Knicks · Yes or No. Is It Time To Cut Bait On Andrea Bargnani? (page 1)
More Jason Smith and Travis Wear please.
Definately not, only way I envision doing so would be if it is after the trade deadline and he suffers a career ending injury
His contract could be used to add up salaries in trades, he also is out stretch Center, his 1v1 DEFENSE isn't that bad when playing the Center
I know at least one person would agree with me, Nix_ _ _ _ _ 
knickscity wrote:I'm all for giving a player a fresh start, but I swear I cant support this cat at all. But I love the Knicks....so cut him dont allow this cat to be on my HD. And somebody has to go to sign Travis...I'm guessing that would likely be Outlaw though. It would be great if a trade was on the horizon...a two-out/one-in to make room.
From Phil's mouth
To our ears
"He's overlooked. We think he's going to really do well in the system we have," Jackson said of Bargnani on MSG Network during the second quarter of the Knicks' 95-72 Summer League victory over Charlotte. "We have a couple of guards he likes to play with, Jose (Calderon) and Pablo (Prigioni), and I think he's going to be a surprise and a pleasant one for our fans."
If Phil says so
Then it must come true
nixluva wrote:Seems a bit early. It makes more sense to just let things play out. His contract is expiring anyway so no need to rush. It's unfortunate he has a hammy but that's no reason to burry him. At the same time we have coverage so it doesn't hurt us right now. I think Phil wanted Bargs to do well for value's sake. It's a LOOOONG season so let's chill on the overreacting to minor injuries in preseason.Its funny though Bargs seems to be a slow healer. I read this morning about a football player that received what was termed, 'quick recovery therapy' for a bad hammy. The guy got treatment for three days and was ready to play on Sunday. Obviously Bargs doesn't need to be rushed back for a preseason game but it appeared he was a part of Phil's plans for the team and that he was looked at as a good fit for the triangle.
What I see as a way higher probability is Outlaw is cut and Travis Wear is guaranteed the rest of his contract. If they waive Wear, they lose him completely. He becomes a free agent again so the Knicks would have to ask him to play in Westchester and hope he says yes.
Even if the new regime is not beholden to Bargs and Amare, they still are big salaries to dump as long they could be of some use this year. I see them as insurance and I expect both will get minutes at some point due to other injuries or to rest the other frontline players just because half of the games are back to backs this year (what idiot did this schedule?).
Bargs and Amare can be utilized. Outlaw is just a locker room guy at this point. If he cannot be part of a trade package, then he could be cut. I would keep Wear myself.
CrushAlot wrote:nixluva wrote:Seems a bit early. It makes more sense to just let things play out. His contract is expiring anyway so no need to rush. It's unfortunate he has a hammy but that's no reason to burry him. At the same time we have coverage so it doesn't hurt us right now. I think Phil wanted Bargs to do well for value's sake. It's a LOOOONG season so let's chill on the overreacting to minor injuries in preseason.Its funny though Bargs seems to be a slow healer. I read this morning about a football player that received what was termed, 'quick recovery therapy' for a bad hammy. The guy got treatment for three days and was ready to play on Sunday. Obviously Bargs doesn't need to be rushed back for a preseason game but it appeared he was a part of Phil's plans for the team and that he was looked at as a good fit for the triangle.
Imo, he seems like a player not eager to get back on the court. Hammy's are tricky though, I would cut him some slack in that respect. but it is very ironic that as important as preseason is to get acquainted with teammates and the sytem that he isnt playing at all. Sounds like K-Mart with his season long ankle.
Splat wrote:I see a very low probability they'd cut Bargs.They can protect him from the dleague draft as one of their camp invites and sign him in Westchester. He would be available for any team to sign him but I am not sure if that would happen.What I see as a way higher probability is Outlaw is cut and Travis Wear is guaranteed the rest of his contract. If they waive Wear, they lose him completely. He becomes a free agent again so the Knicks would have to ask him to play in Westchester and hope he says yes.
Even if the new regime is not beholden to Bargs and Amare, they still are big salaries to dump as long they could be of some use this year. I see them as insurance and I expect both will get minutes at some point due to other injuries or to rest the other frontline players just because half of the games are back to backs this year (what idiot did this schedule?).
Bargs and Amare can be utilized. Outlaw is just a locker room guy at this point. If he cannot be part of a trade package, then he could be cut. I would keep Wear myself.
