Knicks · Carmelo Is Right, Andrea Bargnini Was a Steal (page 1)

"I hate to lose [Steve] Novak and [Marcus] Camby,'' he said, "but when you get someone like [Bargnani] in return, it's kind of a win-win situation."

Win

Melo loves volume shooting PFs who struggle in all other aspects of the game

Game Knows Game

Bonn1997 - as much as you would enjoy stereocasting Carmelo as public enemy, pariah and patron saint of everything that is wrong with the New York Knicks, the fact remains that Bargnani was a coveted first round selection fir a reason.

If Carmelo has competed against Bargnani, and seen his game at close range, who are we to pour lime flavored haterade on his professional opinion?

Bargs goes for 18 and 5.

Book it.

Bonn1997 wrote:Melo loves volume shooting PFs who struggle in all other aspects of the game

Or he could be saying something positive about his new teammate

The key to Bargs' production is how Woody balances the rotations. There's a lot you can do with this roster. If Metta and Shump can defend the perimeter it should go a long way in shoring up the interior D, which was a huge problem obviously.

I think well be better than last year.

No Freakin Way

TeamBall wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Melo loves volume shooting PFs who struggle in all other aspects of the game

Or he could be saying something positive about his new teammate

The moment Carmelo embraces Andrea Bargnani as a man who has the same need for redemption as he does, the two will make an intriguing tandem. Both are gifted and versatile. Neither can be typecast or limited to anyone's hard line opinion. The moment anyone thinks they have Melo (or Bargnani) pegged, they look up and he has dropped 30, or led the league in scoring.

The nerve of dat guy.

misterearl wrote:No Freakin Way

TeamBall wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Melo loves volume shooting PFs who struggle in all other aspects of the game

Or he could be saying something positive about his new teammate

The moment Carmelo embraces Andrea Bargnani as a man who has the same need for redemption as he does, the two will make an intriguing tandem. Both are gifted and versatile. Neither can be typecast or limited to anyone's hard line opinion. The moment anyone thinks they have Melo (or Bargnani) pegged, they look up and he has dropped 30, or led the league in scoring.

The nerve of dat guy.

You still hanging your hat on the phony scoring title.

Bonn1997 wrote:Melo loves volume shooting PFs who struggle in all other aspects of the game

whats the point of this comment?

http://www.postingandtoasting.com/2013/7...

While I have been a vocal critic of the Bargnani trade, my utter lack of a time machine has forced me to accept the man and look for ways he might help the Knicks in 2013-14. Yes, I am standing up right here and now and declaring that I, a Knicks fan, am rooting for New York Knick Andrea Bargnani to succeed while playing for the New York Knicks!

The book on Bargnani seems to be that he was a quality player (on offense) a few years ago, but that his play fell off the past few years due to a wide range of factors (injuries, the loss of front-court partner Chris Bosh, repeatedly blowing off practice to nosh on bear claws at the local Tim Hortons).

Since his 2012-13 season was an unmitigated disaster, let us focus on the four previous seasons - from 2008 to 2012. Check out is numbers and see if you can spot his most effective season with the Raptors:

Season G MP FG FGA FG% 3P 3PA 3P% FT FTA FT% TRB AST TOV PTS

2008-09 78 31.4 5.5 12.3 .450 1.5 3.7 .409 2.8 3.4 .831 5.3 1.2 1.7 15.4

2009-10 80 35.0 6.7 14.3 .470 1.5 4.1 .372 2.3 2.9 .774 6.2 1.2 1.5 17.2

2010-11 66 35.7 8.0 17.8 .448 1.2 3.4 .345 4.3 5.3 .820 5.2 1.8 2.3 21.4

2011-12 31 33.3 6.7 15.6 .432 1.1 3.7 .296 4.9 5.6 .873 5.5 2.0 2.2 19.5

Provided by Basketball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 7/27/2013.

Now the point-fetishists among us will surely choose 2010-11, year of the 20-PLUS POINTS PER GAME, as Bargnani's finest campaign. Those of you more partial to shooting percentages might choose either his 2008-09 or his 2009-10 season. But which season do the advanced stats rate as Bargnani's best? Let me warn you: it's about to get weird up in here:

Season G MP PER TS% eFG% TRB% AST% TOV% USG% WS/48

2008-09 78 2453 14.6 .559 .512 10.0 6.4 11.2 22.7 .076

2009-10 80 2799 15.5 .552 .523 10.4 5.4 8.8 22.3 .072

2010-11 66 2353 16.4 .533 .480 8.6 8.8 10.3 28.2 .052

2011-12 31 1032 17.9 .538 .467 9.8 11.6 11.0 28.7 .104

Provided by Basketball-Reference.com: View Original Table
Generated 7/29/2013.

