Knicks · Knicks traded for Towns (finally official 10/1) (page 23)

martin wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

martin wrote:Now imagine him and Brunson with OG Mikal and a cutter

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Good stuff. Are there any stats on KAT setting screens to free up a teammate?

Like in a situation where you pick the ball handler’s guy off of him and pop out to the 3point line to get the ball back after he frees up?

Where Kat sets a screen that frees up the ball handler to get to the rim or shoot off the dribble. Isnt the stat about KAT hitting a 3?

BigDaddyG wrote:

Rookie wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

Rookie wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

Rookie wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

Knicksfan wrote:

martin wrote:

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How can anyone hate this trade?

Hold on, yes, I loved Randle and Donte. That three against the Sixers runs rent-free in my mind. I wish them luck in their new situation.

But man! MAN! Remember many seasons ago when we were hoping for a star Point Guard and we finally got our star in Brunson? And his connection to the Knicks was clear since the beginning as a young NY fan?

What about a stretch 5 to truly compete in this era, a very talented and legit 7-footer who has played at his best as a Center and has the shot to rival guards! And the guy was a Knicks fan as a kid as well?! And his reasons to appreciate the franchise even beyond his fan hood are solid. He must be conflicted because he really seems to love Min and who wouldn’t after 9 years, but he is indeed coming home. He now has a chance to get his game to a new level while playing for his childhood team?

I’m very excited about this! Yes, people have questions and I’m glad there are because that means there is potential for better days from him. Just like it was with Brunson, so many doubting him and calling him a bench player and nothing more.

This is such a cool team to represent New York! I’m very excited about what this all could lead to!

The issue I have with the trade is that KAT isn't a center, IMHO. If the trade is Randle/Divo for a legit stretch "5", I can get behind the vision. Randle/Divo for another 4 who isnt substantially better seems like a lateral move, at best.

Would you consider Jokic a good defender? If not, then I guess it would be impossible for Denver to win a chip with him playing center or to make deep playoff runs. I really don’t get the argument. Towns does a lot of things at an elite level but that’s not good enough for you. Maybe you just really wanted to keep the status quo with Randle and Divo. Towns is a VERY good basketball player. Hating on him because maybe he’s not a plus defender is illogical. There’s a video on this thread of Towns bombing 3’s, then further in it details how he gets to the basket. There is so much to like there. It’s such a mute improvement over putting your head down and dribbling into 3 guys guarding the basket. Our floor spacing is going to give teams nightmares. No more 5-10 minute stretches where we can’t score. Our team got better. We upgraded talent. It’s all good. DDV can be replaced. His replacement might even already be on the team. What we really need is a healthy Mitch which isn’t Towns’s fault

Are you suggesting KAT is in the same stratosphere as Jokic? KAT shoots at an elite level. That's not a lot of things. KAT is a flawed star, like many in the league. Heck, Jokic is flawed. But he's still miles ahead of KAT in terms of impact. Yes, I'm hating on Towns because he's not a plus defender. The premise I'm hearing is that KAT is this stretch 5 who will lead the team to the promise land. But, how accurate is that if you can't defend the position full-time. The reason KP works is that he provides elite rim protection. As of now, all I can say is that team traded a borderline All NBA PF and a starting level SG for a borderline All NBA PF. I don't think it moves the needle.

Yes, I am suggesting Towns is in the same stratosphere as Jokic on the defensive end. Are you suggesting Jokic is in the same stratosphere as Towns from 3pt range?

No, but I'm suggesting Jokic is a better player. A way better player. Imma go out of my way and say the words "KAT for MVP have never been uttered. This is like saying DDV is close to Devin Booker because he's a better three point shooter. Jokic functions at such a high level on offense that it more than makes up for his defense. KAT isn't at that level.

Maybe you watched this already, it was posted earlier in this thread but I dunno. Look what Towns brings with his offensive skillset and tell me that this isn’t a great fit for this team.

I'm not arguing KAT is a scrub. My thing is, I don't really see him as center. If he's not a center, then what's the point? Even if you argue he's better than Randle, I'll pushback on anyone who says he Donte and a fake first round pick levels better than Randle. So what if Donte is unhappy. Trade him for a pick it a legit backup center. This move is lateral. We traded a borderline All NBA PF for another borderline All NBA PF. The difference is we're stuck with a borderline All NBA PF making $50M a year. You know what happens if he doesn't workout? The team is stuck with him. He's untradable for the next 3 years. Even if you extend Randle for 3/$40M, Randle and Donte combined still wouldn't take up as much cap space. If you're going to push all your chips in, I'd expect morenthan KAT.