CrushAlot wrote:Splat wrote:I see a very low probability they'd cut Bargs.They can protect him from the dleague draft as one of their camp invites and sign him in Westchester. He would be available for any team to sign him but I am not sure if that would happen.What I see as a way higher probability is Outlaw is cut and Travis Wear is guaranteed the rest of his contract. If they waive Wear, they lose him completely. He becomes a free agent again so the Knicks would have to ask him to play in Westchester and hope he says yes.
Even if the new regime is not beholden to Bargs and Amare, they still are big salaries to dump as long they could be of some use this year. I see them as insurance and I expect both will get minutes at some point due to other injuries or to rest the other frontline players just because half of the games are back to backs this year (what idiot did this schedule?).
Bargs and Amare can be utilized. Outlaw is just a locker room guy at this point. If he cannot be part of a trade package, then he could be cut. I would keep Wear myself.
I suggest we make a petition titled, Outlaw Outlaw, Wear Wear
knickscity wrote:CrushAlot wrote:nixluva wrote:Seems a bit early. It makes more sense to just let things play out. His contract is expiring anyway so no need to rush. It's unfortunate he has a hammy but that's no reason to burry him. At the same time we have coverage so it doesn't hurt us right now. I think Phil wanted Bargs to do well for value's sake. It's a LOOOONG season so let's chill on the overreacting to minor injuries in preseason.Its funny though Bargs seems to be a slow healer. I read this morning about a football player that received what was termed, 'quick recovery therapy' for a bad hammy. The guy got treatment for three days and was ready to play on Sunday. Obviously Bargs doesn't need to be rushed back for a preseason game but it appeared he was a part of Phil's plans for the team and that he was looked at as a good fit for the triangle.
Imo, he seems like a player not eager to get back on the court. Hammy's are tricky though, I would cut him some slack in that respect. but it is very ironic that as important as preseason is to get acquainted with teammates and the sytem that he isnt playing at all. Sounds like K-Mart with his season long ankle.
Could it be Bargs simply doesn't
Have what is deemed a passion and high
Motor for the sport, he's seems okay with what he is
A player who's skills have always been overrated
But could have put in the work to be much better
Btw were some of you fans employed by the Raptors
Because by some of the comments here
It echoes what went on Bargs time there
Sam Mitchell speaking on Bargnani
Article from Yahoo Sports almost 2yrs ago
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-ball-d...
"I wasn't allowed to coach Andrea the same way I was allowed to coach Jose (Calderon)," Mitchell told Tim & Sid on Sportsnet 590 The Fan on Wednesday. "I was a hard ass on Jose; I was hard on him, but look at the type of player he turned out to be."I was not allowed to be that tough on Andrea because within the organization we felt he couldn't take it. And my whole thing was if he can't take it then we can't build around him. And no one thought Jose could take it, and Jose did."
Their offense is scoring 8.3 points per 100 possessions better than their season average in the last 10 games, in part because they are just shooting the ball better (their eFG%, which accounts for the bonus of a made three, has jumped from 48.3 percent on the season to 52.7 percent the last 10 games).Then on the other end of the floor, the Raptors defense is nearly 4 points per 100 possessions better than their season average.
Look at it this way, in games 11-20 of the season the Raptors were a -8.2 points per 100 possessions when you compare their offense and defense. In the last 10 games that is +10.3, which is second best in the NBA in that stretch.
Don't players need A FULL training camp and preseason
In order to get familiar with each other and system
knickscity wrote:CrushAlot wrote:nixluva wrote:Seems a bit early. It makes more sense to just let things play out. His contract is expiring anyway so no need to rush. It's unfortunate he has a hammy but that's no reason to burry him. At the same time we have coverage so it doesn't hurt us right now. I think Phil wanted Bargs to do well for value's sake. It's a LOOOONG season so let's chill on the overreacting to minor injuries in preseason.Its funny though Bargs seems to be a slow healer. I read this morning about a football player that received what was termed, 'quick recovery therapy' for a bad hammy. The guy got treatment for three days and was ready to play on Sunday. Obviously Bargs doesn't need to be rushed back for a preseason game but it appeared he was a part of Phil's plans for the team and that he was looked at as a good fit for the triangle.
Imo, he seems like a player not eager to get back on the court. Hammy's are tricky though, I would cut him some slack in that respect. but it is very ironic that as important as preseason is to get acquainted with teammates and the sytem that he isnt playing at all. Sounds like K-Mart with his season long ankle.
