Knicks · Scout: Knicks' second unit 'scares no one' - ESPN (page 1)

After the Knicks defeated the Warriors on Wednesday night, Tyson Chandler, who played 42 minutes -- the most he's played since Nov. 26 against the Nets -- knew how important it was for him to be on the floor for his team.

"I really wanted to be out there," Chandler said. "It was necessary, especially this time of year. We've got to get these wins."

But Chandler's overloaded playing time represents a recent fundamental issue with the Knicks. Coach Mike Woodson has shortened his rotation from 12 -- at the start of the season -- to usually nine players these days. And that has affected the Knicks' defensive balance. While the starting five has looked sharper making stops -- outscoring the Warriors 27-18 in the first quarter, thanks to Chandler and Iman Shumpert's defense -- the bench has been exposed.

"Their second unit scares no one," a veteran NBA scout told ESPNNewYork.com. "I'm not sure why they didn't make a trade."

The Knicks' worst five-man defensive lineup -- with a minimum of 40 minutes played together -- is Pablo Prigioni, J.R. Smith, Steve Novak, Carmelo Anthony and Amar'e Stoudemire. The main problems have been Novak getting beat off the dribble by wing slashers and Stoudemire switching poorly and leaving the paint open. They are not strong defenders, and they need support around them.

Recently, Paul George, Rudy Gay and Evan Turner took advantage of the Knicks' subs and had big games. On Wednesday night in the second quarter, with some of the starters resting, Stephen Curry went off for 23 points. Not only have the Knicks struggled defending pick-and-rolls, but they have also been out of sync getting back in transition and setting up the defense quickly.

Who knows how much worse it will get? The Knicks next face explosive point guard John Wall on Friday in Washington. Then they play the Heat, with All-Stars LeBron James and Dwyane Wade, on Sunday at the Garden.

Even with Marcus Camby and Rasheed Wallace sidelined due to injuries, James White, Kenyon Martin and Kurt Thomas are available and serviceable. In addition, Woodson could balance out the point guards' minutes more to alleviate some of the pressure on Jason Kidd. While he starts off well, Kidd loses steam in the second half and opponents purposely look to attack him.

While the scout said Woodson may feel the pressure of winning in New York, he has to face this fact: Managing older players who have wear and tear means preserving them for the latter part of the season.

"He is stubborn, and that could get him the ax," the scout said. "He definitely needs to play more guys. It would be beneficial to them. It can't hurt."

A seasoned NBA agent agreed and brought up another possible reason for Woodson's shrinking substitutions. He said politics are likely involved.

"The NBA is always political in that the Knicks are not going to want to play a 30-year-old journeyman [White] over a second-year first-round pick [Shumpert] who they see as developing into part of their future," he said.

No matter how Woodson feels about things, he needs to realize what he's working with: an older roster that needs care.

"He is stubborn, and that could get him the ax," the scout said. "He definitely needs to play more guys. It would be beneficial to them. It can't hurt."

A seasoned NBA agent agreed and brought up another possible reason for Woodson's shrinking substitutions. He said politics are likely involved.

"The NBA is always political in that the Knicks are not going to want to play a 30-year-old journeyman [White] over a second-year first-round pick [Shumpert] who they see as developing into part of their future," he said.

This makes me laugh. I guess the scout doesn't know that past practice says you play the 30 year old journeyman and decrease the young players value so that you get taken advantage of when you trade him for another journeyman. Also, Woodson hasn't lost nearly enough games to consider resigning yet.

That word political is on point, we use the word stubborn when higher ups in management tell you what to do or not what to do !

playa2 wrote:That word political is on point, we use the word stubborn when higher ups in management tell you what to do or not to do !

ok. just wanted to know if there was a specific reason for him.

I thought maybe you were thinking that management would want to bring an israeli ball player to NY because of its jewish population.

Why did we give up a great defender in Brewer? Hmm...

There'd be no shame in getting James White in the game. Isn't that why he was brought here? Or is he a "practice player?"

It looks like Shump should not be playing and his leg not healed to the point he is a better player than White at the moment. The pressure to play shump for either trade considerations or he is a better circus attraction for the gate.

Second unit scares the dickens out me at times!!!!

how many genuine two-way players do the knicks have? how many complete players?

dk7th wrote:how many genuine two-way players do the knicks have? how many complete players?

After watching the LA Clippers last night .... none.

