Knicks · Phil with the giant left hook to Melo's jaw / reputation (page 6)

fishmike wrote:We will see what the end game is. Part of the problem is we dont know what conversations have taken place.

With our limited visibility it sure seems that Phil is being a douche. Why not just work to get him out of here? Keep it under the table? How does this possibly help?

Now the flip side is if Phil asked Melo to focus more on leading, playing defense, sharing the ball, setting those tones than Melo's play this year has been a straight up F-U to Phil. If thats the case it *still* doesnt make sense for Phil to trash him but I certainly understand the frustration.

As far as FAs, I am not convinced of Melo's respect around the league. I think his peers see him for what he is, a great scorer and a good guy but not the guy who is going to battle and take your team to anywhere near elite. Melo is a power hitter who strikes out 200 times a year. His overall numbers look good but his HRs and RBIs come in bunches and dont really reflect his day to day play, which is wildly inconsistent.

People here are WAY to focused on blame. Blaming Phil, blaming Melo. Blame accomplishes nothing but to justify one party in doing nothing about a situation. We all know Melo's flaws and they are not improving, they are worsening. Are we going to be an elite team with Melo as a centerpiece? Are we going to be a good team with Melo as a centerpiece? The teams we are talking about him joining already have 2-3 elite players in the league. We have none. KP is a wonderful prospect, but he is not yet an elite NBA player. Finally the last and most important question is if we are rebuilding this roster does having Melo on the squad help or hurt? When you consider how the offense stops with him on the floor and how the young players under his wing lean on him I think having him here hurts. These guys need to take their lumps. I am much more comfortable with Noah and Lee's veteran leadership than Melo's at this point.

Phil was very complimentary publicly regarding Melo. The telling quote was when he said Melo is one of the NBA's elite scorers, but still has another level he can take it to. Remember that? I suspect Phil spelled it out for him, and Melo went on being Melo and Phil is pissed and sick of it.

Neither are right. All that matters is whats best for the Knicks and Phil has drafted well and scouted well and signed good players. I get the early trades were not good, but neither were Tyson/JR/Shump and all got contracts right after the Knicks that nobody would want, so Is hard to sell Phil's failure to get great assets back when what went out was pretty bad also.

I agree 100% with the sentiment that it is certainly more gentlemanly to keep the criticism out of the media. But what if trade routes were drying up with Cavs and Clips; what if there are legitimate offers from "lesser" teams and Melo is saying no. Melo certainly has the right to say no; he negotiated for it and I don't blame it (he left 5 mill or so on the table and got that in return). But it's certainly in Phil's right to say Melo is not doing what's being asked, and to stop pretending that the organization is happy with melo, and to try and force him to reconsider. It's like a gambit in chess, sacrificing a rook to expose a king.

GoNyGoNyGo wrote:Melo once said:

"Most athletes don't have an opportunity to say that they won a gold medal, better yet three gold medals," Anthony said. "I would be very happy walking away from the game knowing that I've given the game everything I have, knowing I played on a high level at every level: high school, college, won [a championship at Syracuse] in college and possibly three gold medals.

"I can look back on it when my career is over -- if I don't have an NBA championship ring -- and say I had a great career."

I think this shows his mindset. He is content with what he has already won. He does not have the fire to do the hard things (for him) that PJax is trying to get him to do. Defend, Defer, lead.

HE will be great on LAC or Cleveland because all he needs to do there is score. Here he needs to lead.

I remember him saying that and I wasn't very happy. He basically gave himself a get out of jail free card. How was he ever going to become a greater superstar if he was thinking that he already hit his apex?

fishmike wrote:We will see what the end game is. Part of the problem is we dont know what conversations have taken place.

With our limited visibility it sure seems that Phil is being a douche. Why not just work to get him out of here? Keep it under the table? How does this possibly help?

Now the flip side is if Phil asked Melo to focus more on leading, playing defense, sharing the ball, setting those tones than Melo's play this year has been a straight up F-U to Phil. If thats the case it *still* doesnt make sense for Phil to trash him but I certainly understand the frustration.

As far as FAs, I am not convinced of Melo's respect around the league. I think his peers see him for what he is, a great scorer and a good guy but not the guy who is going to battle and take your team to anywhere near elite. Melo is a power hitter who strikes out 200 times a year. His overall numbers look good but his HRs and RBIs come in bunches and dont really reflect his day to day play, which is wildly inconsistent.

People here are WAY to focused on blame. Blaming Phil, blaming Melo. Blame accomplishes nothing but to justify one party in doing nothing about a situation. We all know Melo's flaws and they are not improving, they are worsening. Are we going to be an elite team with Melo as a centerpiece? Are we going to be a good team with Melo as a centerpiece? The teams we are talking about him joining already have 2-3 elite players in the league. We have none. KP is a wonderful prospect, but he is not yet an elite NBA player. Finally the last and most important question is if we are rebuilding this roster does having Melo on the squad help or hurt? When you consider how the offense stops with him on the floor and how the young players under his wing lean on him I think having him here hurts. These guys need to take their lumps. I am much more comfortable with Noah and Lee's veteran leadership than Melo's at this point.

Phil was very complimentary publicly regarding Melo. The telling quote was when he said Melo is one of the NBA's elite scorers, but still has another level he can take it to. Remember that? I suspect Phil spelled it out for him, and Melo went on being Melo and Phil is pissed and sick of it.

Neither are right. All that matters is whats best for the Knicks and Phil has drafted well and scouted well and signed good players. I get the early trades were not good, but neither were Tyson/JR/Shump and all got contracts right after the Knicks that nobody would want, so Is hard to sell Phil's failure to get great assets back when what went out was pretty bad also.

Phil being upset with Melo's style of play is one thing, but there is no need to drag your player in public the way Phil has. Especially after they had a sit down after Phils previous public shot at Melo. Its one thing for fans and the media to blast Melo for his short commings, but the prez should not be doing this in public. Its a horrible PR move and classless.

These are statements you make to Melos face, behind closed doors. Even if Melo is not getting the message, you still handle it in house and try to move him. As smart as everyone says Phil is, he had to know that Melo who had already been in the league 10 plus years (when he was resigned) wasn't going to change his game much. If you had that much of a problem with Melos game, why resign him? And to make matters worse, you allow him to have a NTC in his contract?

Chandler wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:Bahahaha. Keving Ding? What a Fucking Ding Dong. The blogger with as much NBA experience as a high school boy? He takes all the hater shit said about Melo over the las few years and the idiots on here buy it. Cuz it has nothing to do with getting hits on the net. And what better way is there but to feed the haters.

My favorite part of the article. PHIL HAS BROUGHT OVER EXPERIENCE VETS TO SURROUND HIM, TWICE1 GTFOH!!! You mean Robin fuckin Lopez? Aflalo? The broken down Rose and Noah? Cuz i'm sure you guys think they are All Stars. Yeah can see it now. Watch put LBJ, Love and Irving...Here come Melo AA and Rolo. They must have been really scared with that sight. LMAO.

