Knicks · Do you think Phil will make a trade before the deaadline (page 3)

Vmart wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

Vmart wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

Vmart wrote:I think Melo will get moved at his request.

So he's leaving his home because the Knicks are 2 games under 22 games in?

I think Melo knows his best chance at winning is on another team. The Knicks are still very far away from competing for a title.

He choose NY a year ago knowing the championship parts weren't there.

I think evidence strongly suggests he just wanted to be in NY.

I just don't think this urgency that fans feel translates over to players the way we think it does.

Agreed maybe he doesn't have the sense of urgency. But that no trade Claus in his contract says other wise he wanted his contract and control his destination if it doesn't work out.

I think he's already chosen his destination, is my point.

And not for nothing, what do you think he sees his odds on overtaking GS the next couple of years?Where's he going that gives him a shot?

bigbasketballs wrote:

Vmart wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

Vmart wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

Vmart wrote:I think Melo will get moved at his request.

So he's leaving his home because the Knicks are 2 games under 22 games in?

I think Melo knows his best chance at winning is on another team. The Knicks are still very far away from competing for a title.

He choose NY a year ago knowing the championship parts weren't there.

I think evidence strongly suggests he just wanted to be in NY.

I just don't think this urgency that fans feel translates over to players the way we think it does.

Agreed maybe he doesn't have the sense of urgency. But that no trade Claus in his contract says other wise he wanted his contract and control his destination if it doesn't work out.

I think he's already chosen his destination, is my point.

And not for nothing, what do you think he sees his odds on overtaking GS the next couple of years?Where's he going that gives him a shot?

Miami or Cleveland.

Vmart wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

Vmart wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

Vmart wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

Vmart wrote:I think Melo will get moved at his request.

So he's leaving his home because the Knicks are 2 games under 22 games in?

I think Melo knows his best chance at winning is on another team. The Knicks are still very far away from competing for a title.

He choose NY a year ago knowing the championship parts weren't there.

I think evidence strongly suggests he just wanted to be in NY.

I just don't think this urgency that fans feel translates over to players the way we think it does.

Agreed maybe he doesn't have the sense of urgency. But that no trade Claus in his contract says other wise he wanted his contract and control his destination if it doesn't work out.

I think he's already chosen his destination, is my point.

And not for nothing, what do you think he sees his odds on overtaking GS the next couple of years?Where's he going that gives him a shot?

Miami or Cleveland.

Propose a trade(s)?

(and I won't eliminate Cleveland, but c'mon… Cleveland?)

Again, he's already demonstrated championships are not his top priority.

clyderules wrote:Miami seems right. He's practically family.

Okay, how?

WaltLongmire wrote:

Vmart wrote:I think Melo will get moved at his request.

Yup...only way he goes.

Not going to get much value back for him, though, and of course his contract make any possible trade much more complicated-perhaps even impossible, I would assume.

He has not shown enough since the injury to warrant any kind of trade that we would like, IMO...and if he does start playing well, we might be winning, and it would be difficult to give him up under those circumstances.

What team would actually want an older player coming off a knee injury? He would be a complimentary player on a good team, and no rebuilding team would give up valuable draft picks or players for him at this point.

Not going to happen.

At this point of time given how far out of whack his contract is wrt. his production and health issues I would be inclined to keep him another year or two. Any good team that wants him won't part with anything of value, and we don't need longer term or even more toxic contracts back. Now if someone like Miami would give up a Winslow in package then definitely look at it. We won't get a legitimate start back, but we can possibly get some high upside yoots.

Galloway Afflalo Melo Porzingis Lopez

Williams Calderon Lance Grant Serapin OQuinn off the bench.

Williams should be the 6th man. He has that skillset.

This offense doesn't do traditional guards. If you can upgrade the guard spots with guys who can handle the ball but aren't traditional PG's that would be ideal. A guy like Avery Bradley or Marcus Smart out of Boston would be perfect. Chalmers would be a nice add. They wont trade him, but Alec Burks in Utah or Patrick Beverly in Houston are nice too.

meloshouldgo wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

Vmart wrote:I think Melo will get moved at his request.

Yup...only way he goes.

Not going to get much value back for him, though, and of course his contract make any possible trade much more complicated-perhaps even impossible, I would assume.

He has not shown enough since the injury to warrant any kind of trade that we would like, IMO...and if he does start playing well, we might be winning, and it would be difficult to give him up under those circumstances.

What team would actually want an older player coming off a knee injury? He would be a complimentary player on a good team, and no rebuilding team would give up valuable draft picks or players for him at this point.

Not going to happen.

