Knicks · Screw getting a starting pg we already have one in Ron baker we need a starting shooting guard (page 2)

StarksEwing1 wrote:I like baker BUT lets dial it down. This is one of the better drafts for point guards in recent memory. Take the best player available but dont pass up a good point guard because of baker

I'm hoping we don't sleep on Frank Mason if he's there when we pick in the 2nd round.

LivingLegend wrote:Please find and watch the U.K. Vs. Florida game where Fox was hurt and Monk started off very slow/sloppy but ABSOLUTELY EXPLODED in the 2nd half scoring, passing, shooting, attacking the rim and tell me we can't use a guard like this taking some scoring load off KP.

What I particularly like about Monk is when the game gets late/tight this kid will be able to find, take and make shots and he is fearless.

I see Monk, Jackson and Tatum as cleanest triangle fits...Fox is questionable and DSJ is NOT a triangle fit IMO.

Just remember that when people compare Monk to JR Smith they're right cause the kid is pretty streaky with his shooting. I don't think being compared to JR is a bad thing and is actually a good thing cause the comparisons aren't for the dumb shyt JR does on and off the court, it's compared to his game play only which if you took away all the dumb shyt JR does he'd probably still be a Knick.

nixluva wrote:Just look at how far Baker has come since the start of the year! The confidence and how smooth he looks now!
He's an NBA player for sure. IMO he's another Knicks Scouts success. A 2 way player that is smart enough to run the offense and tough. You can play him with a PG or SG.

He played a very good game today. I keep hearing triangle pg and Ron Harper and Fisher.... come on man get off that. Fisher and Ron Harper never played the way Baker played today. Totally different games. Basketball is basketball. We can give the triangle bullshit a rest now. Ron Baker is proving to be a better point guard tan any of us expected. I think we can leave it at that.

I can totally see Monk or Fultz playing along side Baker. At pick #6 we'd definitely have a shot at both

nixluva wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:Just look at how far Baker has come since the start of the year! The confidence and how smooth he looks now!
He's an NBA player for sure. IMO he's another Knicks Scouts success. A 2 way player that is smart enough to run the offense and tough. You can play him with a PG or SG.

Nobody is saying we don't want Baker...he should be apart of the team next year. HOWEVER that doesn't mean we should abandon drafting a point guard in a strong draft class for point guards

My point is more about the Flexibility of Baker. He's a guy that can play next to any guard we'd draft or just come off the bench. He's good next to a PG or SG as he can guard both and run the team too. In the Triangle you don't have to be a star to play the PG. Baker has the BB IQ to handle the job.

100% agree ... perfect high IQ glue pg for the system

I like Baker, but he's a good bench PG. Eventually he might become starter good but not next year and it wouldn't be fair to go into the season with him in that role. I do hope he avg between 12 - 20 minutes a night.

Expect them to draft Fox, Monk, Ntilikina who are all big guards (6'4) alongside Austin Rivers (6'4) or Reggie Jackson (6'3). For Reggie I would expect Phil to get this year's Detroit draft pick as well. However, all things even I think it's Austin who fits the triangle PG role more and is a better defender.

Knicks rotation

Austin
Lee
???
KP
Willy

Rookie PG
Baker

That team isn't great but I expect the Knicks to be bad at least 1 more year to try and draft the future European player Gawd Doncic

Nothing against Baker - but honest, he should not be getting minutes on a team that plays 500 or above ball. And not because he can't contribute - sure, he can. But it's hard to imagine us not being able to wildly upgrade the PG position.

He is stop gap. Does he have grit, yes.

Baker could be a secondary guard in the Triangle, in a backcourt where the other guard is a scoring/shooting stud. He needs a 20-22 points a night guy next to him. He looked best when Sasha was shooting great or when Rose was next to him scoring well. Without that, we'd be too depleted.

He needs to improve his 3 ball.

I can see him be a Fisher or Dellavedova for a team, but Fisher played with Kobe Bryant, Westbrook and players like that in his career.

franco12 wrote:Nothing against Baker - but honest, he should not be getting minutes on a team that plays 500 or above ball. And not because he can't contribute - sure, he can. But it's hard to imagine us not being able to wildly upgrade the PG position.

He is stop gap. Does he have grit, yes.

Not for me. Dude has shown something this year at one of the harder positions to understand in an offense that is not dumbed down to PnR over and over and over again.

And he plays some tough D.

reub wrote:If we combine need and talent, the right pick for this team is probably Ntilikina. Our perimeter defense is our biggest weakness. Plus it looks like he can really shoot and doesn't need the ball.

A positive for him is that he will mature into a player who can play both guard positions...and if his shooting continues to improve, and all reports are that his shooting did improve this year, there is no reason to think that he could not be on the court at the same time with Baker playing lead guard...giving us a pretty good perimeter D.