The real question is would you rather have Randle at 5O mil per or KAT at 5O mil per?

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BigDaddyG wrote:

Rookie wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

Knicksfan wrote:

martin wrote:

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How can anyone hate this trade?

Hold on, yes, I loved Randle and Donte. That three against the Sixers runs rent-free in my mind. I wish them luck in their new situation.

But man! MAN! Remember many seasons ago when we were hoping for a star Point Guard and we finally got our star in Brunson? And his connection to the Knicks was clear since the beginning as a young NY fan?

What about a stretch 5 to truly compete in this era, a very talented and legit 7-footer who has played at his best as a Center and has the shot to rival guards! And the guy was a Knicks fan as a kid as well?! And his reasons to appreciate the franchise even beyond his fan hood are solid. He must be conflicted because he really seems to love Min and who wouldn’t after 9 years, but he is indeed coming home. He now has a chance to get his game to a new level while playing for his childhood team?

I’m very excited about this! Yes, people have questions and I’m glad there are because that means there is potential for better days from him. Just like it was with Brunson, so many doubting him and calling him a bench player and nothing more.

This is such a cool team to represent New York! I’m very excited about what this all could lead to!

The issue I have with the trade is that KAT isn't a center, IMHO. If the trade is Randle/Divo for a legit stretch "5", I can get behind the vision. Randle/Divo for another 4 who isnt substantially better seems like a lateral move, at best.

Would you consider Jokic a good defender? If not, then I guess it would be impossible for Denver to win a chip with him playing center or to make deep playoff runs. I really don’t get the argument. Towns does a lot of things at an elite level but that’s not good enough for you. Maybe you just really wanted to keep the status quo with Randle and Divo. Towns is a VERY good basketball player. Hating on him because maybe he’s not a plus defender is illogical. There’s a video on this thread of Towns bombing 3’s, then further in it details how he gets to the basket. There is so much to like there. It’s such a mute improvement over putting your head down and dribbling into 3 guys guarding the basket. Our floor spacing is going to give teams nightmares. No more 5-10 minute stretches where we can’t score. Our team got better. We upgraded talent. It’s all good. DDV can be replaced. His replacement might even already be on the team. What we really need is a healthy Mitch which isn’t Towns’s fault

Are you suggesting KAT is in the same stratosphere as Jokic? KAT shoots at an elite level. That's not a lot of things. KAT is a flawed star, like many in the league. Heck, Jokic is flawed. But he's still miles ahead of KAT in terms of impact. Yes, I'm hating on Towns because he's not a plus defender. The premise I'm hearing is that KAT is this stretch 5 who will lead the team to the promise land. But, how accurate is that if you can't defend the position full-time. The reason KP works is that he provides elite rim protection. As of now, all I can say is that team traded a borderline All NBA PF and a starting level SG for a borderline All NBA PF. I don't think it moves the needle.

Yes, I am suggesting Towns is in the same stratosphere as Jokic on the defensive end. Are you suggesting Jokic is in the same stratosphere as Towns from 3pt range?

No, but I'm suggesting Jokic is a better player. A way better player. Imma go out of my way and say the words "KAT for MVP have never been uttered. This is like saying DDV is close to Devin Booker because he's a better three point shooter. Jokic functions at such a high level on offense that it more than makes up for his defense. KAT isn't at that level.

Maybe you watched this already, it was posted earlier in this thread but I dunno. Look what Towns brings with his offensive skillset and tell me that this isn’t a great fit for this team.

I'm not arguing KAT is a scrub. My thing is, I don't really see him as center. If he's not a center, then what's the point? Even if you argue he's better than Randle, I'll pushback on anyone who says he Donte and a fake first round pick levels better than Randle. So what if Donte is unhappy. Trade him for a pick it a legit backup center. This move is lateral. We traded a borderline All NBA PF for another borderline All NBA PF. The difference is we're stuck with a borderline All NBA PF making $50M a year. You know what happens if he doesn't workout? The team is stuck with him. He's untradable for the next 3 years. Even if you extend Randle for 3/$40M, Randle and Donte combined still wouldn't take up as much cap space. If you're going to push all your chips in, I'd expect morenthan KAT.

