^ I don't think Melo realizes he should've passed more. I'm hoping the rest of the team and I he coaches realize it though and adjust accordingly
That was a missed opportunity. Here's the rub. When you watch feeds for other teams that pass a lot and have player movement they all say you have to pass to reward the movement. Players will move more if you pass more.
That's why I hate the iso crap so much. It has a cost on team spirit
martin wrote:nixluva wrote:This was a situation that was partly due to the back to back. There were so many missed shots from POINT BLANK RANGE! Melo has actually made many great passes and I fully expect he realizes he should've passed it more but he did have a TON of open looks as did others. As a whole this team passes well. If they can improve on that just a little it will push them higher. The level of competition has been pretty stiff and recently this team has been playing at a much higher level. I'm not overly concerned 😳
If Melo can't survive a back to back with 2 off days before that, he's in trouble. And this was a home and home, so really no excuse.
Dude has got to pick his spots and know when he's got it and when he doesn't.
And not for nothing, but he should have hit a WIDE OPEN KP during the end of regulation for the first Hornets game.
I agree under most circumstances but that 2st game was grueling and both teams looked spent but the Knicks have older guys at the core of the team. It's to the benefit of the younger Hornets.
I also agree that both Melo and Rose have missed WIDE OPEN KP the last 2 games.
Game in NY went over time and Melo carried the team. His shot after regulation about went in.
Then 5 more minutes.
Melo sat a lot last nite and when the knicks tied it late in the game it was simple: Someone gets hot this team wins.
Instead, Frank Phucking Kaminsky got it done.
Lamb did not play in NY, got 17 rebs and was clutch. Hawes did not play either, and Walker was in foul trouble and was fresh for game two.
No excuses, the game was close. Melo is a proven scorer. He was flat and they denied KP. Rose shot was off and Jennings can't freaking shoot. Courtney Lee did ok.
I suppose Melo will always get the flak when not able to seal the deal.
This team will have taken a step fwd when they learn to win games when melo has little to no impact
nyknickzingis wrote:And move the ball when he's off. He's playing as if he's Jordan or Kobe in their prime and I'm sorry he just isn't that kind of player. They have to run less Melo iso sets. When he is on, that's fine. However tonight he was off clearly physically he was tired and we kept letting him isolate and let Melo take so many shots.This is not to say I want KP shooting those shots, but we have some good shooters on this team and we have KP playing well. We need to find a way to get our offense going without relying on Melo so much. There just isn't a way this team can be a good playoff team if they are relying on Melo to carry the team. He is not that kind of player, certainly not now while his prime is almost over. An all-star for sure, but not a guy you want taking these many shots and getting so many ISO plays.
it will never happen, he is taking 20 shots whether he hits them or not
CrushAlot wrote:knicks1248 wrote:This team will have taken a step fwd when they learn to win games when melo has little to no impact
Or when he doesn't play.
+1
The ugly little stat that so easily gets ignored...
Jmpasq wrote:Vmart wrote:Rose wasn't great either 6-20. Combined with Melo these two were a staggering 13-45.
Rose had 8 assists and 8 boards with just 1 TO his shooting I can live with. Melo is a waste of space if he isnt shooting well
Ummm, Melo the waste of space had 8 boards too. Funny how that stat shines for someone else, but not for Melo.
Yeah, yeah, I know, at 6'8" Melo should have 15 boards every night.
Oh wait, most of those rebounds were off his own misses, right? Because we all know following your own shot is for losers.
If Rose or no one else is getting it done, what would you rather have Melo do? Disappear like H20 used to?
Melo's 13 years in the NBA has a playoff career that should explain Melo status as a NBA player.
Those who want to believe Melo is the best player on the team, or is a star player, rather than a scorer like Allan Houston its on them.
Dolan gave all the reign of the Knicks to Melo, after Donnie Walsh hoodwink Dolan with some 2010 Plan to get Lebron.
Melo has never been a team-baller or team leader .. Melo is just a INDIVIDUAL scorer, that's it.
Kemet wrote:Melo's 13 years in the NBA has a playoff career that should explain Melo status as a NBA player.
Those who want to believe Melo is the best player on the team, or is a star player, rather than a scorer like Allan Houston its on them.
Dolan gave all the reign of the Knicks to Melo, after Donnie Walsh hoodwink Dolan with some 2010 Plan to get Lebron.
Melo has never been a team-baller or team leader .. Melo is just a INDIVIDUAL scorer, that's it.
That's a bit overstated tho! Yes Melo is a scorer but he's gotten better at passing and even defending even if it's not always consistent. We need him right now and there isn't a replacement you can name to take his spot. Most of the top guys are locked into their own teams right now.
We have to accept that for now Melo is here and we need him in order to succeed.
