Knicks · [Game Thread 10/22] Knicks @ Celtics 7:30PM TNT (page 12)

Just 1 game out of 1st place in the East!

Dear lord the over-reactions on this thread --- holy mackerel!!!

One game - Celtics shoot like Priest from Caddy Shack on opening night ring ceremony night.

Some thoughts....

- not convinced with Josh in the starting unit (indecisive and often in the way) --- I feel like he should be spark plug on this squad
- Deuce looks great (proud of him)
- I thought Towns was fine --- ON BOTH ENDS
- Thibs is always going to lean into protect paint and live/die with three balls (tonight we were slaughtered and left for dead)
- good to see Mikal hit some jump shots and 2 threes in 2nd half
- would be nice if Jalen created a bit more for others but hard to ever knock him
- actually thought Sims looked ok, same for Payne and Daddies

This is a very good team if we stay healthy - going to take some time to jell

If we want to match up with Celtics it's hard to match their 5 shooters with our 4 --- it's possible Deuce could negate that advantage and give us a legit 5 out starting line-up. Yes we'd be weaker on the boards and at rim protection but it does allow you to lean into the floor spreading concept.

LivingLegend wrote:If we want to match up with Celtics it's hard to match their 5 shooters with our 4 --- it's possible Deuce could negate that advantage and give us a legit 5 out starting line-up. Yes we'd be weaker on the boards and at rim protection but it does allow you to lean into the floor spreading concept.

Against 5 - out offense we would not be at a disadvantage when it comes to boards. Not as much as against other offenses

What we witnessed was so dirty, even after bathing and scrubbing for hours I just couldn't feel clean

LivingLegend wrote:Dear lord the over-reactions on this thread --- holy mackerel!!!

One game - Celtics shoot like Priest from Caddy Shack on opening night ring ceremony night.

Some thoughts....

- not convinced with Josh in the starting unit (indecisive and often in the way) --- I feel like he should be spark plug on this squad
- Deuce looks great (proud of him)
- I thought Towns was fine --- ON BOTH ENDS
- Thibs is always going to lean into protect paint and live/die with three balls (tonight we were slaughtered and left for dead)
- good to see Mikal hit some jump shots and 2 threes in 2nd half
- would be nice if Jalen created a bit more for others but hard to ever knock him
- actually thought Sims looked ok, same for Payne and Daddies

This is a very good team if we stay healthy - going to take some time to jell

All good points. Only quibble is Sims. I agree he attempted to get more involved but there were a couple of WTF moments. Prefer Big Mermaid

One thing (among many) that Celts did well last night is they used 5 out as a vehicle for offensive boards. If you think about it, if you try to man up on 5 out, the offensive players have a strategic advantage. they are facing the rim seeing the shot and arguably the ball trajectory better. While the defender is closer to the rim there is more wide open space in 5 out than if people were packing the paint. thus unless the rebound is coming right at the defender it makes it more of a 50-50 proposition.

then you have the aspect that the offensive player is just moving forward while the defender needs to turn and pursue.

All of the above might be BS, but for sure it was maddening how many O boards they got considering they were all hanging out at the 3 point line

A healthy Mitch might be more important than ever with this new team makeup.

BigDaddyG wrote:

VDesai wrote:Baby Knicks showing up

They should've started the second quarter

Maybe should have been the 6 min mark of first!

Rookie wrote:We need Melo to teach Dadiet the jab step

Just 1 or 2 though, not the 10 count

cooch2584 wrote:Im gonna rant here a little. KAT you aint in minnie no more. You come to DA MECCA our fans will gut you inside out. First game mind you, but you were the tallest guy on the floor and your being guarded by a guy 7INCHES SMALLER THAN YOU! Bridges, you aint in the swamp no more, because we gave up our whole future for you and KAT, I swear our fans will ride your azzes every freaking nite to squeeze every last ounce of your energy for your NY KNICKS FANS. END OF RANT

Those 2 guys about to find out what it means to move from small market to prime time.