We won 50 games this last season. With this trade I am very comfortable predicting a 56 win season, so yes, I think the trade makes us a better team. We struggled in the playoffs against Miami. Our offense is better now and not as stagnant. I have zero worries we are a better team than Miami with this trade. We barely beat Philly with a hobbled Embiid. This team with Towns is better than the Sixers and Indiana....Cleveland, Orlando and Milwaukee. We will also match up against Boston very well. With this trade, we are a better team so no, this was not a lateral move

I'd say this looked like a 56 win team when Randle, OG, Brunson were all healthy. The team's strength was it's depth and that's taken a hit. Imma say this team as it stands now has taken a step backwards

So I just got a little time to get on YouTube and watched some Timberwolves full game stuff. You can just take all that defensive yards yada Towns sucks at defense crap and throw it in the trash bin. There is no way you can compare a Finch coached team to a Thibs coached team. There is no way on earth Thibs will have Towns out on the perimeter on an island guarding guards. This is a fact whether he is playing forward or center.

ramtour420 wrote:Biggest point is would you rather have a frontcourt player that's is the best 3 point shooter at his position who is a better rebounder and blocker and actually performs in the playoffs vs a guy who is worse from the 3, is not a blocker, worse rebounder and melts every time in the playoffs?

The stats clearly point toward KAT being a better player than Randle from a plug-and-play standpoint. And the physical numbers (height/weight/length) say he should give us better positional versatility as a PF/C at a time where we have a lot of center minutes available for the taking.

Any argument of Randle over KAT really just comes down to loyalty and appreciating his contributions in helping to pilot us out of dark times. But we already ripped the proverbial bandaid off when we traded away RJ and Quickley - I was about as sick as anyone could be after that trade. I hadn't felt that bad about a trade since Mason for LJ. (Camby for McDyess is just a notch lower!)

I miss DDV more and more as I think about how much he evolved in his time with us, and his gutty late season and playoff performances. It was like the Starks career arc compressed into 1 season. That 3 to sink the Sixers was sort of like his signature dunk moment. I was mentally prepared to have DDV as our starting SG for the next few seasons.

technomaster wrote:

ramtour420 wrote:Biggest point is would you rather have a frontcourt player that's is the best 3 point shooter at his position who is a better rebounder and blocker and actually performs in the playoffs vs a guy who is worse from the 3, is not a blocker, worse rebounder and melts every time in the playoffs?

The stats clearly point toward KAT being a better player than Randle from a plug-and-play standpoint. And the physical numbers (height/weight/length) say he should give us better positional versatility as a PF/C at a time where we have a lot of center minutes available for the taking.

Any argument of Randle over KAT really just comes down to loyalty and appreciating his contributions in helping to pilot us out of dark times. But we already ripped the proverbial bandaid off when we traded away RJ and Quickley - I was about as sick as anyone could be after that trade. I hadn't felt that bad about a trade since Mason for LJ. (Camby for McDyess is just a notch lower!)

I miss DDV more and more as I think about how much he evolved in his time with us, and his gutty late season and playoff performances. It was like the Starks career arc compressed into 1 season. That 3 to sink the Sixers was sort of like his signature dunk moment. I was mentally prepared to have DDV as our starting SG for the next few seasons.

I feel the same way. Figured Randle wouldn’t make it to extension without some hefty concession. But Donte seemed like an absolute keeper with the NovaKnicks identity.

Spot on analysis.

martin wrote:Um OK

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Yeah right.

"A source close to the Minnesota said that they needed a legit backup SG to back up Anthony Edwards so badly that they were willing to give up their unicorn big and his stack of career accolades. The Knicks played hardball, and the Wolves settled on Randle as a throw in."

BigDaddyG wrote:

blkexec wrote:

EwingsGlass wrote:

I think people overstate his “bad” on defense. I love this guy’s takes on tape. I don’t expect him to be Tyson Chandler good at defense. But he can hold his own.

I absolutely love this video take, including the human sound affects (boosh…boosh). I forgot how agile Kat is on his feet guarding pick and rolls. Looks like we have him at the perfect time in his career at 28 yrs old. Seems like his defensive issues was not ability but effort. And in this series under the bright lights of the playoffs against the champs while guarding an MVP caliber player, (on an island) Kat stepped up. Now image what he looks like under a defensive genius name Thibs. I’m not worried. Health is my ONLY concern at this point.

