ after he scored 5 of the teams first 12 points like its an issue was really that note worthy?
Is RJ not listening to his coach? He gone rouge or just a WTF moment?
So nobody wants to acknowledge how R.J. Barrett is averaging .476% from the field (30/63) throughout 5 games since All-Star Weekend?
NYKMentality wrote:So nobody wants to acknowledge how R.J. Barrett is averaging .476% from the field (30/63) throughout 5 games since All-Star Weekend?
I'm high in RJ He is playing better since the break but even in his improved play he is still looking off open team mates every game to take his own shot, like Julius did when he was bad. Team might be telling him to be aggressive and he is failing, as opposed to IQ who is also being aggressive but hitting more shots relatively. I think RJ has the work ethic and talent to be a much better two way player consistently. However, he is on the clock for this team which is a win now team needing a two way wing starter. Heck even a wing who is just more consistent and effecient if even if not as gifted, to play his defined role day in and day out. RJ has to start seasons better, start games better, and play faster decision wise, and not pound the ball
RJ and Grimes are two X factors. If either one of them raises their level of play the team will be a powerhouse going forward. If both do, we will be elite. RJ should be the one we can expect to improve the most down the stretch of the season but I can see Grimes being the guy. He has to start scoring some more and those shots may have to come from the shots RJ is currently taking.
Jmpasq wrote:Knixkik wrote:KnickDanger wrote:joec32033 wrote:Something from the Post article on the front page...But Barrett still has given the team a third 20-point scorer (20.1 ppg) since Dec. 4, with a 44.4/37.0/73.0 slash.
Grimes is contributing 11.5 points on average over that stretch (44.7/37.1/80.0), including 6-for-9 from long range and 22 points Wednesday against Brooklyn. Sixth man Immanuel Quickley also has played in all but one of the past 41 games, netting 14.6 points per appearance while shooting 46.1/38.0/80.6.
For all the shit Barrett is getting, and all the praise IQ and Grimes are getting about their shooting....All 3 players are shooting are pretty close percentage wise. Not saying it to be a schmuck, but it really surprised me they were so close.
I saw this article too and was surprised to see RJ’s percentages in the last 41 games essentially equal to the much loved IQ and Grimes. And averaging 20 points a game. Not saying there aren’t other issues such as consistency on defense, but it is interesting.
Since Randle is balling everyone just needs a new outlet and RJ is the punching bag for the year. Every year it has to be someone. It should be Obi but he’s too much of a fan favorite like Ntilikina was. And I’m not saying RJ concerns aren’t warranted, they are just overblown because everyone is hyper aware of when he does something wrong, myself included.
RJ is a solid player I just don't know if he is the ideal fit. I think a long wing defender that can spread the floor might be a better fit overall. Hart duplicates a lot of what RJ does. He is also a better defender, finisher, and rebounder. This would open up more shots for Quckley as the 3rd scorer. Say you swap RJ with OG. Is the team better?
We may end up including RJ in a package to get a superstar next offseason we almost did it last year with Mitchell. Can that be enough to placate the RJ-Haters?
