Knicks · The Return of The Real Carmelo (page 1)
Bonn1997 wrote:ten what?
Rebounds....
28/8/5 assists/1 1/2 blocks/1 steal.
That is a lot more like what he his numbers will look like
Bonn1997 wrote:There's a big difference between 10 and his normal healthy 6 to 7 rbs and a big difference between 5 and his normal 3 assists a game. You're talking about him doing things he's never done before. Regardless of those per game stats, I just want to see him make (MUCH) more than 43% of his 2 point shots .
He will. I expect for him to do a much better job rebounding and passing the ball. He has the capabilities. Instead of getting mad at Barkley for calling him out, he needs to let his game speaks for itself. Go out there and defend like he did in Portland; suddenly the whole world will take notice
I hope he's back - this team is 8-3 when he shoots over 40% from the field. We're a different, better team with a good Carmelo.
crzymdups wrote:I don't know that he's back yet. He didn't trust his shot in the Sacramento game - he looked very off to me in that one. I hope he's back, but he's had hot games before that haven't carried over - Washington, Brooklyn, etc.I hope he's back - this team is 8-3 when he shoots over 40% from the field. We're a different, better team with a good Carmelo.
I wonder if he changed his preface routine to fit the Carmelo he is today. If not, perhaps he needs to consider going to the arena earlier to work on his game. I really don't like the fourth quarter Carmelo I have seen the last two years; he definitely needs to improve in that department. In the forth, he needs to stop settling for jumpers and put onus on the refs by attacking the basket. IMO, he is getting his catches way too far from the basket. He needs to get in the paint to do his things. He should be shooting at least 8 freethrows per game
this season was not supposed to be about making the playoffs anyway. it was supposed to be about learning how to play as a unit and engaging in the process of learning how to win and what it takes to sustain a level of excellence.
fishmike wrote:the real Carmelo was able to sustain performances like that for a month at time and carry a team to many wins while winning NBA player of the month. What we have now is an oversized SF who takes tons of jump shots. Its very possible (cringe) this team was built with that Carmelo (the *real* Carmelo) in mind and he's never coming back. Time will tell. Portland game was promising. So was Sac. Some hybrid of the two is ideal.
At 31 coming off that surgery, it was tough to expect that Carmelo to fully come back. We won't see him put up 30 ppg consistently, but hopefully we don't have to. What i'm hoping for is an equally efficient Melo to come back, in less minutes. For him to be back, i will judge it on shooting percents climbing back up, rather than total ppg. And some games like that from time to time where he just takes over. Hopefully we get back 90% of the old Melo, which i think we will.
However, we simply do not have the weapons needed, for better BALL AND PLAYER movement, along with shooters to spread the floor
Therefore we need to upgrade our roster to execute a philosophy
I still believe CA plays his best at PF, while the combination of Lopez, KP, and CA is simply too slow and has too many weakness together on BOTH OFF and DEF
At least until KP can take advantage of his mismatches and get stronger, while developing his skills and body
ROLO needs to also improve his lack of OFFENSE and poor hands, along with a more consistent FREE THROW DISTANCE shot that he is capable of making
He currently is a HUGE liability on OFFENSE and isn't good enough in DEFENSE/REBOUNDING/SHOT BLOCKING to START with our roster
Though he is 26 and could improve and has a strong work ethic like Jared Jeffries improved from his 1st stinct to 2nd stinct
If we can trade him with the Centers available this summer, I would do so
With some other players from the other post I made,
Though we can improve with smaller contracts like
Ish Smith (as there will be a HUGE crop of PGs to chose from in 1 1/2 year)
Shabazz Muhmmedd (who is available in trade talks eventually)
Evan Turner
David Lee/Josh Smith
Lance Stephnson/Tony Wroten
With Durant being in a contract year and the rise of the cap, will OKC keep both Westbrook and Durant? At 30m per year? And Ibaka will be looking for an extension as well with Triston Thompson setting the market...
Or may Westbrook seek to go to another team, whether Durant resigns or not, could give him an incentive to leave, especially to a larger market to promote his branding
MSG and Westbrook would give each other ENERGY like no other arena, while IMO, Westbrook needs a system to tweak his style of play to being a more efficient player on BOTH ENDS
IF Westbrook wanted to force his way out of OKC to NYK's, he could, rather than being a possible pawn in signing an extension with 2 alphas in OKC and being known as a cheap low market team while Dolan would overpay for him till he is 38
Knicks1969 wrote:Bonn1997 wrote:ten what?Rebounds....
28/8/5 assists/1 1/2 blocks/1 steal.
