Knicks · MSG employee talk with phil (page 1)

as i've told you before, my best friend works as a lawyer at MSG. sometimes he works on cases directly with steve mills. as a result, he gets some inside info that i'm privy to. i'll share what i can. yesterday, phil was a guest speaker and spoke with MSG employees

here are some highlights:
- phil loves coach red holzmann - he never diagrammed plays; just expected you to get open
- phil ideally wanted to get Monroe and draft WCS - team desperately needed size. he "settled" for lopez and KP
- phil values size - basketball is a game of height
- phil thinks you need 1 ALPHA talent, then 3 Co stars and role players to make a good team
- phil acknowledges that not all players can play in NYC due to its distractions
- phil wants high IQ, self motivated guys - he got rid of those who aren't and he's proud of the players they brought in
- phil is ok with the wild types like "Rodman and Artest" as long as you have a good stable team around them (used the word "blending" a million times)
- phil liked jerian grant ever since he met him with horace a few yrs ago

again, a lot of this is common knowledge. the main thing that stands out was how badly he wanted WCS.

(i'd post pictures but i dont want to get him in trouble)

You sure that you don't mean Towns and Monroe? That was the duo that it was heavily hinted in the media he wanted and who would of worked together like a glove.

He could of drafted WCS if he had wanted him. Also WCS and Monroe would of been a bad pairing due to the fact they operate in the same area on the court. On the flip I believe this story (if you meant Towns) just because Lopez and KP are also in the same boat in that they fit well together (and around Melo). O'quinn is similar to Monroe in that he's a big who can pass, and likely was on Phil's radar as a possible backup to get if Monroe wasn't available (which is why we traded for him for a second round swap lmao. Some part of me likes to think maybe Phil did a ROI between O'quinn's 4 years for 16 and Monroe starting contract that was worth all that and more for the first year of it and chose O'Quinn do to the cost & potential.

That stable comment is interesting. As crazy as he is I wouldn't mind going after Lance Stephenson either in the 2016 FA (where if the knicks keep their core together they wont have a lot of money and will need to go after under the radar guys and reclamation projects like the 2015 FA) or if the knicks want to move grant to the starting lineup and see Calderon as expendable (Keep in mind I like Calderon as the starter but if they go for grant there I don't like Calderon operating with that bench unit).

wargames wrote:You sure that you don't mean Towns and Monroe? That was the duo that it was heavily hinted in the media he wanted and who would of worked together like a glove.

He could of drafted WCS if he had wanted him. Also WCS and Monroe would of been a bad pairing due to the fact they operate in the same area on the court. On the flip I believe this story (if you meant Towns) just because Lopez and KP are also in the same boat in that they fit well together (and around Melo). O'quinn is similar to Monroe in that he's a big who can pass, and likely was on Phil's radar as a possible backup to get if Monroe wasn't available (which is why we traded for him for a second round swap lmao. Some part of me likes to think maybe Phil did a ROI between O'quinn's 4 years for 16 and Monroe starting contract that was worth all that and more for the first year of it and chose O'Quinn do to the cost & potential.

That stable comment is interesting. As crazy as he is I wouldn't mind going after Lance Stephenson either in the 2016 FA (where if the knicks keep their core together they wont have a lot of money and will need to go after under the radar guys and reclamation prorjects like the 2015 FA) or if the knicks want to move grant to the starting lineup and see Calderon as expendable (Keep in mind I like Calderon as the starter but if they go for grant there I don't like Calderon operating with that bench unit).

with the #4 pick they werent going to get towns.
also he heard thru the grapevine that monroe didnt want to come to nyc
i'm just delivering the message. this is all true

wargames wrote:You sure that you don't mean Towns and Monroe? That was the duo that it was heavily hinted in the media he wanted and who would of worked together like a glove.

He could of drafted WCS if he had wanted him. Also WCS and Monroe would of been a bad pairing due to the fact they operate in the same area on the court. On the flip I believe this story (if you meant Towns) just because Lopez and KP are also in the same boat in that they fit well together (and around Melo). O'quinn is similar to Monroe in that he's a big who can pass, and likely was on Phil's radar as a possible backup to get if Monroe wasn't available (which is why we traded for him for a second round swap lmao. Some part of me likes to think maybe Phil did a ROI between O'quinn's 4 years for 16 and Monroe starting contract that was worth all that and more for the first year of it and chose O'Quinn do to the cost & potential.