Jmpasq wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:And move the ball when he's off. He's playing as if he's Jordan or Kobe in their prime and I'm sorry he just isn't that kind of player. They have to run less Melo iso sets. When he is on, that's fine. However tonight he was off clearly physically he was tired and we kept letting him isolate and let Melo take so many shots.This is not to say I want KP shooting those shots, but we have some good shooters on this team and we have KP playing well. We need to find a way to get our offense going without relying on Melo so much. There just isn't a way this team can be a good playoff team if they are relying on Melo to carry the team. He is not that kind of player, certainly not now while his prime is almost over. An all-star for sure, but not a guy you want taking these many shots and getting so many ISO plays.
it will never happen, he is taking 20 shots whether he hits them or not
So true .. They been saying that bout Melo in Denver during the Miller for Iverson trade.
That's Melo career shooting 20 or more shots per game.
Melo don't perform to win games, Melo perform to increase his scoring stats.
What else does Melo do for the win for 35 minute on court per game?
I never was happy bout the Marbury or Melo trade to NY.
nixluva wrote:Kemet wrote:Melo's 13 years in the NBA has a playoff career that should explain Melo status as a NBA player.
Those who want to believe Melo is the best player on the team, or is a star player, rather than a scorer like Allan Houston its on them.
Dolan gave all the reign of the Knicks to Melo, after Donnie Walsh hoodwink Dolan with some 2010 Plan to get Lebron.
Melo has never been a team-baller or team leader .. Melo is just a INDIVIDUAL scorer, that's it.
That's a bit overstated tho! Yes Melo is a scorer but he's gotten better at passing and even defending even if it's not always consistent. We need him right now and there isn't a replacement you can name to take his spot. Most of the top guys are locked into their own teams right now.
We have to accept that for now Melo is here and we need him in order to succeed.
Agree. The Knicks haven't won without him in over a year.
StarksEwing1 wrote:Melo really should realize that he fits better as the second guy now that we have KP rising fast. He shouldn't take offense to that because it will make his job easier and the team better
Yawn...with your insistence on KP being the first option. Sorry but KP is not better than him....yet.
nyknickzingis wrote:And move the ball when he's off. He's playing as if he's Jordan or Kobe in their prime and I'm sorry he just isn't that kind of player. They have to run less Melo iso sets. When he is on, that's fine. However tonight he was off clearly physically he was tired and we kept letting him isolate and let Melo take so many shots.This is not to say I want KP shooting those shots, but we have some good shooters on this team and we have KP playing well. We need to find a way to get our offense going without relying on Melo so much. There just isn't a way this team can be a good playoff team if they are relying on Melo to carry the team. He is not that kind of player, certainly not now while his prime is almost over. An all-star for sure, but not a guy you want taking these many shots and getting so many ISO plays.
Fair point. Think the loss against the Hornets shows he needs to have this mindset more when his shot is off. Think he feels it's his job alone to bring team back when down by large margins. Specially coming off a great game the night before when he made clutch passes at end of the game. May have been also that no one else was playing well. Except for Jennings. Think we win if JH leaves him in.
jrodmc wrote:Jmpasq wrote:Vmart wrote:Rose wasn't great either 6-20. Combined with Melo these two were a staggering 13-45.
Rose had 8 assists and 8 boards with just 1 TO his shooting I can live with. Melo is a waste of space if he isnt shooting well
Ummm, Melo the waste of space had 8 boards too. Funny how that stat shines for someone else, but not for Melo.
Yeah, yeah, I know, at 6'8" Melo should have 15 boards every night.
Oh wait, most of those rebounds were off his own misses, right? Because we all know following your own shot is for losers.
If Rose or no one else is getting it done, what would you rather have Melo do? Disappear like H20 used to?
Funny how we didn't see a shit load of Melo played great threads after Fridays game.
HofstraBBall wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:And move the ball when he's off. He's playing as if he's Jordan or Kobe in their prime and I'm sorry he just isn't that kind of player. They have to run less Melo iso sets. When he is on, that's fine. However tonight he was off clearly physically he was tired and we kept letting him isolate and let Melo take so many shots.This is not to say I want KP shooting those shots, but we have some good shooters on this team and we have KP playing well. We need to find a way to get our offense going without relying on Melo so much. There just isn't a way this team can be a good playoff team if they are relying on Melo to carry the team. He is not that kind of player, certainly not now while his prime is almost over. An all-star for sure, but not a guy you want taking these many shots and getting so many ISO plays.
Fair point. Think the loss against the Hornets shows he needs to have this mindset more when his shot is off. Think he feels it's his job alone to bring team back when down by large margins. Specially coming off a great game the night before when he made clutch passes at end of the game. May have been also that no one else was playing well. Except for Jennings. Think we win if JH leaves him in.