Herre is a pic of your boy. You think he was in favor of letting Lin go? You think he blames Melo? IS this DK7th? Think so!

You haters keep going with all the obscure personal shit to support your hate for the guy. It will be over soon. And you can sit on here every night and complain how the misfits are not turning out to what you experts thought them to be. Think the basketball gods have it right, why give a chip to a bunch of whinning no talent recognizing haters.

are you trying to ironic? That's some pretty racist crap there. I can only hope you leave when Melo does, or that you're banned for racism and calling everyone an idiot

Nothing racist about what he wrote...stop being so damn sensitive because he called everyone out and this non-sense

Swishfm3 wrote:

Chandler wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:Bahahaha. Keving Ding? What a Fucking Ding Dong. The blogger with as much NBA experience as a high school boy? He takes all the hater shit said about Melo over the las few years and the idiots on here buy it. Cuz it has nothing to do with getting hits on the net. And what better way is there but to feed the haters.

My favorite part of the article. PHIL HAS BROUGHT OVER EXPERIENCE VETS TO SURROUND HIM, TWICE1 GTFOH!!! You mean Robin fuckin Lopez? Aflalo? The broken down Rose and Noah? Cuz i'm sure you guys think they are All Stars. Yeah can see it now. Watch put LBJ, Love and Irving...Here come Melo AA and Rolo. They must have been really scared with that sight. LMAO.

Herre is a pic of your boy. You think he was in favor of letting Lin go? You think he blames Melo? IS this DK7th? Think so!

You haters keep going with all the obscure personal shit to support your hate for the guy. It will be over soon. And you can sit on here every night and complain how the misfits are not turning out to what you experts thought them to be. Think the basketball gods have it right, why give a chip to a bunch of whinning no talent recognizing haters.

are you trying to ironic? That's some pretty racist crap there. I can only hope you leave when Melo does, or that you're banned for racism and calling everyone an idiot

Nothing racist about what he wrote...stop being so damn sensitive because he called everyone out and this non-sense

You're not serious are you? Posts a picture of the writer to show he's Asian and then impute his motive was because Lin was run out of town by Melo -- i.e., that he has some ax to grind

Give me a break! It's not about being sensitive. It's about keeping things to reasonable expectations of civility. He should be ashamed and so should you if you honestly think that wasn't racist

I have to say that I am eagerly awaiting Melo's reaction.
This is better than WWE, UFC or soap opera.

This is a legit battle going on. Two sides playing poker and trying to mind fuck the other.

Melo can pretend he's the victim, but how do you think the Knicks even know about Clippers and Cavs as Melo's destination? Clearly in the past at some point Melo's agent/reps and NY's front office have had a conversation about where Melo would be willing to go. There's no way that they just picked out of the blue, lets negotiate with the Clippers or the Cavs. There's a reason this story as a trade destination has had fuel for over a year. Last trade deadline it was the same thing.

Melo can always say he doesn't want to go, yet why does NY even have knowledge of his interest to play with Paul in LA or Bron in CLE? Clearly his people have spoken to some degree with NY about this in the past or at some point. Melo isn't asking out, so he looks good and he's happy being a good player hogging all the plays and spotlight on a bad team in his favorite city. He's allowed to do that, he's a business man and he got what he wanted in free agency. That's why he played that game.

But here's the thing. Phil is also looking out for NY's best interests. This isn't lets just mind fuck Melo because it's Melo. This is about getting Melo to waive his NTC and get out of town. I don't agree with Phil Jackson's methods but I love his goal for the franchise. He wants to bring it up from the ground up and wants to bring in players who represent winning and playing hard every night.

Say whatever you want about his bad moves - Noah is a hard worker. Noah sucks on offense. But Noah works his tail off. He talks to Willy and KP on the bench all the time. Noah values the defensive possesion. Noah passes the ball. Bad signing, yes. In terms of drafting? We have made some great ones and we have lots of quality picks coming our way. We have to trade Melo to rebuild properly. Phil is pushing Melo out of town not because of some personal agenda against Melo. He got Rose, Lee and guys like that for Melo to win now. He's pushing Melo out of town because it helps Melo go to a situation he can actually win (as the 2nd or 3rd best player) and it also allows NY to do what's in the best interests for them - which is rebuild around Porzingis, draft picks, young players and capspace.

Saddest part in all this is Phil is doing for Melo what Melo or any player with pride and a desire to win should want for themselves. To go to a good team and be the 2nd best player on a championship run. Phil doesn't hate Melo. It's not like that at all. It's about getting this done. He doesn't want to play "I love NY, I love this city, so let me hog the ball, shoot 25 times night, play almost no defense" game anymore. He's seen enough.

Only a Melo first fan wouldn't see how virtually any smart GM with a player like Kristaps, with a lottery pick coming, with a ton of capspace potentially available, would trade Melo in this situation. Phil's methods are wack, but we don't know that Melo would actually wiave his trade clause. A fan who was jeering him at the Brooklyn game - a Knicks fan who screamed at Melo to be traded - said that when Melo saw him he said "No Trade Clause". That's just how Melo has been operating. There hasn't been any real indication that he wants to accept a trade. Mind fucking, fueding in the press, challenging him, may be the only way this gets done.

nyknickzingis wrote:I have to say that I am eagerly awaiting Melo's reaction.
This is better than WWE, UFC or soap opera.

This is a legit battle going on. Two sides playing poker and trying to mind fuck the other.

Melo can pretend he's the victim, but how do you think the Knicks even know about Clippers and Cavs as Melo's destination? Clearly in the past at some point Melo's agent/reps and NY's front office have had a conversation about where Melo would be willing to go. There's no way that they just picked out of the blue, lets negotiate with the Clippers or the Cavs. There's a reason this story as a trade destination has had fuel for over a year. Last trade deadline it was the same thing.

Melo can always say he doesn't want to go, yet why does NY even have knowledge of his interest to play with Paul in LA or Bron in CLE? Clearly his people have spoken to some degree with NY about this in the past or at some point. Melo isn't asking out, so he looks good and he's happy being a good player hogging all the plays and spotlight on a bad team in his favorite city. He's allowed to do that, he's a business man and he got what he wanted in free agency. That's why he played that game.

But here's the thing. Phil is also looking out for NY's best interests. This isn't lets just mind fuck Melo because it's Melo. This is about getting Melo to waive his NTC and get out of town. I don't agree with Phil Jackson's methods but I love his goal for the franchise. He wants to bring it up from the ground up and wants to bring in players who represent winning and playing hard every night.