This guy is schizophrenic. Showers people with praise and the treats them like the anti-christ later. That said, these clips only confirm what I've stated. KAT is probably better defensively at the 4. He doesn't do drop coverage well and he doesn't really protect the rim well anymore. The Gobert thing doesn't really pass the smell test. In theory, Gobert would have allowed KAT more weak side block opportunities. He couldn't even get a block per game.

How stubborn can you be? Its apparent that you dislike Towns and refuse to see anything positive about him. In the video he IS guarding Nikola Jokić who if I am correct plays center. He is playing GREAT defense against him. How many Minnesota games have you actually watched???

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technomaster wrote:

martin wrote:Um OK

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Yeah right.

"A source close to the Minnesota said that they needed a legit backup SG to back up Anthony Edwards so badly that they were willing to give up their unicorn big and his stack of career accolades. The Knicks played hardball, and the Wolves settled on Randle as a throw in."

If they didnt want to pay KAT what he was getting and they dont bring back Randle. There might be some truth to it. DDV got even better since the last time the Wolves pursued him.

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BigDaddyG wrote:

EwingsGlass wrote:I could see KAT taking the next step here in NY. Yes. Same stratosphere as Jokic and Embiid? Not yet. But not out of realm of possibility.

It's not out of the realm of possibility that KAT can make some gradual steps. But he's entering season 10. I can say it's highly unlikely that KAT enters the Jokic/Embiid. I know, but Jalen! The difference is that KAT was given unlimited minutes and rostered built to his needs.

Crazy to think a guy who will be making $60 needs to take the “next step”?

We did not trade just Randle for KAT.
Which one can still argue who is better. Including value of contracts.
Worry is that we traded two shot creators for a guy that enjoys pitting up 30 footers.
Can be argued Bridges will be the number two shot creator.
Which means our $60M final piece is a number three?

HofstraBBall wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

EwingsGlass wrote:I could see KAT taking the next step here in NY. Yes. Same stratosphere as Jokic and Embiid? Not yet. But not out of realm of possibility.

It's not out of the realm of possibility that KAT can make some gradual steps. But he's entering season 10. I can say it's highly unlikely that KAT enters the Jokic/Embiid. I know, but Jalen! The difference is that KAT was given unlimited minutes and rostered built to his needs.

Crazy to think a guy who will be making $60 needs to take the “next step”?

We did not trade just Randle for KAT.
Which one can still argue who is better. Including value of contracts.
Worry is that we traded two shot creators for a guy that enjoys pitting up 30 footers.
Can be argued Bridges will be the number two shot creator.
Which means our $60M final piece is a number three?

Next step for KAT is from All NBA to league MVP. There is always a next step.

KAT is easily the #2 scoring option based on simple metrics.

Mikal is secondary ball handler. 3&D++.

This is happening with or without you. Might as well climb aboard.

BigRedDog wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

blkexec wrote:

EwingsGlass wrote:

I think people overstate his “bad” on defense. I love this guy’s takes on tape. I don’t expect him to be Tyson Chandler good at defense. But he can hold his own.

I absolutely love this video take, including the human sound affects (boosh…boosh). I forgot how agile Kat is on his feet guarding pick and rolls. Looks like we have him at the perfect time in his career at 28 yrs old. Seems like his defensive issues was not ability but effort. And in this series under the bright lights of the playoffs against the champs while guarding an MVP caliber player, (on an island) Kat stepped up. Now image what he looks like under a defensive genius name Thibs. I’m not worried. Health is my ONLY concern at this point.

This guy is schizophrenic. Showers people with praise and the treats them like the anti-christ later. That said, these clips only confirm what I've stated. KAT is probably better defensively at the 4. He doesn't do drop coverage well and he doesn't really protect the rim well anymore. The Gobert thing doesn't really pass the smell test. In theory, Gobert would have allowed KAT more weak side block opportunities. He couldn't even get a block per game.

How stubborn can you be? Its apparent that you dislike Towns and refuse to see anything positive about him. In the video he IS guarding Nikola Jokić who if I am correct plays center. He is playing GREAT defense against him. How many Minnesota games have you actually watched???

Uptown wrote:FYI, for those tht claim that KAT is not very good at the 5, just know that he was a 2x All star and 2x ALL NBA while playing the center position.

Not very good at the 5 Defensively, especially in Thibs schemes. No one argued talent for scoring. For all intents and purposes, he guards 4s better than 5s. And the numbers show he's really bad at guarding 5s.

