Knicks · Would you pay Melo the max he could get if that's what it took to bring him back. (page 2)

Max or Walk Out......Both options will hurt the franchise.

Locking Melo up to a longterm contract, below max value (aka Tim Duncan and co) is the best move. Phil and even Melo knows that. I doubt anybody will give Melo a max contract. I could see if he actually made his teammates better, and helped us get into the playoffs, in the east when it was probably the easiest time to get him, will all the bad teams.

No Max....

Also, we don't need Melo to attract stars. And personally, I think Lebron is the only star he attracts. Melo is the type to attract role players like Chandler....Players that don't need the ball, like Philly's team when AI was the star.

Phil, Fisher and NYC will attract starts just fine. We already saw what a Max Melo will do for us last season.....

Bonn1997 wrote:Why would you make a top 20 player the highest paid player in the game? Doesn't that strike you as a bad use of limited cap space?

it could be. however, that is our only leverage. we all don't have a crystal ball and know for sure if the 2015 market will have all of the free agents that we want. we watched the game enough that the landscape can change over the year. ALL options are a gamble. however, I would rather have the bird in the hand than 2 in the bush.

jazz74 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:Why would you make a top 20 player the highest paid player in the game? Doesn't that strike you as a bad use of limited cap space?

it could be. however, that is our only leverage. we all don't have a crystal ball and know for sure if the 2015 market will have all of the free agents that we want. we watched the game enough that the landscape can change over the year. ALL options are a gamble. however, I would rather have the bird in the hand than 2 in the bush.

Why so focused on 2015? That is just one year. It's not like the NBA is ending before 2016. People are talking about signing through his 17th season (2019).

Other,

Phil did not come here unless he felt he could turn the team around.

If its with Melo, thats cool.

If not, Thats cool. I trust the Zen. HE walks........a door opens. Swings both ways. One door closes and another opens.

As Spurs - and now Lebron Bosh and Wade are proving - taking the max is harmful to winning.
Any max contract impossible to justify, and for Melo, no, I wouldn't.

Knicks22 wrote:As Spurs - and now Lebron Bosh and Wade are proving - taking the max is harmful to winning.
Any max contract impossible to justify, and for Melo, no, I wouldn't.

Interesting point. There wasn't one max contract in the last two NBA finals or on the last three nba champions. Other top teams are signing better core players to lower prices. We can't possibly compete against that with Melo at the max.

Bonn1997 wrote:

Knicks22 wrote:As Spurs - and now Lebron Bosh and Wade are proving - taking the max is harmful to winning.
Any max contract impossible to justify, and for Melo, no, I wouldn't.

Interesting point. There wasn't one max contract in the last two NBA finals or on the last three nba champions. Other top teams are signing better core players to lower prices. We can't possibly compete against that with Melo at the max.

Has Melo taken the Max yet this time yet? Has he asked for it? Has the Knicks even offered it to him? So why bring up the max until it is relevant again? This is not singling you out but in general why go to that?

However Bonn, why restrict it to the last two finals that could be more than just a blimp than trend. Was Dirk at the Max? Did Chris Paul ruin his chances at winning by taking a max? I think it goes team to team and as the salary cap increases it will become less and less of an issue.

yellowboy90 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Knicks22 wrote:As Spurs - and now Lebron Bosh and Wade are proving - taking the max is harmful to winning.
Any max contract impossible to justify, and for Melo, no, I wouldn't.

Interesting point. There wasn't one max contract in the last two NBA finals or on the last three nba champions. Other top teams are signing better core players to lower prices. We can't possibly compete against that with Melo at the max.

Has Melo taken the Max yet this time yet? Has he asked for it? Has the Knicks even offered it to him? So why bring up the max until it is relevant again? This is not singling you out but in general why go to that?

However Bonn, why restrict it to the last two finals that could be more than just a blimp than trend. Was Dirk at the Max? Did Chris Paul ruin his chances at winning by taking a max? I think it goes team to team and as the salary cap increases it will become less and less of an issue.

Well that is the subject of the thread!
If you have a legit max player like Dirk and great supporting cast, then yeah, you at least have a shot still.