Say whatever you want about his bad moves - Noah is a hard worker. Noah sucks on offense. But Noah works his tail off. He talks to Willy and KP on the bench all the time. Noah values the defensive possesion. Noah passes the ball. Bad signing, yes. In terms of drafting? We have made some great ones and we have lots of quality picks coming our way. We have to trade Melo to rebuild properly. Phil is pushing Melo out of town not because of some personal agenda against Melo. He got Rose, Lee and guys like that for Melo to win now. He's pushing Melo out of town because it helps Melo go to a situation he can actually win (as the 2nd or 3rd best player) and it also allows NY to do what's in the best interests for them - which is rebuild around Porzingis, draft picks, young players and capspace.

Yeah and he is/was trying to stuff Rambis and the triangle down our throats...

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:We will see what the end game is. Part of the problem is we dont know what conversations have taken place.

With our limited visibility it sure seems that Phil is being a douche. Why not just work to get him out of here? Keep it under the table? How does this possibly help?

Now the flip side is if Phil asked Melo to focus more on leading, playing defense, sharing the ball, setting those tones than Melo's play this year has been a straight up F-U to Phil. If thats the case it *still* doesnt make sense for Phil to trash him but I certainly understand the frustration.

As far as FAs, I am not convinced of Melo's respect around the league. I think his peers see him for what he is, a great scorer and a good guy but not the guy who is going to battle and take your team to anywhere near elite. Melo is a power hitter who strikes out 200 times a year. His overall numbers look good but his HRs and RBIs come in bunches and dont really reflect his day to day play, which is wildly inconsistent.

People here are WAY to focused on blame. Blaming Phil, blaming Melo. Blame accomplishes nothing but to justify one party in doing nothing about a situation. We all know Melo's flaws and they are not improving, they are worsening. Are we going to be an elite team with Melo as a centerpiece? Are we going to be a good team with Melo as a centerpiece? The teams we are talking about him joining already have 2-3 elite players in the league. We have none. KP is a wonderful prospect, but he is not yet an elite NBA player. Finally the last and most important question is if we are rebuilding this roster does having Melo on the squad help or hurt? When you consider how the offense stops with him on the floor and how the young players under his wing lean on him I think having him here hurts. These guys need to take their lumps. I am much more comfortable with Noah and Lee's veteran leadership than Melo's at this point.

Phil was very complimentary publicly regarding Melo. The telling quote was when he said Melo is one of the NBA's elite scorers, but still has another level he can take it to. Remember that? I suspect Phil spelled it out for him, and Melo went on being Melo and Phil is pissed and sick of it.

Neither are right. All that matters is whats best for the Knicks and Phil has drafted well and scouted well and signed good players. I get the early trades were not good, but neither were Tyson/JR/Shump and all got contracts right after the Knicks that nobody would want, so Is hard to sell Phil's failure to get great assets back when what went out was pretty bad also.

Phil being upset with Melo's style of play is one thing, but there is no need to drag your player in public the way Phil has. Especially after they had a sit down after Phils previous public shot at Melo. Its one thing for fans and the media to blast Melo for his short commings, but the prez should not be doing this in public. Its a horrible PR move and classless.

These are statements you make to Melos face, behind closed doors. Even if Melo is not getting the message, you still handle it in house and try to move him. As smart as everyone says Phil is, he had to know that Melo who had already been in the league 10 plus years (when he was resigned) wasn't going to change his game much. If you had that much of a problem with Melos game, why resign him? And to make matters worse, you allow him to have a NTC in his contract?

For a guy everyone says is smart, he has made some dumb trades and signings...

TripleThreat wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:
So now every star player or any FA has to think, if I don't play according to phils liking, He's going to throw me under the bus, try and crush my brand or trade me at the first sign of adversity..SORRY NO THANKS

.....And how do these tactics help the Knicks get a free agent this summer? Is Jrue Holiday following this story and thinking "that's where I'll make my big splash! Where Phil will arrange a tear down piece of my game to be written if I have a bad week."

Phil is doing damage to the franchise, doing damage to his star player (and his star player's trade value)... and worst of all... what does KP think about all this? He's got a walk year coming in a few years... does he really want to stick around for this circus? This shouldn't even be a question... but it will become one if Phil continues on this path.

....I think your miss understanding the point. Phil is ripping up his reputation by single out one player consistenly. It's a real bicth move when someones in your face, and then you chose to run and talk sht about him behind his back.

Sorry, I'm not singling you out personally, because others are saying something along the same lines, and honestly, this type of narrative doesn't make a whole ton of sense.

And it basically defies almost all of NBA modern free agency and how NBA free agents have chosen to actually operate.

Free Agents go after

1) The most money and/or the most years. The higher the AAV the better, the longer the contract with the higher AAV the better.

2) A chance to win and win consistently, including getting on a contender or getting into the playoffs

3) A chance to play within their "hometown" or to minimize disruption within their family ( basically to not uproot their kids, not drive their wife insane which will drive the entire family insane, or for a young player, maybe to be close to his mother/grandmother/father/whomever raised him)

4) A chance to play in a large market, for ancillary opportunities ( lifestyle, branding, etc)

No#3 and No#4 are often much minor considerations from the first two.

Is a free agent WITH CHOICES going to pick the Knicks. Most of the time, if they can get more money and/or a better chance to win/contend, the answer is No. Durant was not coming to the Knicks. LBJ was not coming the Knicks. Dirk was not coming to the Knicks. The list goes on and on with players with choices who were not coming to the Knicks. They were not coming NO MATTER WHAT JACKSON said or did not say to any specific player.

Will a free agent with far far fewer choices turn down MORE MONEY and MORE YEARS than anyone else would offer JUST BECAUSE OF SOMETHING JACKSON SAID TO MELO. I highly doubt it. It openly defies how NBA FAs have generally operated. Can you name one instance where a player actually and openly said, "Dude, this team, team X offered me an extra 2 years and an extra X million per year, and I turned it down JUST BECAUSE GM/Coach X said or did this to said player in some article I read" Has that ever happened?

Teams are cutthroat. Players are cutthroat. As if players are going to turn down more cash and more years CONSISTENTLY over some article that said team executive did this or that.

Jackson went after Kobe in the press ALL THE TIME. He wrote a book trashing him. And guess what? Jackson and Kobe got back together. LBJ left by spitting on his hometown city, his owner trashed him in public, and a few years later, they got back together. Do you think Kevin Love resigned for big money there thinking, wow, that owner could trash me too? Or did he think, I can make max money AND get a chance to win here?

Jackson wrote not just ONE but TWO BOOKS trashing how Kobe Bryant plays. Do you think he cares? Do you think Jennings or Lopez or Noah thought, oh no, he trashed Kobe Bryant, he is gonna do it to me too?

You want to be bulletproof to criticism? Play the game the right way. It's not that complicated an answer to how Melo can avoid criticism. Melo should know better, after seeing Jackson take on Kobe and others in the press. And using the PRESS WORKS. How can a bunch of NY guys, after seeing Parcells operate with the Giants and every team afterwards, not see how using the press is effective to manipulating your players and using that narrative to turn the public/fanbase against them. The Big Tuna, like Zen Master, knew how to push those buttons.