It's very disappointing but it's also still early and there's no reason to push things. I'd say the same about anyone on this team at this point. Bargs looked good and so far only STAT and JR have looked way out of it. It's not a high pressure situation at this point. Bargs can be brought along slowly and it won't impact things negatively this year cuz of Phil stocking the roster with more talent. For those who poo poo'd the work Phil did it's clear he did a pretty good job of tweaking the roster and making it better IMO. With so much risk of injury it was important that Phil got as much help as he could on this bench.
nixluva - in the case of Bargnani, it is NOT early, it is late. Last season he was of little use and this season appears to be some of the same in the pre season. Travis Wear would be a terrible player to lose to another franchise who spots his potential.
Starting over is never easy.
nixluva wrote:knickscity wrote:CrushAlot wrote:nixluva wrote:Seems a bit early. It makes more sense to just let things play out. His contract is expiring anyway so no need to rush. It's unfortunate he has a hammy but that's no reason to burry him. At the same time we have coverage so it doesn't hurt us right now. I think Phil wanted Bargs to do well for value's sake. It's a LOOOONG season so let's chill on the overreacting to minor injuries in preseason.Its funny though Bargs seems to be a slow healer. I read this morning about a football player that received what was termed, 'quick recovery therapy' for a bad hammy. The guy got treatment for three days and was ready to play on Sunday. Obviously Bargs doesn't need to be rushed back for a preseason game but it appeared he was a part of Phil's plans for the team and that he was looked at as a good fit for the triangle.
Imo, he seems like a player not eager to get back on the court. Hammy's are tricky though, I would cut him some slack in that respect. but it is very ironic that as important as preseason is to get acquainted with teammates and the sytem that he isnt playing at all. Sounds like K-Mart with his season long ankle.
It's very disappointing but it's also still early and there's no reason to push things. I'd say the same about anyone on this team at this point. Bargs looked good and so far only STAT and JR have looked way out of it. It's not a high pressure situation at this point. Bargs can be brought along slowly and it won't impact things negatively this year cuz of Phil stocking the roster with more talent. For those who poo poo'd the work Phil did it's clear he did a pretty good job of tweaking the roster and making it better IMO. With so much risk of injury it was important that Phil got as much help as he could on this bench.
The team lost when Bargs played, same narrative as last year. How he plays individually dont matter to me, only the team winning. I understand you're never ending with praise towards Phils "moves", but the reality is the games will decide everything, the real ones that count. Personally I think Phil has done the best a GM could with limited flexibility and I'll leave it at that.
I do recall YOU stating this training camp is different with one reason pointing to everyone being healthy. That isnt true....Bargs is INJURED. He wasnt healthy from the start, that is obvious as well. What will be even more telling is what Fisher does with this guy when he is "healthy".
knickscity wrote:nixluva wrote:knickscity wrote:CrushAlot wrote:nixluva wrote:Seems a bit early. It makes more sense to just let things play out. His contract is expiring anyway so no need to rush. It's unfortunate he has a hammy but that's no reason to burry him. At the same time we have coverage so it doesn't hurt us right now. I think Phil wanted Bargs to do well for value's sake. It's a LOOOONG season so let's chill on the overreacting to minor injuries in preseason.Its funny though Bargs seems to be a slow healer. I read this morning about a football player that received what was termed, 'quick recovery therapy' for a bad hammy. The guy got treatment for three days and was ready to play on Sunday. Obviously Bargs doesn't need to be rushed back for a preseason game but it appeared he was a part of Phil's plans for the team and that he was looked at as a good fit for the triangle.
Imo, he seems like a player not eager to get back on the court. Hammy's are tricky though, I would cut him some slack in that respect. but it is very ironic that as important as preseason is to get acquainted with teammates and the sytem that he isnt playing at all. Sounds like K-Mart with his season long ankle.
It's very disappointing but it's also still early and there's no reason to push things. I'd say the same about anyone on this team at this point. Bargs looked good and so far only STAT and JR have looked way out of it. It's not a high pressure situation at this point. Bargs can be brought along slowly and it won't impact things negatively this year cuz of Phil stocking the roster with more talent. For those who poo poo'd the work Phil did it's clear he did a pretty good job of tweaking the roster and making it better IMO. With so much risk of injury it was important that Phil got as much help as he could on this bench.
