yellowboy90 wrote:Phil just struck out. You do not go to Monroe 1st if you didn't want him bad. Monore chose to go to a better situation for him. This is on phil
Look at it this way. Monroe came to us first. He wanted to be here and did not expect to be lowballed. Same way LMA went to SA first. LeBron went to Miami first
Phil is sticking to his plan. Great news. They are not star-phucing.
Dolan is staying out of it. Great news.
They will be fine. Even if they end up NOT spending the money, they are fine because then they have cap room to absorb deals and be deal facilitators which means Draft picks!!
martin wrote:gunsnewing wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Beck saying Knicks offered the max Wojo saying they didn't. Interesting. Two of the best. Not sure what to believe here.
I would believe Wojo of the national Yahoo sports over a New York beat writer trying to stay on Phil's good side
Beck is not a NY beat writer
He's with Bleacher Report now but he was with the New York Times. Probably still close to a lot of people in the Knicks organization.
martin wrote:gunsnewing wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Beck saying Knicks offered the max Wojo saying they didn't. Interesting. Two of the best. Not sure what to believe here.
I would believe Wojo of the national Yahoo sports over a New York beat writer trying to stay on Phil's good side
Beck is not a NY beat writer
Yup... and I never considered Beck a boot licker when he was writing for the Times, anyway:
gunsnewing wrote:martin wrote:gunsnewing wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Beck saying Knicks offered the max Wojo saying they didn't. Interesting. Two of the best. Not sure what to believe here.
I would believe Wojo of the national Yahoo sports over a New York beat writer trying to stay on Phil's good side
Beck is not a NY beat writer
He's with Bleacher Report now but he was with the New York Times. Probably still close to a lot of people in the Knicks organization.
I would think that Jackson talked to him about taking less than the Max, but also told him that they would match anything he was offered elsewher, or something like this.
GoNyGoNyGo wrote:Phil is sticking to his plan. Great news. They are not star-phucing.Dolan is staying out of it. Great news.
They will be fine. Even if they end up NOT spending the money, they are fine because then they have cap room to absorb deals and be deal facilitators which means Draft picks!!
Signing Melo to $124mil after his failures here was the ultimate starphuch. It put immense pressure on Phil to build a winner around Melo right away.
How do you plan on doing that with Jason Smith type signings? We can't afford to miss the playoffs next year or we surrender another lottery pick.
GoNyGoNyGo wrote:Phil is sticking to his plan. Great news. They are not star-phucing.Dolan is staying out of it. Great news.
They will be fine. Even if they end up NOT spending the money, they are fine because then they have cap room to absorb deals and be deal facilitators which means Draft picks!!
yes that...or the top tier FA's don't want to play for teams that suck. I don't see where any of the lottery teams have done anything in FA this year. Given the choice, these guys are going to take the money AND the better team. We have the money, but we are a mix of the D league, rookies, scrubs and Melo. The second tier guys are the ones who are going to use us to get paid by other (better) teams. This is going to be a long week with more disappointment headed our way.
WaltLongmire wrote:gunsnewing wrote:martin wrote:gunsnewing wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Beck saying Knicks offered the max Wojo saying they didn't. Interesting. Two of the best. Not sure what to believe here.
I would believe Wojo of the national Yahoo sports over a New York beat writer trying to stay on Phil's good side
Beck is not a NY beat writer
He's with Bleacher Report now but he was with the New York Times. Probably still close to a lot of people in the Knicks organization.
I would think that Jackson talked to him about taking less than the Max, but also told him that they would match anything he was offered elsewher, or something like this.
Bottom line - he didn't sell Monroe on coming here and wanted to. It's a setback. It's not the end of the world. But Phil thought he had this guy. Asking him to take less may have been the thing that left a bad taste in Monroe's mouth. It's all speculation but the facts we know are that Phil wanted him and he signed with Milwaukee.
Free Agency isn't fantasy BB. You can't make players chose you. This is why you talk to multiple players and formulate multiple plans. You can't have all your eggs in one basket.
nixluva wrote:Free Agency isn't fantasy BB. You can't make players chose you. This is why you talk to multiple players and formulate multiple plans. You can't have all your eggs in one basket.
You've got to sell these guys on a vision. Make them see how they can win. Phil didn't do that. He's got his work cut out for him.
In some ways you can argue - what was more valuable - blowing up the team early and only winning 17 games and getting the fourth pick in the draft?
Or would it have been more valuable to keep Tyson, Amar'e, JR, Shump, Felton and try to make one last run with that squad, win 50 games and be a major major player in free agency. That squad finished the 2013-4 season 16-4 under Woodson.
Knicks install the difficult Triangle. Hire an untested coach. Trade every single veteran other than Melo on their roster for very little in return.
It's not gonna make this team a free agency hot spot, that's for sure.
phil is living in a fckng time warp, why are not giving this guy you have been waiting for, the max for 2 fkng years in a time the cap has sky rocketed...what a complete ass
gunsnewing wrote:GoNyGoNyGo wrote:Phil is sticking to his plan. Great news. They are not star-phucing.Dolan is staying out of it. Great news.
They will be fine. Even if they end up NOT spending the money, they are fine because then they have cap room to absorb deals and be deal facilitators which means Draft picks!!
Signing Melo to $124mil after his failures here was the ultimate starphuch. It put immense pressure on Phil to build a winner around Melo right away.