Why would Zinger give a flying f**k? Right now, he's not getting the ball because Melo is freezing him out. Melo is gone, he will get the ball. How horrible is that going to make him feel? Right now, he's getting bombarded with Melo questions over and over, and if Melo is gone, he won't, how is that going to make him feel horrible? This team wants to make him the franchise player, in the biggest of all big cities on Earth. How is that horrible?

This "narrative" that you and a few others are pushing MAKES NO SENSE and defies all actual FA behavior. A few players said something to this effect when Dan Gilbert blasted LBJ when he left Cleveland by ripping their hearts out with a classless TV special, and you know what? Do you think they were going to sign with a gutted and empty Cavs team anyway? And how did they react when LBJ came back?

If the Knicks build a strong enough young roster and can offer mostly competitive money and years, no one will give a sh!t about any years old feud between Melo the ball stopping no defense chucker and Zen Master. It won't have to years old, it could days or weeks old and no one will care. A decade ago, the best the Warriors could do is sign super chucker Corey Maggette. Who is a chucker that would make Jamal Crawford, Kobe Bryant and even Melo blush. Last offseason, they signed Kevin Durant. You win enough, you build a strong enough young roster, you have enough cap space, and the players will come to you or actually consider you.

The average adult male in America lives to like 78. That's somewhere around the average. And this is the "average", most guys don't make it that far. Statistically, guys who are several deviations above the mean height just don't live as long. Jackson is an old man edging into the bonus round into his practical lifespan. He has 11 rings as a coach. Do you think he gives a f**k if some generation of millennial players think he's a douchebag?

Outside the Patriots lockerroom is a simple sign - DO YOUR JOB

Do your job the right way, and then you will get called things in public that you want to hear. That applies to both Jackson AND Melo. Melo wants to stop hearing the chirping, then play defense, be a leader, play team basketball.

Your narrative is an ESPN First Take sound byte, it's not reflective of how the NBA marketplace actually operates.

You just spent all this time making an argument as to why no one has been added to help Melo. As free agents dont want to be here. Also, Doing your job in the game of basketball involves a team effort. Your vastly affected much more than the 24 starters on football. You cant expect mMelo to take the hit with the likes of AA, Grant, Gallo, Rolo, Rose, Noah, and several other misfits. Thats all we are saying. Dont put the blame on one guy. It takes a lot of people to screw shit up. And that has been going on for quite some time here. Btw, Patriots have lots of good players to help Brady do his job and they didnt do "Their Job" agains my Giants!! Twice bitches.

Chandler wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:Bahahaha. Keving Ding? What a Fucking Ding Dong. The blogger with as much NBA experience as a high school boy? He takes all the hater shit said about Melo over the las few years and the idiots on here buy it. Cuz it has nothing to do with getting hits on the net. And what better way is there but to feed the haters.

My favorite part of the article. PHIL HAS BROUGHT OVER EXPERIENCE VETS TO SURROUND HIM, TWICE1 GTFOH!!! You mean Robin fuckin Lopez? Aflalo? The broken down Rose and Noah? Cuz i'm sure you guys think they are All Stars. Yeah can see it now. Watch put LBJ, Love and Irving...Here come Melo AA and Rolo. They must have been really scared with that sight. LMAO.

Herre is a pic of your boy. You think he was in favor of letting Lin go? You think he blames Melo? IS this DK7th? Think so!

You haters keep going with all the obscure personal shit to support your hate for the guy. It will be over soon. And you can sit on here every night and complain how the misfits are not turning out to what you experts thought them to be. Think the basketball gods have it right, why give a chip to a bunch of whinning no talent recognizing haters.

are you trying to ironic? That's some pretty racist crap there. I can only hope you leave when Melo does, or that you're banned for racism and calling everyone an idiot

Explain the racist part? A guy having a hard on for a pro athlete of same ethnicity? Wow what a shocker. So pointing out that every asian loved Yao is racist? And Dk7th was a Melo poster on here, dont know if you think its something else? And ofcourse that is my point. Any Lin supporter equals Melo hate. Any Gallo supporter equals Melo hate. Congrats!

holfresh wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:I have to say that I am eagerly awaiting Melo's reaction.
This is better than WWE, UFC or soap opera.

This is a legit battle going on. Two sides playing poker and trying to mind fuck the other.

Melo can pretend he's the victim, but how do you think the Knicks even know about Clippers and Cavs as Melo's destination? Clearly in the past at some point Melo's agent/reps and NY's front office have had a conversation about where Melo would be willing to go. There's no way that they just picked out of the blue, lets negotiate with the Clippers or the Cavs. There's a reason this story as a trade destination has had fuel for over a year. Last trade deadline it was the same thing.

Melo can always say he doesn't want to go, yet why does NY even have knowledge of his interest to play with Paul in LA or Bron in CLE? Clearly his people have spoken to some degree with NY about this in the past or at some point. Melo isn't asking out, so he looks good and he's happy being a good player hogging all the plays and spotlight on a bad team in his favorite city. He's allowed to do that, he's a business man and he got what he wanted in free agency. That's why he played that game.

But here's the thing. Phil is also looking out for NY's best interests. This isn't lets just mind fuck Melo because it's Melo. This is about getting Melo to waive his NTC and get out of town. I don't agree with Phil Jackson's methods but I love his goal for the franchise. He wants to bring it up from the ground up and wants to bring in players who represent winning and playing hard every night.

Say whatever you want about his bad moves - Noah is a hard worker. Noah sucks on offense. But Noah works his tail off. He talks to Willy and KP on the bench all the time. Noah values the defensive possesion. Noah passes the ball. Bad signing, yes. In terms of drafting? We have made some great ones and we have lots of quality picks coming our way. We have to trade Melo to rebuild properly. Phil is pushing Melo out of town not because of some personal agenda against Melo. He got Rose, Lee and guys like that for Melo to win now. He's pushing Melo out of town because it helps Melo go to a situation he can actually win (as the 2nd or 3rd best player) and it also allows NY to do what's in the best interests for them - which is rebuild around Porzingis, draft picks, young players and capspace.

Yeah and he is/was trying to stuff Rambis and the triangle down our throats...

To run most offenses at a great level you need a superstar who is dominant. Phil had that with Jordan. Then Shaq. Then Kobe. In NY, Melo wasn't able to be that guy. Trying wasn't a bad idea. In theory Melo is a great isolation scorer, so the Triangle was a great set up for him to balance out the Triangle with his great scoring skill. But here is where Melo failed. Melo didn't really understand the importance of using the Triangle or a team offense to balance the attack. He actually did do it for like half a season, well more like a quarter. But that's it. He quickly reverted back to 2-3 assists a night Melo. The best players in the Triangle got 25 points a night on effecient shooting and also 5-6 assists. Melo just couldn't do that. Maybe he was past his prime. Maybe he just isn't a player that likes to pass on a consistent basis. Whatever it is, it was a bad match in the end.