Papabear wrote:Papabear Says

you have a choice either pay him or see the post Ewing era over again. Even the great Phil Jackson can't save us. Even though I believe Melo will take less money. New York however is a strange impatient town when it comes to the Knicks.if LeBron played for us and he had a bad year we would be willing to throw him under the bus. Thats just how we are.

Paying Melo the max threatens to provide us a repeat of the post ewing years. The way I remember them, is our front office thought they were '1 or 2 pieces' away from competing again. One more move, can't rebuild in NYC.

And we got no where.

We'd probably have a championship right now if the team had fully ripped the roster apart and actually kept our draft picks.

So, Melo leaving to me isn't the end of the world.

I'm worried that if Melo leaves, our roster and coach will be competitive enough to just make or slightly miss the play offs, and we'll end up with a draft pick that can make us a little better- but not an impact player- which is what we need if we expect to win a championship.

I'd like to keep Melo.

I'd offer him max $ for 3 years, not five.

Maybe offer him a staggered kind of deal where his salary goes down in 2015, then up, then down in years 4 & 5 and year 5 is team option.

If possible and if needed

I would offer him the MAX possible on EVERY YEAR but

2015-16
2016-17

With those years, paying him closer to 10-12m on those 2 years, however, in the other 3 years of the contract he can get 20m +
We need to be able to assemble a team/roster that would allow us to compete, and that isn't happening if we pay him a max contract

RonRon wrote:If possible and if needed

I would offer him the MAX possible on EVERY YEAR but

2015-16
2016-17

With those years, paying him closer to 10-12m on those 2 years, however, in the other 3 years of the contract he can get 20m +
We need to be able to assemble a team/roster that would allow us to compete, and that isn't happening if we pay him a max contract

That's not possible. Increases/decreases can only be by 7% of the salary in the previous year if he resigns with the knicks. His contract should probably go High, 7% decrease, 7% decrease, 7% Increase, and 7% increase.

RonRon wrote:If possible and if needed

I would offer him the MAX possible on EVERY YEAR but

2015-16
2016-17

With those years, paying him closer to 10-12m on those 2 years, however, in the other 3 years of the contract he can get 20m +
We need to be able to assemble a team/roster that would allow us to compete, and that isn't happening if we pay him a max contract

i dont think that is allowed under the cba. the year to year increase/decrease has to be way below the % you are using in this scenario.

Tony Parker doesn't get enough credit. The guy is a star. Look at the amount of possessions he handles and how efficient he himself is as well as the whole spurs team. I'd probably take Chris Paul over Parker but that's about it among pg's(not factoring in age). Obviously they are a very well rounded team that is coached tremendously as well.

Back to Melo, I think if we don't pay him we might be back in the gutter for 5 more years. It all depends on how well we draft. Either we overpay a guy like we did Amare to come here and get us back in contention or we hope that we nail a couple picks in the draft. Our roster currently doesn't seem to be constructed well, yoots or not. Yeah if we don't pay Melo we'll have cap space but it will be useless with no one wanting to come here.

tj23 wrote:Tony Parker doesn't get enough credit. The guy is a star. Look at the amount of possessions he handles and how efficient he himself is as well as the whole spurs team. I'd probably take Chris Paul over Parker but that's about it among pg's(not factoring in age). Obviously they are a very well rounded team that is coached tremendously as well.

Back to Melo, I think if we don't pay him we might be back in the gutter for 5 more years. It all depends on how well we draft. Either we overpay a guy like we did Amare to come here and get us back in contention or we hope that we nail a couple picks in the draft. Our roster currently doesn't seem to be constructed well, yoots or not. Yeah if we don't pay Melo we'll have cap space but it will be useless with no one wanting to come here.

See i dont buy that. I mean even though i defend melo a lot its not like he has made us a contender. To be fair we have mostly been a 7th/8th seed and first round exit since he has been here. I dont mind brining him back BUT im sorry giving him 5 years 129 million in his 30's is crazy. Giving any player that money in his 30's is nuts unless its a player who has a bgitime resume and a few rings

StarksEwing1 wrote:

tj23 wrote:Tony Parker doesn't get enough credit. The guy is a star. Look at the amount of possessions he handles and how efficient he himself is as well as the whole spurs team. I'd probably take Chris Paul over Parker but that's about it among pg's(not factoring in age). Obviously they are a very well rounded team that is coached tremendously as well.

