Knicks · Article from Raptors blog mostly about Calderon (page 4)

That's where Larkin is key. He needs to prove that he is an NBA caliber pg

CrushAlot wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:Melo had no issues passing when there were shooters who he was confident in. The thing about the Triangle is that there are so many more possessions where the players have a chance to pass to a cutting teammate. It's just an entirely different way to play compared to any system Melo has been in before. I often complained about Woodson's offense because he didn't have anything going on in his sets. Players were often going East and West and none of the plays really led to the basket. We didn't have a lot of back cuts or curls etc. Well in the triangle the off ball motion and players presenting themselves for the pass are plentiful. It's just a constant rotation of players moving to scoring spots or headed towards the basket. That's gonna lead to more assists for Melo by virtue of the flow of the offense. No special effort on Melo's part.

A good example is the 2010 Lakers against the superb defense of the Celtics. It's one example that can at least come close to showing what it does for a team having all that ball and player motion and spacing. The defense is never able to settle in and focus on one player. This has been the problem for Melo here in NY. When teams can't focus on defending Melo he'll go to another level.

Melo has always had issues passing.

I bet he does it more this year than ever before. It's a system that lends itself to getting more assists. When you pass to teammates who are in scoring position more often it really helps. Melo will still see defensive attention. He'll have to pass, but now his teammates will be moving rather than just standing around watching him. It's the nature of the offense. Constant ball and player movement. Everyone on the floor is engaged and has something to do on every play. We've NEVER played like that since Melo has been here. Melo will get more catch and shoot looks, but when he posts up, he'll have passing opportunities right in his sight lines.

So how many assists do you predict that he will average this year?

My prediction is 4. I haven't researched the triangle to see if my estimate should be higher.

Correct I say 4.5-4.7

gunsnewing wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:Melo had no issues passing when there were shooters who he was confident in. The thing about the Triangle is that there are so many more possessions where the players have a chance to pass to a cutting teammate. It's just an entirely different way to play compared to any system Melo has been in before. I often complained about Woodson's offense because he didn't have anything going on in his sets. Players were often going East and West and none of the plays really led to the basket. We didn't have a lot of back cuts or curls etc. Well in the triangle the off ball motion and players presenting themselves for the pass are plentiful. It's just a constant rotation of players moving to scoring spots or headed towards the basket. That's gonna lead to more assists for Melo by virtue of the flow of the offense. No special effort on Melo's part.

A good example is the 2010 Lakers against the superb defense of the Celtics. It's one example that can at least come close to showing what it does for a team having all that ball and player motion and spacing. The defense is never able to settle in and focus on one player. This has been the problem for Melo here in NY. When teams can't focus on defending Melo he'll go to another level.

Melo has always had issues passing.

I bet he does it more this year than ever before. It's a system that lends itself to getting more assists. When you pass to teammates who are in scoring position more often it really helps. Melo will still see defensive attention. He'll have to pass, but now his teammates will be moving rather than just standing around watching him. It's the nature of the offense. Constant ball and player movement. Everyone on the floor is engaged and has something to do on every play. We've NEVER played like that since Melo has been here. Melo will get more catch and shoot looks, but when he posts up, he'll have passing opportunities right in his sight lines.

So how many assists do you predict that he will average this year?

My prediction is 4. I haven't researched the triangle to see if my estimate should be higher.

Correct I say 4.5-4.7

Bonn1997 wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:Melo had no issues passing when there were shooters who he was confident in. The thing about the Triangle is that there are so many more possessions where the players have a chance to pass to a cutting teammate. It's just an entirely different way to play compared to any system Melo has been in before. I often complained about Woodson's offense because he didn't have anything going on in his sets. Players were often going East and West and none of the plays really led to the basket. We didn't have a lot of back cuts or curls etc. Well in the triangle the off ball motion and players presenting themselves for the pass are plentiful. It's just a constant rotation of players moving to scoring spots or headed towards the basket. That's gonna lead to more assists for Melo by virtue of the flow of the offense. No special effort on Melo's part.

A good example is the 2010 Lakers against the superb defense of the Celtics. It's one example that can at least come close to showing what it does for a team having all that ball and player motion and spacing. The defense is never able to settle in and focus on one player. This has been the problem for Melo here in NY. When teams can't focus on defending Melo he'll go to another level.