BigDaddyG wrote:No, but I'm suggesting Jokic is a better player. A way better player. Imma go out of my way and say the words "KAT for MVP have never been uttered. This is like saying DDV is close to Devin Booker because he's a better three point shooter. Jokic functions at such a high level on offense that it more than makes up for his defense. KAT isn't at that level.

Jumping in on this thread.
Jokic has been the best in the game for the past 4 years. Only a handful of players are even in that argument, and Towns isn't one of them. And that's okay.

With the versatile talent on our team, I don't expect anyone to put up MVP numbers. Everyone on our roster is already getting paid. We're just asking players to do their part, move the ball and get the high % shot. He'll have some big games from time to time, but I don't think it'll be the norm. We're looking at Towns to do his part. And if we run into injuries at other positions, we'll ask him to do a little more.

Call the Knicks top heavy, lacking the depth we used to have. Injury prone. And not a lock to reach the ECF.

The consensus was Minny made out a little better in the trade.

Bontemps calling it a gigantic bet on Towns.

I was hoping they were going to change my mind.

ToddTT wrote:Hoop Collective podcast not overly impressed with the trade, and the final results for all the assets we had stockpiled in recent years.

Call the Knicks top heavy, lacking the depth we used to have. Injury prone. And not a lock to reach the ECF.

The consensus was Minny made out a little better in the trade.

Bontemps calling it a gigantic bet on Towns.

I was hoping they were going to change my mind.

That's a weird take from them. How are the knicks top heavy but not the celtics? We probably have a better bench than them.
I'm on the fence on this trade but i don't understand why they're saying this.

https://knicksfilmschool.substack.com/p/...

A New Era

Even after a full weekend, we’re still wrapping our heads around it.

There are so many pieces to this trade that I want to dive deeper into (see: my list of a dozen questions from Saturday morning) that I know I won’t be able to get to it all in one day. As a result, expect a lot of KAT talk for the next several weeks.

For today though, I’ve spotlighted eight of the most interesting aspects of the deal and tried to peel back a few layers.
1. Donte’s Value

To get us started, we have a question from America’s favorite television critic, Alan Sepinwall:

Once trading Donte DiVincenzo became an option, is there a Donte-for-center trade you would have preferred to this deal, where we would have gotten a Mitch upgrade in the starting five while also keeping Julius? Utah’s Walker Kessler perhaps?

The reporting strongly suggests that New York’s braintrust had specifically targeted Towns for some time, and that DiVincenzo was the price of admission. Once Minnesota agreed to the deal, I doubt they had any inclination to go back to the drawing board and consider other Donte-centric trades that didn’t return their ultimate prize.

To answer Alan’s question, I don’t think they should have, for a few reasons.

As frequent readers know, player valuation is my favorite NBA concept to contemplate, mostly because it’s almost entirely theoretical and no one really knows anything for sure. That uncertainty goes doubly so for role players.
In a vacuum, Donte might be the best value contract in the league, which is an argument I made late last season. In theory, no one wouldn’t want a 27-year-old sharpshooter who recently evoked comps to prime Klay Thompson and aptly defends his position.

But “wanting” is different than “coveting,” and the Minnesota Timberwolves certainly slot into the latter category. As a team clearly unwilling to go into the second apron (see: this trade), the value of a major rotation piece making less than $12 million for the next three seasons is immense. They are also a contender, so win-now talent was of the essence in any KAT trade. Finally, they have as much of a need for DiVincenzo as any contending team in the league.

Compare that to a team like Utah: nowhere close to winning (and maybe even a preference for losing), no tax or apron concerns, and a strong desire to foster and grow their young talent.

Obviously a guy like Ainge is always up for flipping an asset for better value down the road, but is DiVincenzo the sort of player who would generate a Godfather-level return? My personal dividing line for this sort of question is whether a player warrants a future unprotected (or very lightly protected) pick or swap. We can consider Derrick White as the baseline here, after he netted the Spurs a distant top-one protected pick swap from Boston a few years ago.

White is a nominal point guard who just made All-Defense. Folks smarter than me seem to regard him as a top 50 player in the league. DiVincenzo isn’t quite at that level, mostly because he’s a somewhat slight 6'4", isn’t a point guard, and doesn’t offer much on-ball creation. He’s an exceptional role player, but there’s a good chance that if the Knicks were fully healthy, DiVincenzo would have seen around 20-25 minutes a game, and even less in a high level playoff series.

