Knicks · Would you: young Barrett for dame? (page 1)

The Blazers are screwed if they can't find a trade partner for Dame. When he's 35 and 36 in a couple years they'll still be on the hook for paying him $58M then $63M in the final 2 years of his deal.

I’d rather trade RJ for a player who fits better.

Knixkik wrote:I’d rather trade RJ for a player who fits better.

This

We don't maximize our talent by trading RJ for another undersized combo guard to pair with Brunson. We need a lengthy SG/SF who can play defense and stretch the floor. Guys like Trey Murphy III and Cameron Johnson seem to be the best kind of fits.

Dame is a great, but will be in his mid 30s and hasn't played over 70 games in 5 yrs and leaves us weak defensively. And it will cost way more than RJ.

VDesai wrote:We don't maximize our talent by trading RJ for another undersized combo guard to pair with Brunson. We need a lengthy SG/SF who can play defense and stretch the floor. Guys like Trey Murphy III and Cameron Johnson seem to be the best kind of fits.

Dame is a great, but will be in his mid 30s and hasn't played over 70 games in 5 yrs and leaves us weak defensively. And it will cost way more than RJ.

2 guys I am trading RJ for

Jaylen Brown
Brandon Ingram

The guys you mentioned should be gettable with a guy like Obi.

I know the cliche line of "we need a team of Josh Hart's, instead of selfish players like RJ and Julius" sounds great and honorable, but you need talent, top end talent (RJ is a top end talent) and players like that to win. The Knicks are not good enough to trade for fit yet. Cam Johnson and Trey Murphy are NOT getting you closer to a title, no matter the fit.

This is not a starphuck (I hate the fucking term...thanks Nalod) post, but a maximize your assets post. The RJ hate gets in the way of valuing him when talking trade.

martin wrote:

Knixkik wrote:I’d rather trade RJ for a player who fits better.

This

x3... I would be fine with bringing in an older guy, especially a good finisher like Dame, but he's a PG and its 100% our strongest position with Brunson/IQ

Im all for moving RJ and maybe Obi/McBride/picks (depending on player). Targets should be OG/Butler/Ingram IMO

I dunno about that- the Knicks have scoring. They have 2 guys that are legit 24/25 ppg scorers and honestly 3 guys that are capable of going for 40+ on any given night if you count Quickley, who has established himself as a guy who can get his shot at multiple levels and times. Barrett can be a dominant scorer at times, but plays a slow ISO game that overlaps with Brunson and Randle. What i'm talking about is getting a guy with upside that is a better fit. Murphy/Johnson are already 14-15 ppg type scorers, but they have length, play defense and can space the floor with their shooting. They can put up similar points to Barrett and provide a better fit around your 2 key players. The Knicks are competitive with every major team in the league. They had a good record vs. all the big dogs except Milwaukee- who they played close multiple times only to lose in the last cpl mins. Maybe it won't happen with Johnson who seems locked in a role player, but Murphy will be come a 20+ PPG scorer in the league next year at his current rate of improvement, and he showed off his full game vs. just a few nights ago.

Their biggest issue is execution down the stretch when their ISO players are keyed on - they don't have great spacing or shooters to stop the doubles/lane clogging. They also need consistent defenders around Randle and Brunson that can change the game.

Go big or go home Starphuck…..(your welcome Joe),

Randle
IQ
Dallas pick, another first protected.
For Luka.
Two first rounders, allstar, high tier young player. Cube wants more. Hang up.

I have Brunson, I don’t need IQ. I love IQ BTW. Im starphuching and its expensive.
Naturally if one believes RJ is who he is then thats another story.
Look at Jeremi Grants stats. He blossomed with Detroit. Played 63 games this year on another shit team.
Igraham? Look at his games missed also.
Sure these guys are talented.
Key to NBA success? Employing Players who get better, not just paying for past success.

Obi
Luka
Mitch
JoshHart
Brunson

Is this a chip starting 5? Wheres RJ? Im not sure what to do here. Bring him off the bench?
Does not mean it lasts forever. He gets that shot back he can slot in at PF to finish.
You go with the lineup that wins.