Bad habits die hard. Melo is 14 years veteran who payed certain way all his NBA tenure.
Expect him to drastically change his game is absurd.
It is on coach and PGs to manage his minutes and facilitate him at the end of the clock or when no other options available.
His usage should be also reduced to preserve him for the length of his contract.
But all this is difficult business and requires his full cooperation.
He is a luxury to have when used properly.
jrodmc wrote:Jmpasq wrote:Vmart wrote:Rose wasn't great either 6-20. Combined with Melo these two were a staggering 13-45.
Rose had 8 assists and 8 boards with just 1 TO his shooting I can live with. Melo is a waste of space if he isnt shooting well
Ummm, Melo the waste of space had 8 boards too. Funny how that stat shines for someone else, but not for Melo.
Yeah, yeah, I know, at 6'8" Melo should have 15 boards every night.
Oh wait, most of those rebounds were off his own misses, right? Because we all know following your own shot is for losers.
If Rose or no one else is getting it done, what would you rather have Melo do? Disappear like H20 used to?
You're surprised that 8 rebounds from a PG is viewed much more favorably than 8 rebounds from a combo forward? 8 Rbs from a PG is phenomenon. From a combo forward, it's slightly good - not nearly enough to make up for 18 points on 25 shots.
Another example of what I am talking about is this first half here against OKC. He's 3-5 and things are going smoothly. Rose is on, KP is on. Melo comes in and has to show he can do it, and again and again goes into isolation mode.
Look I know Melo's value to the team, but this is extremely poor decision making. He has to see that he can not have these 3-11 stretches when Rose and KP are his teammates. Rose is getting any shot he wants at will. The Rose/KP 2 man game is ridiculously good.
Unfortunately with Melo, I fear he does have some part of him that keeps telling himself that he must take ownership of the team. All he needs to play is similar to how he plays when he is at the Olympics. He should not slow down the offense looking to take over in isolation plays unless it's late in the game. I look at Hornachek he has some great sets, but he's not coaching Melo here. It's on Hornachek to get Melo to see he can not play this way.
I repeat I am not a Melo hater, and I think he has helped KP big time in his development. Having Melo allows KP to have more space. However we won't maximize the Melo-Rose-KP trio unless Melo plays less of a isolation heavy game. The worst thing that could have happened to him is ESPN and the First Take guys questioning whether it should be KP's team. Stupid stuff. It's not about whose team it is. It's about utilizing each other's strengths to get the most of the overall team. We are not doing that. I will be super pissed if we lose this one to OKC.
nyknickzingis wrote:Another example of what I am talking about is this first half here against OKC. He's 3-5 and things are going smoothly. Rose is on, KP is on. Melo comes in and has to show he can do it, and again and again goes into isolation mode. Look I know Melo's value to the team, but this is extremely poor decision making. He has to see that he can not have these 3-11 stretches when Rose and KP are his teammates. Rose is getting any shot he wants at will. The Rose/KP 2 man game is ridiculously good.
Unfortunately with Melo, I fear he does have some part of him that keeps telling himself that he must take ownership of the team. All he needs to play is similar to how he plays when he is at the Olympics. He should not slow down the offense looking to take over in isolation plays unless it's late in the game. I look at Hornachek he has some great sets, but he's not coaching Melo here. It's on Hornachek to get Melo to see he can not play this way.
I repeat I am not a Melo hater, and I think he has helped KP big time in his development. Having Melo allows KP to have more space. However we won't maximize the Melo-Rose-KP trio unless Melo plays less of a isolation heavy game. The worst thing that could have happened to him is ESPN and the First Take guys questioning whether it should be KP's team. Stupid stuff. It's not about whose team it is. It's about utilizing each other's strengths to get the most of the overall team. We are not doing that. I will be super pissed if we lose this one to OKC.
Hornachek cannot get to Melo. Not enough authority.
If Phil will be coach himself yes... but I afraid he will just sit him.
Jordan and Kobe were the biggest egos in the game ever but even they were playing in team concept.
There is a reason Melo never went anywhere from NY. Why go out of his comfort zone and be a second fiddle to other star.
This is not easy to get out of this supper hero mode even if he has nothing to show for this in NBA.
All his accolades were won when he was a part of great teams doing the things he does best.
Yehhh... another 2.5 years to suffer...
A great deal was made about his assist numbers last year. It was a sure sign that he had turned into a mature team player and blah blah blah. I would say reading between the lines he is still a dim witted low awareness one dimensional ball hog. Knicks will be bad for another 2 seasons after this. It is what it is.
knicks1248 wrote:This team will have taken a step fwd when they learn to win games when melo has little to no impact
He will always have impact, he is either going to play well and they win or he will shoot until they cant win.1 up, 1 down its been that way his whole career. This team is going nowhere until they replace him with another talented wing
