Knicks · [Game Thread 11/1/23] Knicks vs Cavs 7:30PM EST (page 6)
Rookie wrote:LivingLegend wrote:Trying to think hard of a lower IQ player in Knicks history —- somebody help me?Still trying….
Al Harrington
That’s a good one
Alpha1971 wrote:Clean wrote:At least I am not getting a lot of pushback on my Randle hate this year. People are not getting mesmerized by big regular season numbers to the point they ignore the laundry list of negatives he brings. The part I hate is we have no one to takeover for him when he plays bad now. Obi might be playing like trash so far this season but when he had to play big minutes for Randle he played well for us. I am going to give it more time but I might be eating crow on Obi. I thought he would be better with the Pacers.I always thought Obi meant more to our team then he would on a lot of other teams. He had a niche that aided the team uniquely to win when he was clicking in the second unit. Obi wanted out because Thibs didn't respect his contribution. When Randall played like he is Obi wouldn't get more time to shine but if Obi made a mistake he would be benched. Can't blame him for wanting to go. But once they gave up on Obi he should have been replaced or a more versatile 3/4. But they didn't add a forward at all. Even to be a 10th man respecting the 9 man rotation. The nine man rotation we have is good but man an injury, foul trouble, back to backs, slumps, or a suspension and we are in trouble.
Watching Obi first few games with Indy and he is still doing the exact EXACT same actions he was with the Knicks - he is doing the 3-point hand offs with occasional fake handoff where he tries to get to basket and he’s still afraid to put the ball down in traffic—- absolutely no advancement of the skill/play set.
LivingLegend wrote:martin wrote:DangJavascript is not enabled or there was problem with the URL: https://www.twitter.com/knicksmuse/status/1719897275076321496?s=61&t=X2NvaBkjFz8kZPoGlCbCzA
Click here to view the TweetIt’s not even the bricking - it’s also completely nuking ball movement, refusing to run the court, not defending at times.
I can’t believe his teammates don’t hate him - if they don’t they must be really nice guys because he’s a sh** teammate
There was a close up where Brunson was obviously not happy and telling Randle. Randle atleast seemed to try after that.
LivingLegend wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Clean wrote:At least I am not getting a lot of pushback on my Randle hate this year. People are not getting mesmerized by big regular season numbers to the point they ignore the laundry list of negatives he brings. The part I hate is we have no one to takeover for him when he plays bad now. Obi might be playing like trash so far this season but when he had to play big minutes for Randle he played well for us. I am going to give it more time but I might be eating crow on Obi. I thought he would be better with the Pacers.I always thought Obi meant more to our team then he would on a lot of other teams. He had a niche that aided the team uniquely to win when he was clicking in the second unit. Obi wanted out because Thibs didn't respect his contribution. When Randall played like he is Obi wouldn't get more time to shine but if Obi made a mistake he would be benched. Can't blame him for wanting to go. But once they gave up on Obi he should have been replaced or a more versatile 3/4. But they didn't add a forward at all. Even to be a 10th man respecting the 9 man rotation. The nine man rotation we have is good but man an injury, foul trouble, back to backs, slumps, or a suspension and we are in trouble.
Watching Obi first few games with Indy and he is still doing the exact EXACT same actions he was with the Knicks - he is doing the 3-point hand offs with occasional fake handoff where he tries to get to basket and he’s still afraid to put the ball down in traffic—- absolutely no advancement of the skill/play set.
That's fine. Not saying I care if we let him go. Point is if you let go of Obi, you needed to replace him or improve on him. This 9 man rotation being so set in stone is ridiculous. If Hart was going to be used as a back up 4 at times fine. Depending on match ups sure but primary back up, hell nah. Team showed sero creativity this off season. DDV at the mle was fine but make a trade and get a versatile forward for the bench if your serious about winning. I've been getting grief about this opinion all preseason. Team better fix this sooner then later
LivingLegend wrote:Holy Mackerel Obi was a -41 +/- tonight
Don't get it twisted the point is not Obi being let go. It's not replacing him with another forward for the bench. Someone who could contribute when RJ is out of Randall is not playing well. That's the point. Sticking emphatically to a argument that the team has it's 9 man rotation so why waste assets to have a forward who won't play much. These preconceived fixed rotations is preposterous.