Back to Melo, I think if we don't pay him we might be back in the gutter for 5 more years. It all depends on how well we draft. Either we overpay a guy like we did Amare to come here and get us back in contention or we hope that we nail a couple picks in the draft. Our roster currently doesn't seem to be constructed well, yoots or not. Yeah if we don't pay Melo we'll have cap space but it will be useless with no one wanting to come here.

See i dont buy that. I mean even though i defend melo a lot its not like he has made us a contender. To be fair we have mostly been a 7th/8th seed and first round exit since he has been here. I dont mind brining him back BUT im sorry giving him 5 years 129 million in his 30's is crazy. Giving any player that money in his 30's is nuts unless its a player who has a bgitime resume and a few rings

Plus the team is basically a blank slate in a year. The only way we're bad for 5 years is if there are tons of bad decisions made. (And what's 5 bad years compared to 15 anyway!?)
We're much more likely to be stuck for years if we overpay Melo than if we start over. Many teams are hampered by bad contracts. No teams are hampered by having cap space.

Bonn1997 wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

tj23 wrote:Tony Parker doesn't get enough credit. The guy is a star. Look at the amount of possessions he handles and how efficient he himself is as well as the whole spurs team. I'd probably take Chris Paul over Parker but that's about it among pg's(not factoring in age). Obviously they are a very well rounded team that is coached tremendously as well.

Back to Melo, I think if we don't pay him we might be back in the gutter for 5 more years. It all depends on how well we draft. Either we overpay a guy like we did Amare to come here and get us back in contention or we hope that we nail a couple picks in the draft. Our roster currently doesn't seem to be constructed well, yoots or not. Yeah if we don't pay Melo we'll have cap space but it will be useless with no one wanting to come here.

See i dont buy that. I mean even though i defend melo a lot its not like he has made us a contender. To be fair we have mostly been a 7th/8th seed and first round exit since he has been here. I dont mind brining him back BUT im sorry giving him 5 years 129 million in his 30's is crazy. Giving any player that money in his 30's is nuts unless its a player who has a bgitime resume and a few rings

Plus the team is basically a blank slate in a year. The only way we're bad for 5 years is if there are tons of bad decisions made. (And what's 5 bad years compared to 15 anyway!?)
We're much more likely to be stuck for years if we overpay Melo than if we start over. Many teams are hampered by bad contracts. No teams are hampered by having cap space.

Exactly. The only reason we ave been a mess for so long is JAMES DOLAN. Phil jackson now has complete control and he knows what he is doing. If melo wnats to stay in new york and eventually win then he nees to take less. You cant have your cake and eat it too.

I would not give him the max. If Lebron isn't taking the max why the heck should Carmelo? Signing guys to max contracts is what makes it hard/impossible to surround them with quality teammates. The max contract should be a rarity, not the standard for great players.

actofgod wrote:I would not give him the max. If Lebron isn't taking the max why the heck should Carmelo? Signing guys to max contracts is what makes it hard/impossible to surround them with quality teammates. The max contract should be a rarity, not the standard for great players.

The only way you can do it is if your a team like the 76ers or Cavs who have already drafted multiple lottery players that are on rookie deals. If those players deelop you have enough guys bringing more to the team then their contract amount to offset the max deal. Its why draft picks are important even late 1's even if you get a role player paying for 4 years of a player at 1 million per is better than 4 years 14 million

I would consider a max deal for Melo only if he give the Knicks a team option in year three of contract.

actofgod wrote:I would not give him the max. If Lebron isn't taking the max why the heck should Carmelo? Signing guys to max contracts is what makes it hard/impossible to surround them with quality teammates. The max contract should be a rarity, not the standard for great players.

I can't imagine how pissed the majority of NBA players are right now an how ecstatic the Owners are. The players have willingly decided not to be paid creating a negative attitude within the NBA fanbase at any player that wishes to get a max contract.