Lots of options in this draft...we need that 6 slot, though.

newyorker4ever wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:I like baker BUT lets dial it down. This is one of the better drafts for point guards in recent memory. Take the best player available but dont pass up a good point guard because of baker

I'm hoping we don't sleep on Frank Mason if he's there when we pick in the 2nd round.

Have thought about Mason also...if we pick up an Isaac in Rnd 1, I could see giving him a chance, though we know that Jackson supposedly likes larger guards.

Will be interesting to see if we work him out.

Let's also give Hornacek the credit he deserves for coaching up Baker (and Willy). The mentorship that he can provide to these kids is key, and should put to rest any talk of whether he's the right coach for the team.

WaltLongmire wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:I like baker BUT lets dial it down. This is one of the better drafts for point guards in recent memory. Take the best player available but dont pass up a good point guard because of baker

I'm hoping we don't sleep on Frank Mason if he's there when we pick in the 2nd round.

Have thought about Mason also...if we pick up an Isaac in Rnd 1, I could see giving him a chance, though we know that Jackson supposedly likes larger guards.

Will be interesting to see if we work him out.

Isn't D.Fisher like 6'1 or 6'2??

WaltLongmire wrote:

newyorker4ever wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:I like baker BUT lets dial it down. This is one of the better drafts for point guards in recent memory. Take the best player available but dont pass up a good point guard because of baker

I'm hoping we don't sleep on Frank Mason if he's there when we pick in the 2nd round.

Have thought about Mason also...if we pick up an Isaac in Rnd 1, I could see giving him a chance, though we know that Jackson supposedly likes larger guards.

Will be interesting to see if we work him out.

I'd like to snatch someone like Nigel Williams-Goss with the last pick. Has size and is heady. He's not athletic enough to be a Frontline starter, but I can see him developing into a rotation player. Baker doesn't score enough to be a Frontline starter. It could happen. But until that happens, we still need an upgrade. Who knows tho? Maybe Baker will have his mid-range and close-range attack figured out in year two. I think Baker's defense definitely gives him and edge over Randle coming back. Next year looks solid for SGs, so I don't see the same urgency to draft Monk over Issac, Jackson Tatum and some of the other SF types that drop down.

martin wrote:

franco12 wrote:Nothing against Baker - but honest, he should not be getting minutes on a team that plays 500 or above ball. And not because he can't contribute - sure, he can. But it's hard to imagine us not being able to wildly upgrade the PG position.

He is stop gap. Does he have grit, yes.

Not for me. Dude has shown something this year at one of the harder positions to understand in an offense that is not dumbed down to PnR over and over and over again.

And he plays some tough D.

Exactly!!! People are totally underestimating the BB IQ of Baker. Think about it, both Rose and BJ could not figure out the Triangle. Baker demonstrates he can execute at a high level and as he got more comfortable you saw the return of his offense starting. He's much more capable as a scorer than it looked. So big, tough, smart, long, 2Way guard that can play PG or SG! That's special. He doesn't have to be a star to be very effective for this team.

StarksEwing1 wrote:I like baker BUT lets dial it down. This is one of the better drafts for point guards in recent memory. Take the best player available but dont pass up a good point guard because of baker

Other very recent favorite young PGs that were hyped prematurely or during meaningless seasons:
Jerian Grant
Langston Galloway
Toney Douglas

Let's just chill. I remember people saying they wouldn't trade Channing Frye for Kevin Garnett after his rookie year. Same story every year. Homers projecting rookie players to be starters before they've proven anything.

Panos wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:I like baker BUT lets dial it down. This is one of the better drafts for point guards in recent memory. Take the best player available but dont pass up a good point guard because of baker

Other very recent favorite young PGs that were hyped prematurely or during meaningless seasons:
Jerian Grant
Langston Galloway
Toney Douglas

Let's just chill. I remember people saying they wouldn't trade Channing Frye for Kevin Garnett after his rookie year. Same story every year. Homers projecting rookie players to be starters before they've proven anything.

I actually think Baker has shown a lot already. NEVER did any of Grant, Galloway or TD look as capable of running the team as Baker has. No, Baker isn't a lock to be a star but he has demonstrated he can hold his own on D and he understands how to run Triangle too.

Baker seems to be closer to the ideal PG Phil is looking for. We had hopes Grant would develop along these lines but Baker is a stronger player and doesn't get pushed around. Galloway was never as good at running the offense as Baker.

nixluva wrote:

Panos wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:I like baker BUT lets dial it down. This is one of the better drafts for point guards in recent memory. Take the best player available but dont pass up a good point guard because of baker

Other very recent favorite young PGs that were hyped prematurely or during meaningless seasons:
Jerian Grant
Langston Galloway
Toney Douglas

Let's just chill. I remember people saying they wouldn't trade Channing Frye for Kevin Garnett after his rookie year. Same story every year. Homers projecting rookie players to be starters before they've proven anything.