Knixkik wrote:Knicks are clearly worthless onthe second of back to backsis forced to consistently make the right decisions on offense and defense.
Never thought I'd ask this, but how many first rounders will it take to bring in Siakam?
Javascript is not enabled or there was problem with the URL: https://twitter.com/KnicksMuse/status/1719920100520681859
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There were many plays like these during his "All NBA" season.
Javascript is not enabled or there was problem with the URL: https://twitter.com/IQfor3/status/1719918309569679695
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This guys twitter thread shows his effort level was even worse than the one above.
Clean wrote:Javascript is not enabled or there was problem with the URL: https://twitter.com/IQfor3/status/1719918309569679695
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This guys twitter thread shows his effort level was even worse than the one above.
May be early and maybe needs more time due to summer of recovery but watching DDV effort and contribution compared to JR makes me want to move on from JR more. Also tired of trying to figure out what's wrong with JR's head. He had zero confidence last night. Say what you say about him in the past but he was always confident. JR looked broken last night. If we look at every play that DDV makes it is high energy and looking to set someone else up. He also makes quick decisions on when to shoot. This is the type player I have wanted. We need a whole team of that. Compared to guys like JR, RJ and JB who often have tunnel vision and pound the rock excessively. Second observation last night, despite good game, IQ is in build future contract mode. He is not thinking about the team right now.
Alpha1971 wrote:LivingLegend wrote:Holy Mackerel Obi was a -41 +/- tonightDon't get it twisted the point is not Obi being let go. It's not replacing him with another forward for the bench. Someone who could contribute when RJ is out of Randall is not playing well. That's the point. Sticking emphatically to a argument that the team has it's 9 man rotation so why waste assets to have a forward who won't play much. These preconceived fixed rotations is preposterous.
how is it a preconceived fixed rotation? Last years rotation was completely different at the end of the season vs how it started.
Fixating on a 10mpg backup PF position is just odd, our issue hasn't been rebounding or size, it's been Randle shooting historically bad and lets face it we've had the most difficult schedule to start.
We just need to hover around .500 til the schedule eases up and Randle and Brunson get going.
Truth is Randle has always struggled against good defensive teams and we've played some of the best so far.
Randle and IQ for KAT is something that could make sense and relieve the glut at the guard position.
Because my other fear is there are simply not enough minutes to go around and we are already seeing guys squeezed and no one is really in rhythm, same thing that happened last year before Thibs benched Rose and Evan.
LivingLegend wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Clean wrote:At least I am not getting a lot of pushback on my Randle hate this year. People are not getting mesmerized by big regular season numbers to the point they ignore the laundry list of negatives he brings. The part I hate is we have no one to takeover for him when he plays bad now. Obi might be playing like trash so far this season but when he had to play big minutes for Randle he played well for us. I am going to give it more time but I might be eating crow on Obi. I thought he would be better with the Pacers.I always thought Obi meant more to our team then he would on a lot of other teams. He had a niche that aided the team uniquely to win when he was clicking in the second unit. Obi wanted out because Thibs didn't respect his contribution. When Randall played like he is Obi wouldn't get more time to shine but if Obi made a mistake he would be benched. Can't blame him for wanting to go. But once they gave up on Obi he should have been replaced or a more versatile 3/4. But they didn't add a forward at all. Even to be a 10th man respecting the 9 man rotation. The nine man rotation we have is good but man an injury, foul trouble, back to backs, slumps, or a suspension and we are in trouble.