Uh? The Knicks second unit of Amare Smith Novak and Prigioni has to be one of the best 2nd units--??? The problem with Knicks is starting 2-3-4 4 should be 3 and 2-3 are not nba starters right now

Our starting lineup doesn't scare anyone either. Felton-Kidd-Shumpert-Melo-Tyson are -22 in 102 minutes played, score 0.9 points/possession (ppp), and give up 1.02 ppp. But we can't just play our 5 best, Felton-JR-Melo-Amare-Tyson are only +1 in 88 minutes played, score 1.17 ppp, and give up 1.15 ppp. We should probably replace Shumpert in the starting lineup with JR since that lineup has been our best by far this season: +93 in 197 minutes played, scoring 1.25 ppp, and giving up only 0.98 ppp.

BRIGGS wrote:Uh? The Knicks second unit of Amare Smith Novak and Prigioni has to be one of the best 2nd units--??? The problem with Knicks is starting 2-3-4 4 should be 3 and 2-3 are not nba starters right now

Any lineup with Amare and Novaks as your defensive anchors can not be good.

No team should be "scared" of anyone, what kind of nonsense is this?

They go to that same critical scout every year to hear them complain about how the Knicks stink- every year! Last year it was probably him that was saying Lin was a scrub.

The sad thing is we scare no one and yet our own shadow scares us....

Tomorrow's Gonna Come!!!!!!

Key letters being "ESPN". Other than broadcasting live sporting events/games, it's a joke of a sports station full of talking heads/media tools.

Come postseason play I believe both Shumpert (2G) and Stoudemire (PF) will be starting for our Knicks.

C: Tyson Chandler.
PF: Amar'e Stoudemire.
SF: Carmelo Anthony.
2G: Iman Shumpert.
PG: Raymond Felton.

__________________________________________________

C: Marcus Camby.
PF: Kenyon Martin.
SF: Steve Novak.
2G: J.R Smith.
PG: Jason Kidd

With Pablo Prigioni and Kurt Thomas as our 11th/12th men off the bench.

Forget what ESPN says, because when healthy, I challenge anyone to list me 5 teams (players and all) in which feature a stronger backup unit when compared to our Knicks. I'll be waiting...

http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/knicks/...

They need to cut loose some dead weight (Sheed and Kurt or White) and call up Syms. Looking at this article, I agree and have been saying Delonte should be signed. The dude is nuts but can definitely play and would help Kidd rest up for the playoffs and, as funny as it sounds, bring some stability to the PG spot. It's a risk worth taking IMO. I'm tired of watching opposing guards light us up.

Marcus Camby is the reason Tyson Chandler has to play so much. Whenever you are ready, Marcus.

Novak has been a huge disappointment this season. Blame Woody's offense, but even when he gets a few consecutive wide open shots, he keeps missing. When your only weapon is your shooting and you miss, you have no use.

At this point, you either include White and Copeland in the rotation or simply cut them. I agree with this article's point that with an older team, you need to play a bigger rotation, which Woody hasn't in the past months.

We still need a backup big and a two-way guard. Cut Rasheed and one of Copeland and White, probably White.

Delonte West is not a player I want on our Knicks roster. He slept with the mother of LeBron James. When it comes to being a bad, more like awful teammate? It doesn't get any worse than sleeping with a teammates own mother. I want nothing to do with West inside of a Knicks locker room and/or around our players.

Thing is, beggars can't be choosers and we DO need help at guard. If there is a to-way guard in the DL that we can sign and Woody will play, bring him!

NYKMentality wrote:Delonte West is not a player I want on our Knicks roster. He slept with the mother of LeBron James. When it comes to being a bad, more like awful teammate? It doesn't get any worse than sleeping with a teammates own mother. I want nothing to do with West inside of a Knicks locker room and/or around our players.

No team has ever said Delonte was a bad teammate, the players everywhere loved him for his effort and heart in games.

And there is zero proof that the rumor even happened, quit falling for the soap.

knickscity wrote:

NYKMentality wrote:Delonte West is not a player I want on our Knicks roster. He slept with the mother of LeBron James. When it comes to being a bad, more like awful teammate? It doesn't get any worse than sleeping with a teammates own mother. I want nothing to do with West inside of a Knicks locker room and/or around our players.

No team has ever said Delonte was a bad teammate, the players everywhere loved him for his effort and heart in games.

And there is zero proof that the rumor even happened, quit falling for the soap.

The teammates may not have said it but the multiple suspensions for "conduct detramental to the team" says it loud and clear.