The most recent reports implicatoing Wong to this becomes very compelling to the court of public opinion but like most things regarding professional leagues we draw conclusions and insist conspiracy to not disclose full details.
What fan base loves its commish?
Fans love the game and in a way an emotional ownership of it. We accuse the league and its its owners putting profits ahead of integrity when there is a conflict. We assume collusion of sorts when things happen that cannot be explained.
If our blood lust for justice is not quelled we assume the worst and feel "the little guy is not being heard". Its a natural reaction or an emotion. PHilC is a great example of this.
How am I over it? I view it as an entertainment company owned by an elite group who have privelidge. They carved out excemptions to labor laws by self regulation. Players have gained leverage and get paid very well for their talents. Fans may love the game but nobody forces us to buy tickets, pay subscription rights to watch games, or support the sponsers. We are thrilled by the product and feel the disappointments.
As for "ClipperGate" its playing out in a very public manner and this will force a more public result to provide satisfaction that "Our game" and its competitive balance is preserved. The reality is this is an issue for the owners to solve as the true owners of the venue. They will also not cut their noses to spite their face.
The allstar game is in LA in the new state of the art arena. I doubt we get any results from this recent disclosure before that. Silver will have to speak for the league and kick the can down the road. Some fans who might see this as him being weak. TO the contrary, he is the defacto talking piece of the league and his job is not to satisfy fans emotions but preserve the financial interests of the the league and not offend the paying customer. That is not going to be an easy task. The league will take some hit on this. It will be calculated but the big picture will be considered. A strong executive will take the body blows so if one thinks Silver is weak, its perhaps by design. Hate him but love your team. He gets paid very well for this. If you hate Silver its him being strong, not weak.
What is the bottom line? What is the true measure of a leaders work? Well who actually hires him? The oweners, not us.
Two things: Revenue growth and franshise valuations.
Some of you will be "disgusted" by not having satisfaction in a short time frame and want the percieved justice. The true cost of this might be Balmer paying off his ownership group some ungodly sum of money for his act of thievery and the court of public opinoin thrown a bone in some manner and we all move on. Maybe not everything is disclosed to the public to preserve the public faith? Lord knows things like this might have occured before without our knowledge. This one is not one of them.
Knicks win a chip, who cares? 
the argument I've heard as to why the NBA can't really do anything about this, is because every team's hands are dirty. You after one, then they'll go after everybody else. It's a house of cards. I love this sport but tim Donaghy kind of proved this league would rather sweep it under the rug
SupremeCommander wrote:the argument I've heard as to why the NBA can't really do anything about this, is because every team's hands are dirty. You after one, then they'll go after everybody else. It's a house of cards. I love this sport but tim Donaghy kind of proved this league would rather sweep it under the rug
But at the end of the day they had to deal with it and him, and do what they can to stop/prevent it.
I can assume by logic there are things we don't know that never saw the light of day.
In the history of the NBA we basically had but one deviant who was egregious enought to get caught.
Im not naive to think he was the only one. He was the poster child. Other sports had scandals of some sort.
Are they the only entitly to be rocked by it?
All business does this. All gov't do it. All religions do it. They have outliers.
So why are we shocked by any of it?
NBA has eliminated owners when it became detrimental to the buisness. Whle it should never should have gone that far but it did. Times changed also changed the public perceptions tolerance levels set the morality. When breached, its bad for business.
Every league commish gets booed at their draft. They are paid to take the shots of an imperfect system.
But Silver did some things few if any had before done and drew a line. Im not here to say he is going to make good and clean it all that is wrong with everything, but if its a gross example and oozes with bad publcity a dollar figure will be assigned and some form of equitable settlement will occur. Mabye Wong gets thrown under the bus, or Lawrence Frank, or all the above in some manner.
SupremeCommander wrote:the argument I've heard as to why the NBA can't really do anything about this, is because every team's hands are dirty. You after one, then they'll go after everybody else. It's a house of cards. I love this sport but tim Donaghy kind of proved this league would rather sweep it under the rug
Chewbacca defense again. If a majority of nba teams would like to pay the players more, why is there a salary cap at all? why have harsh penalties for the 2nd apron beyond a tax? Its safe to assume that a majority of teams want a strictly enforced cap abd max salary structure because they fought for it to be in the cba. The players union sure as hell wasnt arguing for salary restrictions.