Yes Phil gets blame for trying to push the Triangle on the team, but it was in theory a good offense and system for Melo. What's the right offense for Melo? D'Antoni's? Oh guess what, Melo rebelled and failed in that one as well. Maybe the problem isn't the systems, it's the player. It's why D'Antoni ran out of town as well. Ever read what George Karl said about Melo?

So Phil, D'Antoni and Karl are all bufoons while Melo is perfect? Ok.

We don't have to like Phil's methods to appreciate the goal. If we end up with De'aaron Fox and some other young talent people won't be bytching about Phil's crazy tweets!!!

nyknickzingis wrote:

holfresh wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:I have to say that I am eagerly awaiting Melo's reaction.
This is better than WWE, UFC or soap opera.

This is a legit battle going on. Two sides playing poker and trying to mind fuck the other.

Melo can pretend he's the victim, but how do you think the Knicks even know about Clippers and Cavs as Melo's destination? Clearly in the past at some point Melo's agent/reps and NY's front office have had a conversation about where Melo would be willing to go. There's no way that they just picked out of the blue, lets negotiate with the Clippers or the Cavs. There's a reason this story as a trade destination has had fuel for over a year. Last trade deadline it was the same thing.

Melo can always say he doesn't want to go, yet why does NY even have knowledge of his interest to play with Paul in LA or Bron in CLE? Clearly his people have spoken to some degree with NY about this in the past or at some point. Melo isn't asking out, so he looks good and he's happy being a good player hogging all the plays and spotlight on a bad team in his favorite city. He's allowed to do that, he's a business man and he got what he wanted in free agency. That's why he played that game.

But here's the thing. Phil is also looking out for NY's best interests. This isn't lets just mind fuck Melo because it's Melo. This is about getting Melo to waive his NTC and get out of town. I don't agree with Phil Jackson's methods but I love his goal for the franchise. He wants to bring it up from the ground up and wants to bring in players who represent winning and playing hard every night.

Say whatever you want about his bad moves - Noah is a hard worker. Noah sucks on offense. But Noah works his tail off. He talks to Willy and KP on the bench all the time. Noah values the defensive possesion. Noah passes the ball. Bad signing, yes. In terms of drafting? We have made some great ones and we have lots of quality picks coming our way. We have to trade Melo to rebuild properly. Phil is pushing Melo out of town not because of some personal agenda against Melo. He got Rose, Lee and guys like that for Melo to win now. He's pushing Melo out of town because it helps Melo go to a situation he can actually win (as the 2nd or 3rd best player) and it also allows NY to do what's in the best interests for them - which is rebuild around Porzingis, draft picks, young players and capspace.

Yeah and he is/was trying to stuff Rambis and the triangle down our throats...

To run most offenses at a great level you need a superstar who is dominant. Phil had that with Jordan. Then Shaq. Then Kobe. In NY, Melo wasn't able to be that guy. Trying wasn't a bad idea. In theory Melo is a great isolation scorer, so the Triangle was a great set up for him to balance out the Triangle with his great scoring skill. But here is where Melo failed. Melo didn't really understand the importance of using the Triangle or a team offense to balance the attack. He actually did do it for like half a season, well more like a quarter. But that's it. He quickly reverted back to 2-3 assists a night Melo. The best players in the Triangle got 25 points a night on effecient shooting and also 5-6 assists. Melo just couldn't do that. Maybe he was past his prime. Maybe he just isn't a player that likes to pass on a consistent basis. Whatever it is, it was a bad match in the end.

Yes Phil gets blame for trying to push the Triangle on the team, but it was in theory a good offense and system for Melo. What's the right offense for Melo? D'Antoni's? Oh guess what, Melo rebelled and failed in that one as well. Maybe the problem isn't the systems, it's the player. It's why D'Antoni ran out of town as well. Ever read what George Karl said about Melo?

So Phil, D'Antoni and Karl are all bufoons while Melo is perfect? Ok.

Let's be real..His supporting cast has sucked so far..Melo never had a Shaq or Pippen/Grant/Rodman playing next to him...The Knicks had an opportunity to reload with Amare and Chandler coming off the books but Phil just isn't good at what he does or he is just darn lazy at this point in his career...He is bad, let be honest....You and I know KP isn't ready..You know you can't win when Horny and Rambis doesn't know the first thing about defense...So here we are, Phil needs a scapegoat and he has one..The hated guy that got Gallo traded..Carmelo Anthony...Get rid of Melo and we can lose for the next two years of Phil contract with no pressure...

after hundreds of email requests, i have decided to chime in on this :)

this is as impartial a review i can make when it comes to how i perceive phil and his tenure so far. i will ramble a bit so bear with me...

i think porzingis is as good a prospect as you can get in the lottery. does that mean he will be a superstar? no. but he has the potential to be one. he could easily just end up being as good as bosh was in his miami days - a high level 3rd wheel but that's still a good player.

many of us want our players to be something they are not. and when the team is not a good one, those players values become even more inflated. to relate that to your squad, when you sit back and evaluate players like hernangomez, baker, kuz and holliday, i think you have to really look at their cons more than their pros to really figure out where they fit in today's nba. i think hernangomez, kuz and holliday can be solid 15-20 min bench players for a good team. i mean a good team needs role players and bench role players are important but none of them show the skill and defense to be legit starters. kuz is 27 so he is a finished product. holliday i think can hit the 3 and play some defense but for him to start, he would have to be your worst starter surrounded by 4 potential all star type players to win. hernangomez has shown rebounding skill but overall, he is too slowfooted in today's nba and will get destroyed by starting guards. teams would would blitz pick n rolls all day and score easy on him. therefore he doesn't project to be a starter but he would be a serviceable backup big. imho, ron baker is a fringe nba player and if he's getting 15-20 mins a night, your team is a really bad one. look at backup pg's on bad teams - dj augustin, jameer nelson, even the guy from philly - they are all better than him and those teams are terrible.

my point is that many fans over value players on their teams that just aren't that great. we constantly think backups could start but that's just not the case. i'm speaking from experience as i've overvalued players on the raptors but not until we started winning do you really know how a player can slot into that environment.

imho, phil does not know how to build a basketball team. chemistry, cohesion, culture and talent - all things he has failed in bringing to the knicks. he spent 2 years trying to implement an archaic system (yes it's archaic b/c you need top 5 players to run it). if it's a quality system, then you at least would have chemistry and cohesion even if the wins may not be there. but the knicks did not have that. he then thought adding rose to a team with melo and having a center like noah would expedite wins - again, another fail.

in today's nba, you need guards/wings (and a pg) that can not only score well but also distribute. at the very best, rose is a scorer but not a distributer. adding that to melo was never going to work. melo has won in this league before (and my definition of won is over .500 and making playoffs consistently) - and the teams he's won with included a distributing pg/leader. and in phil's tenure, he has not provided one. he did not recognize melo is a scorer and that's it. he needs to be the recipient of guards passes, not the initiator. in fact, his love for the triangle actually devalues the importance of a pg which is the complete opposite direction the nba is going today.

