Knicks · Dangelo Russell is available for a first rounder (page 4)
fishmike wrote:Russell is very young. Most of us are pretty stupid at age 18, 19 and 20. He can shoot, has court vision, good size, great passer... plays no defense but this was a great job by the Nets to get talent using their cap space. Russell and Lin will be a high scoring backcourt.Nothing wrong with what the nets did. They lost two lottery picks from the awful trade so they might as well take a chance on a former lottery pick who still has a ton of upside despite maturity issues and defensive issues. Who knows maybe a change of scenery would be good for him. He was actually my favorite prospect going into the 2015 draft
fishmike wrote:Russell is very young. Most of us are pretty stupid at age 18, 19 and 20. He can shoot, has court vision, good size, great passer... plays no defense but this was a great job by the Nets to get talent using their cap space. Russell and Lin will be a high scoring backcourt.
I agree. Lin has swown that he can play with another ball dominant PG in Kemba Walker. They are now guard heavy. They need to find another front court player because right now they only have Booker and Mozgov that is worth anything. This starting 5 is not bad
PG-Lin
SG-Russell
SF-LeVert
PF-Booker
C-Mozgov
Should be good for 40+ wins in the weak east.
Mistake by the Lakers.
nyknickzingis wrote:Russell is going to average 20 points a night on that Nets team.
Mistake by the Lakers.
Not if they're high on Ball and believe a package of low first round pick and young role players will net the PG. There are so many moving parts to these deals that it's too early too declare a winner or loser.
NYKBocker wrote:fishmike wrote:Russell is very young. Most of us are pretty stupid at age 18, 19 and 20. He can shoot, has court vision, good size, great passer... plays no defense but this was a great job by the Nets to get talent using their cap space. Russell and Lin will be a high scoring backcourt.I agree. Lin has swown that he can play with another ball dominant PG in Kemba Walker. They are now guard heavy. They need to find another front court player because right now they only have Booker and Mozgov that is worth anything. This starting 5 is not bad
PG-Lin
SG-Russell
SF-LeVert
PF-Booker
C-MozgovShould be good for 40+ wins in the weak east.
Lopez at the moment is better then Russell. Russell may or may not be a big piece for them in the long term. But he doesn't make them a better team today. Lin & Russell is also a poor defensive backcourt that to me won't be able to guard anyone. So they are going to have to push the pace as much points as possible which Mozgov isn't going to help them with. Good thing for them there is plenty of athletic big men late in this draft.
Odds are though unless they make some drastic moves they are netting the #1 pick in the 2018 draft as well.
BigDaddyG wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:Russell is going to average 20 points a night on that Nets team.
Mistake by the Lakers.Not if they're high on Ball and believe a package of low first round pick and young role players will net the PG. There are so many moving parts to these deals that it's too early too declare a winner or loser.
Ball is Russell 2.0
He has the exact same limitations as Russell.
Big guard with limited blow by/driving ability. Won't be a constant drive and dish or penetration threat.
Good outside shooter but relies too much on it perhaps.
Can be a role player at times and too passive.
Can he guard small quicks?
Great passing ability. Outstanding vision.
Best position defensively may be 2 guard.
I think they will see the two are very similar in strengths and weaknesses. Ball may be a better leader and more mature, as Russell lacked in those areas. We will see, but I think Russell will be a star on the Nets. The Nets made a great move. They had no young longterm draft pick to build around or with. Now they do. He's going to give them 18-20 a night and make some great passes. Good for them. Lakers I think will regret it as Brook is heading into free agency and will command a massive contract in 2018 if they keep him.
nyknickzingis wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:Russell is going to average 20 points a night on that Nets team.
Mistake by the Lakers.Not if they're high on Ball and believe a package of low first round pick and young role players will net the PG. There are so many moving parts to these deals that it's too early too declare a winner or loser.
Ball is Russell 2.0
He has the exact same limitations as Russell.Big guard with limited blow by/driving ability. Won't be a constant drive and dish or penetration threat.
Good outside shooter but relies too much on it perhaps.
Can be a role player at times and too passive.
Can he guard small quicks?
Great passing ability. Outstanding vision.
Best position defensively may be 2 guard.I think they will see the two are very similar in strengths and weaknesses. Ball may be a better leader and more mature, as Russell lacked in those areas. We will see, but I think Russell will be a star on the Nets. The Nets made a great move. They had no young longterm draft pick to build around or with. Now they do. He's going to give them 18-20 a night and make some great passes. Good for them. Lakers I think will regret it as Brook is heading into free agency and will command a massive contract in 2018 if they keep him.
