Knicks · The really short off season for knicks! How to run it back? (page 26)

BlueKnickers wrote:

Chandler wrote:

martin wrote:I think I’m in this bucket, kinda. I think it’s a little about the KAT contract too.

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Me too

Good theory, because it makes sense.

It is hard to imagine going into the draft without the FO being on the same page as Dolan. It goes against the competent image this FO has established for itself.

Pure guess: all things being equal, Dolan & FO are not really worried about this upcoming year and paying the tax but are for the one after where KAT and Hart’s next extensions kick in. They are perhaps worried about (for example) being $16m over the cap and paying $60+m in taxes (see the Denver numbers in link below) while also wondering if Mitch could even be playable 2 years from now, and if not, how they could both move off of that salary and get a replacement cause it would be $60m of deadweight with the second apron rules.

What is a reasonable contract for Mitch? Years and $ guaranteed? For a guy who didn’t play the first game of the season this year and no back to backs and did seem to somehow be exhausted during the finals with a fucking broken hand just before the finals that may not be really accidental cause why wouldn’t they just say that? Mitch maxed out at 60 games this year during regular season and it’ll be a minor miracle if he makes that mark again just playing the odds? What are those odds 2 years from now?

I think that’s the argument that makes the most sense?

https://www.salaryswish.com/luxury-tax/2...

Apologies if this was already brought up, but I’ve been thinking that the Knicks trade McBride and maybe a guy like dadiet for future considerations perhaps a couple of second round pics maybe even if you’re lucky a future first round pick that’s protected. This way you free up about 8 to 10,000,000 in salary give or take and add that to the 14 or 15 million in cap space the Knicks have, and perhaps they could bring back Mitch Robinson.

Per the AI Interwebs:

Yes, the Knicks can trade away Miles "Deuce" McBride and Pacôme Dadiet (assuming you mean Dadiet instead of Daddy Yankee) and take back no salary. Since an NBA team can trade players for nothing but draft picks or cash considerations, doing so allows them to open up valuable cap space.

Back to my thoughts, I’ve seen a lot of nyk fans and pundits convincing the world that Mitchell Robinson is all but out of here. I’m on the record, I think he’s coming back. KNicks just might have to sacrifice players like McBride and maybe someone else I’m forgetting about that makes just enough money.

Apologies if this was brought up already I didn’t have time to go through the whole thread.

PS I still fucking love you guys. I can’t believe we’re champs. So many demons set free. So much trauma has been lifted.

I did a little more digging, trading padiet and deuce would free up about 7 million. Kolek makes 2-3 million too fwiw.

I know Mitch has his weaknesses and flaws, but he gives you such an elite skill set that is difficult to replicate. I also understand that deuce McBride has an elite skill set as he is an elite three-point shooter and a solid defender, but I think mcbride’s skill set is easier to come by than Mitchell Robinson‘s defensive dynamics and offensive rebounding. FLaws and all, Mitchell Robinson is gonna be hard to replace. He’s a luxury you don’t want to lose. He’s like air conditioner. Sure, you can live without it, but who wants to….

PatCummings wrote:Ok, here’s a sample roster with KATs correct salary. No Mitch and no Alvarado in this version. Shamet still at $10M. I also removed Dadiet and included a salary for pick 40, assuming we get that for Dadiet + 55 to land a senior PG like Jaden Bradley who can compete with Kolek for the backup role. I also went with a 14 man roster instead of 15. Assume we draft Tarris Reed at 24 to replace Mitch.

PLAYER | 2026-27 SALARY
Karl-Anthony Towns | $57,078,728
OG Anunoby | $42,500,000
Jalen Brunson | $37,739,521
Mikal Bridges | $33,482,145
Josh Hart | $20,923,760
Landry Shamet | $10,000,000
Miles McBride | $3,956,523
Ariel Hukporti | $2,650,000
Mohamed Diawara | $2,600,000
Tyler Kolek | $2,486,995
Kevin McCullar Jr. | $2,185,633
Draft Pick #24 | $2,800,000
Draft Pick #31 | $1,400,000
Draft Pick #40s | $1,300,000
TOTAL PAYROLL | $221,103,305
2ND APRON THRESHOLD | $222,000,000
BUFFER REMAINING | $896,695

Or, don’t pay as many draft picks (which we aren’t)
And don’t pay the following players as they are traded away:

Landry Shamet | $10,000,000 (let him walk)
Miles McBride | $3,956,523 (trade along with dadiet for future pick)
Ariel Hukporti | $2,650,000 (let him walk)
Draft Pick #24 | $2,800,000
Draft Pick #31 | $1,400,000

TOTAL PAYROLL | lower than earlier estimates.
Re-sign Mitch for 1 year 25 million, assuming we have 25 million under the 2nd apron.

Simply put, if you’re the Knicks, would you trade away Landry Shamet, Miles McBride and dadiet for one or two years of Mitchell Robinson and let’s say two future second round pics or maybe even one protected first round pick a few years out? I think I would.