I actually think Baker has shown a lot already. NEVER did any of Grant, Galloway or TD look as capable of running the team as Baker has. No, Baker isn't a lock to be a star but he has demonstrated he can hold his own on D and he understands how to run Triangle too.

Baker seems to be closer to the ideal PG Phil is looking for. We had hopes Grant would develop along these lines but Baker is a stronger player and doesn't get pushed around. Galloway was never as good at running the offense as Baker.

Let me fix that sentence. Gallo was never good at running an offense. Period. To a lesser extent he is Rose without the athleticism, but at least he tried on D (still wasn't so good at it).

martin wrote:

nixluva wrote:

Panos wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:I like baker BUT lets dial it down. This is one of the better drafts for point guards in recent memory. Take the best player available but dont pass up a good point guard because of baker

Other very recent favorite young PGs that were hyped prematurely or during meaningless seasons:
Jerian Grant
Langston Galloway
Toney Douglas

Let's just chill. I remember people saying they wouldn't trade Channing Frye for Kevin Garnett after his rookie year. Same story every year. Homers projecting rookie players to be starters before they've proven anything.

I actually think Baker has shown a lot already. NEVER did any of Grant, Galloway or TD look as capable of running the team as Baker has. No, Baker isn't a lock to be a star but he has demonstrated he can hold his own on D and he understands how to run Triangle too.

Baker seems to be closer to the ideal PG Phil is looking for. We had hopes Grant would develop along these lines but Baker is a stronger player and doesn't get pushed around. Galloway was never as good at running the offense as Baker.

Let me fix that sentence. Gallo was never good at running an offense. Period. To a lesser extent he is Rose without the athleticism, but at least he tried on D (still wasn't so good at it).

Yeah no question that Baker offers a lot more than Grant, Galloway, and Douglas ever showed. He is establishing himself as a low mistake facilitator who can pass and defend. I think his development as a shooter will determine how good he becomes. He can definitely shoot, the ball just isn't going in a lot yet. If he can become a 36+% 3pt shooter, he can become a good 3rd guard, or even starting guard. His ability to fit in this system bodes well for him as well. This seems like a great fit. I would be intrigued at his ability to fit next to an elite scoring guard, possibly like Monk.

Knixkik wrote:

martin wrote:

nixluva wrote:

Panos wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:I like baker BUT lets dial it down. This is one of the better drafts for point guards in recent memory. Take the best player available but dont pass up a good point guard because of baker

Other very recent favorite young PGs that were hyped prematurely or during meaningless seasons:
Jerian Grant
Langston Galloway
Toney Douglas

Let's just chill. I remember people saying they wouldn't trade Channing Frye for Kevin Garnett after his rookie year. Same story every year. Homers projecting rookie players to be starters before they've proven anything.

I actually think Baker has shown a lot already. NEVER did any of Grant, Galloway or TD look as capable of running the team as Baker has. No, Baker isn't a lock to be a star but he has demonstrated he can hold his own on D and he understands how to run Triangle too.

Baker seems to be closer to the ideal PG Phil is looking for. We had hopes Grant would develop along these lines but Baker is a stronger player and doesn't get pushed around. Galloway was never as good at running the offense as Baker.

Let me fix that sentence. Gallo was never good at running an offense. Period. To a lesser extent he is Rose without the athleticism, but at least he tried on D (still wasn't so good at it).

Yeah no question that Baker offers a lot more than Grant, Galloway, and Douglas ever showed. He is establishing himself as a low mistake facilitator who can pass and defend. I think his development as a shooter will determine how good he becomes. He can definitely shoot, the ball just isn't going in a lot yet. If he can become a 36+% 3pt shooter, he can become a good 3rd guard, or even starting guard. His ability to fit in this system bodes well for him as well. This seems like a great fit. I would be intrigued at his ability to fit next to an elite scoring guard, possibly like Monk.

100%

Improved shooting will keep Baker and NDour in the league. I think Baker has a shot to be a very solid PG starter for the Knicks next to a high level SG or SF. Or both.

martin wrote:

franco12 wrote:Nothing against Baker - but honest, he should not be getting minutes on a team that plays 500 or above ball. And not because he can't contribute - sure, he can. But it's hard to imagine us not being able to wildly upgrade the PG position.

He is stop gap. Does he have grit, yes.

Not for me. Dude has shown something this year at one of the harder positions to understand in an offense that is not dumbed down to PnR over and over and over again.

And he plays some tough D.

Have a feeling that Jackson loves Baker...he'll be able to let Sasha go next year because Baker has bought into the Triangle and seems to be able to run it.

Not unlike Galloway, who also seemed to pick it up quickly...and played hardnosed D.

We better get a star SG because Baker/Lee is not going to cut it. Ever. He looks like a potential back up player which would be a bless at this point.