I agree with you on ball. I'm fact, I think Russell is the better prospect because he has more ways to score and keep the defense honest. But. The key piece is Paul George. If they can get him for smaller pieces, than the Lakers become the winners in the long-term.
At the end of last season Russel showed his true NBA position ..
Combo-SG .... The Lakers would have had a nice young tandem of Ball/Russel in their backcourt if this trade wouldnt have went down.
nyknickzingis wrote:I don't recall anybody ever saying Russell had great passing ability/vision. Certainly nobody compared Russell to Jason Kidd in that category like do Ball. Nor do I recall people referencing Russell's ability to make teammates better. Huge difference between the Russell and Ball in those two areas.BigDaddyG wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:Russell is going to average 20 points a night on that Nets team.
Mistake by the Lakers.Not if they're high on Ball and believe a package of low first round pick and young role players will net the PG. There are so many moving parts to these deals that it's too early too declare a winner or loser.
Ball is Russell 2.0
He has the exact same limitations as Russell.Big guard with limited blow by/driving ability. Won't be a constant drive and dish or penetration threat.
Good outside shooter but relies too much on it perhaps.
Can be a role player at times and too passive.
Can he guard small quicks?
Great passing ability. Outstanding vision.
Best position defensively may be 2 guard.I think they will see the two are very similar in strengths and weaknesses. Ball may be a better leader and more mature, as Russell lacked in those areas. We will see, but I think Russell will be a star on the Nets. The Nets made a great move. They had no young longterm draft pick to build around or with. Now they do. He's going to give them 18-20 a night and make some great passes. Good for them. Lakers I think will regret it as Brook is heading into free agency and will command a massive contract in 2018 if they keep him.
nyknickzingis wrote:Russell is going to average 20 points a night on that Nets team.
Mistake by the Lakers.
20 points? On 20 shots? 
Is he going to help the team? I care about that more than his PPG.
nyknickzingis wrote:Russell is going to average 20 points a night on that Nets team.
Mistake by the Lakers.
Agree, he is going to have a chip on his shoulder. That 8 pick for Russell would have been worth it.
Welpee wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:I don't recall anybody ever saying Russell had great passing ability/vision. Certainly nobody compared Russell to Jason Kidd in that category like do Ball. Nor do I recall people referencing Russell's ability to make teammates better. Huge difference between the Russell and Ball in those two areas.BigDaddyG wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:Russell is going to average 20 points a night on that Nets team.
Mistake by the Lakers.Not if they're high on Ball and believe a package of low first round pick and young role players will net the PG. There are so many moving parts to these deals that it's too early too declare a winner or loser.
Ball is Russell 2.0
He has the exact same limitations as Russell.Big guard with limited blow by/driving ability. Won't be a constant drive and dish or penetration threat.
Good outside shooter but relies too much on it perhaps.
Can be a role player at times and too passive.
Can he guard small quicks?
Great passing ability. Outstanding vision.
Best position defensively may be 2 guard.I think they will see the two are very similar in strengths and weaknesses. Ball may be a better leader and more mature, as Russell lacked in those areas. We will see, but I think Russell will be a star on the Nets. The Nets made a great move. They had no young longterm draft pick to build around or with. Now they do. He's going to give them 18-20 a night and make some great passes. Good for them. Lakers I think will regret it as Brook is heading into free agency and will command a massive contract in 2018 if they keep him.
Russell was touted as an elite passer coming in. That's why the Lakers wasted so much time playing him at pg.
BigDaddyG wrote:Not a Jason Kidd-level passer. If Russell was considered elite there must be another level above that.Welpee wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:I don't recall anybody ever saying Russell had great passing ability/vision. Certainly nobody compared Russell to Jason Kidd in that category like do Ball. Nor do I recall people referencing Russell's ability to make teammates better. Huge difference between the Russell and Ball in those two areas.BigDaddyG wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:Russell is going to average 20 points a night on that Nets team.
Mistake by the Lakers.Not if they're high on Ball and believe a package of low first round pick and young role players will net the PG. There are so many moving parts to these deals that it's too early too declare a winner or loser.
Ball is Russell 2.0
He has the exact same limitations as Russell.Big guard with limited blow by/driving ability. Won't be a constant drive and dish or penetration threat.