How do you plan on doing that with Jason Smith type signings? We can't afford to miss the playoffs next year or we surrender another lottery pick.
I agree about Melo. I would not have signed him. NY does not have a pick in 2016 no matter what. They will make a deal to get one, if that is what is needed. By having cap space and players on good contracts they can facilitate deals.
crzymdups wrote:nixluva wrote:Free Agency isn't fantasy BB. You can't make players chose you. This is why you talk to multiple players and formulate multiple plans. You can't have all your eggs in one basket.
You've got to sell these guys on a vision. Make them see how they can win. Phil didn't do that. He's got his work cut out for him.
In some ways you can argue - what was more valuable - blowing up the team early and only winning 17 games and getting the fourth pick in the draft?
Or would it have been more valuable to keep Tyson, Amar'e, JR, Shump, Felton and try to make one last run with that squad, win 50 games and be a major major player in free agency. That squad finished the 2013-4 season 16-4 under Woodson.
Knicks install the difficult Triangle. Hire an untested coach. Trade every single veteran other than Melo on their roster for very little in return.
It's not gonna make this team a free agency hot spot, that's for sure.
It's a tough spot to be in since he decided to trash the team and start over. That means other teams can offer a playoff roster already. It's an advantage. However, i'm glad that Phil did what he did cuz KP's upside is higher than the guys we could get in Free Agency. That as the entire point of trashing the roster. We have KP, Jerian and a lot of other young talent. If we have to go into this season with less big named FA's and instead go younger that's fine with me. NO one we got was gonna turn this into a contender in one off season.
We still have some solid options out there. We can save some cap for 2016 too.
Knixkik wrote:They are saying Phil never offered him the max. Hopefully it's because he has a bigger plan.
what plan, dude his plan is at the for front of every media outlet, and he sucks big time..your being cheap in a time everybody is doling out money like they hit the lottery.
All these yrs of over paying players, and your coming off a historically bad season, and your being cheap and conservative as if you have the upper hand..
another 15 win season on the horizon..
Rookie wrote:GoNyGoNyGo wrote:Phil is sticking to his plan. Great news. They are not star-phucing.Dolan is staying out of it. Great news.
They will be fine. Even if they end up NOT spending the money, they are fine because then they have cap room to absorb deals and be deal facilitators which means Draft picks!!
yes that...or the top tier FA's don't want to play for teams that suck. I don't see where any of the lottery teams have done anything in FA this year. Given the choice, these guys are going to take the money AND the better team. We have the money, but we are a mix of the D league, rookies, scrubs and Melo. The second tier guys are the ones who are going to use us to get paid by other (better) teams. This is going to be a long week with more disappointment headed our way.
Its possible that Phil did nothing wrong. Milwaukee is a good situation. Good young team that needed a C.
The negativity around here about missing out on players is crazy. Monroe is good but not great. I am glad NY is not paying him $17M a year. He is not worth it.
knicks1248 wrote:Knixkik wrote:They are saying Phil never offered him the max. Hopefully it's because he has a bigger plan.
what plan, dude his plan is at the for front of every media outlet, and he sucks big time..your being cheap in a time everybody is doling out money like they hit the lottery.
All these yrs of over paying players, and your coming off a historically bad season, and your being cheap and conservative as if you have the upper hand..
another 15 win season on the horizon..
That's not necessarily the case. We have to see who he actually ends up getting and how our young players figure into things. The Knicks don't have to be as bad as last year just cuz we missed out on Monroe!!!
crzymdups wrote:WaltLongmire wrote:gunsnewing wrote:martin wrote:gunsnewing wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Beck saying Knicks offered the max Wojo saying they didn't. Interesting. Two of the best. Not sure what to believe here.
I would believe Wojo of the national Yahoo sports over a New York beat writer trying to stay on Phil's good side
Beck is not a NY beat writer
He's with Bleacher Report now but he was with the New York Times. Probably still close to a lot of people in the Knicks organization.
I would think that Jackson talked to him about taking less than the Max, but also told him that they would match anything he was offered elsewher, or something like this.
Bottom line - he didn't sell Monroe on coming here and wanted to. It's a setback. It's not the end of the world. But Phil thought he had this guy. Asking him to take less may have been the thing that left a bad taste in Monroe's mouth. It's all speculation but the facts we know are that Phil wanted him and he signed with Milwaukee.
For all we know Jackson offered him a 4 year deal, and Monroe decided he wanted more flexibility for the future.
I would think that if you believed a player could be a cornerstone for your future, and they were young enough, you would offer them a 4 year contract or some kind or another.
Monroe can now leave the Bucks or ask for even more money after only 2 years. Makes him less of a building block if you are looking for any kind of franchise stability, IMO.
I consider him a different case than Aflalo, who I see as more of a rented gun...and a guy will probably not be here 4 years down the line.
Interesting to see what happens with Kanter and Lopez... I figure Kanter wants to stay in OKC. Better chance we get Lopez.
knicks1248 wrote:Knixkik wrote:They are saying Phil never offered him the max. Hopefully it's because he has a bigger plan.
what plan, dude his plan is at the for front of every media outlet, and he sucks big time..your being cheap in a time everybody is doling out money like they hit the lottery.
All these yrs of over paying players, and your coming off a historically bad season, and your being cheap and conservative as if you have the upper hand..
another 15 win season on the horizon..
NOt sure that because everyone else is doing it makes it right.
knicks are targeting lopez and not kanter
