LivingLegend wrote:If he were to stay healthy for 2-3 years the perfect guy is Jimmy B because….1 unselfish star
2 Thibs guy
3 Fits this teams culture
4 gets to line and refs respect him
5 may be cheaper vs other stars
Question would be why would Pat the Rat send him to NY
He getting old, he missing games, his contract is massive.
LivingLegend wrote:martin wrote:VDesai wrote:I dont understand how OG Anunobody carries a Durant pricetag. If he was that good Toronto would he over .500. Buyer beware.
He doesn’t?
But it’s still rumored to be steep no?
At time of the reported offer, OG was lead candidate for DPOY. Knicks offer of 3 picks were the 3 highly protected picks we received for the 1 pick #12 pick.
The “star” package is 4 unprotected and 4 pick swaps. You must trade your fortune for the next decade for a top 10 player.
Finding a star without paying that price is what moves you up a tier.
Knicks model appears to be finding guys on the cusp and getting them with the hope they take the next step. Brunson and Randle fit that mold.
I’ve always believed that despite the high risk, that the draft is the best place to find your star.
Define star player. Cause to me, there are only a handful of players who truly make an impact. I'm talking about players at that elite level like Giannis, Embiid, Luka, Jokic. Those are the type of players you risk it all and trade future unprotected picks 5 years from now. You do NOT in any shape or form do that for someone like Spida, LaVine, DeRozan, Beal or even Jaylen Brown!
I think we have one of the top treasure chests and packages to improve the roster but we have to be smart and make the right and fair trades and for players who make sense and most importantly, FIT!
Honestly I don't think we're going to be able to trade for that elite level star that will elevate us to contender status so the best route is to acquire players that just fit and make us better like Hart. I think when you look at the roster, having that reliable scorer/defender/playmaker as the 3rd guy is key. RJ does it well at times but I wouldn't say I trust him 100%. Same with the Center position. I like Rob and he does his job as a rebounder and defender well at times but he is not reliable with the injuries and his lack of offensive game hurts us. If you can find 'Hart level improvement' at those two starting positions, I think we can close that gap and get close to contender status.
SergioNYK wrote:Define star player. Cause to me, there are only a handful of players who truly make an impact. I'm talking about players at that elite level like Giannis, Embiid, Luka, Jokic. Those are the type of players you risk it all and trade future unprotected picks 5 years from now. You do NOT in any shape or form do that for someone like Spida, LaVine, DeRozan, Beal or even Jaylen Brown! I think we have one of the top treasure chests and packages to improve the roster but we have to be smart and make the right and fair trades and for players who make sense and most importantly, FIT!
Honestly I don't think we're going to be able to trade for that elite level star that will elevate us to contender status so the best route is to acquire players that just fit and make us better like Hart. I think when you look at the roster, having that reliable scorer/defender/playmaker as the 3rd guy is key. RJ does it well at times but I wouldn't say I trust him 100%. Same with the Center position. I like Rob and he does his job as a rebounder and defender well at times but he is not reliable with the injuries and his lack of offensive game hurts us. If you can find 'Hart level improvement' at those two starting positions, I think we can close that gap and get close to contender status.
"player" is someone that can improve our situation without taking away from the existing talent pool conceptual. WE use expiring contracts, picks and RJ and Obi, or whom ever did not do well in the last game or two. Its ok to use picks in this manner. When we use them to replace RJ and Obi was are getting young players whom are not inconsistent either. I know this because Walt Perrin and Brock Aller make it so. WE don't talk about Perry because his Orlando picks are all we go on.
WE have RoKas too whose trading rights are like Lukas.
Truth is Windhorst, Whose podcasts I do listen to (not this past one) are pretty good. Big phrase is "THEY CAN". Not "They will".
Im having too much fun this season to worry about any of this. Its all fun.
Im wondering if EF, Mitch, and (what ever) for Ayton? Not saying it puts us over the top alone. NO one move does. Maybe that marinates for year and we get closer.
or.........is there a world we move up in the draft, promote Ihart to start for year, and devlop said rookie and Sims in the interim.
Reality might be small moves, running it back mostly intact, and keep having a treasure chest until opportunity knocks. Its abstract, but as long as the team is moving forward im patient.
I've felt that Knicks are 2 moves away from really contending. Upgrade in 1 role player and then someone who is better than both Brunson and Randle.
IMO Knicks will make all sorts moves towards that.
martin wrote:I've felt that Knicks are 2 moves away from really contending. Upgrade in 1 role player and then someone who is better than both Brunson and Randle.IMO Knicks will make all sorts moves towards that.
they are both averaging 24ppg! Jules is now a 2x all star! Who are we getting that's better? There's not that many guys that even fit there.
We arent getting a star from division rival. Maybe a 2nd tier guy like Lavine or Beal who are at positions already of strength for us.