Good outside shooter but relies too much on it perhaps.
Can be a role player at times and too passive.
Can he guard small quicks?
Great passing ability. Outstanding vision.
Best position defensively may be 2 guard.I think they will see the two are very similar in strengths and weaknesses. Ball may be a better leader and more mature, as Russell lacked in those areas. We will see, but I think Russell will be a star on the Nets. The Nets made a great move. They had no young longterm draft pick to build around or with. Now they do. He's going to give them 18-20 a night and make some great passes. Good for them. Lakers I think will regret it as Brook is heading into free agency and will command a massive contract in 2018 if they keep him.
Russell was touted as an elite passer coming in. That's why the Lakers wasted so much time playing him at pg.
Welpee wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:Not a Jason Kidd-level passer. If Russell was considered elite there must be another level above that.Welpee wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:I don't recall anybody ever saying Russell had great passing ability/vision. Certainly nobody compared Russell to Jason Kidd in that category like do Ball. Nor do I recall people referencing Russell's ability to make teammates better. Huge difference between the Russell and Ball in those two areas.BigDaddyG wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:Russell is going to average 20 points a night on that Nets team.
Mistake by the Lakers.Not if they're high on Ball and believe a package of low first round pick and young role players will net the PG. There are so many moving parts to these deals that it's too early too declare a winner or loser.
Ball is Russell 2.0
He has the exact same limitations as Russell.Big guard with limited blow by/driving ability. Won't be a constant drive and dish or penetration threat.
Good outside shooter but relies too much on it perhaps.
Can be a role player at times and too passive.
Can he guard small quicks?
Great passing ability. Outstanding vision.
Best position defensively may be 2 guard.I think they will see the two are very similar in strengths and weaknesses. Ball may be a better leader and more mature, as Russell lacked in those areas. We will see, but I think Russell will be a star on the Nets. The Nets made a great move. They had no young longterm draft pick to build around or with. Now they do. He's going to give them 18-20 a night and make some great passes. Good for them. Lakers I think will regret it as Brook is heading into free agency and will command a massive contract in 2018 if they keep him.
Russell was touted as an elite passer coming in. That's why the Lakers wasted so much time playing him at pg.
Not elite like Jason Kidd, but upper echelon court vision.
StarksEwing1 wrote:fishmike wrote:Russell is very young. Most of us are pretty stupid at age 18, 19 and 20. He can shoot, has court vision, good size, great passer... plays no defense but this was a great job by the Nets to get talent using their cap space. Russell and Lin will be a high scoring backcourt.Nothing wrong with what the nets did. They lost two lottery picks from the awful trade so they might as well take a chance on a former lottery pick who still has a ton of upside despite maturity issues and defensive issues. Who knows maybe a change of scenery would be good for him. He was actually my favorite prospect going into the 2015
I agree - The Lakers on the other hand are getting injury prone Lopez on an expiring contract. Russell and Ball would have set their backcourt for 10 years. Now
We will see but I think the NEts made out on this one. They will flip Mozgov most likely.
Welpee wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:Not a Jason Kidd-level passer. If Russell was considered elite there must be another level above that.Welpee wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:I don't recall anybody ever saying Russell had great passing ability/vision. Certainly nobody compared Russell to Jason Kidd in that category like do Ball. Nor do I recall people referencing Russell's ability to make teammates better. Huge difference between the Russell and Ball in those two areas.BigDaddyG wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:Russell is going to average 20 points a night on that Nets team.
Mistake by the Lakers.Not if they're high on Ball and believe a package of low first round pick and young role players will net the PG. There are so many moving parts to these deals that it's too early too declare a winner or loser.
Ball is Russell 2.0
He has the exact same limitations as Russell.Big guard with limited blow by/driving ability. Won't be a constant drive and dish or penetration threat.
Good outside shooter but relies too much on it perhaps.
Can be a role player at times and too passive.
Can he guard small quicks?
Great passing ability. Outstanding vision.
Best position defensively may be 2 guard.I think they will see the two are very similar in strengths and weaknesses. Ball may be a better leader and more mature, as Russell lacked in those areas. We will see, but I think Russell will be a star on the Nets. The Nets made a great move. They had no young longterm draft pick to build around or with. Now they do. He's going to give them 18-20 a night and make some great passes. Good for them. Lakers I think will regret it as Brook is heading into free agency and will command a massive contract in 2018 if they keep him.