For that reason, I’m not sure the Knicks missed out on any great opportunity here. Even if someone like Kessler was on the table, I would rather have KAT. That may seem controversial, so to explain why, let’s get to the next topic…

2. All In On Offense

In 2004, the Detroit Pistons (a team I wrote about earlier this summer as a possible Knicks comp) won the NBA championship with the 19th ranked offense in the league thanks in large part to one of the greatest defenses in NBA history. That title coincided with the nadir of league-wide offense, which had been gradually trending down for two decades.

Since then, things have been steadily going in the other direction. Over the last dozen years, the eventual NBA champion has had a top-five offense 10 times, and top-three six times. The two exceptions were teams that employed LeBron James (‘20 Lakers) and Steph Curry (‘22 Warriors), two of the most devastating offensive forces in league history.

This isn’t to say defense no longer matters. Seven of those 12 teams had a top-five defense, including five in the top-three. But we’ve also seen teams with the 9th, 10th, 11th, and most recently with Denver, the 15th best defense win it all.

Before his recent untimely departure from ESPN, Zach Lowe was fond of talking about how the pendulum was starting to swing more towards a dominant offense being a greater indicator of a title than a top defense. The Nuggets really laid the blueprint here, riding elite scoring (118.2 postseason offensive rating, highest in recorded history) and a just-good-enough defense to the 2023 title. Last season, Dallas didn’t win it all, but they made the Finals with the 18th ranked regular season defense.

Again, it should be noted that Boston’s second ranked defense maintained its stinginess through 16 postseason wins, but they also depended on their top-ranked offense to carry them to several victories as well.

In making this trade, the Knicks clearly believe that the recent trend isn’t reversing, and in Towns, they’ve increased their offensive potential from “really, really good” to “five alarm fire.”

But did they need to do it now, before ever seeing this team take the court?

Why yes, in fact, they did.

3. What’s the Rush?

From now until the start of the regular season, NBA teams are allowed to carry 21 players on their roster. The Hornets, conveniently enough, only have 19 players at the moment.

In making this trade before the season starts, the Knicks were able to make the math work without needing to further upend the core of their team. They can ship off three players via sign & trade, and Charlotte (after they cut one of their three Exhibit 10 guys, presumably) can inherit those contracts, promptly waive anyone they don’t want, and everyone moves on.

Once the regular season begins though, rosters are limited to 15 players. Not only would the Knicks have been unable to sign players to immediately trade away, but no team would have had the roster space to inherit such flotsam.

That means an in-season trade would have been considerably more complicated. For one, the Wolves would have filled in the rest of their roster and would have needed to waive multiple players to accommodate a 3-for-1 swap¹.

After that, there would still be another gap of over $6 million to make up. Every player on New York’s roster earning enough to make up that difference is a key rotation piece. They could have packaged Precious and a minimum, but again, there’s a roster spot issue that likely would have required them finding a third team with a) the ability to open up roster space and b) an exception into which they could inherit the additional money.

With all the hoops Brock Aller already had to jump through to get this deal done, waiting until the middle of the season would have made what was already hard downright impossible.

4. Small Ball: Grounded Before It Ever Took Off?

Part of the problem with analyzing the various angles of this trade is that none of them exist in a vacuum.

For instance, saying that New York didn’t have confidence in the long term viability of small-ball - something that was, almost without question, the only way the Knicks were ever going to get all of their most talented players on the floor at the same time - is too simplistic. Randle’s contract situation factors in massively in the decision to shift course, as do a handful of other factors.

In the end though, there had to exist at least some doubt that this roster was capable of winning four playoff rounds with a Randle/OG front court playing prominent minutes.

But why stop there. What if they looked at the potential of that unit, with its benefits and drawbacks, and asked themselves “why stop there?”

Randle can do things with the ball that KAT can’t. He’s a superior playmaker and a back-to-the-basket nightmare in a way KAT isn’t. Even with those positives, the offensive ceiling should still be raised significantly after this deal.

That’s true if Towns plays the four, but it’s especially true if he plays the five, which is where we get back to the small-ball comp. Randle and Towns are very different defenders with similar weaknesses (both stink in drop) and different strengths (Julius can be good in switches; KAT has gotten great at hedging and recovering). All things considered, Towns’ size alone gives you more defensive versatility as the nominal five than Randle ever could (see: his defense on Jokic in the playoffs last season).