Clipper guys arent going anywhere. Hard to see a Lebron or AD trade (or really want one). Dame has said he's not moving (bad fit anyway). Giannis? Jokic? Things always change but I got a feeling its going to the pattern we are in for a bit
fishmike wrote:martin wrote:I've felt that Knicks are 2 moves away from really contending. Upgrade in 1 role player and then someone who is better than both Brunson and Randle.IMO Knicks will make all sorts moves towards that.
they are both averaging 24ppg! Jules is now a 2x all star! Who are we getting that's better? There's not that many guys that even fit there.We arent getting a star from division rival. Maybe a 2nd tier guy like Lavine or Beal who are at positions already of strength for us.
Clipper guys arent going anywhere. Hard to see a Lebron or AD trade (or really want one). Dame has said he's not moving (bad fit anyway). Giannis? Jokic? Things always change but I got a feeling its going to the pattern we are in for a bit
It's definitely does not have to happen any time soon. How many fans saw Harden, Kryie, Durant, Donovan, Dejounte Murray, Gobert or even the possibility of 2 or more of those guys getting moved no less than 6 of them within 1 year time. I am not suggesting 6 will happen every year, but over the next 2 years, how many of those sorts of guys having expiring contracts and will the cap increase also help lubricate some movement?
For me, Randle is really playing at a high level for regular season stuff, so is Brunson; neither consistently, there is definitely another level they need to get to, especially past that second round and beyond. For all of Randle's talents, in tight times in tight games when the physicality gets going, he wilts enough and his emotional state needs to be managed too much, Randle is limiting himself. Maybe he can get beyond that but it's hard to see.
martin wrote:fishmike wrote:martin wrote:I've felt that Knicks are 2 moves away from really contending. Upgrade in 1 role player and then someone who is better than both Brunson and Randle.IMO Knicks will make all sorts moves towards that.
they are both averaging 24ppg! Jules is now a 2x all star! Who are we getting that's better? There's not that many guys that even fit there.We arent getting a star from division rival. Maybe a 2nd tier guy like Lavine or Beal who are at positions already of strength for us.
Clipper guys arent going anywhere. Hard to see a Lebron or AD trade (or really want one). Dame has said he's not moving (bad fit anyway). Giannis? Jokic? Things always change but I got a feeling its going to the pattern we are in for a bit
It's definitely does not have to happen any time soon. How many fans saw Harden, Kryie, Durant, Donovan, Dejounte Murray, Gobert or even the possibility of 2 or more of those guys getting moved no less than 6 of them within 1 year time. I am not suggesting 6 will happen every year, but over the next 2 years, how many of those sorts of guys having expiring contracts and will the cap increase also help lubricate some movement?
For me, Randle is really playing at a high level for regular season stuff, so is Brunson; neither consistently, there is definitely another level they need to get to, especially past that second round and beyond. For all of Randle's talents, in tight times in tight games when the physicality gets going, he wilts enough and his emotional state needs to be managed too much, Randle is limiting himself. Maybe he can get beyond that but it's hard to see.
Randle simply shouldnt have the ball in his hands in crunch time. He's a proven liability there and I am one of his biggest supporters. I dont mind him taking any shot when the ball finds him or even running plays for him to score but he should NOT be facilitating the offense... ever. Literally every crunch time plan should be to smother Brunson, force it to Randle, look for TOs.
A top flight wing like Jalen Brown would accomplish that. You are right it doesnt have to be this year. We have done a good job resigning guys to good deals. Lets see how IQ/Hart playout
I love the idea of buying low on LaVine...
I think Kyle Kuzma would be a good fit here, he should decline his option... he has played exceptionally well in DC and he has experience as the third option. Also, he seems like a player on the ascent. Would certainly allow us to package all the tradeable assets in a trade for an elite player
SGA, OGA, Jaylen Brown, Mikal Bridges are “stars” that I think fit in between Brunson and Randle. Some better than others, but if you get a lineup with any two of those in between Brunson and Randle, I think you pull that trigger depending on cost.
The 4 unprotected and 3 swaps is like Devin Booker. I don’t know who else fits perfect enough other than him that I make a move with that cost.
EwingsGlass wrote:SGA, OGA, Jaylen Brown, Mikal Bridges are “stars” that I think fit in between Brunson and Randle. Some better than others, but if you get a lineup with any two of those in between Brunson and Randle, I think you pull that trigger depending on cost.The 4 unprotected and 3 swaps is like Devin Booker. I don’t know who else fits perfect enough other than him that I make a move with that cost.
All do respect, when did guys like OG and Mikal Bridges become "stars"? They don't have a single All-Star birth between them. SGA is a star, Jaylen Brown will be a star when he gets out from behind Tatum. Guys like OG and Bridges who barely average 18 a game are not "stars". They are high level role players. Far as I'm concerned OG and Bridges are the same level as Barrett, with just different skill sets.
If you want to bring in an "older" star and make a run at it next year I target Kawhi.
Will depend on if the Clippers are looking to re-load and move Kawhi -but to make the salaries match I would offer Barrett, Mitch, Deuce, and Picks for Kawhi.
Kawhi is 31 with knee issues - but it would give the Knicks a true Big 3 for the next 2 years to compete with while maintaining defensive focus and intensity.