Russell was touted as an elite passer coming in. That's why the Lakers wasted so much time playing him at pg.
http://www.draftexpress.com/article/DAng...
Russell is extremely difficult to contain in pick and roll situations for this reason, as he has an elite ability to operate at different speeds, utilize smooth hesitation moves, and take what the defense gives him. His passing ability is arguably his best attribute at the moment, as he sees the floor wonderfully at 6-5 and shows incredible creativity and skill for a player his age, constantly probing the defense and whipping balls all over the floor with utmost confidence. He's extremely unselfish, not afraid to throw the ball ahead in transition to ignite the offense, even if he won't get credited with an assist. He often sees plays developing before they actually materialize in the half-court, and will move the ball calmly and quickly in the flow of the offense, getting his team an easy quick-hitting basket before the defense can react. -
BigDaddyG wrote:"His passing ability is arguably his best attribute at the moment..." is a bit different than having practically your entire profile comparing you to Jason Kidd:Welpee wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:Not a Jason Kidd-level passer. If Russell was considered elite there must be another level above that.Welpee wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:I don't recall anybody ever saying Russell had great passing ability/vision. Certainly nobody compared Russell to Jason Kidd in that category like do Ball. Nor do I recall people referencing Russell's ability to make teammates better. Huge difference between the Russell and Ball in those two areas.BigDaddyG wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:Russell is going to average 20 points a night on that Nets team.
Mistake by the Lakers.Not if they're high on Ball and believe a package of low first round pick and young role players will net the PG. There are so many moving parts to these deals that it's too early too declare a winner or loser.
Ball is Russell 2.0
He has the exact same limitations as Russell.Big guard with limited blow by/driving ability. Won't be a constant drive and dish or penetration threat.
Good outside shooter but relies too much on it perhaps.
Can be a role player at times and too passive.
Can he guard small quicks?
Great passing ability. Outstanding vision.
Best position defensively may be 2 guard.I think they will see the two are very similar in strengths and weaknesses. Ball may be a better leader and more mature, as Russell lacked in those areas. We will see, but I think Russell will be a star on the Nets. The Nets made a great move. They had no young longterm draft pick to build around or with. Now they do. He's going to give them 18-20 a night and make some great passes. Good for them. Lakers I think will regret it as Brook is heading into free agency and will command a massive contract in 2018 if they keep him.
Russell was touted as an elite passer coming in. That's why the Lakers wasted so much time playing him at pg.http://www.draftexpress.com/article/DAng...
Russell is extremely difficult to contain in pick and roll situations for this reason, as he has an elite ability to operate at different speeds, utilize smooth hesitation moves, and take what the defense gives him. His passing ability is arguably his best attribute at the moment, as he sees the floor wonderfully at 6-5 and shows incredible creativity and skill for a player his age, constantly probing the defense and whipping balls all over the floor with utmost confidence. He's extremely unselfish, not afraid to throw the ball ahead in transition to ignite the offense, even if he won't get credited with an assist. He often sees plays developing before they actually materialize in the half-court, and will move the ball calmly and quickly in the flow of the offense, getting his team an easy quick-hitting basket before the defense can react. -
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Lonz...
Welpee wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:"His passing ability is arguably his best attribute at the moment..." is a bit different than having practically your entire profile comparing you to Jason Kidd:Welpee wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:Not a Jason Kidd-level passer. If Russell was considered elite there must be another level above that.Welpee wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:I don't recall anybody ever saying Russell had great passing ability/vision. Certainly nobody compared Russell to Jason Kidd in that category like do Ball. Nor do I recall people referencing Russell's ability to make teammates better. Huge difference between the Russell and Ball in those two areas.BigDaddyG wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:Russell is going to average 20 points a night on that Nets team.
Mistake by the Lakers.Not if they're high on Ball and believe a package of low first round pick and young role players will net the PG. There are so many moving parts to these deals that it's too early too declare a winner or loser.
Ball is Russell 2.0
He has the exact same limitations as Russell.Big guard with limited blow by/driving ability. Won't be a constant drive and dish or penetration threat.
Good outside shooter but relies too much on it perhaps.
Can be a role player at times and too passive.
Can he guard small quicks?
Great passing ability. Outstanding vision.
Best position defensively may be 2 guard.I think they will see the two are very similar in strengths and weaknesses. Ball may be a better leader and more mature, as Russell lacked in those areas. We will see, but I think Russell will be a star on the Nets. The Nets made a great move. They had no young longterm draft pick to build around or with. Now they do. He's going to give them 18-20 a night and make some great passes. Good for them. Lakers I think will regret it as Brook is heading into free agency and will command a massive contract in 2018 if they keep him.