In this sense, I wonder if the front office didn’t view this trade as having their cake and eating it too: all the benefits of small ball with a much bigger body to play around with on defense. That’s why Towns has always been so alluring, and what many have forgotten with him playing out of position the last two years. This trade should represent a return to form.

Even so, it came with a significant cost, which brings us to…

5. Depth re-Charge?

One big issue people seem to have with this trade is that New York went from one of the deepest teams in the league to one that is suddenly a little shallow.

Assuming Thibs doesn’t surprise us all by starting Precious Achiuwa (never say never; the man has a thing for size), New York will have very questionable guard/wing depth beyond whomever of Deuce or Hart doesn’t start. So just how big of a deal is this?

As always, it depends - in this case, primarily on injuries. The best part of the pre-KAT roster was that New York had the ability to easily withstand one or even two missing players that don’t play center and who aren’t named Jalen Brunson. Now that isn’t the case. Or is it?

We know Precious Achiuwa is a strong depth piece capable of filling in minutes at the four or the five. Cameron Payne isn’t the sexiest name, but he’s appeared in 58 playoff games, most of which came as part of a rotation for a good team, and he was at least serviceable for Philly against New York last season, hitting 8-of-18 from long range across six games. Tyler Kolek is probably the biggest unknown, and it’s hard to see a world where both he and Payne play #meaningful minutes, but his emergence as a rotation cog isn’t out of the question. Mook is more of a 4/5 at this point in his career, Shamut seems boxed out by superior guards, and rookie Pacome Dadiet is still in his embryonic stage as an NBA player, but all carry the potential to step in and help here and there.

It all adds up the need, ideally, for one more wing - partially as a safeguard against injury, and partially as a necessity against the bigger teams they could come across in the playoffs. The only feasible way to acquire such a player at this point would be to send out Mitchell Robinson, which begs an immediate question: what is the best use of limited resources? If Towns is primarily a five, how much more expendable does that make Mitch?

There is one other benefit to moving Mitch and bringing in a lower salaried player. As it stands, after this trade the Knicks will be closer to the second apron than Linus is to his blanket. They still have access to the $5.2 million taxpayer midlevel, which could be used to sign a buyout guy who made less than $12.9 million, but they’re functionally barred from using the TP-MLE because it would take them over the apron. Opening up more salary space would alleviate this issue.

On the flip side, KAT hasn’t exactly been an iron man, and moving Mitch would leave the Knicks incredibly thin at center. They could still go small even without Randle and use OG at the five (along with Precious and Sims), but this is just another part of the cost benefit analysis that needs to be considered.

There is a subtle irony to all of this. One of the thoughts behind moving Randle was that the Knicks had a few too many starting caliber players. The cost of moving him, naturally, was one of those starters in waiting.

Speaking of Julius….

6. The Randle of it All

I wonder what this trade will do to Julius Randle’s earning potential next summer. In short, I’m not sure he’s better off now than he would have been with whatever the Knicks were offering.

Brian Windhorst wrote a 1500-word article on this trade over the weekend, and more than half of those words related to how it was motivated by Minnesota’s financial issues. Keeping Towns would have made it impossible to retain key impending free agents Naz Reid and Nickeil Alexander-Walker while staying under the second apron.

What does that mean for Randle? Not only would signing him to the sort of extension he’s likely seeking defeat the purpose of this deal, but Julius opting in to his $30 million player option next summer could have them looking for someplace to unload his salary.

Of course there’s a chance that all this gets turned on its head and Randle helps lead the Wolves to their first Finals in franchise history, but it’s just as likely he’s watching from the bench during crunch time, stuck behind the sweeter shooting (and arguably better defending) Reid, not to mention the other Knick involved in this trade, Donte DiVincenzo. I wouldn’t even bet on him finishing the season in Minny².

This is clearly a situation New York wanted no part of, leading to a decision we probably should have seen coming.

If you remember way back in the beginning of the summer, I wrote about why the Knicks would want the Randle situation resolved one way or another, and that they would either trade him or agree to an extension before the season began. The ultimate conclusion I reached - that they wouldn’t find a workable trade and would offer Julius a $181.5 million extension - couldn’t have been more wrong. It’s apparent now that they never saw Randle as a player worth going into the second apron for.

After the August 3rd extension window opened and not so much as a stiff breeze came through it, I figured I was off base on my initial prediction as well, and that New York was comfortable enough with the uncomfortable Randle contract situation to let it play out.

