Knicks · [Tournament Game Thread 11/3/23] Knicks at Bucks 7:30PM EST (page 6)
gradyandrew wrote:This team might need to make a trade sooner rather than later.
Those have been my exact words all preseason to the present. Team is structurally flawed. Look what having just one player out in the front court has caused, RJ. No depth at forward been saying this all preseason.
There are some silver linings in that despite all the above we are hanging in there against the top teams in the league. We just haven't been able to beat them. We most likely lose to the Clips and then it becomes time to string together a little streak to get ourselves back into the race.
Losing to Boston, CLE, NO, MIL with two of those on travel B2Bs and the BOS/MIL games going down to the wire is not a sign of a horrible team.
Alpha1971 wrote:gradyandrew wrote:This team might need to make a trade sooner rather than later.Those have been my exact words all preseason to the present. Team is structurally flawed. Look what having just one player out in the front court has caused, RJ. No depth at forward been saying this all preseason.
You think having no backup 4 is our biggest problem right now? What does that have tot do with RJ?
Alpha1971 wrote:gradyandrew wrote:This team might need to make a trade sooner rather than later.Those have been my exact words all preseason to the present. Team is structurally flawed. Look what having just one player out in the front court has caused, RJ. No depth at forward been saying this all preseason.
you've picked a really odd hill to die on.
Jhart at the backup 4 has been a big upgrade, he's a 1 man fastbreak when he gets a rebound. 10 reb/5assist/3 steals last night. and defends much better around the perimeter.
DDV's defense and floor spacing is also a big upgrade. he's already gotten us so many extra posessions with his hustle and defense and that's our calling card.... possessions.
we dominated the boards last night, that's the only thing that kept us in the game. We've literally won the rebounds EVERY game this season, including some dominant games on the boards like last night. Our style of play hasn't changed from last year, we are an extra possessions team that defends and rebounds.
Defense and rebounding has not been our issue at all. It's offense and shooting, and that really starts and ends with Randle. Brunson too wasn't shooting well before last night.
we def missed RJ on both ends last night, but we had this game won on the road against arguably the best team in the NBA who was at full strength.
nycericanguy wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:gradyandrew wrote:This team might need to make a trade sooner rather than later.Those have been my exact words all preseason to the present. Team is structurally flawed. Look what having just one player out in the front court has caused, RJ. No depth at forward been saying this all preseason.
you've picked a really odd hill to die on.
Jhart at the backup 4 has been a big upgrade, he's a 1 man fastbreak when he gets a rebound. 10 reb/5assist/3 steals last night. and defends much better around the perimeter.
DDV's defense and floor spacing is also a big upgrade. he's already gotten us so many extra posessions with his hustle and defense and that's our calling card.... possessions.
we dominated the boards last night, that's the only thing that kept us in the game. We've literally won the rebounds EVERY game this season, including some dominant games on the boards like last night. Our style of play hasn't changed from last year, we are an extra possessions team that defends and rebounds.
Defense and rebounding has not been our issue at all. It's offense and shooting, and that really starts and ends with Randle. Brunson too wasn't shooting well before last night.
we def missed RJ on both ends last night, but we had this game won on the road against arguably the best team in the NBA who was at full strength.
Yea it seems like our defense and rebounding actually carried over from last year and got better despite the smaller approach. The offense and shooting, which small ball was supposed to help (and should hopefully over time) has gotten way worse. But our lack of size has not been exposed at all and quite the opposite actually.
DLeethal wrote:nycericanguy wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:gradyandrew wrote:This team might need to make a trade sooner rather than later.Those have been my exact words all preseason to the present. Team is structurally flawed. Look what having just one player out in the front court has caused, RJ. No depth at forward been saying this all preseason.
you've picked a really odd hill to die on.
Jhart at the backup 4 has been a big upgrade, he's a 1 man fastbreak when he gets a rebound. 10 reb/5assist/3 steals last night. and defends much better around the perimeter.
DDV's defense and floor spacing is also a big upgrade. he's already gotten us so many extra posessions with his hustle and defense and that's our calling card.... possessions.
we dominated the boards last night, that's the only thing that kept us in the game. We've literally won the rebounds EVERY game this season, including some dominant games on the boards like last night. Our style of play hasn't changed from last year, we are an extra possessions team that defends and rebounds.
Defense and rebounding has not been our issue at all. It's offense and shooting, and that really starts and ends with Randle. Brunson too wasn't shooting well before last night.
we def missed RJ on both ends last night, but we had this game won on the road against arguably the best team in the NBA who was at full strength.