Donaghy was kind of a unique situation because the nba was negotiating a new tv deal at the time and it was threatening the integrity of the league. This case are the actions of a rogue player and owner. The fact that in the past week both the Raptors and Lakers have come forward saying thst Kawhi was also pushing for similar arrangements with them shows that at least 2 teams feel this id unfair.
@nalod
Spot on about the All Star game. I think thats a huge factor now because the nbs doesnt want to change the venue. I think a better plan would be a swift resolution and go forward with the game as is. The recent reporting on Wong makes things a lot easier. NBA can penalize Wong and Kawhi and the Clippers without having to dirrctly call Balmer a liar and a cheat. Penalties can be applied, Wong removed as owner, big fines, Kawhi contract voided, and loss of draft picks, but without directly implicating Steve, the All Star game goes on.
SupremeCommander wrote:the argument I've heard as to why the NBA can't really do anything about this, is because every team's hands are dirty. You after one, then they'll go after everybody else. It's a house of cards. I love this sport but tim Donaghy kind of proved this league would rather sweep it under the rug
Then why have a salary cap. Let’s just let the lakers and clippers sign anyone they want and force teams to trade them great players because the draft lottery is rigged. Oh wait.
WIngstop would get even more wingy, or stoppy.
Dolan could throw in some Sphere tickets to Kawhi. Or more
Not happening Silver doesn’t have the balls. Plus Ballmer would sue in federal court and probably win
NBA is just waiting this out hoping people’s attention drifts away and they forget about it
Philc1 wrote:SupremeCommander wrote:the argument I've heard as to why the NBA can't really do anything about this, is because every team's hands are dirty. You after one, then they'll go after everybody else. It's a house of cards. I love this sport but tim Donaghy kind of proved this league would rather sweep it under the rug
Then why have a salary cap. Let’s just let the lakers and clippers sign anyone they want and force teams to trade them great players because the draft lottery is rigged. Oh wait.
I'm not arguing for or against anything. I am just saying why this will 'go away' just like everything else has
Silver also clarified his prior comments in which he said he’d never heard of the company Aspiration before. Silver's comment followed a post from Pablo Torre where he indicated he obtained a copy of Aspiration’s $300 million “Founding Sponsorship Agreement” that said the agreement must be approved by the NBA before its enforcement.“If I said I never heard of it, I meant in the context of the accusations here. I mean, I certainly was aware of the brand,” Silver said.
This is definitely not what Silver said in the presser. There is no disambiguation in the phrase "Frankly, I had never heard of the company until the recent reporting on a podcast." I thought it was fishy at the time for the same reason as I said in a previous post. Again, I'm not really sure why Silver would lie or offer this extremely disenguous explanation. Why not just say this in the beginning? Why not just say he forgot or was unawre in his explanation? Now he looks very suspicious because it looks like he was covering. If I'm the Raptors owner, I am livid.
Philc1 wrote:Not happening Silver doesn’t have the balls. Plus Ballmer would sue in federal court and probably winNBA is just waiting this out hoping people’s attention drifts away and they forget about it
Rather than another beratement from Nalod I'll let the AI machine do it for me. (see below)
Professional sports franchises generally do not sue each other because they are part of a closed-loop business relationship, and league rules mandate internal conflict resolution. Lawsuits could harm the entire league, which would hurt each franchise's profitability and public image. Disputes between teams are typically addressed through league arbitration or other internal processes to avoid the financial and reputational costs of public litigation. Here is a more detailed breakdown of why franchises do not sue each other:
League control and internal processes
Professional sports leagues operate as private associations, and member franchises agree to be bound by the league's rules and constitution.
Arbitration and mediation: Leagues have established internal mechanisms, such as mandatory arbitration, to resolve disputes between teams. This process is generally faster and less expensive than a civil lawsuit.
Collective bargaining agreements (CBAs): In many major sports leagues, CBAs between team owners and player unions dictate how disputes are handled. These agreements establish a clear framework for conflict resolution, further limiting the need for litigation.
League commissioner: In most leagues, the commissioner has broad authority to discipline teams, settle disputes, and intervene in conflicts. Teams agree to this authority as a condition of their membership.
Shared financial interests
Although teams compete against each other, they also have a shared financial interest in the overall success of the league.
Revenue sharing: Teams share a significant portion of league-wide revenue from television deals, sponsorships, and licensing. A lawsuit that damages the league's financial standing could negatively affect every team's profits.