he does have a big that can stretch it out which does follow nba trends in porzingis but not bringing in guards that fit today's nba is the #1 reason why the knicks haven't won. there is absolutely zero evidence he knows how to put together a roster...and that's the biggest argument against him.

melo - you may not like him as a player but publicly, he has been professional and he has not thrown management under the bus as far as i can tell. but phil tweeting like he did shows that the culture of the team is the same as it's always been. everyone out for themselves. he didn't change anything.

what he's done that's different is that he hasn't traded future firsts - which for the knicks is amazing. but using that to laud him is also a bit shortsighted as you're only comparing him to past knicks gm's instead of comparing him to his peers around the league.

overall, i think he's done a bad job. the biggest issue to me is that i don't think he knows how to build a team in today's nba. but by not being 100% reckless, he could benefit or get lucky (and every gm needs luck) via the draft. time will tell but imho, i would cut bait with not only melo but phil and hire a no-name guy from a successful organization. ego in the front office does not work imho.

sorry for the ramble. now back to the politics thread :)

nyknickzingis wrote:

holfresh wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:I have to say that I am eagerly awaiting Melo's reaction.
This is better than WWE, UFC or soap opera.

This is a legit battle going on. Two sides playing poker and trying to mind fuck the other.

Melo can pretend he's the victim, but how do you think the Knicks even know about Clippers and Cavs as Melo's destination? Clearly in the past at some point Melo's agent/reps and NY's front office have had a conversation about where Melo would be willing to go. There's no way that they just picked out of the blue, lets negotiate with the Clippers or the Cavs. There's a reason this story as a trade destination has had fuel for over a year. Last trade deadline it was the same thing.

Melo can always say he doesn't want to go, yet why does NY even have knowledge of his interest to play with Paul in LA or Bron in CLE? Clearly his people have spoken to some degree with NY about this in the past or at some point. Melo isn't asking out, so he looks good and he's happy being a good player hogging all the plays and spotlight on a bad team in his favorite city. He's allowed to do that, he's a business man and he got what he wanted in free agency. That's why he played that game.

But here's the thing. Phil is also looking out for NY's best interests. This isn't lets just mind fuck Melo because it's Melo. This is about getting Melo to waive his NTC and get out of town. I don't agree with Phil Jackson's methods but I love his goal for the franchise. He wants to bring it up from the ground up and wants to bring in players who represent winning and playing hard every night.

Say whatever you want about his bad moves - Noah is a hard worker. Noah sucks on offense. But Noah works his tail off. He talks to Willy and KP on the bench all the time. Noah values the defensive possesion. Noah passes the ball. Bad signing, yes. In terms of drafting? We have made some great ones and we have lots of quality picks coming our way. We have to trade Melo to rebuild properly. Phil is pushing Melo out of town not because of some personal agenda against Melo. He got Rose, Lee and guys like that for Melo to win now. He's pushing Melo out of town because it helps Melo go to a situation he can actually win (as the 2nd or 3rd best player) and it also allows NY to do what's in the best interests for them - which is rebuild around Porzingis, draft picks, young players and capspace.

Yeah and he is/was trying to stuff Rambis and the triangle down our throats...

To run most offenses at a great level you need a superstar who is dominant. Phil had that with Jordan. Then Shaq. Then Kobe. In NY, Melo wasn't able to be that guy. Trying wasn't a bad idea. In theory Melo is a great isolation scorer, so the Triangle was a great set up for him to balance out the Triangle with his great scoring skill. But here is where Melo failed. Melo didn't really understand the importance of using the Triangle or a team offense to balance the attack. He actually did do it for like half a season, well more like a quarter. But that's it. He quickly reverted back to 2-3 assists a night Melo. The best players in the Triangle got 25 points a night on effecient shooting and also 5-6 assists. Melo just couldn't do that. Maybe he was past his prime. Maybe he just isn't a player that likes to pass on a consistent basis. Whatever it is, it was a bad match in the end.

Yes Phil gets blame for trying to push the Triangle on the team, but it was in theory a good offense and system for Melo. What's the right offense for Melo? D'Antoni's? Oh guess what, Melo rebelled and failed in that one as well. Maybe the problem isn't the systems, it's the player. It's why D'Antoni ran out of town as well. Ever read what George Karl said about Melo?

So Phil, D'Antoni and Karl are all bufoons while Melo is perfect? Ok.

NYZing. I know your not a hater. But question...who did Kobe have around him? Shaq was big right? Horry not bad? Then he had Pau, Artest, Odom and Bynum. When they were playing extremely well. Not to mention clutch shooting from a little unknown guard name Fisher.

As for Karl. Really? Talking about Melo when he was just a kid? Would like to see your reaction if someone wrote a book about KP saying stuff about him when he was just a kid? Will also see what your reaction will be when KP is surrounded by misfits and taking all the blame.

I am not saying Melo is perfect and ddoes not have flaws. Just that people expected way too much and he has had no help. That and that others need to take blame for this fiasco we call the Knicks.

HofstraBBall wrote:

Chandler wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:Bahahaha. Keving Ding? What a Fucking Ding Dong. The blogger with as much NBA experience as a high school boy? He takes all the hater shit said about Melo over the las few years and the idiots on here buy it. Cuz it has nothing to do with getting hits on the net. And what better way is there but to feed the haters.

My favorite part of the article. PHIL HAS BROUGHT OVER EXPERIENCE VETS TO SURROUND HIM, TWICE1 GTFOH!!! You mean Robin fuckin Lopez? Aflalo? The broken down Rose and Noah? Cuz i'm sure you guys think they are All Stars. Yeah can see it now. Watch put LBJ, Love and Irving...Here come Melo AA and Rolo. They must have been really scared with that sight. LMAO.

Herre is a pic of your boy. You think he was in favor of letting Lin go? You think he blames Melo? IS this DK7th? Think so!