Yea it seems like our defense and rebounding actually carried over from last year and got better despite the smaller approach. The offense and shooting, which small ball was supposed to help (and should hopefully over time) has gotten way worse. But our lack of size has not been exposed at all and quite the opposite actually.
i'm confident it will, especially once we start playing more middle of the road teams. Thibs was saying Randle didn't train or play as he usually does in the offseason b/c of the surgery, so he expected him to start slow. So that's reassuring a bit at least.
my only concern is, will guys be able to find rhythm with less minutes now? But offensively i like our look much better playing small, we are a team that has refused to play small for so many years so i'm glad it's finally happening. when we have to play big, we have plenty upfront with Mitch/Hart/Randle and Sims is more than capable of playing spot minutes at PF if need be.
but ultimately this is not a final form roster and we will need a 2 or 3 for 1 type of trade eventually. Too many guys that need 25-30mpg right now.
nycericanguy wrote:GustavBahler wrote:nycericanguy wrote:Mitch again with this BS? He's the only guy always complaining on twitter...Its his trainer and he's 100 pct on the money. Wasting one of the best lob threats in the league, who is busting his butt on both ends of the court.
Mitch spoke too soon last season. Going into Brunson's second season in NY, its on Brunson and Thibs.
whether its mitch or his camp, it's always him complaining on social media. He's matured alot since coming into the league but he's still very immature. no one else on the team does this. IHart doesn't complain. he knows his role.
and Mitch's role is very clear, he's not a scorer never has been never will. taking thinly veiled shots at Brunson, who carries this team and is the best PG we've had in forever is just... ridic. especially considering the success we have had since he got here.
"Always him complaining"? Thats hyperbole. You're conflating a scoring threat, with a lob threat. A scoring threat can create their own shot. A lob threat is only a threat if their teammates, especially the PG is looking to make the most of that talent. Brunson would rather take the shot himself.
Brunson is maybe the best scoring PG we've ever had, but he's too often a mediocre playmaker. If he wants to take his game to the next level as the starting PG. Thats where he should start.
GustavBahler wrote:nycericanguy wrote:GustavBahler wrote:nycericanguy wrote:Mitch again with this BS? He's the only guy always complaining on twitter...Its his trainer and he's 100 pct on the money. Wasting one of the best lob threats in the league, who is busting his butt on both ends of the court.
Mitch spoke too soon last season. Going into Brunson's second season in NY, its on Brunson and Thibs.
whether its mitch or his camp, it's always him complaining on social media. He's matured alot since coming into the league but he's still very immature. no one else on the team does this. IHart doesn't complain. he knows his role.
and Mitch's role is very clear, he's not a scorer never has been never will. taking thinly veiled shots at Brunson, who carries this team and is the best PG we've had in forever is just... ridic. especially considering the success we have had since he got here.
"Always him complaining"? Thats hyperbole. You're conflating a scoring threat, with a lob threat. A scoring threat can create their own shot. A lob threat is only a threat if their teammates, especially the PG is looking to make the most of that talent. Brunson would rather take the shot himself.
Brunson is maybe the best scoring PG we've ever had, but he's too often a mediocre playmaker. If he wants to take his game to the next level as the starting PG. Thats where he should start.
its not hyperbole, he's complained on social media pretty every year several times about some type of limitation on his non-existent offense. it's always just him even when we are winning.
and yes Brunson would rather take the shot b/c he's damn good at it and SHOULD take it.
nycericanguy wrote:GustavBahler wrote:nycericanguy wrote:GustavBahler wrote:nycericanguy wrote:Mitch again with this BS? He's the only guy always complaining on twitter...Its his trainer and he's 100 pct on the money. Wasting one of the best lob threats in the league, who is busting his butt on both ends of the court.
Mitch spoke too soon last season. Going into Brunson's second season in NY, its on Brunson and Thibs.
whether its mitch or his camp, it's always him complaining on social media. He's matured alot since coming into the league but he's still very immature. no one else on the team does this. IHart doesn't complain. he knows his role.
and Mitch's role is very clear, he's not a scorer never has been never will. taking thinly veiled shots at Brunson, who carries this team and is the best PG we've had in forever is just... ridic. especially considering the success we have had since he got here.