That stable comment is interesting. As crazy as he is I wouldn't mind going after Lance Stephenson either in the 2016 FA (where if the knicks keep their core together they wont have a lot of money and will need to go after under the radar guys and reclamation projects like the 2015 FA) or if the knicks want to move grant to the starting lineup and see Calderon as expendable (Keep in mind I like Calderon as the starter but if they go for grant there I don't like Calderon operating with that bench unit).

Yup...The draft takes place before FA, so I'm confused with the WCS comment. I'm assuming that Phil could not know beforehand that Monroe would not come here...could he? I know that he's complained about the timing of the two events, and feels FA should come before the draft.

I thought that he also liked OK4 more than Towns...no? But Towns does have a midrange game, and I would think that he would have been the best complimentary player with Monroe. He is also a better defender in terms of shot blocking than OK4.

Phil's been talking about the stability factor and a player having a solid support group for a long time, now, and it seemed to be something he considered during the draft and FA.

Lance would have been a mistake, IMO. Too many distractions in his home town. At some point in his career I expect that he could become an option, but he did not exactly distinguish himself last season.

Not doubting what you were told, but pieces don't seem to fit together on the Monroe/WCS scenario. Draft was well before free agency, and obviously Phil chose KP over WCS. Then we never actually made an offer to Monroe (which is one thing if Monroe expressed he didn't want to come to NYC - but then he fit us in for the first available meeting at 12AM July 1st?)

WaltLongmire wrote:Yup...The draft takes place before FA, so I'm confused with the WCS comment. I'm assuming that Phil could not know beforehand that Monroe would not come here...could he? I know that he's complained about the timing of the two events, and feels FA should come before the draft.

I thought that he also liked OK4 more than Towns...no? But Towns does have a midrange game, and I would think that he would have been the best complimentary player with Monroe. He is also a better defender in terms of shot blocking than OK4.

- yes, apparently he had inside info (from his agent) that Monroe wouldn't want to come. but they still reached out to him because phil badly wanted him.
- also knicks were drafting #4 so towns or okafor werent options

callmened wrote:

wargames wrote:You sure that you don't mean Towns and Monroe? That was the duo that it was heavily hinted in the media he wanted and who would of worked together like a glove.

He could of drafted WCS if he had wanted him. Also WCS and Monroe would of been a bad pairing due to the fact they operate in the same area on the court. On the flip I believe this story (if you meant Towns) just because Lopez and KP are also in the same boat in that they fit well together (and around Melo). O'quinn is similar to Monroe in that he's a big who can pass, and likely was on Phil's radar as a possible backup to get if Monroe wasn't available (which is why we traded for him for a second round swap lmao. Some part of me likes to think maybe Phil did a ROI between O'quinn's 4 years for 16 and Monroe starting contract that was worth all that and more for the first year of it and chose O'Quinn do to the cost & potential.

That stable comment is interesting. As crazy as he is I wouldn't mind going after Lance Stephenson either in the 2016 FA (where if the knicks keep their core together they wont have a lot of money and will need to go after under the radar guys and reclamation prorjects like the 2015 FA) or if the knicks want to move grant to the starting lineup and see Calderon as expendable (Keep in mind I like Calderon as the starter but if they go for grant there I don't like Calderon operating with that bench unit).

with the #4 pick they werent going to get towns.
also he heard thru the grapevine that monroe didnt want to come to nyc
i'm just delivering the message. this is all true

WCS and Monroe is such a horrible mix though offensively. It would let opponents just double monroe since WCS is the equivalent of Tyson Chandler offensively.... and Phil could of had WCS (and probably another high first rounder) if he had traded back for him.

WaltLongmire wrote:Yup...The draft takes place before FA, so I'm confused with the WCS comment. I'm assuming that Phil could not know beforehand that Monroe would not come here...could he? I know that he's complained about the timing of the two events, and feels FA should come before the draft.

I thought that he also liked OK4 more than Towns...no? But Towns does have a midrange game, and I would think that he would have been the best complimentary player with Monroe. He is also a better defender in terms of shot blocking than OK4.

Phil's been talking about the stability factor and a player having a solid support group for a long time, now, and it seemed to be something he considered during the draft and FA.

Lance would have been a mistake, IMO. Too many distractions in his home town. At some point in his career I expect that he could become an option, but he did not exactly distinguish himself last season.

Oh I agree about his past and yeah in the real world due to his connections to people in NYC I doubt Phil ever gets him..... but I find him intriguing. If this team performs well I expect a lot of that cap space goes to locking the current guys down for 3-4 years. The knicks are going to have to round the team out with some less likely guys like Lance to get talent.