The team lost when Bargs played, same narrative as last year. How he plays individually dont matter to me, only the team winning. I understand you're never ending with praise towards Phils "moves", but the reality is the games will decide everything, the real ones that count. Personally I think Phil has done the best a GM could with limited flexibility and I'll leave it at that.I do recall YOU stating this training camp is different with one reason pointing to everyone being healthy. That isnt true....Bargs is INJURED. He wasnt healthy from the start, that is obvious as well. What will be even more telling is what Fisher does with this guy when he is "healthy".
Troubling comments from nixluva always
Center around on what he thinks the company line is
For one thing Bargs was not acquired by Phil
Bargs does not fit into the long term plans
It's highly debatable if he fits into the short term plans
What Phil should have done instead of feeding the fan base
A bunch of hot air, he should have taken the Masai
Approach and found a creative way to dump Bargnani
Especially since he forecast the financial flexibility
We'd have from what was on the horizon of the new NBA TV deal
knickscity wrote:nixluva wrote:knickscity wrote:CrushAlot wrote:nixluva wrote:Seems a bit early. It makes more sense to just let things play out. His contract is expiring anyway so no need to rush. It's unfortunate he has a hammy but that's no reason to burry him. At the same time we have coverage so it doesn't hurt us right now. I think Phil wanted Bargs to do well for value's sake. It's a LOOOONG season so let's chill on the overreacting to minor injuries in preseason.Its funny though Bargs seems to be a slow healer. I read this morning about a football player that received what was termed, 'quick recovery therapy' for a bad hammy. The guy got treatment for three days and was ready to play on Sunday. Obviously Bargs doesn't need to be rushed back for a preseason game but it appeared he was a part of Phil's plans for the team and that he was looked at as a good fit for the triangle.
Imo, he seems like a player not eager to get back on the court. Hammy's are tricky though, I would cut him some slack in that respect. but it is very ironic that as important as preseason is to get acquainted with teammates and the sytem that he isnt playing at all. Sounds like K-Mart with his season long ankle.
It's very disappointing but it's also still early and there's no reason to push things. I'd say the same about anyone on this team at this point. Bargs looked good and so far only STAT and JR have looked way out of it. It's not a high pressure situation at this point. Bargs can be brought along slowly and it won't impact things negatively this year cuz of Phil stocking the roster with more talent. For those who poo poo'd the work Phil did it's clear he did a pretty good job of tweaking the roster and making it better IMO. With so much risk of injury it was important that Phil got as much help as he could on this bench.
The team lost when Bargs played, same narrative as last year. How he plays individually dont matter to me, only the team winning. I understand you're never ending with praise towards Phils "moves", but the reality is the games will decide everything, the real ones that count. Personally I think Phil has done the best a GM could with limited flexibility and I'll leave it at that.I do recall YOU stating this training camp is different with one reason pointing to everyone being healthy. That isnt true....Bargs is INJURED. He wasnt healthy from the start, that is obvious as well. What will be even more telling is what Fisher does with this guy when he is "healthy".
The team losing when Bargs played wasn't cuz of him. We can go into this in depth but there was a LOT more going on in the team's losing besides Bargs playing. It's just convenient to point to Bargs and ignore the absolutely putrid production from JR, Felton and Shump to start the year. STAT wasn't fully there and KMart and Tyson getting hurt had nothing to do with it. It was all Bargs. SMFH.
Healthy meaning not coming off surgery and still rehabbing. I love how you guys like to twist the meaning of my statements. Bargs didn't have a bad hammy coming in. He had a bad elbow last season. Fisher was happy with Bargs before he got hurt. I guess it all depends on how things go when he gets healthy and Fish tries to get him into the rotation. It's in our best interests for Bargs to be a useful part of the team. We may end up needing him at some point and we need him healthy if he's going to be part of a trade.
nixluva wrote:
It's very disappointing but it's also still early and there's no reason to push things. I'd say the same about anyone on this team at this point. Bargs looked good and so far only STAT and JR have looked way out of it. It's not a high pressure situation at this point. Bargs can be brought along slowly and it won't impact things negatively this year cuz of Phil stocking the roster with more talent. For those who poo poo'd the work Phil did it's clear he did a pretty good job of tweaking the roster and making it better IMO. With so much risk of injury it was important that Phil got as much help as he could on this bench.
I agree. The pickups made now largely negate the chaos of assembling a rotation. If Bargs is just a passionless sofa fart or if Amare can't add 1+1, we can deal with it now. Our frontline this season in no way depends upon either of them and that is a good thing. This is just another example of Phil transitioning the club into his image one step at a time.