At this point of time given how far out of whack his contract is wrt. his production and health issues I would be inclined to keep him another year or two. Any good team that wants him won't part with anything of value, and we don't need longer term or even more toxic contracts back. Now if someone like Miami would give up a Winslow in package then definitely look at it. We won't get a legitimate start back, but we can possibly get some high upside yoots.

That is the problem that this organization always makes. They never take into consideration the time needed for his replacement to get acclimated. Say the Heat make a deal where they send Winslow and Deng for Melo. The Knicks are not going to win a championship with their current team with Melo if Melo decides to hang around and not win here he would have eaten into Prozingis years. Now the Knicks have to develop another player after Melo and that will eat into more of the Prozingis years.

You get a deal done now and have Winslow and Prozingis develop together and 3-4 years down the line you have two developed players going forward.

I'm just using Heat as an example it could be any team.

bigbasketballs wrote:

clyderules wrote:Miami seems right. He's practically family.

Okay, how?

See Thanksgiving of November 2015.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/25935...

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

clyderules wrote:Miami seems right. He's practically family.

Okay, how?

See Thanksgiving of November 2015.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/25935...

I meant, how do you get him to Miami?

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

clyderules wrote:Miami seems right. He's practically family.

Okay, how?

See Thanksgiving of November 2015.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/25935...

I meant, how do you get him to Miami?

ESPN trade machine checks out.

See. Anyone can be a GM!

I don't know that we'll see a ton of drastic moves thoughout the league. I could see Philly trying to make some moves to have a more sensible roster, maybe moving some picks for actual players. I could see Milwaukee trying to shake up their roster - it seems like a mess right now. I could see the Pelicans making a move to shake up their roster.

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ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

clyderules wrote:Miami seems right. He's practically family.

Okay, how?

See Thanksgiving of November 2015.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/25935...

I meant, how do you get him to Miami?

ESPN trade machine checks out.

See. Anyone can be a GM!

So Miami is passing on Whiteside next year? They picking Melo over him?

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

clyderules wrote:Miami seems right. He's practically family.

Okay, how?

See Thanksgiving of November 2015.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/25935...

I meant, how do you get him to Miami?

ESPN trade machine checks out.

See. Anyone can be a GM!

So Miami is passing on Whiteside next year? They picking Melo over him?

?

Don't they have his bird rights?

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

clyderules wrote:Miami seems right. He's practically family.

Okay, how?

See Thanksgiving of November 2015.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/25935...

I meant, how do you get him to Miami?

ESPN trade machine checks out.

See. Anyone can be a GM!

So Miami is passing on Whiteside next year? They picking Melo over him?

?

Don't they have his bird rights?

No, they have his early Bird rights and given he already had two years service time before they got him, that means he's unrestricted.

So they essentially have nothing. They don't have matching rights. They can only re-sign to 175% of his 2015-16 salary or 104.5% this season's average salary.

He gets a big contract, they have to use cap room to sign him. If they have Melo-Wade-Bosh-Dragic on the books, Whiteside is gone unless he plays for the average salary for at least 2 years.

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

clyderules wrote:Miami seems right. He's practically family.

Okay, how?

See Thanksgiving of November 2015.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/25935...

I meant, how do you get him to Miami?

ESPN trade machine checks out.

See. Anyone can be a GM!

So Miami is passing on Whiteside next year? They picking Melo over him?

?

Don't they have his bird rights?

No, they have his early Bird rights and given he already had two years service time before they got him, that means he's unrestricted.

So they essentially have nothing. They don't have matching rights. They can only re-sign to 175% of his 2015-16 salary or 104.5% this season's average salary.

He gets a big contract, they have to use cap room to sign him. If they have Melo-Wade-Bosh-Dragic on the books, Whiteside is gone unless he plays for the average salary for at least 2 years.

Doesn't the salary cap go up next year?

http://nba.nbcsports.com/2015/04/17/repo...

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

clyderules wrote:Miami seems right. He's practically family.

Okay, how?

See Thanksgiving of November 2015.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/25935...

I meant, how do you get him to Miami?

ESPN trade machine checks out.

See. Anyone can be a GM!

So Miami is passing on Whiteside next year? They picking Melo over him?

?

Don't they have his bird rights?

No, they have his early Bird rights and given he already had two years service time before they got him, that means he's unrestricted.

So they essentially have nothing. They don't have matching rights. They can only re-sign to 175% of his 2015-16 salary or 104.5% this season's average salary.

He gets a big contract, they have to use cap room to sign him. If they have Melo-Wade-Bosh-Dragic on the books, Whiteside is gone unless he plays for the average salary for at least 2 years.

Doesn't the salary cap go up next year?

http://nba.nbcsports.com/2015/04/17/repo...

It does. Significantly.