That is a lot more like what he his numbers will look like
whoa! Are you dreaming?
fishmike wrote:the real Carmelo was able to sustain performances like that for a month at time and carry a team to many wins while winning NBA player of the month. What we have now is an oversized SF who takes tons of jump shots. Its very possible (cringe) this team was built with that Carmelo (the *real* Carmelo) in mind and he's never coming back. Time will tell. Portland game was promising. So was Sac. Some hybrid of the two is ideal.
He never avg'd 10 rebounds and 5 assists for a month. He probably never did that for 3 straight games.
5APG is "real?" Wish Melo could average 5 APG...did not do it in his prime, though- never even cracked 4. He has been a much better distributor at times this year, which I like. He should continue to do it, even if guys are missing too many of the good looks he gets them.
If he is scoring 28PPG it will mean that the offense is broken and Anthony is putting up a ton of shots, since he is not going to have the 62% from the field he had the other day. This is not "real," and not good for the team, either.
If the Knicks are not winning, and he is averaging 28PPG, who cares. If he's doing it, and we are winning and the team is playing like a team, then I can accept it.
You know you have a losing team when fans cling to the statistics other than the winning % of their team. If you play the right way and win, the good stats will be there to cherish and roll about in like a pig in mud.
Most important thing for this season though is the development of our "younger" players, and I'm not just talking about the rookies. Have to see if we have something in Williams, Gallo, and O'Quinn, and I'd really like to know if Early has a future with the team.
At this time I'm probably more willing to accept a certain kind of play if it can somehow sneak us into the playoff picture because it would be good for the franchise and a selling point to FAs, but if a situation develops where there is an offensive imbalance, and the team is losing while the rookies are stagnant in their development, what is the point of it all?
WaltLongmire wrote:Have no idea what the word "Real" means to some.5APG is "real?" Wish Melo could average 5 APG...did not do it in his prime, though- never even cracked 4. He has been a much better distributor at times this year, which I like. He should continue to do it, even if guys are missing too many of the good looks he gets them.
If he is scoring 28PPG it will mean that the offense is broken and Anthony is putting up a ton of shots, since he is not going to have the 62% from the field he had the other day. This is not "real," and not good for the team, either.
If the Knicks are not winning, and he is averaging 28PPG, who cares. If he's doing it, and we are winning and the team is playing like a team, then I can accept it.
You know you have a losing team when fans cling to the statistics other than the winning % of their team. If you play the right way and win, the good stats will be there to cherish and roll about in like a pig in mud.
Most important thing for this season though is the development of our "younger" players, and I'm not just talking about the rookies. Have to see if we have something in Williams, Gallo, and O'Quinn, and I'd really like to know if Early has a future with the team.
At this time I'm probably more willing to accept a certain kind of play if it can somehow sneak us into the playoff picture because it would be good for the franchise and a selling point to FAs, but if a situation develops where there is an offensive imbalance, and the team is losing while the rookies are stagnant in their development, what is the point of it all?
+1
dk7th wrote:WaltLongmire wrote:Have no idea what the word "Real" means to some.5APG is "real?" Wish Melo could average 5 APG...did not do it in his prime, though- never even cracked 4. He has been a much better distributor at times this year, which I like. He should continue to do it, even if guys are missing too many of the good looks he gets them.
If he is scoring 28PPG it will mean that the offense is broken and Anthony is putting up a ton of shots, since he is not going to have the 62% from the field he had the other day. This is not "real," and not good for the team, either.
If the Knicks are not winning, and he is averaging 28PPG, who cares. If he's doing it, and we are winning and the team is playing like a team, then I can accept it.
You know you have a losing team when fans cling to the statistics other than the winning % of their team. If you play the right way and win, the good stats will be there to cherish and roll about in like a pig in mud.
Most important thing for this season though is the development of our "younger" players, and I'm not just talking about the rookies. Have to see if we have something in Williams, Gallo, and O'Quinn, and I'd really like to know if Early has a future with the team.
At this time I'm probably more willing to accept a certain kind of play if it can somehow sneak us into the playoff picture because it would be good for the franchise and a selling point to FAs, but if a situation develops where there is an offensive imbalance, and the team is losing while the rookies are stagnant in their development, what is the point of it all?
+1
1 + 1
mreinman wrote:I never quoted numbers. He's has carried teams with his scoring for months at a time and won player of the month while doing so. I value the wins, not the other #s. Thats what I want to see.fishmike wrote:the real Carmelo was able to sustain performances like that for a month at time and carry a team to many wins while winning NBA player of the month. What we have now is an oversized SF who takes tons of jump shots. Its very possible (cringe) this team was built with that Carmelo (the *real* Carmelo) in mind and he's never coming back. Time will tell. Portland game was promising. So was Sac. Some hybrid of the two is ideal.He never avg'd 10 rebounds and 5 assists for a month. He probably never did that for 3 straight games.