Competitive balance: Lawsuits could disrupt the league's competitive balance, harming the on-field product and potentially alienating fans. All teams have an interest in maintaining a stable and exciting competition to ensure continued fan interest.
Antitrust concerns
Sports leagues are often viewed as "natural monopolies," and courts have traditionally given them leeway to create rules that promote competitive balance.
Single entity vs. competitors: In the eyes of the law, leagues exist in a grey area between being a "single economic entity" and a collection of competing businesses. Public litigation could bring greater antitrust scrutiny to league rules, potentially challenging long-standing practices like revenue sharing or drafts.
Damage to public image
Public lawsuits can be messy and generate negative media attention, which can harm the league's brand and diminish fan loyalty.
Brand protection: Maintaining the integrity and public image of the sport is paramount for all franchises. The league's internal systems are designed to resolve problems discreetly, protecting the public image of the sport and its teams.
When lawsuits do happen
While rare, lawsuits between sports entities do occur, though they are often a last resort. For example, the Oakland Raiders successfully sued the NFL in the 1980s for the right to move to Los Angeles. More recently, college conferences and schools have engaged in legal battles over media rights and realignment. These cases are typically high-stakes and involve issues fundamental to the league's structure.
While not a perfect depiction its what many of us know to be accurate. PhilC: You might want to absorb some of this and perhaps why collective bargaining agreements exist between these owners and employees (players). Many posters in the UK refer to these facts as basis of discussion over raw emotions. Not just "Silver sucks, Doris sucks, and Elfred Payton" retorts.
Silver has no balls? This dude cracked the code and NBA is moving to perhaps a 15-17 team league based in Europe. Soon a real "world champion" will have true meaning!
SupremeCommander wrote:Philc1 wrote:SupremeCommander wrote:the argument I've heard as to why the NBA can't really do anything about this, is because every team's hands are dirty. You after one, then they'll go after everybody else. It's a house of cards. I love this sport but tim Donaghy kind of proved this league would rather sweep it under the rug
Then why have a salary cap. Let’s just let the lakers and clippers sign anyone they want and force teams to trade them great players because the draft lottery is rigged. Oh wait.
I'm not arguing for or against anything. I am just saying why this will 'go away' just like everything else has
Your likly not wrong as its "not good for business". They will likely settle it behind closed doors and do damage control so most fans maintain some integrity of the game. Would the Raptors be pissed? Maybe but if all things were monetarily equal would Kawhi have stayed in Toronto or go to LA were he long wanted to be? Did the side deals actually sway him? Did the raptors try themselves to match it in an underhanded way? End of the day not like the clippers have been a perennial finals team with him? This kid has had a bad knee and sits out over the last 5 years. Is it right he got the money? Of course not. Should fans be upset? To some degree yes, but not like its our financial interests at stake. To be honest, our pursuit of Brunson was awesome but not like knicks were without some cause of suspicion given the circumstances. Make no bones about it, it was not nearly as egregious as what clippers are being accused of!
Has a sports journalist ever received the Pulitzer prize?
New Pablo Torre YouTube connects the dots even more.
When Mark Cuban went on he said he didn't believe it because if an.under the table deal existed for the Clippers to pay Kawhi via Aspiration, Balmer would have just kept it quiet by funneling Aspiration even more cash. Today Pablo shows documents showing this exact case. Almost 120 million in investments and bogus deals went from Balmer or the LAC, all around the time when Kawhis money was due.
This story keeps growing new legs.
Nalod wrote:Philc1 wrote:Not happening Silver doesn’t have the balls. Plus Ballmer would sue in federal court and probably winNBA is just waiting this out hoping people’s attention drifts away and they forget about it
Rather than another beratement from Nalod I'll let the AI machine do it for me. (see below)
Professional sports franchises generally do not sue each other because they are part of a closed-loop business relationship, and league rules mandate internal conflict resolution. Lawsuits could harm the entire league, which would hurt each franchise's profitability and public image. Disputes between teams are typically addressed through league arbitration or other internal processes to avoid the financial and reputational costs of public litigation. Here is a more detailed breakdown of why franchises do not sue each other:
League control and internal processes
Professional sports leagues operate as private associations, and member franchises agree to be bound by the league's rules and constitution.
Arbitration and mediation: Leagues have established internal mechanisms, such as mandatory arbitration, to resolve disputes between teams. This process is generally faster and less expensive than a civil lawsuit.