"Always him complaining"? Thats hyperbole. You're conflating a scoring threat, with a lob threat. A scoring threat can create their own shot. A lob threat is only a threat if their teammates, especially the PG is looking to make the most of that talent. Brunson would rather take the shot himself.
Brunson is maybe the best scoring PG we've ever had, but he's too often a mediocre playmaker. If he wants to take his game to the next level as the starting PG. Thats where he should start.
he's complained on social media pretty every year about some type of limitation on his non-existent offense.
and yes Brunson would rather take the shot b/c he's damn good at it and SHOULD take it.
How many times in his career? If it was that bad, he would have been off the team by now. Its about getting all your teammates involved, rewarding your bigs for the hard work.
Its also about tactics. Making Mitch a lob threat again forces the D to pay more attention to him on offense. Saying Brunson should freeze Mitch out of the offense because JB can get buckets, is the same excuse ballhogs make around the world.
Clean wrote:Who I am watching from now on is Thibs. I need to see how long will he ride Randle. If this continues through the season will thibs ever bench him? will he ever not close a game with Randle? or is he willing to let the team die to not upset Randle. This is like a science experiment.
That would be some moment but in reality Thibs has never bent/wavered on Randle and has never pulled/benched him when he is playing awful and has ALEAYS allowed him to finish games regardless of shit play/effort —- even with a #9 pick in Obi playing well behind him.
I don’t see Thibs changing and to a degree there is some safety in that for Thibs because it’s Leon who signed Randle and if Randle fails technically Randle/Leon will get some/most of blame.
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This is how I was taught to play the game. Clyde always talks about rewarding the big. Even if the big misses the shot you giving him the ball keeps him happy.
You can’t do this if teams are packing the paint with bodies because we can’t shoot
Swishfm3 wrote:Watch out now…All this Thibs bashing may upset the site owner.
If anything Thibs has shown his style.system works and he;s also shown if he had someone better than Randle at the 4 we’d be much better —- as stubborn as Thibs is he is kind of showing us get me better talent and I will win.
LivingLegend wrote:Clean wrote:Who I am watching from now on is Thibs. I need to see how long will he ride Randle. If this continues through the season will thibs ever bench him? will he ever not close a game with Randle? or is he willing to let the team die to not upset Randle. This is like a science experiment.That would be some moment but in reality Thibs has never bent/wavered on Randle and has never pulled/benched him when he is playing awful and has ALEAYS allowed him to finish games regardless of shit play/effort —- even with a #9 pick in Obi playing well behind him.
I don’t see Thibs changing and to a degree there is some safety in that for Thibs because it’s Leon who signed Randle and if Randle fails technically Randle/Leon will get some/most of blame.
We need a big trade this season. With or without Randle involved. This should clear up if Thibs is the coach to get us deep into the postseason.
nycericanguy wrote:really thought we had the game won after that Brunson 3, would have been a real nice road W against what is probably the favorite to win it all, especially considering how poorly we shot. MIL just couldnt miss from 3 though.The Thibs explanation on why Randle is struggling so much makes sense though and makes me feel better.
I’m programmed (also with NY Giants) to expect the minute things look good (Brunson 3 pointer puts us up 2) —- and I think literally 30 seconds of game clock later we were down 5.
nycericanguy wrote:I think we really missed RJ tonight on both ends, we probably win this game if we have him.
Nah because RJ only taking minutes from other guys who were playing hard - Julius still would have got his 39 minutes (oh my) and killed the game.
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This is how I was taught to play the game. Clyde always talks about rewarding the big. Even if the big misses the shot you giving him the ball keeps him happy.You can’t do this if teams are packing the paint with bodies because we can’t shoot
Plenty of times Mitch rolled to the rim and got looked off, other times your right, poor shooting. Not bad enough a situation for zero lobs from Brunson to Mitch this season. As far as I can tell.
GustavBahler wrote:I'm half expecting a down year from Randle. But his ankle issues, and the absence of RJ, arent doing his game any favors. Hopefully when RJ comes back,Randle's game will settle down.Its clear Randle's ankle isnt 100 percent. The best thing Randle can do as I said before is stay in his lane. And not take his frustrations out on his teammates this season, if things arent going his way.
If we were to do a trade before the first deadline it would probably have to be a fire sale. Not worth it at this point. We could trade for a backup who wont be good enough to match Randle's regular production, but good enough to start, If things go really south with Jules this season.
Please stop with the damn ankle injury - it has absolutely no bearing on his brick laying - none/nada it’s just a bad excuse. If he’s hurt get him off the court and his poor little ankle isn’t making him quit on D either.