WaltLongmire wrote:Have no idea what the word "Real" means to some.Melo has played 12 years. I believe every year he's led his team in scoring and his first 10 seasons in the NBA were all winning seasons. The anti Melo crowd would have you believe he's a career loser putting up good numbers. His problem has been the post season where his style of play and/or lack of team depth have been exposed each year. Losing regular season games is a new thing for him.5APG is "real?" Wish Melo could average 5 APG...did not do it in his prime, though- never even cracked 4. He has been a much better distributor at times this year, which I like. He should continue to do it, even if guys are missing too many of the good looks he gets them.
If he is scoring 28PPG it will mean that the offense is broken and Anthony is putting up a ton of shots, since he is not going to have the 62% from the field he had the other day. This is not "real," and not good for the team, either.
If the Knicks are not winning, and he is averaging 28PPG, who cares. If he's doing it, and we are winning and the team is playing like a team, then I can accept it.
You know you have a losing team when fans cling to the statistics other than the winning % of their team. If you play the right way and win, the good stats will be there to cherish and roll about in like a pig in mud.
Most important thing for this season though is the development of our "younger" players, and I'm not just talking about the rookies. Have to see if we have something in Williams, Gallo, and O'Quinn, and I'd really like to know if Early has a future with the team.
At this time I'm probably more willing to accept a certain kind of play if it can somehow sneak us into the playoff picture because it would be good for the franchise and a selling point to FAs, but if a situation develops where there is an offensive imbalance, and the team is losing while the rookies are stagnant in their development, what is the point of it all?
As father time kicks in we will see how he adjusts. He's passed better and defended better this year. Sadly for Knick fans we have yet to view those improved traits with some good shooting as well. Now would be nice!
fishmike wrote:WaltLongmire wrote:Have no idea what the word "Real" means to some.Melo has played 12 years. I believe every year he's led his team in scoring and his first 10 seasons in the NBA were all winning seasons. The anti Melo crowd would have you believe he's a career loser putting up good numbers. His problem has been the post season where his style of play and/or lack of team depth have been exposed each year. Losing regular season games is a new thing for him.5APG is "real?" Wish Melo could average 5 APG...did not do it in his prime, though- never even cracked 4. He has been a much better distributor at times this year, which I like. He should continue to do it, even if guys are missing too many of the good looks he gets them.
If he is scoring 28PPG it will mean that the offense is broken and Anthony is putting up a ton of shots, since he is not going to have the 62% from the field he had the other day. This is not "real," and not good for the team, either.
If the Knicks are not winning, and he is averaging 28PPG, who cares. If he's doing it, and we are winning and the team is playing like a team, then I can accept it.
You know you have a losing team when fans cling to the statistics other than the winning % of their team. If you play the right way and win, the good stats will be there to cherish and roll about in like a pig in mud.
Most important thing for this season though is the development of our "younger" players, and I'm not just talking about the rookies. Have to see if we have something in Williams, Gallo, and O'Quinn, and I'd really like to know if Early has a future with the team.
At this time I'm probably more willing to accept a certain kind of play if it can somehow sneak us into the playoff picture because it would be good for the franchise and a selling point to FAs, but if a situation develops where there is an offensive imbalance, and the team is losing while the rookies are stagnant in their development, what is the point of it all?
As father time kicks in we will see how he adjusts. He's passed better and defended better this year. Sadly for Knick fans we have yet to view those improved traits with some good shooting as well. Now would be nice!
you're right... it's his style of play. so you can't throw his teammates under the bus for the playoff failures every single year. that's just a way of avoiding the uncomfortable truth that his style of play, with its profound flaws, gets exposed in the playoffs. he is the the red thread in his own career.
dk7th wrote:fishmike wrote:WaltLongmire wrote:Have no idea what the word "Real" means to some.Melo has played 12 years. I believe every year he's led his team in scoring and his first 10 seasons in the NBA were all winning seasons. The anti Melo crowd would have you believe he's a career loser putting up good numbers. His problem has been the post season where his style of play and/or lack of team depth have been exposed each year. Losing regular season games is a new thing for him.5APG is "real?" Wish Melo could average 5 APG...did not do it in his prime, though- never even cracked 4. He has been a much better distributor at times this year, which I like. He should continue to do it, even if guys are missing too many of the good looks he gets them.