Collective bargaining agreements (CBAs): In many major sports leagues, CBAs between team owners and player unions dictate how disputes are handled. These agreements establish a clear framework for conflict resolution, further limiting the need for litigation.
League commissioner: In most leagues, the commissioner has broad authority to discipline teams, settle disputes, and intervene in conflicts. Teams agree to this authority as a condition of their membership.
Shared financial interests
Although teams compete against each other, they also have a shared financial interest in the overall success of the league.
Revenue sharing: Teams share a significant portion of league-wide revenue from television deals, sponsorships, and licensing. A lawsuit that damages the league's financial standing could negatively affect every team's profits.
Competitive balance: Lawsuits could disrupt the league's competitive balance, harming the on-field product and potentially alienating fans. All teams have an interest in maintaining a stable and exciting competition to ensure continued fan interest.
Antitrust concerns
Sports leagues are often viewed as "natural monopolies," and courts have traditionally given them leeway to create rules that promote competitive balance.
Single entity vs. competitors: In the eyes of the law, leagues exist in a grey area between being a "single economic entity" and a collection of competing businesses. Public litigation could bring greater antitrust scrutiny to league rules, potentially challenging long-standing practices like revenue sharing or drafts.
Damage to public image
Public lawsuits can be messy and generate negative media attention, which can harm the league's brand and diminish fan loyalty.
Brand protection: Maintaining the integrity and public image of the sport is paramount for all franchises. The league's internal systems are designed to resolve problems discreetly, protecting the public image of the sport and its teams.
When lawsuits do happen
While rare, lawsuits between sports entities do occur, though they are often a last resort. For example, the Oakland Raiders successfully sued the NFL in the 1980s for the right to move to Los Angeles. More recently, college conferences and schools have engaged in legal battles over media rights and realignment. These cases are typically high-stakes and involve issues fundamental to the league's structure.
While not a perfect depiction its what many of us know to be accurate. PhilC: You might want to absorb some of this and perhaps why collective bargaining agreements exist between these owners and employees (players). Many posters in the UK refer to these facts as basis of discussion over raw emotions. Not just "Silver sucks, Doris sucks, and Elfred Payton" retorts.
Silver has no balls? This dude cracked the code and NBA is moving to perhaps a 15-17 team league based in Europe. Soon a real "world champion" will have true meaning!
Martin needs to integrate with AI.
Actually typing replies is barbaric. At this point AI should be able to generate replies that are close enough.
Then all we would need is a a bot to generate new topics occasionally.
There is also another "AI"......."Artificial Ignorance"
I have not really followed the details of this saga but here are Marks words
Nalod gets hung up on "context"from time to time. I respect Cubans effots at least to put somethings into perspective rather than leave fans to "league/silver has not balls" and color them guilty. Almost seems as if Cuban is creating the narrative that league won't destroy Balmer down the road? I don't know. Torres stuff was pretty damning but there is more. No "Pulitzer Prize" quite yet. WE not in "Woodward and Bernstein" blasting open Watergate stuff yet. Cuban putting context of the deal and the market precovid and before FTX blew up. Digital currancy platforms were throwing around stupid money then.
Im taking it all in and for the most part its not a matter of faith in Silver to levy a death penalty, but just understanding it won't be in the leagues best interests to do so. At least publically. That he forced two owners to sell for "bad behavior" (not criminal) shows me the dude did have the stones to do what was right. In a less than over woke environment does he still do that in todays environment? Those guys got good valuation fro their teams and it was their behavior that caused the expulsion.
Back on point, Cuban is saying the coincidence of payments and timeing is not enough to "Convict" Balmer that Torres is relying on as his primary proof. Is Cuban right? I don't know. That Cuban states he wants Clippers to get tagged for it is interesting so Cuban is kind of doing this for the intellectual arguement and relevance? For the benefit of the league? His own financial interests?
He has not said anything of late abot losing Brunson or making any additional accusations about it.
Torres no doubt did a good job with this and put out some compelling info that the league need provide response to. That alone is an accomplishment. The outcome might be substantial. If not many will hate on the league regardless. Its what we do.
The CBA and self governence will ensure this stay out of the courts unless the public was damaged by this. I don't see that. Anyone gambling on the teams was not affected. ONly gets sticky if there was corp. fraud outside of the NBA interests. If so then its a different story.