DLeethal wrote:This might be similar to Dallas last year who struggled to figure out a championship formula around Kyrie and Luka. Eventually it clicked but it was very rocky for awhile. They also needed to make a couple small moves around the margins. We might have to do that too. Or just get Mitch/Precious back and find an answer to backup wing which could be Dadiet.

Man, I forgot about Precious too. iHart, Mitch, Precious, Randle are not on the team any more or not last night. That's a lot of beef up front and KAT ain't that type of, well, cat.

The wing bro's gotta step up and Dadiet looks interesting now.

martin wrote:

Rookie wrote:We need Melo to teach Dadiet the jab step

Just 1 or 2 though, not the 10 count

Man, forgot how strong and quick Melo was when he was young.

Dadiet has the same lightening quick release, just not the athleticism, strength, and explosiveness. But Dadiet does have a better team feel for the game IMHO. We shall see how it plays out for him.

Rookie wrote:

martin wrote:

Rookie wrote:We need Melo to teach Dadiet the jab step

Just 1 or 2 though, not the 10 count

this is what happens when Thibs goes resting starters for preseason games. SOFT

Chandler wrote:One thing (among many) that Celts did well last night is they used 5 out as a vehicle for offensive boards. If you think about it, if you try to man up on 5 out, the offensive players have a strategic advantage. they are facing the rim seeing the shot and arguably the ball trajectory better. While the defender is closer to the rim there is more wide open space in 5 out than if people were packing the paint. thus unless the rebound is coming right at the defender it makes it more of a 50-50 proposition.

then you have the aspect that the offensive player is just moving forward while the defender needs to turn and pursue.

All of the above might be BS, but for sure it was maddening how many O boards they got considering they were all hanging out at the 3 point line

They did seem to get a # of key (long) rebounds on the few 3's they missed.

It is more difficult when spread and a step or 2 further from the basket because you are boxing out in more space and like you said sometimes the offense can see the shot trajectory better BUT I think we could do the same thing and this was just an horrific night where Boston (particularly Tatum) rarely touched the rim.

I've seen Boston go crazy like this before and have also seen them clanking the same 3's. It's tough you set your D to minimize penetration - you contest the 3 the best you can and they were just hitting a very high %.

Biggest thing that also showed in pre-season was just guys too open off simple screen action - I know Kat had some moments but entire team was off. Good thing is Thibs almost always tightens the D up over time.

Clean wrote:A healthy Mitch might be more important than ever with this new team makeup.

I don't see it with Mitch --- the last thing we need is Mitch trying to keep up with Boston on the perimeter (he'll be limping before he hits the scorers table) and don't get me started on how poor Mitch is offensively.

I wouldn't be surprised if Mitch never plays another minute for Knicks - could be way off but I think the Towns along with Mitch always being unavailable sealed his fate. We already know Knicks were offering him up in multiple deals all summer. The minute they get a solid offer he's gone....IMO.

Chandler wrote:One thing (among many) that Celts did well last night is they used 5 out as a vehicle for offensive boards. If you think about it, if you try to man up on 5 out, the offensive players have a strategic advantage. they are facing the rim seeing the shot and arguably the ball trajectory better. While the defender is closer to the rim there is more wide open space in 5 out than if people were packing the paint. thus unless the rebound is coming right at the defender it makes it more of a 50-50 proposition.

then you have the aspect that the offensive player is just moving forward while the defender needs to turn and pursue.

All of the above might be BS, but for sure it was maddening how many O boards they got considering they were all hanging out at the 3 point line

Yep. And if no one boxes out it doesn't help either

LivingLegend wrote:

Clean wrote:A healthy Mitch might be more important than ever with this new team makeup.

I don't see it with Mitch --- the last thing we need is Mitch trying to keep up with Boston on the perimeter (he'll be limping before he hits the scorers table) and don't get me started on how poor Mitch is offensively.

I wouldn't be surprised if Mitch never plays another minute for Knicks - could be way off but I think the Towns along with Mitch always being unavailable sealed his fate. We already know Knicks were offering him up in multiple deals all summer. The minute they get a solid offer he's gone....IMO.