Trying adding up Bosh, Melo, Dragic 2016-17's salaries and Wade's cap hold, subtract it from the new cap and see what you have left.

Spoiler warning - this is legitimate ... and common knowledge.

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

clyderules wrote:Miami seems right. He's practically family.

Okay, how?

See Thanksgiving of November 2015.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/25935...

I meant, how do you get him to Miami?

ESPN trade machine checks out.

See. Anyone can be a GM!

So Miami is passing on Whiteside next year? They picking Melo over him?

?

Don't they have his bird rights?

No, they have his early Bird rights and given he already had two years service time before they got him, that means he's unrestricted.

So they essentially have nothing. They don't have matching rights. They can only re-sign to 175% of his 2015-16 salary or 104.5% this season's average salary.

He gets a big contract, they have to use cap room to sign him. If they have Melo-Wade-Bosh-Dragic on the books, Whiteside is gone unless he plays for the average salary for at least 2 years.

Doesn't the salary cap go up next year?

http://nba.nbcsports.com/2015/04/17/repo...

It does. Significantly.

Trying adding up Bosh, Melo, Dragic 2016-17's salaries and Wade's cap hold, subtract it from the new cap and see what you have left.

Spoiler warning - this is legitimate ... and common knowledge.

Isn't Wade a free agent also? Don't think he'd sign for the max at his age again.

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

clyderules wrote:Miami seems right. He's practically family.

Okay, how?

See Thanksgiving of November 2015.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/25935...

I meant, how do you get him to Miami?

ESPN trade machine checks out.

See. Anyone can be a GM!

So Miami is passing on Whiteside next year? They picking Melo over him?

?

Don't they have his bird rights?

No, they have his early Bird rights and given he already had two years service time before they got him, that means he's unrestricted.

So they essentially have nothing. They don't have matching rights. They can only re-sign to 175% of his 2015-16 salary or 104.5% this season's average salary.

He gets a big contract, they have to use cap room to sign him. If they have Melo-Wade-Bosh-Dragic on the books, Whiteside is gone unless he plays for the average salary for at least 2 years.

Doesn't the salary cap go up next year?

http://nba.nbcsports.com/2015/04/17/repo...

It does. Significantly.

Trying adding up Bosh, Melo, Dragic 2016-17's salaries and Wade's cap hold, subtract it from the new cap and see what you have left.

Spoiler warning - this is legitimate ... and common knowledge.

Isn't Wade a free agent also? Don't think he'd sign for the max at his age again.

Melo-Bosh-Dragic will make $65m between them.

If Melo is declining, and Melo-Wade-Bosh are so close and Wade is still good enough to make them a legit contender (then entire premise of the concept), how much you think Wade's settling for, given what he already deferred?

Either way, subtract Winslow's $2.6m from the $24m you have left.

Now, show me how Miami can sign Wade, Whiteside and 6 other players (making their bench worth a damn) for $21.4m.

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:

bigbasketballs wrote:

clyderules wrote:Miami seems right. He's practically family.

Okay, how?

See Thanksgiving of November 2015.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/25935...

I meant, how do you get him to Miami?

ESPN trade machine checks out.

See. Anyone can be a GM!

So Miami is passing on Whiteside next year? They picking Melo over him?

?

Don't they have his bird rights?

No, they have his early Bird rights and given he already had two years service time before they got him, that means he's unrestricted.

So they essentially have nothing. They don't have matching rights. They can only re-sign to 175% of his 2015-16 salary or 104.5% this season's average salary.

He gets a big contract, they have to use cap room to sign him. If they have Melo-Wade-Bosh-Dragic on the books, Whiteside is gone unless he plays for the average salary for at least 2 years.

Doesn't the salary cap go up next year?

http://nba.nbcsports.com/2015/04/17/repo...

It does. Significantly.

Trying adding up Bosh, Melo, Dragic 2016-17's salaries and Wade's cap hold, subtract it from the new cap and see what you have left.

Spoiler warning - this is legitimate ... and common knowledge.

Isn't Wade a free agent also? Don't think he'd sign for the max at his age again.

Melo-Bosh-Dragic will make $65m between them.

If Melo is declining, and Melo-Wade-Bosh are so close and Wade is still good enough to make them a legit contender (then entire premise of the concept), how much you think Wade's settling for, given what he already deferred?

Either way, subtract Winslow's $2.6m from the $24m you have left.

Now, show me how Miami can sign Wade, Whiteside and 6 other players (making their bench worth a damn) for $21.4m.

They can offer Whiteside less than the max and see if he bites. Wade, if he still cares about winning and stayin in Miami, can settle in a lower 3 or 4 year contract. Sign the rest to vet minimums. Hey they did it before, right?