You haters keep going with all the obscure personal shit to support your hate for the guy. It will be over soon. And you can sit on here every night and complain how the misfits are not turning out to what you experts thought them to be. Think the basketball gods have it right, why give a chip to a bunch of whinning no talent recognizing haters.

are you trying to ironic? That's some pretty racist crap there. I can only hope you leave when Melo does, or that you're banned for racism and calling everyone an idiot

Explain the racist part? A guy having a hard on for a pro athlete of same ethnicity? Wow what a shocker. So pointing out that every asian loved Yao is racist? And Dk7th was a Melo poster on here, dont know if you think its something else? And ofcourse that is my point. Any Lin supporter equals Melo hate. Any Gallo supporter equals Melo hate. Congrats!

dk7 also had some very overt racist posts. You're in unique company

djsunyc wrote:after hundreds of email requests, i have decided to chime in on this :)

this is as impartial a review i can make when it comes to how i perceive phil and his tenure so far. i will ramble a bit so bear with me...

i think porzingis is as good a prospect as you can get in the lottery. does that mean he will be a superstar? no. but he has the potential to be one. he could easily just end up being as good as bosh was in his miami days - a high level 3rd wheel but that's still a good player.

many of us want our players to be something they are not. and when the team is not a good one, those players values become even more inflated. to relate that to your squad, when you sit back and evaluate players like hernangomez, baker, kuz and holliday, i think you have to really look at their cons more than their pros to really figure out where they fit in today's nba. i think hernangomez, kuz and holliday can be solid 15-20 min bench players for a good team. i mean a good team needs role players and bench role players are important but none of them show the skill and defense to be legit starters. kuz is 27 so he is a finished product. holliday i think can hit the 3 and play some defense but for him to start, he would have to be your worst starter surrounded by 4 potential all star type players to win. hernangomez has shown rebounding skill but overall, he is too slowfooted in today's nba and will get destroyed by starting guards. teams would would blitz pick n rolls all day and score easy on him. therefore he doesn't project to be a starter but he would be a serviceable backup big. imho, ron baker is a fringe nba player and if he's getting 15-20 mins a night, your team is a really bad one. look at backup pg's on bad teams - dj augustin, jameer nelson, even the guy from philly - they are all better than him and those teams are terrible.

my point is that many fans over value players on their teams that just aren't that great. we constantly think backups could start but that's just not the case. i'm speaking from experience as i've overvalued players on the raptors but not until we started winning do you really know how a player can slot into that environment.

imho, phil does not know how to build a basketball team. chemistry, cohesion, culture and talent - all things he has failed in bringing to the knicks. he spent 2 years trying to implement an archaic system (yes it's archaic b/c you need top 5 players to run it). if it's a quality system, then you at least would have chemistry and cohesion even if the wins may not be there. but the knicks did not have that. he then thought adding rose to a team with melo and having a center like noah would expedite wins - again, another fail.

in today's nba, you need guards/wings (and a pg) that can not only score well but also distribute. at the very best, rose is a scorer but not a distributer. adding that to melo was never going to work. melo has won in this league before (and my definition of won is over .500 and making playoffs consistently) - and the teams he's won with included a distributing pg/leader. and in phil's tenure, he has not provided one. he did not recognize melo is a scorer and that's it. he needs to be the recipient of guards passes, not the initiator. in fact, his love for the triangle actually devalues the importance of a pg which is the complete opposite direction the nba is going today.

he does have a big that can stretch it out which does follow nba trends in porzingis but not bringing in guards that fit today's nba is the #1 reason why the knicks haven't won. there is absolutely zero evidence he knows how to put together a roster...and that's the biggest argument against him.

melo - you may not like him as a player but publicly, he has been professional and he has not thrown management under the bus as far as i can tell. but phil tweeting like he did shows that the culture of the team is the same as it's always been. everyone out for themselves. he didn't change anything.

what he's done that's different is that he hasn't traded future firsts - which for the knicks is amazing. but using that to laud him is also a bit shortsighted as you're only comparing him to past knicks gm's instead of comparing him to his peers around the league.

overall, i think he's done a bad job. the biggest issue to me is that i don't think he knows how to build a team in today's nba. but by not being 100% reckless, he could benefit or get lucky (and every gm needs luck) via the draft. time will tell but imho, i would cut bait with not only melo but phil and hire a no-name guy from a successful organization. ego in the front office does not work imho.

sorry for the ramble. now back to the politics thread :)

A-effing-Men...Completely agree..And when you state facts as you see it, you are a hater...Thank you DJ...

holfresh wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:

holfresh wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:I have to say that I am eagerly awaiting Melo's reaction.
This is better than WWE, UFC or soap opera.

This is a legit battle going on. Two sides playing poker and trying to mind fuck the other.

Melo can pretend he's the victim, but how do you think the Knicks even know about Clippers and Cavs as Melo's destination? Clearly in the past at some point Melo's agent/reps and NY's front office have had a conversation about where Melo would be willing to go. There's no way that they just picked out of the blue, lets negotiate with the Clippers or the Cavs. There's a reason this story as a trade destination has had fuel for over a year. Last trade deadline it was the same thing.

Melo can always say he doesn't want to go, yet why does NY even have knowledge of his interest to play with Paul in LA or Bron in CLE? Clearly his people have spoken to some degree with NY about this in the past or at some point. Melo isn't asking out, so he looks good and he's happy being a good player hogging all the plays and spotlight on a bad team in his favorite city. He's allowed to do that, he's a business man and he got what he wanted in free agency. That's why he played that game.

But here's the thing. Phil is also looking out for NY's best interests. This isn't lets just mind fuck Melo because it's Melo. This is about getting Melo to waive his NTC and get out of town. I don't agree with Phil Jackson's methods but I love his goal for the franchise. He wants to bring it up from the ground up and wants to bring in players who represent winning and playing hard every night.

Say whatever you want about his bad moves - Noah is a hard worker. Noah sucks on offense. But Noah works his tail off. He talks to Willy and KP on the bench all the time. Noah values the defensive possesion. Noah passes the ball. Bad signing, yes. In terms of drafting? We have made some great ones and we have lots of quality picks coming our way. We have to trade Melo to rebuild properly. Phil is pushing Melo out of town not because of some personal agenda against Melo. He got Rose, Lee and guys like that for Melo to win now. He's pushing Melo out of town because it helps Melo go to a situation he can actually win (as the 2nd or 3rd best player) and it also allows NY to do what's in the best interests for them - which is rebuild around Porzingis, draft picks, young players and capspace.

Yeah and he is/was trying to stuff Rambis and the triangle down our throats...

To run most offenses at a great level you need a superstar who is dominant. Phil had that with Jordan. Then Shaq. Then Kobe. In NY, Melo wasn't able to be that guy. Trying wasn't a bad idea. In theory Melo is a great isolation scorer, so the Triangle was a great set up for him to balance out the Triangle with his great scoring skill. But here is where Melo failed. Melo didn't really understand the importance of using the Triangle or a team offense to balance the attack. He actually did do it for like half a season, well more like a quarter. But that's it. He quickly reverted back to 2-3 assists a night Melo. The best players in the Triangle got 25 points a night on effecient shooting and also 5-6 assists. Melo just couldn't do that. Maybe he was past his prime. Maybe he just isn't a player that likes to pass on a consistent basis. Whatever it is, it was a bad match in the end.

Yes Phil gets blame for trying to push the Triangle on the team, but it was in theory a good offense and system for Melo. What's the right offense for Melo? D'Antoni's? Oh guess what, Melo rebelled and failed in that one as well. Maybe the problem isn't the systems, it's the player. It's why D'Antoni ran out of town as well. Ever read what George Karl said about Melo?

So Phil, D'Antoni and Karl are all bufoons while Melo is perfect? Ok.