Melo has always had issues passing.

I bet he does it more this year than ever before. It's a system that lends itself to getting more assists. When you pass to teammates who are in scoring position more often it really helps. Melo will still see defensive attention. He'll have to pass, but now his teammates will be moving rather than just standing around watching him. It's the nature of the offense. Constant ball and player movement. Everyone on the floor is engaged and has something to do on every play. We've NEVER played like that since Melo has been here. Melo will get more catch and shoot looks, but when he posts up, he'll have passing opportunities right in his sight lines.

So how many assists do you predict that he will average this year?

My prediction is 4. I haven't researched the triangle to see if my estimate should be higher.

Correct I say 4.5-4.7

That's almost double his average last year. I don't think anyone has come remotely close to that kind of change in the triangle.

Just having Calderon hitting shots that Felton always missed alone may get him there. System should help too.

gunsnewing wrote:Yea probably closer to 4 than 5

yeah probably.

If Kobe was at 4.6, I am not sure if Carmelo wants to do better.

Kobe was one of the kings of all time chucking though.

Melo can definitely do 5 if he wanted to. I hope that he surprises me - he is certainly capable of doing it.

CrushAlot wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:Melo had no issues passing when there were shooters who he was confident in. The thing about the Triangle is that there are so many more possessions where the players have a chance to pass to a cutting teammate. It's just an entirely different way to play compared to any system Melo has been in before. I often complained about Woodson's offense because he didn't have anything going on in his sets. Players were often going East and West and none of the plays really led to the basket. We didn't have a lot of back cuts or curls etc. Well in the triangle the off ball motion and players presenting themselves for the pass are plentiful. It's just a constant rotation of players moving to scoring spots or headed towards the basket. That's gonna lead to more assists for Melo by virtue of the flow of the offense. No special effort on Melo's part.

A good example is the 2010 Lakers against the superb defense of the Celtics. It's one example that can at least come close to showing what it does for a team having all that ball and player motion and spacing. The defense is never able to settle in and focus on one player. This has been the problem for Melo here in NY. When teams can't focus on defending Melo he'll go to another level.

Melo has always had issues passing.

I bet he does it more this year than ever before. It's a system that lends itself to getting more assists. When you pass to teammates who are in scoring position more often it really helps. Melo will still see defensive attention. He'll have to pass, but now his teammates will be moving rather than just standing around watching him. It's the nature of the offense. Constant ball and player movement. Everyone on the floor is engaged and has something to do on every play. We've NEVER played like that since Melo has been here. Melo will get more catch and shoot looks, but when he posts up, he'll have passing opportunities right in his sight lines.

So how many assists do you predict that he will average this year?

My prediction is 4. I haven't researched the triangle to see if my estimate should be higher.

Correct I say 4.5-4.7

That's almost double his average last year. I don't think anyone has come remotely close to that kind of change in the triangle.

He averaged 3.1 last year. My math says double is 6.2.

I accidentally looked at 2012-13. You're right.

His career is 3.1.

mreinman wrote:1 year is not a good sample size.

His career is 3.1.

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:1 year is not a good sample size.

His career is 3.1.

You're corect. I thought he averaged around 2.5 fir 2 straight years. I didn't realize he returned to his career avg. last year

whats your prediction for his assist numbers next year?

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:1 year is not a good sample size.

His career is 3.1.

You're corect. I thought he averaged around 2.5 fir 2 straight years. I didn't realize he returned to his career avg. last year

Did Mreinman just pull a Bonn on Bonn? You don't hit Bonn with sample sizes he hits you.

yellowboy90 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:1 year is not a good sample size.

His career is 3.1.

You're corect. I thought he averaged around 2.5 fir 2 straight years. I didn't realize he returned to his career avg. last year

Did Mreinman just pull a Bonn on Bonn? You don't hit Bonn with sample sizes he hits you.

perhaps subliminally

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:1 year is not a good sample size.

His career is 3.1.

You're corect. I thought he averaged around 2.5 fir 2 straight years. I didn't realize he returned to his career avg. last year

whats your prediction for his assist numbers next year?

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:1 year is not a good sample size.

His career is 3.1.