-spits out brandy- GASP! You mean to tell me, my dear numbers, that Bargnani's best season came in what was clearly his worst shooting season? Surely you jest, statistics!

Well the numbers don't lie, people. Despite shooting less than 30% from beyond the arc, Bargnani was a transcendent presence for the Raptor's offense in 2011-12. Overall, Toronto had the second-worst offensive efficiency rating that season, but when Bargnani took the court the Raptors offense jumped from a ghastly 99.4 points-per-100-possessions to a league-average 104.3 points-per-100-possessions. That +4.9 offensive rating on/off number was by far the best of Bargnani's career:

- 2011-12: +4.9

- 2010-11: +3.1

- 2009-10: +2.1

- 2008-09: +0.1

Call it the Bargnani paradox: a reputed shooter performing at his highest level of offensive efficiency while shooting at his lowest level of efficiency. How did he pull it off? First, you should check his assists rate: in 2011-12 he assisted on 11.6% of his teammates' field goals while he was on the floor, a rate nearly three percent higher than his next-best season. Second, he excelled at getting points from the free-throw line - 4.9 made free throws per game.

Sounds better if a player from another team made that comment..... it would carry more weight & mean more. Because it meant nothing to us to lose Novak and Camby, it's all about bringing in guys who play and help us to win.

nyk4ever wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Melo loves volume shooting PFs who struggle in all other aspects of the game

whats the point of this comment?

you can say the same thing about this thread to be honest..

tkf wrote:

nyk4ever wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Melo loves volume shooting PFs who struggle in all other aspects of the game

whats the point of this comment?

you can say the same thing about this thread to be honest..

lol

Wow, this site is basically in POS mode til preseason, might as shut it down unless somebody is in the news or a game is being played.

playa2 wrote:... Because it meant nothing to us to lose Novak and Camby, it's all about bringing in guys who play and help us to win.

which is why melo thinks getting bargs was...a steal.

There is a difference between a deal being a steal with respect to talent and a steal with respect to value. The Bargs trade was a steal for us in terms of talent and a steal for raps in terms of value. Players don't care for thinking about value in trades unless it pertains to players. Draft picks and overseas players don't count for much in their eyes until the player has actually come to the nba or been drafted.

Clean wrote:There is a difference between a deal being a steal with respect to talent and a steal with respect to value. The Bargs trade was a steal for us in terms of talent and a steal for raps in terms of value. Players don't care for thinking about value in trades unless it pertains to players. Draft picks and overseas players don't count for much in their eyes until the player has actually come to the nba or been drafted.

I see your point. I don't think they got a lot of value in the picks though. Next years second rounder is projected to be the 59th pick in the draft. The other second rounder will be a very late pick. The first round pick will be a late pick but could turn out to be decent for them. I don't think that comes close to the value Bargs has for the Knicks. I like Novak but I think he and Landry will spend most of the season sitting by each other on the bench.

Bargs was a really good deal and a great add. Bargs is a very good player that will complement Melo. The only thing you need now is a PG. Sadly, Felton is not that. Maybe Beno can be the answer.

I think Bargnani has ALOT to prove. I hope to god he is a steal. But to be fair Bargnani hasnt lived up to expectations. he needs to stay heatlthy and motivated which have been 2 problems for him the last 2 years.

StarksEwing1 wrote:I think Bargnani has ALOT to prove. I hope to god he is a steal. But to be fair Bargnani hasnt lived up to expectations. he needs to stay heatlthy and motivated which have been 2 problems for him the last 2 years.

yea and for novak and camby? he can't be anything but a steal

Melo don't care about draft picks?

IronWillGiroud wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:I think Bargnani has ALOT to prove. I hope to god he is a steal. But to be fair Bargnani hasnt lived up to expectations. he needs to stay heatlthy and motivated which have been 2 problems for him the last 2 years.

yea and for novak and camby? he can't be anything but a steal

Well i wanst totally endorsing Bargnani. I still think teh jury is still out on him. I have followed him during his career and he has many flaws that i dont like. He is kind of soft of teh defensive side for a 7 footer, also his motivavtion has been question ed and he is injury prone. As a Knick fan i hope he finally lives up to expectation but eh has to prove it