I'm not saying this isn't true, cause most of it was already reported in his ESPN interview. My questions is why is telling this to a bunch of MSG EMPLOYEES

MaTT4281 wrote:Not doubting what you were told, but pieces don't seem to fit together on the Monroe/WCS scenario. Draft was well before free agency, and obviously Phil chose KP over WCS. Then we never actually made an offer to Monroe (which is one thing if Monroe expressed he didn't want to come to NYC - but then he fit us in for the first available meeting at 12AM July 1st?)

Looking at your signature...

Heard a comment from a pro athlete on the radio this morning(did not catch his name)- might have been Cliff Floyd talking about the Mets' pitchers:

If you want to beat a guy...attack his weaknesses.

If you want to break a guy...attack his strengths.

I'm not coaching anymore...I would have been using phrase all the time if I still was.

I for one wanted WCS as well. I believe we picked the wrong guy at 4. Only time will tell.

knicks1248 wrote:I'm not saying this isn't true, cause most of it was already reported in his ESPN interview. My questions is why is telling this to a bunch of MSG EMPLOYEES

lol great question.

callmened wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:Yup...The draft takes place before FA, so I'm confused with the WCS comment. I'm assuming that Phil could not know beforehand that Monroe would not come here...could he? I know that he's complained about the timing of the two events, and feels FA should come before the draft.

I thought that he also liked OK4 more than Towns...no? But Towns does have a midrange game, and I would think that he would have been the best complimentary player with Monroe. He is also a better defender in terms of shot blocking than OK4.

- yes, apparently he had inside info (from his agent) that Monroe wouldn't want to come. but they still reached out to him because phil badly wanted him.
- also knicks were drafting #4 so towns or okafor werent options

Interesting about the inside info...I think he has some ties to Monroe's agent.

callmened wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:I'm not saying this isn't true, cause most of it was already reported in his ESPN interview. My questions is why is telling this to a bunch of MSG EMPLOYEES

lol great question.

Jackson is always playing with us little folk, it would seem.

After the secret workout with Russell and some other under the radar stuff he's done it is hard to figure him out sometimes.

As is well documented on this site...I'm quite happy we did not take Stein over KP, but as someone said...only time will tell.

wargames wrote:

callmened wrote:

wargames wrote:You sure that you don't mean Towns and Monroe? That was the duo that it was heavily hinted in the media he wanted and who would of worked together like a glove.

He could of drafted WCS if he had wanted him. Also WCS and Monroe would of been a bad pairing due to the fact they operate in the same area on the court. On the flip I believe this story (if you meant Towns) just because Lopez and KP are also in the same boat in that they fit well together (and around Melo). O'quinn is similar to Monroe in that he's a big who can pass, and likely was on Phil's radar as a possible backup to get if Monroe wasn't available (which is why we traded for him for a second round swap lmao. Some part of me likes to think maybe Phil did a ROI between O'quinn's 4 years for 16 and Monroe starting contract that was worth all that and more for the first year of it and chose O'Quinn do to the cost & potential.

That stable comment is interesting. As crazy as he is I wouldn't mind going after Lance Stephenson either in the 2016 FA (where if the knicks keep their core together they wont have a lot of money and will need to go after under the radar guys and reclamation prorjects like the 2015 FA) or if the knicks want to move grant to the starting lineup and see Calderon as expendable (Keep in mind I like Calderon as the starter but if they go for grant there I don't like Calderon operating with that bench unit).

with the #4 pick they werent going to get towns.
also he heard thru the grapevine that monroe didnt want to come to nyc
i'm just delivering the message. this is all true

WCS and Monroe is such a horrible mix though offensively. It would let opponents just double monroe since WCS is the equivalent of Tyson Chandler offensively.... and Phil could of had WCS (and probably another high first rounder) if he had traded back for him.

WaltLongmire wrote:Yup...The draft takes place before FA, so I'm confused with the WCS comment. I'm assuming that Phil could not know beforehand that Monroe would not come here...could he? I know that he's complained about the timing of the two events, and feels FA should come before the draft.

I thought that he also liked OK4 more than Towns...no? But Towns does have a midrange game, and I would think that he would have been the best complimentary player with Monroe. He is also a better defender in terms of shot blocking than OK4.

Phil's been talking about the stability factor and a player having a solid support group for a long time, now, and it seemed to be something he considered during the draft and FA.

Lance would have been a mistake, IMO. Too many distractions in his home town. At some point in his career I expect that he could become an option, but he did not exactly distinguish himself last season.