LivingLegend wrote:GustavBahler wrote:I'm half expecting a down year from Randle. But his ankle issues, and the absence of RJ, arent doing his game any favors. Hopefully when RJ comes back,Randle's game will settle down.Its clear Randle's ankle isnt 100 percent. The best thing Randle can do as I said before is stay in his lane. And not take his frustrations out on his teammates this season, if things arent going his way.
If we were to do a trade before the first deadline it would probably have to be a fire sale. Not worth it at this point. We could trade for a backup who wont be good enough to match Randle's regular production, but good enough to start, If things go really south with Jules this season.
Please stop with the damn ankle injury - it has absolutely no bearing on his brick laying - nine/nada it’s just a bad excuse. If he’s hurt get him off the court and his poor little ankle is making him quit on D either.
Who made that claim about bricks? Just you. The ankle injury is limiting his mobility, and his productivity. You can clearly see the difference from when he is healthy
GustavBahler wrote:nycericanguy wrote:GustavBahler wrote:nycericanguy wrote:GustavBahler wrote:nycericanguy wrote:Mitch again with this BS? He's the only guy always complaining on twitter...Its his trainer and he's 100 pct on the money. Wasting one of the best lob threats in the league, who is busting his butt on both ends of the court.
Mitch spoke too soon last season. Going into Brunson's second season in NY, its on Brunson and Thibs.
whether its mitch or his camp, it's always him complaining on social media. He's matured alot since coming into the league but he's still very immature. no one else on the team does this. IHart doesn't complain. he knows his role.
and Mitch's role is very clear, he's not a scorer never has been never will. taking thinly veiled shots at Brunson, who carries this team and is the best PG we've had in forever is just... ridic. especially considering the success we have had since he got here.
"Always him complaining"? Thats hyperbole. You're conflating a scoring threat, with a lob threat. A scoring threat can create their own shot. A lob threat is only a threat if their teammates, especially the PG is looking to make the most of that talent. Brunson would rather take the shot himself.
Brunson is maybe the best scoring PG we've ever had, but he's too often a mediocre playmaker. If he wants to take his game to the next level as the starting PG. Thats where he should start.
he's complained on social media pretty every year about some type of limitation on his non-existent offense.
and yes Brunson would rather take the shot b/c he's damn good at it and SHOULD take it.
How many times in his career? If it was that bad, he would have been off the team by now. Its about getting all your teammates involved, rewarding your bigs for the hard work.
Its also about tactics. Making Mitch a lob threat again forces the D to pay more attention to him on offense. Saying Brunson should freeze Mitch out of the offense because JB can get buckets, is the same excuse ballhogs make around the world.
I used to get upset with Mitch twitter bitching but the kid is playing hard and doing what he does pretty damn well and he is obviously working on his body so go ahead and bitch a bit Mitch - your not the issue.
Now offensively Mitch sucks and that is the reality- I can’t even count how many balls that clanked off his hands or were knocked out of his hands and his FTs tell you all you need to know about Mitch’s offensive skill.
In terms of Brunson - he is in no way selfish and if he does miss Mitch it’s probably because he’s working so hard to find a shot because nobody else can get a bucket. Plus it’s obvious teams are contesting the paint - you can’t run pretty lob dunks when there are 3, 4, 5 bodies collapsed in the paint.
GustavBahler wrote:LivingLegend wrote:GustavBahler wrote:I'm half expecting a down year from Randle. But his ankle issues, and the absence of RJ, arent doing his game any favors. Hopefully when RJ comes back,Randle's game will settle down.Its clear Randle's ankle isnt 100 percent. The best thing Randle can do as I said before is stay in his lane. And not take his frustrations out on his teammates this season, if things arent going his way.
If we were to do a trade before the first deadline it would probably have to be a fire sale. Not worth it at this point. We could trade for a backup who wont be good enough to match Randle's regular production, but good enough to start, If things go really south with Jules this season.
Please stop with the damn ankle injury - it has absolutely no bearing on his brick laying - nine/nada it’s just a bad excuse. If he’s hurt get him off the court and his poor little ankle is making him quit on D either.
Who made that claim about bricks? Just you. The ankle injury is limiting his mobility, and his productivity. You can clearly see the difference from when he is healthy
I just don’t agree I see him doing everything normal - including bricking/quitting but I respect your view of things — my apologies if coming across harshly but Randle infuriates me.