I’d be even more tempted to do that if I knew I could get Mitchell Robinson back for two years 50 million or so knowing that this two year deal wouldn’t impact the second apron two years out. I’m not sure if it would or wouldn’t. For the sake of posterity I’m going to assume a 2 year 50 mil deal would not hit the 2nd apron and we can get Mitch back for two.

doomed wrote:I did a little more digging, trading padiet and deuce would free up about 7 million. Kolek makes 2-3 million too fwiw.

I know Mitch has his weaknesses and flaws, but he gives you such an elite skill set that is difficult to replicate. I also understand that deuce McBride has an elite skill set as he is an elite three-point shooter and a solid defender, but I think mcbride’s skill set is easier to come by than Mitchell Robinson‘s defensive dynamics and offensive rebounding. FLaws and all, Mitchell Robinson is gonna be hard to replace. He’s a luxury you don’t want to lose. He’s like air conditioner. Sure, you can live without it, but who wants to….

Trading away Deuce and PAC does not free up $7m in cap space to spend on another player.

Give or take, each roster spot typically takes up about $2.8m (unless it’s a second round contract), so it’s only the amount that each player makes above that amount that you can spend around to other players. Roughly, PAC makes $3m and Deuce makes $4m next year, so trading those guys will save you about $1m versus the $7m figure you are thinking.

doomed wrote:

PatCummings wrote:Ok, here’s a sample roster with KATs correct salary. No Mitch and no Alvarado in this version. Shamet still at $10M. I also removed Dadiet and included a salary for pick 40, assuming we get that for Dadiet + 55 to land a senior PG like Jaden Bradley who can compete with Kolek for the backup role. I also went with a 14 man roster instead of 15. Assume we draft Tarris Reed at 24 to replace Mitch.

PLAYER | 2026-27 SALARY
Karl-Anthony Towns | $57,078,728
OG Anunoby | $42,500,000
Jalen Brunson | $37,739,521
Mikal Bridges | $33,482,145
Josh Hart | $20,923,760
Landry Shamet | $10,000,000
Miles McBride | $3,956,523
Ariel Hukporti | $2,650,000
Mohamed Diawara | $2,600,000
Tyler Kolek | $2,486,995
Kevin McCullar Jr. | $2,185,633
Draft Pick #24 | $2,800,000
Draft Pick #31 | $1,400,000
Draft Pick #40s | $1,300,000
TOTAL PAYROLL | $221,103,305
2ND APRON THRESHOLD | $222,000,000
BUFFER REMAINING | $896,695

Or, don’t pay as many draft picks (which we aren’t)
And don’t pay the following players as they are traded away:

Landry Shamet | $10,000,000 (let him walk)
Miles McBride | $3,956,523 (trade along with dadiet for future pick)
Ariel Hukporti | $2,650,000 (let him walk)
Draft Pick #24 | $2,800,000
Draft Pick #31 | $1,400,000

TOTAL PAYROLL | lower than earlier estimates.
Re-sign Mitch for 1 year 25 million, assuming we have 25 million under the 2nd apron.

That's terrible

filter is
20 games
positive dpm
positive ddpm

point is to just filter for analytical defensive big. I'm not trying to get into the weeds of rankings. Dwight Powell is very interesting here because he played on a bad team, and the way DPM and plus/minus analytics works he is an outlier due to the fact that your team is constantly in the negative +/- stats (bc u end up losing games), so the fact that he is positive on both filters is probably a signal that hes a good defensive big.

note: CMB as a rookie is crazy
capela
kalkbrenner
rw iii
dwight Powell
goga

all seem obtainable on some level.

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No brainer Mitch replacement

DLeethal wrote:

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No brainer Mitch replacement

Hope he goes to the Lakers - take a Mitch suitor off the board and let them deal with him in the locker room.

martin wrote:

doomed wrote:I did a little more digging, trading padiet and deuce would free up about 7 million. Kolek makes 2-3 million too fwiw.

I know Mitch has his weaknesses and flaws, but he gives you such an elite skill set that is difficult to replicate. I also understand that deuce McBride has an elite skill set as he is an elite three-point shooter and a solid defender, but I think mcbride’s skill set is easier to come by than Mitchell Robinson‘s defensive dynamics and offensive rebounding. FLaws and all, Mitchell Robinson is gonna be hard to replace. He’s a luxury you don’t want to lose. He’s like air conditioner. Sure, you can live without it, but who wants to….

Trading away Deuce and PAC does not free up $7m in cap space to spend on another player.

Give or take, each roster spot typically takes up about $2.8m (unless it’s a second round contract), so it’s only the amount that each player makes above that amount that you can spend around to other players. Roughly, PAC makes $3m and Deuce makes $4m next year, so trading those guys will save you about $1m versus the $7m figure you are thinking.

Ok thanks. So basically forget everything I just said…..

I still want to bring Mitch back! Not sure how, but we live in magical NYK times….. where there’s a will there’s a way.