Back to point? Dames contract, age, and redundancy means you likely entertain trading Brunson and perhaps lock up IQ for long term Dame replacement and insurance. His contract is a muthafucker. How many teams can take on Dame and still be good afterwards?
ATL with Trae as centerpiece?
Orlando or DC for young role players and picks? Portland likely does not want Beal. A trio of KP, Dame and Beal is intriguing.
They go all in. Way in.
Rockets get Webenyama they can do a lot of things with their picks and yoot.

VDesai wrote:I dunno about that- the Knicks have scoring. They have 2 guys that are legit 24/25 ppg scorers and honestly 3 guys that are capable of going for 40+ on any given night if you count Quickley, who has established himself as a guy who can get his shot at multiple levels and times. Barrett can be a dominant scorer at times, but plays a slow ISO game that overlaps with Brunson and Randle. What i'm talking about is getting a guy with upside that is a better fit. Murphy/Johnson are already 14-15 ppg type scorers, but they have length, play defense and can space the floor with their shooting. They can put up similar points to Barrett and provide a better fit around your 2 key players. The Knicks are competitive with every major team in the league. They had a good record vs. all the big dogs except Milwaukee- who they played close multiple times only to lose in the last cpl mins. Maybe it won't happen with Johnson who seems locked in a role player, but Murphy will be come a 20+ PPG scorer in the league next year at his current rate of improvement, and he showed off his full game vs. just a few nights ago.

Their biggest issue is execution down the stretch when their ISO players are keyed on - they don't have great spacing or shooters to stop the doubles/lane clogging. They also need consistent defenders around Randle and Brunson that can change the game.

Reading some Pelicans message boards Murphy is their version of how Grimes is viewed here. He needs more shots because his percentages on low volume are high.
Cam Johnson hasn't played more than 70 games in a season in his career, which started in 2019/20.

I'm fine with trading RJ if the deal is right (although I think they will regret it) but for a couple for a 3 and D guy it doesn't make sense.

Much respect for Damian Lillard. As a player, entrepreneur, philanthropist, lyricist.

I dont like the idea of trading young for old. If RJ is traded, I'd hope the player we get back would be a starter for the next 3-4 years or so. Not sure how much longer Dame can play at this level. Not to mention defense at this stage in his career.

Kind of hoping Lillard plays his entire career in Portland.

GustavBahler wrote:Much respect for Damian Lillard. As a player, entrepreneur, philanthropist, lyricist.

I dont like the idea of trading young for old. If RJ is traded, I'd hope the player we get back would be a starter for the next 3-4 years or so. Not sure how much longer Dame can play at this level. Not to mention defense at this stage in his career.

Kind of hoping Lillard plays his entire career in Portland.

And this contract is a beast………

Also, your not trading RJ for him straight up. You need RJ and EF contracts, plus picks and yoots.

An aging combo guard who doesn’t play D and is maybe a year away from being strictly catch and shoot guy with $48 million annual salary? Trade RJ for that? Is this like the Isiah Thomas school if GM’ing?

joec32033 wrote:

VDesai wrote:We don't maximize our talent by trading RJ for another undersized combo guard to pair with Brunson. We need a lengthy SG/SF who can play defense and stretch the floor. Guys like Trey Murphy III and Cameron Johnson seem to be the best kind of fits.

Dame is a great, but will be in his mid 30s and hasn't played over 70 games in 5 yrs and leaves us weak defensively. And it will cost way more than RJ.

2 guys I am trading RJ for

Jaylen Brown
Brandon Ingram

The guys you mentioned should be gettable with a guy like Obi.

I know the cliche line of "we need a team of Josh Hart's, instead of selfish players like RJ and Julius" sounds great and honorable, but you need talent, top end talent (RJ is a top end talent) and players like that to win. The Knicks are not good enough to trade for fit yet. Cam Johnson and Trey Murphy are NOT getting you closer to a title, no matter the fit.

This is not a starphuck (I hate the fucking term...thanks Nalod) post, but a maximize your assets post. The RJ hate gets in the way of valuing him when talking trade.

RJ plus picks for Brown yes.

joec32033 wrote:

VDesai wrote:We don't maximize our talent by trading RJ for another undersized combo guard to pair with Brunson. We need a lengthy SG/SF who can play defense and stretch the floor. Guys like Trey Murphy III and Cameron Johnson seem to be the best kind of fits.