Splat wrote:nixluva wrote:
It's very disappointing but it's also still early and there's no reason to push things. I'd say the same about anyone on this team at this point. Bargs looked good and so far only STAT and JR have looked way out of it. It's not a high pressure situation at this point. Bargs can be brought along slowly and it won't impact things negatively this year cuz of Phil stocking the roster with more talent. For those who poo poo'd the work Phil did it's clear he did a pretty good job of tweaking the roster and making it better IMO. With so much risk of injury it was important that Phil got as much help as he could on this bench.I agree. The pickups made now largely negate the chaos of assembling a rotation. If Bargs is just a passionless sofa fart or if Amare can't add 1+1, we can deal with it now. Our frontline this season in no way depends upon either of them and that is a good thing. This is just another example of Phil transitioning the club into his image one step at a time.
+1 Million. But then i'm just a shill for the Knicks so nothing I say is valid...
F500ONE wrote:
A bunch of hot air, he should have taken the MasaiApproach and found a creative way to dump Bargnani
Especially since he forecast the financial flexibilityWe'd have from what was on the horizon of the new NBA TV deal
Easier said than done, don't you think? Why would any team take either Bargs or Stat off our hands? How would you incentivize such a deal now?
nixluva wrote:knickscity wrote:nixluva wrote:knickscity wrote:CrushAlot wrote:nixluva wrote:Seems a bit early. It makes more sense to just let things play out. His contract is expiring anyway so no need to rush. It's unfortunate he has a hammy but that's no reason to burry him. At the same time we have coverage so it doesn't hurt us right now. I think Phil wanted Bargs to do well for value's sake. It's a LOOOONG season so let's chill on the overreacting to minor injuries in preseason.Its funny though Bargs seems to be a slow healer. I read this morning about a football player that received what was termed, 'quick recovery therapy' for a bad hammy. The guy got treatment for three days and was ready to play on Sunday. Obviously Bargs doesn't need to be rushed back for a preseason game but it appeared he was a part of Phil's plans for the team and that he was looked at as a good fit for the triangle.
Imo, he seems like a player not eager to get back on the court. Hammy's are tricky though, I would cut him some slack in that respect. but it is very ironic that as important as preseason is to get acquainted with teammates and the sytem that he isnt playing at all. Sounds like K-Mart with his season long ankle.
It's very disappointing but it's also still early and there's no reason to push things. I'd say the same about anyone on this team at this point. Bargs looked good and so far only STAT and JR have looked way out of it. It's not a high pressure situation at this point. Bargs can be brought along slowly and it won't impact things negatively this year cuz of Phil stocking the roster with more talent. For those who poo poo'd the work Phil did it's clear he did a pretty good job of tweaking the roster and making it better IMO. With so much risk of injury it was important that Phil got as much help as he could on this bench.
The team lost when Bargs played, same narrative as last year. How he plays individually dont matter to me, only the team winning. I understand you're never ending with praise towards Phils "moves", but the reality is the games will decide everything, the real ones that count. Personally I think Phil has done the best a GM could with limited flexibility and I'll leave it at that.I do recall YOU stating this training camp is different with one reason pointing to everyone being healthy. That isnt true....Bargs is INJURED. He wasnt healthy from the start, that is obvious as well. What will be even more telling is what Fisher does with this guy when he is "healthy".
The team losing when Bargs played wasn't cuz of him. We can go into this in depth but there was a LOT more going on in the team's losing besides Bargs playing. It's just convenient to point to Bargs and ignore the absolutely putrid production from JR, Felton and Shump to start the year. STAT wasn't fully there and KMart and Tyson getting hurt had nothing to do with it. It was all Bargs. SMFH.
Healthy meaning not coming off surgery and still rehabbing. I love how you guys like to twist the meaning of my statements. Bargs didn't have a bad hammy coming in. He had a bad elbow last season. Fisher was happy with Bargs before he got hurt. I guess it all depends on how things go when he gets healthy and Fish tries to get him into the rotation. It's in our best interests for Bargs to be a useful part of the team. We may end up needing him at some point and we need him healthy if he's going to be part of a trade.
You dont know what bargs had coming in, but the fact is he got hurt in the very first game with an injury that no one knows when it happened. but you want to rule out he was previously injured....I wont because he's always injured. Thats the narrative, doesnt mean the team lost solely because of him, but they certainly WIN WITHOUIT HIM. Thats a fact. As you say the team has talent and depth....he's already behind the curve now. Bargs aint needed, but as long as he's on the club he should be learning the system on both sides of the ball and he cant do that because he's injured as always.