You are totally looking at it wrong. Mitch is here to clean up all of the misses from Mikal and turn them into Orebounds and easy buckets!

LivingLegend wrote:Dear lord the over-reactions on this thread --- holy mackerel!!!

One game - Celtics shoot like Priest from Caddy Shack on opening night ring ceremony night.

Some thoughts....

- not convinced with Josh in the starting unit (indecisive and often in the way) --- I feel like he should be spark plug on this squad
- Deuce looks great (proud of him)
- I thought Towns was fine --- ON BOTH ENDS
- Thibs is always going to lean into protect paint and live/die with three balls (tonight we were slaughtered and left for dead)
- good to see Mikal hit some jump shots and 2 threes in 2nd half
- would be nice if Jalen created a bit more for others but hard to ever knock him
- actually thought Sims looked ok, same for Payne and Daddies

This is a very good team if we stay healthy - going to take some time to jell

- I would like to see the starting line up a little longer before swapping Deuce for Hart. However, The Celts game plan was to pretty much ignore Hart on the offensive end and use Horford on him as a roamer and help defender. Whenever Kat backed down Jrue in the post, Horford came over to help. Hart needs to do a better job of cutting, but in the end, if more teams employ a similar strategy, We will be playing 4 on 5 most possessions. But, moving Deuce into the starting lineup, will weaken our bench. I can definitely see a move at the trade deadline to add another piece.

- Deuce looks really good, agreed.

- Towns was OK. Made some impressive passes which shows he's willing and has good vision.

- Thibs defensive philosophy is the protect the paint and play inside out. Didn't like that we started the game in drop coverage knowing that the Celts are a 5 out team but it was expected. He did switch it up some after the 1st quarter....

- Mikal's 3rd quarter was one of the few positives in the game. Hopefully, this carries over into the next game. For us to be as good as I think we can be, Mikal needs to be at the very least, a boarder-line allstar. He has the talent to do it

- The paint is gonna be wide open for Jalen to create, with the exception of the defender on Hart, floating and helping. When this happens, Hart needs to cut more and make himself available for Brunson when he is in the paint. Eventually, Brunson will start finding OG and Mikal in the corner. I believe Mikal was the best corner three shooter last year.

- Payne looked good. Pac is intriguing to me. For a 19 year old, he has been schooled very well on the fundamentals. He knows when to cut to the basket from the weakside, how to relocate for a 3 when the point guard is driving to the basket. And, his shot looks good. He has about 2 weeks to make an impression until Precious comes back.

Blowouts happen but let's be real, we are taking this one a little harder because it was the first game. Win or lose, the season opener is probably the least most important regular season game of the season. I don't think we take it too seriously if this loss happened in December or March. Playing in Boston, who let's face it is the best team in the conference, is hard.

It was just one of those games where a team cannot miss. Some of it was poor late defense but a lot of those threes were just elite shooting by them. Boston isn't going to hit 29 threes against us next time. Funny how they couldn't break the record in the final minutes. Could it be a blessing cause it's clear what we need to work on. And lucky for us we have one of the best and most experienced at it with Thibs. He'll maximize this defense by seasons end. We always start off slow at that end anyways.

Even though it was an ugly game, there was some things to like. Deuce is in midseason form and I'm so proud of him for working on his jumper. He's become one of our best shooters! Good to also see Mikal turn it up in the second half too. I don't buy into the changing his shot narrative. He's a vet and he'll be fine. Brunson was good offensively too. KAT had some moments but like Mikal, he needs to jell with this team and find his role. Hart is a slow starter so not worried about him. OG was bad but also not worried. We've seen enough from these guys to give them the benefit of doubt. Payne finished strong in garbage time. Dadiet, Hukporti and Kolek got that rookie jitters out of the way.

Chances are we'll be 4-3 when we return from that early season road trip. First ten games are going to be like an extension of training camp but I think we got the right coach and leader to have this team reach it's potential. Last night did nothing to change my mind.