Russell was touted as an elite passer coming in. That's why the Lakers wasted so much time playing him at pg.http://www.draftexpress.com/article/DAng...
Russell is extremely difficult to contain in pick and roll situations for this reason, as he has an elite ability to operate at different speeds, utilize smooth hesitation moves, and take what the defense gives him. His passing ability is arguably his best attribute at the moment, as he sees the floor wonderfully at 6-5 and shows incredible creativity and skill for a player his age, constantly probing the defense and whipping balls all over the floor with utmost confidence. He's extremely unselfish, not afraid to throw the ball ahead in transition to ignite the offense, even if he won't get credited with an assist. He often sees plays developing before they actually materialize in the half-court, and will move the ball calmly and quickly in the flow of the offense, getting his team an easy quick-hitting basket before the defense can react. -
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Lonz...
"As he sees the floor wonderfully..." Noting the profile similarities. Not saying they're clones, but similar strengths and weaknesses. Russell is obviously a better shot creator and Lonzo is a better passer. You can make the case that Russell is a better ball-handler and PnR player. You can look up the link and watch Russell's strengths video. My main point is that they couldn't co-exist together. Lakers agreed and traded Russell. Time will tell. But if the trade allows them to obtain PG before the season, than it's a good trade for them.
BigDaddyG wrote:That I agree with. Russell and Ball together in the samw backcourt didn't make much sense no matter how many lies were told to the contrary. I think that Nets Lakers trade was a good deal for both teams.Welpee wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:"His passing ability is arguably his best attribute at the moment..." is a bit different than having practically your entire profile comparing you to Jason Kidd:Welpee wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:Not a Jason Kidd-level passer. If Russell was considered elite there must be another level above that.Welpee wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:I don't recall anybody ever saying Russell had great passing ability/vision. Certainly nobody compared Russell to Jason Kidd in that category like do Ball. Nor do I recall people referencing Russell's ability to make teammates better. Huge difference between the Russell and Ball in those two areas.BigDaddyG wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:Russell is going to average 20 points a night on that Nets team.
Mistake by the Lakers.Not if they're high on Ball and believe a package of low first round pick and young role players will net the PG. There are so many moving parts to these deals that it's too early too declare a winner or loser.
Ball is Russell 2.0
He has the exact same limitations as Russell.Big guard with limited blow by/driving ability. Won't be a constant drive and dish or penetration threat.
Good outside shooter but relies too much on it perhaps.
Can be a role player at times and too passive.
Can he guard small quicks?
Great passing ability. Outstanding vision.
Best position defensively may be 2 guard.I think they will see the two are very similar in strengths and weaknesses. Ball may be a better leader and more mature, as Russell lacked in those areas. We will see, but I think Russell will be a star on the Nets. The Nets made a great move. They had no young longterm draft pick to build around or with. Now they do. He's going to give them 18-20 a night and make some great passes. Good for them. Lakers I think will regret it as Brook is heading into free agency and will command a massive contract in 2018 if they keep him.
Russell was touted as an elite passer coming in. That's why the Lakers wasted so much time playing him at pg.http://www.draftexpress.com/article/DAng...
Russell is extremely difficult to contain in pick and roll situations for this reason, as he has an elite ability to operate at different speeds, utilize smooth hesitation moves, and take what the defense gives him. His passing ability is arguably his best attribute at the moment, as he sees the floor wonderfully at 6-5 and shows incredible creativity and skill for a player his age, constantly probing the defense and whipping balls all over the floor with utmost confidence. He's extremely unselfish, not afraid to throw the ball ahead in transition to ignite the offense, even if he won't get credited with an assist. He often sees plays developing before they actually materialize in the half-court, and will move the ball calmly and quickly in the flow of the offense, getting his team an easy quick-hitting basket before the defense can react. -
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Lonz..."As he sees the floor wonderfully..." Noting the profile similarities. Not saying they're clones, but similar strengths and weaknesses. Russell is obviously a better shot creator and Lonzo is a better passer. You can make the case that Russell is a better ball-handler and PnR player. You can look up the link and watch Russell's strengths video. My main point is that they couldn't co-exist together. Lakers agreed and traded Russell. Time will tell. But if the trade allows them to obtain PG before the season, than it's a good trade for them.