If he is scoring 28PPG it will mean that the offense is broken and Anthony is putting up a ton of shots, since he is not going to have the 62% from the field he had the other day. This is not "real," and not good for the team, either.
If the Knicks are not winning, and he is averaging 28PPG, who cares. If he's doing it, and we are winning and the team is playing like a team, then I can accept it.
You know you have a losing team when fans cling to the statistics other than the winning % of their team. If you play the right way and win, the good stats will be there to cherish and roll about in like a pig in mud.
Most important thing for this season though is the development of our "younger" players, and I'm not just talking about the rookies. Have to see if we have something in Williams, Gallo, and O'Quinn, and I'd really like to know if Early has a future with the team.
At this time I'm probably more willing to accept a certain kind of play if it can somehow sneak us into the playoff picture because it would be good for the franchise and a selling point to FAs, but if a situation develops where there is an offensive imbalance, and the team is losing while the rookies are stagnant in their development, what is the point of it all?
As father time kicks in we will see how he adjusts. He's passed better and defended better this year. Sadly for Knick fans we have yet to view those improved traits with some good shooting as well. Now would be nice!
you're right... it's his style of play. so you can't throw his teammates under the bus for the playoff failures every single year. that's just a way of avoiding the uncomfortable truth that his style of play, with its profound flaws, gets exposed in the playoffs. he is the the red thread in his own career.
Would you keep passing to players if they kept missing just to say i'm a team player, would you do anything with anyone who's unreliable. The only time your best scorer should pass the ball is if he's double, or if someone has a better shot. Too many times i see passes that never had a chance, it results in a T O, and the same peole who wanted him to pass, will say how could make that pass.
All i ever want from a player, is to play hard and smart, if you do that, every hitting else will work out
fishmike wrote:WaltLongmire wrote:Have no idea what the word "Real" means to some.Melo has played 12 years. I believe every year he's led his team in scoring and his first 10 seasons in the NBA were all winning seasons. The anti Melo crowd would have you believe he's a career loser putting up good numbers. His problem has been the post season where his style of play and/or lack of team depth have been exposed each year. Losing regular season games is a new thing for him.5APG is "real?" Wish Melo could average 5 APG...did not do it in his prime, though- never even cracked 4. He has been a much better distributor at times this year, which I like. He should continue to do it, even if guys are missing too many of the good looks he gets them.
If he is scoring 28PPG it will mean that the offense is broken and Anthony is putting up a ton of shots, since he is not going to have the 62% from the field he had the other day. This is not "real," and not good for the team, either.
If the Knicks are not winning, and he is averaging 28PPG, who cares. If he's doing it, and we are winning and the team is playing like a team, then I can accept it.
You know you have a losing team when fans cling to the statistics other than the winning % of their team. If you play the right way and win, the good stats will be there to cherish and roll about in like a pig in mud.
Most important thing for this season though is the development of our "younger" players, and I'm not just talking about the rookies. Have to see if we have something in Williams, Gallo, and O'Quinn, and I'd really like to know if Early has a future with the team.
At this time I'm probably more willing to accept a certain kind of play if it can somehow sneak us into the playoff picture because it would be good for the franchise and a selling point to FAs, but if a situation develops where there is an offensive imbalance, and the team is losing while the rookies are stagnant in their development, what is the point of it all?
As father time kicks in we will see how he adjusts. He's passed better and defended better this year. Sadly for Knick fans we have yet to view those improved traits with some good shooting as well. Now would be nice!
Melo is an interesting player. He's very very very good. He's not Lebron or Jordan or Kobe - but for some reason there is this weird expectation he should be? I think he's the next tier down. He's advanced to the conference finals in the stacked Western Conference, something Chris Paul has never done. Something TMac never did. Etc. He came to NY and has played very well, but you can argue we've made some terrible team building decisions around him. Exercising Billups' team option only to amnesty him after the lockout. Then not having that amnesty for Amare. Trading for Bargnani. Letting Lin go for nothing in return. Passing on the potential to trade for Kyle Lowry, which would've been their best trade in years. etc.
You look at his seasons in Denver - he had a pretty good team around him in a stacked Western Conference. In the first round every year they were matching up against the top teams in the West. look at this - three of six years lost to the NBA champion, another year lost to the Lakers who made the Finals, another year the Timberwolves who had MVP KG and made the WCF.
2004 - rookie season lost to the Western conf finalists Timberwolves in KG's MVP season.
2005 - lost to the NBA champion Spurs in first round
2006 - lost to the Clippers in first round
2007 - lost to the NBA champion Spurs in first round
2008 - lost to the NBA finalists Lakers in first round
2009 - made conference finals, lost to NBA champion Lakers in 6 games
etc