Watching Obi first few games with Indy and he is still doing the exact EXACT same actions he was with the Knicks - he is doing the 3-point hand offs with occasional fake handoff where he tries to get to basket and he’s still afraid to put the ball down in traffic—- absolutely no advancement of the skill/play set.
If Obi has the exact same role with Indy, I would expect the same results. If Obi is stuck in the corner again.
The main reason why Obi has such good numbers as a starter, is because Thibs allows him to attack from the area near the top of the key as a starter. Not as a sub.
If you gave Randle Obi's role, I would expect similar results.
GustavBahler wrote:LivingLegend wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Clean wrote:At least I am not getting a lot of pushback on my Randle hate this year. People are not getting mesmerized by big regular season numbers to the point they ignore the laundry list of negatives he brings. The part I hate is we have no one to takeover for him when he plays bad now. Obi might be playing like trash so far this season but when he had to play big minutes for Randle he played well for us. I am going to give it more time but I might be eating crow on Obi. I thought he would be better with the Pacers.I always thought Obi meant more to our team then he would on a lot of other teams. He had a niche that aided the team uniquely to win when he was clicking in the second unit. Obi wanted out because Thibs didn't respect his contribution. When Randall played like he is Obi wouldn't get more time to shine but if Obi made a mistake he would be benched. Can't blame him for wanting to go. But once they gave up on Obi he should have been replaced or a more versatile 3/4. But they didn't add a forward at all. Even to be a 10th man respecting the 9 man rotation. The nine man rotation we have is good but man an injury, foul trouble, back to backs, slumps, or a suspension and we are in trouble.
Watching Obi first few games with Indy and he is still doing the exact EXACT same actions he was with the Knicks - he is doing the 3-point hand offs with occasional fake handoff where he tries to get to basket and he’s still afraid to put the ball down in traffic—- absolutely no advancement of the skill/play set.
If Obi has the exact same role with Indy, I would expect the same results. If Obi is stuck in the corner again.
The main reason why Obi has such good numbers as a starter, is because Thibs allows him to attack from the area near the top of the key as a starter. Not as a sub.
If you gave Randle Obi's role, I would expect similar results.
if we're being honest it's because most of his starts came in meaningless April games where Grimes, IQ and Obi were going nut dropping 30 with ease.
Clean wrote:Javascript is not enabled or there was problem with the URL: https://twitter.com/IQfor3/status/1719918309569679695
Click here to view the Tweet
This guys twitter thread shows his effort level was even worse than the one above.
The previous game Randle stayed in his lane, as far as what he was able to do given his recovery from ankle surgery. And played well.
When RJ sat last night Randle tried (and failed) to pick up the slack. Got frustrated, and looks like he lost interest as well.
Teammates have disagreements all the time, but this clip looks like its from one of his down seasons. We'll see what happens.
GustavBahler wrote:LivingLegend wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Clean wrote:At least I am not getting a lot of pushback on my Randle hate this year. People are not getting mesmerized by big regular season numbers to the point they ignore the laundry list of negatives he brings. The part I hate is we have no one to takeover for him when he plays bad now. Obi might be playing like trash so far this season but when he had to play big minutes for Randle he played well for us. I am going to give it more time but I might be eating crow on Obi. I thought he would be better with the Pacers.I always thought Obi meant more to our team then he would on a lot of other teams. He had a niche that aided the team uniquely to win when he was clicking in the second unit. Obi wanted out because Thibs didn't respect his contribution. When Randall played like he is Obi wouldn't get more time to shine but if Obi made a mistake he would be benched. Can't blame him for wanting to go. But once they gave up on Obi he should have been replaced or a more versatile 3/4. But they didn't add a forward at all. Even to be a 10th man respecting the 9 man rotation. The nine man rotation we have is good but man an injury, foul trouble, back to backs, slumps, or a suspension and we are in trouble.