You're corect. I thought he averaged around 2.5 fir 2 straight years. I didn't realize he returned to his career avg. last year

whats your prediction for his assist numbers next year?

I think there will be an increase. Maybe something like 3.8842

joking aside, you are predicting 3.9?

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:1 year is not a good sample size.

His career is 3.1.

You're corect. I thought he averaged around 2.5 fir 2 straight years. I didn't realize he returned to his career avg. last year

whats your prediction for his assist numbers next year?

I think there will be an increase. Maybe something like 3.8842

joking aside, you are predicting 3.9?

I was just kidding. I'd prob go with his career avg. of course he could be a great distributor in the triangle but he also could struggle.

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

mreinman wrote:1 year is not a good sample size.

His career is 3.1.

You're corect. I thought he averaged around 2.5 fir 2 straight years. I didn't realize he returned to his career avg. last year

whats your prediction for his assist numbers next year?

I think there will be an increase. Maybe something like 3.8842

joking aside, you are predicting 3.9?

I was just kidding. I'd prob go with his career avg. of course he could be a great distributor in the triangle but he also could struggle.

Struggle? WTF?? Nixluva? Can you get in here??

both are better all-round players than carmelo anthony, and although all three can be considered wings, these two guys are essentially shooting guards.

what you want to see from melo is 4.5 to 5 assists in the triangle, and his usage:assist go down to around 1.5 or lower.

lastly, jordan's eFG was elite, completely smoking bryant and melo. jordan's TS% is also considerably better than the other two.

the main issue for melo is how talented and coachable is he actually? his numbers have always been purely borderline for all his accolades. now that he will be put in the same of reference as jordan and bryant, we will be able to get a better gauge of how special carmelo anthony is.

this is what i want to see:

1) 58%TS
2) 5 assists/game
3) 52%eFG
4) usage to assist rate ratio of 1.5 or lower
5) no more than 17 shots per game

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Yea probably closer to 4 than 5

yeah probably.

If Kobe was at 4.6, I am not sure if Carmelo wants to do better.

Kobe was one of the kings of all time chucking though.

Melo can definitely do 5 if he wanted to. I hope that he surprises me - he is certainly capable of doing it.

Melo better average 4.5+ in the triangle. If he doesn't be is chucking too much. The beauty of the triangle is it promotes finding the best shot. When the defense keys in on Jordan and Kobe it makes finding that shot even easier. Here why their assists went up under Phil

dk7th wrote:bryant averaged around 5 assists and had a usage:assist rate ratio of 1.33
jordan avenraged closer to 7 assists and had a usage:assist rate of around 1.35

both are better all-round players than carmelo anthony, and although all three can be considered wings, these two guys are essentially shooting guards.

what you want to see from melo is 4.5 to 5 assists in the triangle, and his usage:assist go down to around 1.5 or lower.

lastly, jordan's eFG was elite, completely smoking bryant and melo. jordan's TS% is also considerably better than the other two.

the main issue for melo is how talented and coachable is he actually? his numbers have always been purely borderline for all his accolades. now that he will be put in the same of reference as jordan and bryant, we will be able to get a better gauge of how special carmelo anthony is.

this is what i want to see:

1) 58%TS
2) 5 assists/game
3) 52%eFG
4) usage to assist rate ratio of 1.5 or lower
5) no more than 17 shots per game

That's a fair expectation. If he comes close to those numbers I think that would be great. No doubt this is what Phil is thinking as well. He is likely expecting Melo to become more efficient and to help his teammates score when he draws attention. Many coaches have tried, but I think this system helps to make it more possible. In the past Melo didn't really know or care what his teammates were doing. If he got stuck he might find someone in the corner for a 3. This system is different since he has more prescribed motions from his teammates as they present themselves for the pass. He'll actually be drilling those plays until they become second nature. He'll just know to expect that Jose will be in the corner or at the top or that JR or tHJ will make a cut etc. It's a much better way to play IMO.

The last few years when Melo did pass his teammates didn't always come thru. Think of how many times Felton blew a perfect setup or Shump got scared and bricked a shot. I think his teammates will be more capable in a guy like Jose and the other guards will be moving to better spots, like THJ coming off the screen as he did in SL and JR and Shump attacking the hoop more often on cuts. That should help get Melo more assists.