Brunson / IQ / Rokas
Grimes / J Hart
Kawhi / First Round Pick / Fournier
Randle / Obi
I Hart / FA (Mid level exception) / Sims / Washington
foosballnick wrote:If you want to bring in an "older" star and make a run at it next year I target Kawhi.Will depend on if the Clippers are looking to re-load and move Kawhi -but to make the salaries match I would offer Barrett, Mitch, Deuce, and Picks for Kawhi.
Kawhi is 31 with knee issues - but it would give the Knicks a true Big 3 for the next 2 years to compete with while maintaining defensive focus and intensity.
Brunson / IQ / Rokas
Grimes / J Hart
Kawhi / First Round Pick / Fournier
Randle / Obi
I Hart / FA (Mid level exception) / Sims / Washington
I’d love Kawahi and add him to this roster makes us a legit championship contender but no way he ever leaves LA
joec32033 wrote:EwingsGlass wrote:SGA, OGA, Jaylen Brown, Mikal Bridges are “stars” that I think fit in between Brunson and Randle. Some better than others, but if you get a lineup with any two of those in between Brunson and Randle, I think you pull that trigger depending on cost.The 4 unprotected and 3 swaps is like Devin Booker. I don’t know who else fits perfect enough other than him that I make a move with that cost.
All do respect, when did guys like OG and Mikal Bridges become "stars"? They don't have a single All-Star birth between them. SGA is a star, Jaylen Brown will be a star when he gets out from behind Tatum. Guys like OG and Bridges who barely average 18 a game are not "stars". They are high level role players. Far as I'm concerned OG and Bridges are the same level as Barrett, with just different skill sets.
Mikal made the all NBA defensive first team last year. If you look at this advanced stats, he’s legit. I think Brooklyn won the Durant trade. I think he takes something close to a star price tag.
OG doesn’t count as a star. I’m projecting. But I also think he is DPOY material.
But if I am filling the positions between Brunson and Randle, I don’t think I can do better than some combination of Mikal, OGA, SGA. Hell, I’d move Brunson and Randle if I could have those 3 as my big 3.
EwingsGlass wrote:joec32033 wrote:EwingsGlass wrote:SGA, OGA, Jaylen Brown, Mikal Bridges are “stars” that I think fit in between Brunson and Randle. Some better than others, but if you get a lineup with any two of those in between Brunson and Randle, I think you pull that trigger depending on cost.The 4 unprotected and 3 swaps is like Devin Booker. I don’t know who else fits perfect enough other than him that I make a move with that cost.
All do respect, when did guys like OG and Mikal Bridges become "stars"? They don't have a single All-Star birth between them. SGA is a star, Jaylen Brown will be a star when he gets out from behind Tatum. Guys like OG and Bridges who barely average 18 a game are not "stars". They are high level role players. Far as I'm concerned OG and Bridges are the same level as Barrett, with just different skill sets.
Mikal made the all NBA defensive first team last year. If you look at this advanced stats, he’s legit. I think Brooklyn won the Durant trade. I think he takes something close to a star price tag.
OG doesn’t count as a star. I’m projecting. But I also think he is DPOY material.
But if I am filling the positions between Brunson and Randle, I don’t think I can do better than some combination of Mikal, OGA, SGA. Hell, I’d move Brunson and Randle if I could have those 3 as my big 3.
Eh....I feel Mikal would be a lateral move (different skill set, but I still view him as a high level role player).
I am ultra unimpressed with OG. Another good role player that may be part of a big 4 or a really good 5 but don't view him as a big 3 player.
I've heard rumblings about Giannis. Surprising, but still. He's the only player in the league worth trading everything for really.
I would send Randle, all the first we could, and whatever the Bucks wanted, except Brunson and Hart. They could have their pick of RJ/Grimes/IQ/Obi.
Caseloads wrote:I've heard rumblings about Giannis. Surprising, but still. He's the only player in the league worth trading everything for really. I would send Randle, all the first we could, and whatever the Bucks wanted, except Brunson and Hart. They could have their pick of RJ/Grimes/IQ/Obi.
He’s not leaving Milwaukee anytime soon and even if he did no way the bucks trade him within the conference. No way Silver wouldn’t orchestrate him going to one of the LA teams or the warriors. I agree I’d pretty much trade the entire roster for him plus picks
Caseloads wrote:I've heard rumblings about Giannis. Surprising, but still. He's the only player in the league worth trading everything for really. I would send Randle, all the first we could, and whatever the Bucks wanted, except Brunson and Hart. They could have their pick of RJ/Grimes/IQ/Obi.
You heard? Like at an NBA insiders party while getting a second hit at the punch bowl?
Bucks have best record in league and are legit favs to win title but are also thinking or making plans to trade the best player in the world who is only 28 and you thought this was legit enough to ponder and also pass along?
This what we are to believe that you believe?
Bro you’ve been on a posting bender of sorts and it’s thin. Literally what the fuck.
martin wrote:
Orange and Blue would go well with his beard.
EwingsGlass wrote:martin wrote:
Orange and Blue would go well with his beard.
Our last real shot at Jaylon Brown was when the Celtics offered him plus multiple picks for KP in 2017. They are not trading him to us unless we offer the farm including IQ.