Watching Obi first few games with Indy and he is still doing the exact EXACT same actions he was with the Knicks - he is doing the 3-point hand offs with occasional fake handoff where he tries to get to basket and he’s still afraid to put the ball down in traffic—- absolutely no advancement of the skill/play set.
If Obi has the exact same role with Indy, I would expect the same results. If Obi is stuck in the corner again.
The main reason why Obi has such good numbers as a starter, is because Thibs allows him to attack from the area near the top of the key as a starter. Not as a sub.
If you gave Randle Obi's role, I would expect similar results.
At some point, it’s just the player.
nycericanguy wrote:GustavBahler wrote:LivingLegend wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Clean wrote:At least I am not getting a lot of pushback on my Randle hate this year. People are not getting mesmerized by big regular season numbers to the point they ignore the laundry list of negatives he brings. The part I hate is we have no one to takeover for him when he plays bad now. Obi might be playing like trash so far this season but when he had to play big minutes for Randle he played well for us. I am going to give it more time but I might be eating crow on Obi. I thought he would be better with the Pacers.I always thought Obi meant more to our team then he would on a lot of other teams. He had a niche that aided the team uniquely to win when he was clicking in the second unit. Obi wanted out because Thibs didn't respect his contribution. When Randall played like he is Obi wouldn't get more time to shine but if Obi made a mistake he would be benched. Can't blame him for wanting to go. But once they gave up on Obi he should have been replaced or a more versatile 3/4. But they didn't add a forward at all. Even to be a 10th man respecting the 9 man rotation. The nine man rotation we have is good but man an injury, foul trouble, back to backs, slumps, or a suspension and we are in trouble.
Watching Obi first few games with Indy and he is still doing the exact EXACT same actions he was with the Knicks - he is doing the 3-point hand offs with occasional fake handoff where he tries to get to basket and he’s still afraid to put the ball down in traffic—- absolutely no advancement of the skill/play set.
If Obi has the exact same role with Indy, I would expect the same results. If Obi is stuck in the corner again.
The main reason why Obi has such good numbers as a starter, is because Thibs allows him to attack from the area near the top of the key as a starter. Not as a sub.
If you gave Randle Obi's role, I would expect similar results.
if we're being honest it's because most of his starts came in meaningless April games where Grimes, IQ and Obi were going nut dropping 30 with ease.
Right...
Julius Randle took part in pregame warm-ups, but was unable to go in Game 1 of the second round because of the left ankle he aggravated in the Knicks’ series-clinching victory in the previous round Wednesday in Cleveland.Toppin stepped in and scored 18 points in 31 minutes — both career-highs over 11 postseason appearances — in the Knicks’ series-opening 108-101 loss to the Heat at the Garden.
GustavBahler wrote:nycericanguy wrote:GustavBahler wrote:LivingLegend wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Clean wrote:At least I am not getting a lot of pushback on my Randle hate this year. People are not getting mesmerized by big regular season numbers to the point they ignore the laundry list of negatives he brings. The part I hate is we have no one to takeover for him when he plays bad now. Obi might be playing like trash so far this season but when he had to play big minutes for Randle he played well for us. I am going to give it more time but I might be eating crow on Obi. I thought he would be better with the Pacers.I always thought Obi meant more to our team then he would on a lot of other teams. He had a niche that aided the team uniquely to win when he was clicking in the second unit. Obi wanted out because Thibs didn't respect his contribution. When Randall played like he is Obi wouldn't get more time to shine but if Obi made a mistake he would be benched. Can't blame him for wanting to go. But once they gave up on Obi he should have been replaced or a more versatile 3/4. But they didn't add a forward at all. Even to be a 10th man respecting the 9 man rotation. The nine man rotation we have is good but man an injury, foul trouble, back to backs, slumps, or a suspension and we are in trouble.