Dame is a great, but will be in his mid 30s and hasn't played over 70 games in 5 yrs and leaves us weak defensively. And it will cost way more than RJ.

2 guys I am trading RJ for

Jaylen Brown
Brandon Ingram

The guys you mentioned should be gettable with a guy like Obi.

I know the cliche line of "we need a team of Josh Hart's, instead of selfish players like RJ and Julius" sounds great and honorable, but you need talent, top end talent (RJ is a top end talent) and players like that to win. The Knicks are not good enough to trade for fit yet. Cam Johnson and Trey Murphy are NOT getting you closer to a title, no matter the fit.

This is not a starphuck (I hate the fucking term...thanks Nalod) post, but a maximize your assets post. The RJ hate gets in the way of valuing him when talking trade.

problem with the bold is nobody in NBA circles believe that but a few Knick fans. If RJ believed it himself he wouldnt have resigned for what he did. He would have bet on himself getting a max contract. Instead he took a 2nd tier contract and is proving to be a 2nd tier player

First off - I get that Lillard is a great scorer and has been a big time player BUT he does fit here with Brunson and has Dame ever made players around him better?

I mean Brunson walked in here an immediately lifted us up.

We have Brunson/IQ —- let’s find a legit..legit 2 or 3 that can play big time in big playoff games.

Only options may be LaVine and Beal — anybody else?

Philc1 wrote:

joec32033 wrote:

VDesai wrote:We don't maximize our talent by trading RJ for another undersized combo guard to pair with Brunson. We need a lengthy SG/SF who can play defense and stretch the floor. Guys like Trey Murphy III and Cameron Johnson seem to be the best kind of fits.

Dame is a great, but will be in his mid 30s and hasn't played over 70 games in 5 yrs and leaves us weak defensively. And it will cost way more than RJ.

2 guys I am trading RJ for

Jaylen Brown
Brandon Ingram

The guys you mentioned should be gettable with a guy like Obi.

I know the cliche line of "we need a team of Josh Hart's, instead of selfish players like RJ and Julius" sounds great and honorable, but you need talent, top end talent (RJ is a top end talent) and players like that to win. The Knicks are not good enough to trade for fit yet. Cam Johnson and Trey Murphy are NOT getting you closer to a title, no matter the fit.

This is not a starphuck (I hate the fucking term...thanks Nalod) post, but a maximize your assets post. The RJ hate gets in the way of valuing him when talking trade.

RJ plus picks for Brown yes.

I don’t see Boston ever dealing with the Knicks on a player like Brown.

If they were I think we would have to start with IQ - who wants to do that?

Ingram is an interesting thought but with Jones/Murphy Pelicans don’t really have a need for RJ.

Pelicans don’t have a PG do they? Again that would lead us back to IQ.

Someone above I think said they wouldn’t deal RJ for T Murphy. Really?

LivingLegend wrote:Ingram is an interesting thought but with Jones/Murphy Pelicans don’t really have a need for RJ.

Pelicans don’t have a PG do they? Again that would lead us back to IQ.

Someone above I think said they wouldn’t deal RJ for T Murphy. Really?

Pels have a bunch of decent wings. I would think they would look HARD had a deal for Ingram for RJ/Obi/McBride. They have had big depth problems and Obi would also give them a nice prospect to look at when Zion misses a 1000 games. For us we upgrade the weakest link in the rotation with an all star caliber guy. He gets hurt alot but I think our depth could offset some on that.

fishmike wrote:

LivingLegend wrote:Ingram is an interesting thought but with Jones/Murphy Pelicans don’t really have a need for RJ.

Pelicans don’t have a PG do they? Again that would lead us back to IQ.

Someone above I think said they wouldn’t deal RJ for T Murphy. Really?

Pels have a bunch of decent wings. I would think they would look HARD had a deal for Ingram for RJ/Obi/McBride. They have had big depth problems and Obi would also give them a nice prospect to look at when Zion misses a 1000 games. For us we upgrade the weakest link in the rotation with an all star caliber guy. He gets hurt alot but I think our depth could offset some on that.