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Clearly, they weren’t, which led us to…

7. The Most Interesting NBA Trade Ever?

Hyperbole? Perhaps.

But ask yourself: how many times in the 78-year history of the NBA have we seen:

A trade between two contending teams³

Involving two former multi-time All-NBA players

Both of whom are 30 or under

And who have generated as much controversy and consternation as Towns and Randle, respectively?

That last part is what makes this stand out for me. Rarely do players make it to their third NBA contract and still have people asking questions like “can this guy be the second banana on a title team?” or “what is his best position?” or “should anyone want him on his current/next contract?”

And yet these questions are routinely asked about both of the big men involved in this deal. Maybe the two negatives cancel each other out and we’re left with a simple swap of imperfect players, but I think it goes deeper than that, at least where Towns is concerned. More on that in a bit. First, finding a trade comp…

We did have the Kawhi-to-Toronto move in 2018, but Leonard was coming off an injury, but we knew exactly what he and DeMar DeRozen were in 2018. Russ for CP3 and Russ for Wall were glorified salary dumps. There was the Simmons/Harden swap, but even if the bloom wasn’t completely off Ben Simmons’ rose yet, there was zero question Philly was getting much better. Speaking of Philly, former Sixer MVP Allen Iverson was sent from Denver to Detroit for Chauncey Billups in 2008. That comes close to this one, but those teams were heading in opposite directions.

I thought about a trade involving two future former Knicks from 20 years ago. Steve Francis was a three-time All-Star when Houston swapped him for T-Mac, and was considered roughly the same level of player that Randle is now. McGrady was a brighter star than KAT, but there were still questions about how much his game translated to winning. The big difference is that Orlando was atrocious at the time, so the stakes were far lower for one of the parties.

Ray Allen for Gary Payton? Jason Kidd for Stephon Marbury? Dominique Wilkins for Danny Manning? None are perfect comps. This might be one of one.

Which brings us to…

8. Two roads diverged in a yellow wood

Nine years ago, Karl-Anthony Towns was drafted into the NBA with quite a bit of fanfare. While not on the level his fellow Wildcat Anthony Davis a few years earlier, there was enough excitement for 62.1 percent of NBA general managers to predict he’d be the best player from his class five years after that draft.

For the next two years - following Towns’ rookie season and sophomore campaign - those same GM’s named KAT as the player they’d most want to build a team around.

Not among his draft mates from the class of 2015. Among every player in the league.

Getting the nod over former and future MVP’s and several of the greatest players ever, Towns was viewed as the next great big man who would dominate the sport.

In the seven years since that second poll, KAT has been anything but a bust. He’s made the All-Star team more than half the time, has been named to a few All-NBA teams, and is one of five players who has averaged at least 23 points on at least a 58 effective field goal percentage, the others being Nikola Jokic, Giannis Antetokounmpo, Kevin Durant and Steph Curry. He is the youngest member of that group.

At the same time, he has been a part of just two playoff series victories, neither of which featured him as the best player. He has also played in an average of just 50 games over the last five seasons, and is slated to be one of the 10 highest paid NBA players for the next four years⁴. He has never received an MVP vote.

Nearing his 29th birthday, it’s not unfair to say that Karl-Anthony Towns is at a crossroads.

If his time in New York goes poorly, he will be remembered as one of the great wasted talents in league history, and in all likelihood, a cautionary tale for any team wondering whether to max out a non-superstar. His prodigious numbers will look like nothing more than empty calories.

The other road? The other road is much more fun.

If Towns can make another All-Star team or two and be one of the top players on the team that ends New York’s title drought, there’s a good chance he’ll eventually be enshrined in Springfield. It’s not a perfect comp, but it’s been a little more than 50 years since the Knicks acquired another former Rookie of the Year who had a checkered reputation. All Jerry Lucas did when he came here was average 20, 10 & 6 in the 1972 Finals before helping the Knicks win their second world championship the following year. His closing act in the Big Apple was the push he needed to be named one of the NBA’s 75 greatest players ever.

Ending up on the league’s top 100 list in 21 years is probably unrealistic for Towns, but New York doesn’t need him to be that level of player for this trade to be a resounding success. All KAT needs to do it be the best version of himself, and that’ll be more than enough.

Whether he can do that will likely be the difference between ending the Knicks’ 51-year (and counting) championship drought or not.

No pressure or anything.