MaTT4281 wrote:

DLeethal wrote:

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No brainer Mitch replacement

Hope he goes to the Lakers - take a Mitch suitor off the board and let them deal with him in the locker room.

He wouldn’t crack the rotation for us … he’s a 3/4 … Mo D is way better . Wouldn’t be a bad depth piece . In case one of our guys misses time.

I got a name if we sign huk back to a minimum what about Mo bamba as a third stringer ? lol I know he’s a bust but he kinda showed out in the g league this year and maybe coming home would ignite a fire under him.

BlueKnickers wrote:

aggo wrote:Not a fan of the Jose extension

He blocks developing kolek and now trading kolek and Dadiet make a lot less sense bc their salaries are too close to 2.5m.

The only counter to this is that we now should trade deuce

Yes, it's kind of tragic actually. People are saying Mitch is overrated, but at this point I'd say that about Jose.

I hope the rotation is different regardless, perhaps because they do trade Deuce and keep minutes open for the pipeline players.

Jose took a big discount to come back. I’d like Kolek to have an opportunity but it’s not looking like it’ll happen. I can see him getting traded as part of a package for a center or a 2nd round pick

Hey if Philly was to buy out Embid would you want him on the Knicks for the vet min ?

PatCummings wrote:

BlueKnickers wrote:

aggo wrote:Not a fan of the Jose extension

He blocks developing kolek and now trading kolek and Dadiet make a lot less sense bc their salaries are too close to 2.5m.

The only counter to this is that we now should trade deuce

Yes, it's kind of tragic actually. People are saying Mitch is overrated, but at this point I'd say that about Jose.

I hope the rotation is different regardless, perhaps because they do trade Deuce and keep minutes open for the pipeline players.

Jose took a big discount to come back. I’d like Kolek to have an opportunity but it’s not looking like it’ll happen. I can see him getting traded as part of a package for a center or a 2nd round pick

I've reconsidered the situation. I think they will both play actually. They bring totally different talents to the game and might even play together.

I don't see Kolek being traded TBH, but anything is possible right now.

Alpha1971 wrote:Hey if Philly was to buy out Embid would you want him on the Knicks for the vet min ?

iHart resigning for 3/75 is a pretty strong market signal for Mitch Rob's value. As much as we make about him taking one night off of the back to back's off, you pay a guy like Mitch for what ge does in the playoffs. He has a pretty long track record of upping his game and especially in the West where you know you will have to beat Wemby and Jokic, his value as a defender for 15 minutes a game really sky rockets.

I'm still really not sure if Mitchell will want to go though. He's such a unique personality and player, part of me thinks that his relationship with the Garden crowd will be really tough for him to walk away from. Let's say he signs in LA for a 50 million contract, will he be able to deal with Luka and the fans shitting on him when he misses free throws with a minute left in the fourth?

A lot has changed since Mitchell was drafted but one constant is that a lot of the moves we made were to take advantage of his unique skill set on both sides of the ball. I think with the explosion in player salaries it's not always just gonna be about the money. It seems if your deal is monster trucks, catching snakes, and running a farm, there isn't much 40 million vs 20 million will do for you.

I think if Dolan had said "I've known Mitch since he was a 20 year old kid straight out of the Bayou coming to the City and whether it was battling Allen and Mobley single handedly in the first round years ago, shutting down Embiid, or getting that offensive board through Wemby's arms, he's always been a key to our team and one of the best New York stories of my tenure. I'm gonna do whatever I can to keep him." We would all have felt more comfortable.

BlueKnickers wrote:

Chandler wrote:

martin wrote:I think I’m in this bucket, kinda. I think it’s a little about the KAT contract too.

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Me too

Good theory, because it makes sense.

It is hard to imagine going into the draft without the FO being on the same page as Dolan. It goes against the competent image this FO has established for itself.

Of the billionaires I’ve met, can’t say any of them are “take one for the team” kind of guys.

gradyandrew wrote:I think if Dolan had said "I've known Mitch since he was a 20 year old kid straight out of the Bayou coming to the City and whether it was battling Allen and Mobley single handedly in the first round years ago, shutting down Embiid, or getting that offensive board through Wemby's arms, he's always been a key to our team and one of the best New York stories of my tenure. I'm gonna do whatever I can to keep him." We would all have felt more comfortable.

If Dolan had said "Whatever Leon wants to do", I would've felt more comfortable.

aggo wrote:

filter is
20 games
positive dpm
positive ddpm

point is to just filter for analytical defensive big. I'm not trying to get into the weeds of rankings. Dwight Powell is very interesting here because he played on a bad team, and the way DPM and plus/minus analytics works he is an outlier due to the fact that your team is constantly in the negative +/- stats (bc u end up losing games), so the fact that he is positive on both filters is probably a signal that hes a good defensive big.

note: CMB as a rookie is crazy
capela
kalkbrenner
rw iii
dwight Powell
goga

all seem obtainable on some level.

For Powell couldn’t it also suggest he’s playing garbage time when the opponent has game in hand and rolls out 3d stringers?