I’d like to hold onto McBride, but you have to give to get. I’d be open to something like that. Ingram is only 25. Hasn’t really been able to stay healthy, but shows some real skill as a distributor. He’d make a pretty solid big 3 with Brunson and Randle, assuming those two can accept his role in the offense.

I’m still on the OG Anunoby kick, but Ingram is the higher end alternative if he were to become available.

LivingLegend wrote:

Philc1 wrote:

joec32033 wrote:

VDesai wrote:We don't maximize our talent by trading RJ for another undersized combo guard to pair with Brunson. We need a lengthy SG/SF who can play defense and stretch the floor. Guys like Trey Murphy III and Cameron Johnson seem to be the best kind of fits.

Dame is a great, but will be in his mid 30s and hasn't played over 70 games in 5 yrs and leaves us weak defensively. And it will cost way more than RJ.

2 guys I am trading RJ for

Jaylen Brown
Brandon Ingram

The guys you mentioned should be gettable with a guy like Obi.

I know the cliche line of "we need a team of Josh Hart's, instead of selfish players like RJ and Julius" sounds great and honorable, but you need talent, top end talent (RJ is a top end talent) and players like that to win. The Knicks are not good enough to trade for fit yet. Cam Johnson and Trey Murphy are NOT getting you closer to a title, no matter the fit.

This is not a starphuck (I hate the fucking term...thanks Nalod) post, but a maximize your assets post. The RJ hate gets in the way of valuing him when talking trade.

RJ plus picks for Brown yes.

I don’t see Boston ever dealing with the Knicks on a player like Brown.

If they were I think we would have to start with IQ - who wants to do that?

Agree I don’t see the Celtics trading Brown within the East.

fishmike wrote:

joec32033 wrote:

VDesai wrote:We don't maximize our talent by trading RJ for another undersized combo guard to pair with Brunson. We need a lengthy SG/SF who can play defense and stretch the floor. Guys like Trey Murphy III and Cameron Johnson seem to be the best kind of fits.

Dame is a great, but will be in his mid 30s and hasn't played over 70 games in 5 yrs and leaves us weak defensively. And it will cost way more than RJ.

2 guys I am trading RJ for

Jaylen Brown
Brandon Ingram

The guys you mentioned should be gettable with a guy like Obi.

I know the cliche line of "we need a team of Josh Hart's, instead of selfish players like RJ and Julius" sounds great and honorable, but you need talent, top end talent (RJ is a top end talent) and players like that to win. The Knicks are not good enough to trade for fit yet. Cam Johnson and Trey Murphy are NOT getting you closer to a title, no matter the fit.

This is not a starphuck (I hate the fucking term...thanks Nalod) post, but a maximize your assets post. The RJ hate gets in the way of valuing him when talking trade.

problem with the bold is nobody in NBA circles believe that but a few Knick fans. If RJ believed it himself he wouldnt have resigned for what he did. He would have bet on himself getting a max contract. Instead he took a 2nd tier contract and is proving to be a 2nd tier player

So now we are equating contracts with talent?
https://www.basketball-reference.com/con...