Let's be real..His supporting cast has sucked so far..Melo never had a Shaq or Pippen/Grant/Rodman playing next to him...The Knicks had an opportunity to reload with Amare and Chandler coming off the books but Phil just isn't good at what he does or he is just darn lazy at this point in his career...He is bad, let be honest....You and I know KP isn't ready..You know you can't win when Horny and Rambis doesn't know the first thing about defense...So here we are, Phil needs a scapegoat and he has one..The hated guy that got Gallo traded..Carmelo Anthony...Get rid of Melo and we can lose for the next two years of Phil contract with no pressure...

Lets be real. Knicks sucked when Phil got here. Knicks sucked before Phil got here. Knicks sucked long before Phil got here. There is one nice 50+ win season sandwiched around a decade plus of losing. Phil needs a scapegoat? No he doesnt. Not at all. Please.

HofstraBBall wrote:Bahahaha. Keving Ding? What a Fucking Ding Dong. The blogger with as much NBA experience as a high school boy? He takes all the hater shit said about Melo over the las few years and the idiots on here buy it. Cuz it has nothing to do with getting hits on the net. And what better way is there but to feed the haters.

My favorite part of the article. PHIL HAS BROUGHT OVER EXPERIENCE VETS TO SURROUND HIM, TWICE1 GTFOH!!! You mean Robin fuckin Lopez? Aflalo? The broken down Rose and Noah? Cuz i'm sure you guys think they are All Stars. Yeah can see it now. Watch put LBJ, Love and Irving...Here come Melo AA and Rolo. They must have been really scared with that sight. LMAO.

Herre is a pic of your boy. You think he was in favor of letting Lin go? You think he blames Melo? IS this DK7th? Think so!

You haters keep going with all the obscure personal shit to support your hate for the guy. It will be over soon. And you can sit on here every night and complain how the misfits are not turning out to what you experts thought them to be. Think the basketball gods have it right, why give a chip to a bunch of whinning no talent recognizing haters.

yup,

you look at what glenn put around melo that had him 3rd in MVP votes, and look at what phil has manage to put around melo.

Every single FA aside from Lopez and lee has been a disappointment, and it's been well documented on these boards, and right now that silly tweet is echoing around the league, and from everything I read, players/coaches/presidents, are all stating that this is not a good look for phil..he's damaging his brand more than melo.

fishmike wrote:

holfresh wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:

holfresh wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:I have to say that I am eagerly awaiting Melo's reaction.
This is better than WWE, UFC or soap opera.

This is a legit battle going on. Two sides playing poker and trying to mind fuck the other.

Melo can pretend he's the victim, but how do you think the Knicks even know about Clippers and Cavs as Melo's destination? Clearly in the past at some point Melo's agent/reps and NY's front office have had a conversation about where Melo would be willing to go. There's no way that they just picked out of the blue, lets negotiate with the Clippers or the Cavs. There's a reason this story as a trade destination has had fuel for over a year. Last trade deadline it was the same thing.

Melo can always say he doesn't want to go, yet why does NY even have knowledge of his interest to play with Paul in LA or Bron in CLE? Clearly his people have spoken to some degree with NY about this in the past or at some point. Melo isn't asking out, so he looks good and he's happy being a good player hogging all the plays and spotlight on a bad team in his favorite city. He's allowed to do that, he's a business man and he got what he wanted in free agency. That's why he played that game.

But here's the thing. Phil is also looking out for NY's best interests. This isn't lets just mind fuck Melo because it's Melo. This is about getting Melo to waive his NTC and get out of town. I don't agree with Phil Jackson's methods but I love his goal for the franchise. He wants to bring it up from the ground up and wants to bring in players who represent winning and playing hard every night.

Say whatever you want about his bad moves - Noah is a hard worker. Noah sucks on offense. But Noah works his tail off. He talks to Willy and KP on the bench all the time. Noah values the defensive possesion. Noah passes the ball. Bad signing, yes. In terms of drafting? We have made some great ones and we have lots of quality picks coming our way. We have to trade Melo to rebuild properly. Phil is pushing Melo out of town not because of some personal agenda against Melo. He got Rose, Lee and guys like that for Melo to win now. He's pushing Melo out of town because it helps Melo go to a situation he can actually win (as the 2nd or 3rd best player) and it also allows NY to do what's in the best interests for them - which is rebuild around Porzingis, draft picks, young players and capspace.

Yeah and he is/was trying to stuff Rambis and the triangle down our throats...

To run most offenses at a great level you need a superstar who is dominant. Phil had that with Jordan. Then Shaq. Then Kobe. In NY, Melo wasn't able to be that guy. Trying wasn't a bad idea. In theory Melo is a great isolation scorer, so the Triangle was a great set up for him to balance out the Triangle with his great scoring skill. But here is where Melo failed. Melo didn't really understand the importance of using the Triangle or a team offense to balance the attack. He actually did do it for like half a season, well more like a quarter. But that's it. He quickly reverted back to 2-3 assists a night Melo. The best players in the Triangle got 25 points a night on effecient shooting and also 5-6 assists. Melo just couldn't do that. Maybe he was past his prime. Maybe he just isn't a player that likes to pass on a consistent basis. Whatever it is, it was a bad match in the end.

Yes Phil gets blame for trying to push the Triangle on the team, but it was in theory a good offense and system for Melo. What's the right offense for Melo? D'Antoni's? Oh guess what, Melo rebelled and failed in that one as well. Maybe the problem isn't the systems, it's the player. It's why D'Antoni ran out of town as well. Ever read what George Karl said about Melo?

So Phil, D'Antoni and Karl are all bufoons while Melo is perfect? Ok.

Let's be real..His supporting cast has sucked so far..Melo never had a Shaq or Pippen/Grant/Rodman playing next to him...The Knicks had an opportunity to reload with Amare and Chandler coming off the books but Phil just isn't good at what he does or he is just darn lazy at this point in his career...He is bad, let be honest....You and I know KP isn't ready..You know you can't win when Horny and Rambis doesn't know the first thing about defense...So here we are, Phil needs a scapegoat and he has one..The hated guy that got Gallo traded..Carmelo Anthony...Get rid of Melo and we can lose for the next two years of Phil contract with no pressure...

Lets be real. Knicks sucked when Phil got here. Knicks sucked before Phil got here. Knicks sucked long before Phil got here. There is one nice 50+ win season sandwiched around a decade plus of losing. Phil needs a scapegoat? No he doesnt. Not at all. Please.

I got all the confirmation I needed about Phil's ability as basketball president when he pulled off the Rose trade..It was a desperate hail mary move...Something Isiah would do..I actually liked the trade...I knew it was a big gamble but that's all Phil has at this point...

If Rose and Melo held up their end of the bargain this team would not be this bad. Teams rely on their top players to win! Lebron and Kyrie. Steph and KD. DeRozan and Lowry. I mean it's not rocket science to figure out what the source of the problem is.