Knixkik wrote:martin wrote:Knixkik wrote:Indirectly related, but I do wonder about DeRozan. Would he be open to coming off the bench for a playoff team as long as the minutes and touches are there, and would he be willing (or eligible?) for a 2-year extension at a slightly inflated price to be in that role ? If so, I wonder if the Knicks would trade Fournier, grimes and a first round pick for him. See how things go. Then this summer flip him and the necessary unprotected firsts for Mitchell if that becomes an option. Cavs can do worse than Garland, Strus, DeRozan, Mobley, and Allen plus getting most of their draft capital back and they would remain very competitive. If Mitchell does not become an option this summer, DeRozan can remain a super 6th man so the Knicks excellent starting lineup can stay intact and DeRozan receives all of the non-Randle and Brunson minutes and gets the freedom with guys like Hart, Anunoby, DDV etc staggered around him in the bench unit. A lot of what-ifs but it’s a way to improve the team now without sacrificing much and set up a future move for a player like Mitchell. It comes down to what DeRozan is willing to prioritize as he is an upcoming free agent and we would need to know ahead of time.
No, they would not, because that is a gross overpay for a guy who is on an expiring contract and will be 35yo next season and can’t shoot from distance for shit. And his shooting in general has dropped off and maybe that’s a hint at more bad shooting to come (or not but don’t risk it cause he is fucking old).
And if he walks at end of season cause Houston wants to give him a Dillon style contract, all you are left with are some dick jokes. Had to work that in.
I’m saying it would have to be contingent on an extension. No trade unless that is sorted out. I don’t consider Fournier, grimes and one of our non-Knicks picks an overpay. He’s still a really good player.
So if you were given a handshake deal of say 3 years at $15M per but some team gave you a FFV level deal of 3 years at $25M per…
What do you think Derozan’s wife AND his side chick and her hot bisexual and oddly flexible gf would tell him to do? Cause Marcus Morris made that same decision to burn the Spurs and go to Knicks and to the great great pleasure of turning into IQ and then OG.
Do you think Leon is dumb enough to leave his flank that wide open and put the Knicks in that position versus other options?
Derozan’s playoff shooting eFG% and overall performances make RJ shooting numbers blush. Or gag. One of the 2, whatever you are into cause there seems to be no shame in these here parts
DM off the bench sounds good. But if he thinks he’s getting more than 17 minutes he can go scratch.
Donovan doing good work! This is not helping lol
Knixkik wrote:Not directly answering your question I know but It seems like the compromise is having him start but pulling him early to lead the bench. OG has completely changed the makeup of the team because I think the front office feels totally comfortable having the small backcourt because OG is such a game changer defensively.Seems like OG and Mitchell to join Brunson, Randle and the centers was the plan all along. And Hartenstein being so legit has given them extra reason to go all-in with this group potentially.
To your point, good stuff
martin wrote:Knixkik wrote:martin wrote:Knixkik wrote:Indirectly related, but I do wonder about DeRozan. Would he be open to coming off the bench for a playoff team as long as the minutes and touches are there, and would he be willing (or eligible?) for a 2-year extension at a slightly inflated price to be in that role ? If so, I wonder if the Knicks would trade Fournier, grimes and a first round pick for him. See how things go. Then this summer flip him and the necessary unprotected firsts for Mitchell if that becomes an option. Cavs can do worse than Garland, Strus, DeRozan, Mobley, and Allen plus getting most of their draft capital back and they would remain very competitive. If Mitchell does not become an option this summer, DeRozan can remain a super 6th man so the Knicks excellent starting lineup can stay intact and DeRozan receives all of the non-Randle and Brunson minutes and gets the freedom with guys like Hart, Anunoby, DDV etc staggered around him in the bench unit. A lot of what-ifs but it’s a way to improve the team now without sacrificing much and set up a future move for a player like Mitchell. It comes down to what DeRozan is willing to prioritize as he is an upcoming free agent and we would need to know ahead of time.
No, they would not, because that is a gross overpay for a guy who is on an expiring contract and will be 35yo next season and can’t shoot from distance for shit. And his shooting in general has dropped off and maybe that’s a hint at more bad shooting to come (or not but don’t risk it cause he is fucking old).
And if he walks at end of season cause Houston wants to give him a Dillon style contract, all you are left with are some dick jokes. Had to work that in.
I’m saying it would have to be contingent on an extension. No trade unless that is sorted out. I don’t consider Fournier, grimes and one of our non-Knicks picks an overpay. He’s still a really good player.
So if you were given a handshake deal of say 3 years at $15M per but some team gave you a FFV level deal of 3 years at $25M per…
What do you think Derozan’s wife AND his side chick and her hot bisexual and oddly flexible gf would tell him to do? Cause Marcus Morris made that same decision to burn the Spurs and go to Knicks and to the great great pleasure of turning into IQ and then OG.
Do you think Leon is dumb enough to leave his flank that wide open and put the Knicks in that position versus other options?
In this hypothetical scenario I’m talking about an actual extension at the time of the trade. No handshake deal. But thinking about it now post trade maybe that’s not legal. But yes it would have to be a scenario like that.
It looks like the Knicks will be pursuing DM after the season. This always seemed like a good match.
He's a star player,you don't have him come off the bench for limited minutes.
People always talk about the defensive liabilities of playing him next to Brunny but they never look at the other side. That backcourt is completely unstoppable.