Oh I agree about his past and yeah in the real world due to his connections to people in NYC I doubt Phil ever gets him..... but I find him intriguing. If this team performs well I expect a lot of that cap space goes to locking the current guys down for 3-4 years. The knicks are going to have to round the team out with some less likely guys like Lance to get talent.

Lance never seems to play "within himself". Always doing something extra. The temptation to showboat or take that unnecessary shot would be heightened in front of the NY audience. I think he will have to be much further along in his career before he is able to come to his home town team.

Knicks1969 wrote:I for one wanted WCS as well. I believe we picked the wrong guy at 4. Only time will tell.

I don't know, reports of WCS being out of shape are seeping thru the internet.

WaltLongmire wrote:

callmened wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:I'm not saying this isn't true, cause most of it was already reported in his ESPN interview. My questions is why is telling this to a bunch of MSG EMPLOYEES

lol great question.

Jackson is always playing with us little folk, it would seem.

After the secret workout with Russell and some other under the radar stuff he's done it is hard to figure him out sometimes.

As is well documented on this site...I'm quite happy we did not take Stein over KP, but as someone said...only time will tell.

The art of working in NYC is the ability to shape the public opinion.
The facts are nothing - the perception is everything.
Phil basically creates a perception that he was right if our picks will work out and was right if they will not.
Masterful.

arkrud wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

callmened wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:I'm not saying this isn't true, cause most of it was already reported in his ESPN interview. My questions is why is telling this to a bunch of MSG EMPLOYEES

lol great question.

Jackson is always playing with us little folk, it would seem.

After the secret workout with Russell and some other under the radar stuff he's done it is hard to figure him out sometimes.

As is well documented on this site...I'm quite happy we did not take Stein over KP, but as someone said...only time will tell.

The art of working in NYC is the ability to shape the public opinion.
The facts are nothing - the perception is everything.
Phil basically creates a perception that he was right if our picks will work out and was right if they will not.
Masterful.

exactly. this is all one big jedi mind trick. ha

Sangfroid wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:I for one wanted WCS as well. I believe we picked the wrong guy at 4. Only time will tell.

I don't know, reports of WCS being out of shape are seeping thru the internet.

Is this true?? Guy always seems to be in great shape.

Did find this from about 2 weeks ago.
http://nba.nbcsports.com/2015/10/05/repo...

Report: Willie Cauley-Stein out of shape
11 Comments
By Dan FeldmanOct 5, 2015, 10:14 AM EDT

How will the Kings fit DeMarcus Cousins, Kosta Koufos and Willie Cauley-Stein into their rotation – especially when Rudy Gay should get minutes at power forward?

The problem might take care of itself.

James Ham of CSN on the Coz and Bru Show:

When you show up to camp and you can’t run up and down the court twice without being so winded you have to pull yourself off the court, then something’s wrong.

This will reopen pre-draft questions about Cauley-Stein’s focus on basketball. But it’s not fair to say a player shouldn’t hold interests outside the sport. Plenty of single-minded players have gotten out of shape, too.

The big worry is that so much of Cauley-Stein’s value comes from his mobility for his size. If he can’t move well, he can’t play.

Cauley-Stein will probably get past this. He’s only a rookie, and there will be many lessons ahead. But for now, it’s a pretty big setback.

Always felt he was a limited player, but in his defense...

My own feeling is that he worked out hard for the pre-draft process and then for the SL, and probably burned himself out psychologically, and did not continue the kind of work outs he usually does to get into shape.

Surprising, considering his rep, but I don't see it as an issue which will haunt him in the future.

Sangfroid wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:I for one wanted WCS as well. I believe we picked the wrong guy at 4. Only time will tell.

I don't know, reports of WCS being out of shape are seeping thru the internet.

I like WCS, think he will be at worst pretty good, but I do question his love for BB which is his second sport.

If given the choice I would choose KP/Rolo over Monroe/WCS

fishmike wrote:

Sangfroid wrote:

Knicks1969 wrote:I for one wanted WCS as well. I believe we picked the wrong guy at 4. Only time will tell.

I don't know, reports of WCS being out of shape are seeping thru the internet.

I like WCS, think he will be at worst pretty good, but I do question his love for BB which is his second sport.

If given the choice I would choose KP/Rolo over Monroe/WCS

in a heartbeat and its not even close

I would not have loved a WCS pick, but I would have kept my mind open. If he showed up as out of shape as described above I would be livid