Watching Obi first few games with Indy and he is still doing the exact EXACT same actions he was with the Knicks - he is doing the 3-point hand offs with occasional fake handoff where he tries to get to basket and he’s still afraid to put the ball down in traffic—- absolutely no advancement of the skill/play set.
If Obi has the exact same role with Indy, I would expect the same results. If Obi is stuck in the corner again.
The main reason why Obi has such good numbers as a starter, is because Thibs allows him to attack from the area near the top of the key as a starter. Not as a sub.
If you gave Randle Obi's role, I would expect similar results.
if we're being honest it's because most of his starts came in meaningless April games where Grimes, IQ and Obi were going nut dropping 30 with ease.
Right...
Julius Randle took part in pregame warm-ups, but was unable to go in Game 1 of the second round because of the left ankle he aggravated in the Knicks’ series-clinching victory in the previous round Wednesday in Cleveland.Toppin stepped in and scored 18 points in 31 minutes — both career-highs over 11 postseason appearances — in the Knicks’ series-opening 108-101 loss to the Heat at the Garden.
Knicks lost the game. Nobody said Obi is not an NBA player, but knicks have an all NBA allstar PF under contract and Obi has earned a chance to start somewhere and prove himself. Obi has not put the “Power” in PF. He can run, jump and dunk. Im sure he’ll get a fair opportunity in Indy. -41 in blow out loss last night. Really worse than anyone else. In a night Randle was not good is inconclusive.
Whats wrong with Jules? We can guess until its said.
Good point about “Staying in his lane” untl last night. With RJ out they needed more offense. Just becuase he was called out and reacted does not mean its back to “Every other year” for him. We got a lot more season infront of us. Lets see what happens.
If Jules plays like this for a long stretch minny won’t want him in a trade.
Nalod wrote:GustavBahler wrote:nycericanguy wrote:GustavBahler wrote:LivingLegend wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Clean wrote:At least I am not getting a lot of pushback on my Randle hate this year. People are not getting mesmerized by big regular season numbers to the point they ignore the laundry list of negatives he brings. The part I hate is we have no one to takeover for him when he plays bad now. Obi might be playing like trash so far this season but when he had to play big minutes for Randle he played well for us. I am going to give it more time but I might be eating crow on Obi. I thought he would be better with the Pacers.I always thought Obi meant more to our team then he would on a lot of other teams. He had a niche that aided the team uniquely to win when he was clicking in the second unit. Obi wanted out because Thibs didn't respect his contribution. When Randall played like he is Obi wouldn't get more time to shine but if Obi made a mistake he would be benched. Can't blame him for wanting to go. But once they gave up on Obi he should have been replaced or a more versatile 3/4. But they didn't add a forward at all. Even to be a 10th man respecting the 9 man rotation. The nine man rotation we have is good but man an injury, foul trouble, back to backs, slumps, or a suspension and we are in trouble.
Watching Obi first few games with Indy and he is still doing the exact EXACT same actions he was with the Knicks - he is doing the 3-point hand offs with occasional fake handoff where he tries to get to basket and he’s still afraid to put the ball down in traffic—- absolutely no advancement of the skill/play set.
If Obi has the exact same role with Indy, I would expect the same results. If Obi is stuck in the corner again.
The main reason why Obi has such good numbers as a starter, is because Thibs allows him to attack from the area near the top of the key as a starter. Not as a sub.
If you gave Randle Obi's role, I would expect similar results.
if we're being honest it's because most of his starts came in meaningless April games where Grimes, IQ and Obi were going nut dropping 30 with ease.
Right...
Julius Randle took part in pregame warm-ups, but was unable to go in Game 1 of the second round because of the left ankle he aggravated in the Knicks’ series-clinching victory in the previous round Wednesday in Cleveland.Toppin stepped in and scored 18 points in 31 minutes — both career-highs over 11 postseason appearances — in the Knicks’ series-opening 108-101 loss to the Heat at the Garden.