Make it happen Leon.
One question....does this mean Devo will have less minutes? If so, the answer is F No!
Agree, this will never happen. The list of obvious reasons why are:
1. No way that NY finally gives up all their saved nuts for their "final piece" then present it as an "off the bench role".
2. Not convinced DM wants to leave Cleveland to come to NY because "it's the MECCA/hometown". Unlike other Knicks fans pushing this narrative, I have seen the proverbial football placed with this notion many many times before. DM wants to win. He is doing that right now. Add the concept that he will be coming off the bench for Martin and he will sign his Cleveland extension faster than a Todd cheerleader post on game threads.
3. As crazy as it sounds with JB playing so well, it is a better idea to not only have JB off the bench but to trade JB and add DM. DM is top 10 to 20 in the league. Proven superstar. JB has had a good two years. Can he be what DM is, i believe, but is not yet sitting at the same plateau. Imo
4. Why not start DM but use him to finish? Never been a fan of having the starters not be the same guys finishing games. Like we saw with Devo and IQ, if you are the BEST to finish games, you should be the best to start a game.
5. Is not the priper conclusion that it is a bad trade IF you cannot put two high level players in the same lineup? And still have needs in second unit?
For now Cleveland controls things.
For now. THat they are this red hot after losing Garland and Mobley are interesting.
Might as well start talking about Garland as a trade?
Jarrett Allen is proving his worth these days.
Strus is proving himself. They are winning.
Maybe demonstrating the two small guard lineup was not correct?
Odds are DM extends. Why? Money matters. He is winning. There will be time for a trade.
If he went FA route, I’d trade Brunson to round out the roster. I love Brunson, but I love winning too.
Not to worry, this is a low probable route. For all the reasons melo did not come via FA, Neither will DM. Don’t hate on him for it. You’d all do the same.
“Low Probable” means I give myself a window because Im not an authority like some of you are.
I’d say in some fashion he finds his way to Brooklyn and Bridges goes there. How that happens is beyond my attention span but it very well might complete them. Still some ifs, like will Mobley be the man? Not some plug and play thing, but a chemistry thing. Use your imagination and infuse an OG like effect with Bridges in that lineup. Maybe?
Brooklyn gets a marketable star and in the age of a parity start building on that.
Do I like DM? Yes, Very much. Can we be a team with three stars and role players on minimums like Phoenix? MOney matters folks. Its not just the outflow, its the punitive nature that makes things harder. How do we pay Randle, OG, Brunson and DM?
With no picks and little yoot the bench gets ugly.
To the point Martin brings up about bench play for DM: Its not the money or the ego, its a stretch to even think it in some starphuch fantasy way. Im not being my usual snarky self here but its a wonderful starphuch greedy concept to think we can get him here and have enough money and talent to truly compete. Its not just one aspect of DM here that makes it hard, its a lot of little things. Money, Fit, Playing time, Rotation, and chemistry. Love the guy, I’d really like to be wrong here and join the circle jerk here. Got to be a Grady Dick joke here somewhere!
Question for everyone: How far into the playoffs does Cleveland have to advance to quell the Donovan fears that that Cavs team is worthwhile to stick around for?
And if they DON'T get that far, how motivated do you think Donovan will be move on if that goal is not reached?
Last year's beat down by the Knicks was a very good thing for New York.
Cleveland's front office has to weigh that answer. Cause if they bounce in the first round (or even second?), lots of sphincters will all tighten at the same time except in the part of the room where Donovan is wallowing in.
If there is a number less than 0 that would be the chances of Donovan coming off the bench for any team in the league smack dab in his prime years.
martin wrote:Question for everyone: How far into the playoffs does Cleveland have to advance to quell the Donovan fears that that Cavs team is worthwhile to stick around for?And if they DON'T get that far, how motivated do you think Donovan will be move on if that goal is not reached?
Last year's beat down by the Knicks was a very good thing for New York.
Cleveland's front office has to weigh that answer. Cause if they bounce in the first round (or even second?), lots of sphincters will all tighten at the same time except in the part of the room where Donovan is wallowing in.
Get to the ECF and put up a good fight.
Question I believe would be as important is, what do the Knicks do? If the Knicks don't do any better, why would he make a lateral move and leave money on the table?
HofstraBBall wrote:martin wrote:Question for everyone: How far into the playoffs does Cleveland have to advance to quell the Donovan fears that that Cavs team is worthwhile to stick around for?And if they DON'T get that far, how motivated do you think Donovan will be move on if that goal is not reached?
Last year's beat down by the Knicks was a very good thing for New York.
Cleveland's front office has to weigh that answer. Cause if they bounce in the first round (or even second?), lots of sphincters will all tighten at the same time except in the part of the room where Donovan is wallowing in.
Get to the ECF and put up a good fight.
Question I believe would be as important is, what do the Knicks do? If the Knicks don't do any better, why would he make a lateral move and leave money on the table?
Very very very easy to answer. Cleveland has already done their All-In move with him as that centerpiece. Cleveland don't have much left in moveable future assets.
The Knicks have not even done the move (Dejounte?) before their All-In move.
As well, Cleveland is rolling with 2 small backcourt guys and then 2 bigs to make up for that; this is not a proven commodity, yet. Garland has missed 20 games this year and so has Mobley. And Mobely has shown that he can be beat by strength; it may take him another 2-4 years to get to where he is legit sized and doesn't get pushed around.