1	Stephen Curry	GSW	$48,070,014	$51,915,615	$55,761,216	$59,606,817			$215,353,662
2	Russell Westbrook	UTA	$47,559,433						$47,063,478
3	LeBron James	LAL	$44,474,988	$53,369,986	$57,639,585				$97,844,974
4	Kevin Durant	PHO	$44,119,845	$47,649,433	$51,179,021	$54,708,609			$197,656,908
5	Bradley Beal	WAS	$43,279,250	$46,741,590	$50,203,930	$53,666,270	$57,128,610		$193,891,040
6	Damian Lillard	POR	$42,492,492	$45,640,084	$48,787,676	$58,545,211	$63,228,828		$195,465,463
7	Giannis Antetokounmpo	MIL	$42,492,492	$45,640,084	$48,787,676	$51,935,268			$136,920,252
8	Paul George	LAC	$42,492,492	$45,640,084	$48,787,676				$88,132,576
9	Kawhi Leonard	LAC	$42,492,492	$45,640,084	$48,787,676				$88,132,576
10	John Wall	HOU	$47,345,760	$6,802,950					$54,148,710
11	Klay Thompson	GSW	$40,600,080	$43,219,440					$83,819,520
12	Kyrie Irving	DAL	$38,917,057						$38,917,057
13	Rudy Gobert	MIN	$38,172,414	$41,000,000	$43,827,586	$46,655,172			$123,000,000
14	Anthony Davis	LAL	$37,980,720	$40,600,080	$43,219,440				$78,580,800
15	Khris Middleton	MIL	$37,948,276	$40,396,552					$37,948,276
16	Jimmy Butler	MIA	$37,653,300	$45,183,960	$48,798,677	$52,413,394			$131,635,937
17	Tobias Harris	PHI	$37,633,050	$39,270,150					$76,903,200
18	Luka Dončić	DAL	$37,096,500	$40,064,220	$43,031,940	$45,999,660	$48,967,380		$215,159,700
19	Trae Young	ATL	$37,096,500	$40,064,220	$43,031,940	$45,999,660	$48,967,380		$215,159,700
20	Zach LaVine	CHI	$37,096,500	$40,064,220	$43,031,940	$45,999,660	$48,967,380		$166,192,320
Salary	
Rk	Player	Tm	2022-23	2023-24	2024-25	2025-26	2026-27	2027-28	Guaranteed
21	Ben Simmons	BRK	$35,448,672	$37,893,408	$40,338,144				$113,680,224
22	Pascal Siakam	TOR	$35,448,672	$37,893,408					$73,342,080
23	Myles Turner	IND	$35,069,500	$20,975,000	$19,928,500				$75,973,000
24	Devin Booker	PHO	$33,833,400	$36,016,200	$49,245,000	$53,184,600	$57,124,200	$61,063,800	$290,467,200
25	Karl-Anthony Towns	MIN	$33,833,400	$36,016,200	$49,245,000	$53,184,600	$57,124,200	$61,063,800	$229,403,400
26	Kristaps Porziņģis	WAS	$33,833,400	$36,016,200					$33,833,400
27	Jrue Holiday	MIL	$33,665,040	$36,158,747	$38,652,454				$69,823,787
28	Joel Embiid	PHI	$33,616,770	$46,900,000	$50,652,000	$54,404,000	$58,156,000		$185,572,770
29	Andrew Wiggins	GSW	$33,616,770	$24,330,357	$26,276,786	$28,223,215	$30,169,644		$112,447,128
30	CJ McCollum	NOP	$33,333,333	$35,802,469	$33,333,333	$30,666,666			$133,135,801
31	Nikola Jokić	DEN	$33,047,803	$46,900,000	$50,652,000	$54,404,000	$58,156,000	$61,908,000	$243,159,803
32	James Harden	PHI	$33,000,000	$35,640,000					$33,000,000
33	Brandon Ingram	NOP	$31,650,600	$33,833,400	$36,016,200				$101,500,200
34	Jamal Murray	DEN	$31,650,600	$33,833,400	$36,016,200				$101,500,200
35	D'Angelo Russell	LAL	$31,377,750						$31,377,750
36	Shai Gilgeous-Alexander	OKC	$30,913,750	$33,386,850	$35,859,950	$38,333,050	$40,806,150		$179,299,750
37	Michael Porter Jr.	DEN	$30,913,750	$33,386,850	$35,859,950	$38,333,050	$40,806,150		$150,493,600
38	Deandre Ayton	PHO	$30,913,750	$32,459,438	$34,005,126	$35,550,814			$132,929,128
39	Donovan Mitchell	CLE	$30,913,750	$33,162,030	$35,410,310	$37,096,620			$99,486,090
40	De'Aaron Fox	SAC	$30,351,780	$32,600,060	$34,848,340	$37,096,620			$134,896,800
Salary	
Rk	Player	Tm	2022-23	2023-24	2024-25	2025-26	2026-27	2027-28	Guaranteed
41	Bam Adebayo	MIA	$30,351,780	$32,600,060	$34,848,340	$37,096,620			$134,896,800
42	Jayson Tatum	BOS	$30,351,780	$32,600,060	$34,848,340	$37,096,620			$97,800,180
43	Gordon Hayward	CHO	$30,075,000	$31,500,000					$61,575,

Top 43 contracts. I stuck with over 30 million. So you are telling me these are the 43 most talented players currently in the NBA?