Knicks lost the game. Nobody said Obi is not an NBA player, but knicks have an all NBA allstar PF under contract and Obi has earned a chance to start somewhere and prove himself. Obi has not put the “Power” in PF. He can run, jump and dunk. Im sure he’ll get a fair opportunity in Indy. -41 in blow out loss last night. Really worse than anyone else. In a night Randle was not good is inconclusive.
Whats wrong with Jules? We can guess until its said.
Good point about “Staying in his lane” untl last night. With RJ out they needed more offense. Just becuase he was called out and reacted does not mean its back to “Every other year” for him. We got a lot more season infront of us. Lets see what happens.
If Jules plays like this for a long stretch minny won’t want him in a trade.
Unfair to expect a sub to singlehandedly win the game in his first playoff start. Obi racked up those points during the playoffs, against one of the best defensive teams in the league. It was never about Obi being better than Randle, it was about Obi being good enough to get an expanded role, and more minutes. As a sub.
Agree about Obi's flaws.
GustavBahler wrote:nycericanguy wrote:GustavBahler wrote:LivingLegend wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Clean wrote:At least I am not getting a lot of pushback on my Randle hate this year. People are not getting mesmerized by big regular season numbers to the point they ignore the laundry list of negatives he brings. The part I hate is we have no one to takeover for him when he plays bad now. Obi might be playing like trash so far this season but when he had to play big minutes for Randle he played well for us. I am going to give it more time but I might be eating crow on Obi. I thought he would be better with the Pacers.I always thought Obi meant more to our team then he would on a lot of other teams. He had a niche that aided the team uniquely to win when he was clicking in the second unit. Obi wanted out because Thibs didn't respect his contribution. When Randall played like he is Obi wouldn't get more time to shine but if Obi made a mistake he would be benched. Can't blame him for wanting to go. But once they gave up on Obi he should have been replaced or a more versatile 3/4. But they didn't add a forward at all. Even to be a 10th man respecting the 9 man rotation. The nine man rotation we have is good but man an injury, foul trouble, back to backs, slumps, or a suspension and we are in trouble.
Watching Obi first few games with Indy and he is still doing the exact EXACT same actions he was with the Knicks - he is doing the 3-point hand offs with occasional fake handoff where he tries to get to basket and he’s still afraid to put the ball down in traffic—- absolutely no advancement of the skill/play set.
If Obi has the exact same role with Indy, I would expect the same results. If Obi is stuck in the corner again.
The main reason why Obi has such good numbers as a starter, is because Thibs allows him to attack from the area near the top of the key as a starter. Not as a sub.
If you gave Randle Obi's role, I would expect similar results.
if we're being honest it's because most of his starts came in meaningless April games where Grimes, IQ and Obi were going nut dropping 30 with ease.
Right...
Julius Randle took part in pregame warm-ups, but was unable to go in Game 1 of the second round because of the left ankle he aggravated in the Knicks’ series-clinching victory in the previous round Wednesday in Cleveland.Toppin stepped in and scored 18 points in 31 minutes — both career-highs over 11 postseason appearances — in the Knicks’ series-opening 108-101 loss to the Heat at the Garden.
He had a great game against MIA, he's going to have some great games this year as well. No one ever said he wasn't capable of good games. My point was his "starter" stats were largely accumulated in April games when the pressure was off and teams were letting each other score 130 with ease and playing 2nd and 3rd units.
The main issue is whats his bread and butter to succeed consistently? He hit a bunch of 3's that game against MIA, that's certainly more of an anomaly. He's not a shooter, he doesn't handle the ball particularly well, he doesn't defend at the rim or on the perimeter. He's a finisher that can occasionally hit a 3, how valuable is that really? Probably valuable as an off the bench energy big.
But Randle and Brunson need to especially play and shoot better. We're simply not a good team without those two playing at an All-Star level.
It's still early and I'm not sounding the alarm yet. I actually expected a slow start and got yelled at by Martin lol.