Knicks · Woj Making Up KP-Trade Rumors? Could Be Related To Martin's Thread From Yesterday? (page 4)
Sinix wrote:EwingsGlass wrote:KP presents a combination of size and skill that is hard to imagine replacing. Even if he has not peaked in his skill set. But make no mistakes, there are flaws in his game and his conditioning program seems to leave him with weak legs and injury prone throughout the season.That said, I absolutely see him as a player with Steph Curry-like game changing attributes were he able to capitalize on all his strengths.
I think what people are saying is that they want to enjoy the journey with KP. Whether he takes it to the next level or not, we want to enjoy the show that is the KP legend in the making. And if he fails he fails. But he can be a top 5 player and a premier player in this league and we, as fans, want the opportunity to witness that here in NY-- not to cash our chips in early.
By contrast, others are responding with the 'what if' game. What if I agreed to give you KAT and the Wolve's next 99 first round draft picks? How about then? And that is just being cute.
The truth is somewhere in between. There are enough flaws in KP's game that you have to consider trade value as it relates to his contract status. The passive overtures in addition to formally skipping meetings create a risk factor on signability at the end of his rookie contract. Given the increase in the salary cap, many teams will be able to offer a ton of money. So, maybe cashing in while he has significant value makes sense?
He would not be cheap. If you can reset your clock on team control on a talented young player and add assets at the same time, that is one fundamental concept in team growth. The 76ers were jokes for years running. Maybe they still are. But who here wouldn't trade rosters with them at this moment? If you can build assets in what appears to be another re-building year, objectively you have to think about the offers as they come in.
'Replacing' implies that we have a team in place worth a damn. Knicks need to build a whole team while there are teams out there that need specific parts like Porzingis. We shouldn't be worried about 'replacing' when we need literally everything we can get.
Agreed. By 'replace', I simply meant that 7'3 mobile centers with 7'6 wingspan and good looking outside shot are hard to "replace" not to mean that the balance of the roster is set such that we would need someone to fill a specific role. My intention was the unique nature of his physical attributes and skills on an individual basis.
knicks1248 wrote:Hey KP, you don't worry about the losing culture and mass confusion, don't worry about melo, don't worry about the revolving door of players we sign and then trade or waive, don't worry about the draftees I keep trading because they are not triangle players after all, or the vets that hate the system.Ignore the dozen of NY media that stands out side your door, or chases you down in central park while riding your bike, don't worry about what your brother says, he doesn't have your best interest at heart. Don't worry that I said anyone on the team can be traded. Just block all that out of your mind and act like your not human, after all you're a unicorn..
KP really appreciates that!!!!! You da man!!!
Also, its good fans tell him to not model his game on Melo, What would these guys do without us!!
Chandler wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:This isn't shocking.
Begley reported Knicks got a ton of calls for Porzingis after he skipped the exit meeting.
Teams know KP and Knicks not on best terms.
They are trying to tempt Phil into making a deal now.I wonder what the offers are,
My guess?
Boston for sure, with #3, future pick, and maybe a rotation player?
Lakers with #2 and a young rotation/starting player.
Sacto with #5 and a young rotation/starting player.Phil should pass on these offers. Only players I trade KP for are Towns or Anthony Davis. Upgrade in talent. Do not downgrade. Plus, how about drafting a kid and building a longterm team around/with him. We like never do that.
KP is worth much more than any of these. Yes he has some issues but he and KAT right now are by far the two biggest "gets" in the league, and I can't think of anyone else who is even close (of course I'm disqualifying the Lebron and Kawhi's and the other MVP-types) -- biggest opportunity to be superstars if they keep at it. Consider that KP has yet to be even close to a focal point, has a good head on his shoulders (though knucklehead brothers), he's everything Shawn Bradley was hyped to be and then some.
Boston would be in the best position to make an offer we couldn't refuse -- but we should still refuse it
He was poisoned by his idol Melo its time to move on, Crowder, #3 and the 76ers pick
knicks1248 wrote:Dagger wrote:knicks1248 wrote:Clean wrote:Hopefully this tells KP to stop with that diva crap. It seems all this unicorn stuff has gone to his head. He has not played well enough to think he can start throwing his weight around.The nerve of KP insisting on wanting to win now
It's not the place of a second year player to tell management what they should and shouldn't be doing. If we coddle KP and give him the power he thinks he deserves it will continue to go to his head and he will never get any better. KP's focus should be on how he can make the team better by improving his own game, not on how phil can do his job. If KP wants to win now he should do everything in his power to make the Knicks that much harder to beat while he is on the floor, not worry about the outside noise surrounding the team.
Sometimes I think you guys don't understand the impact outside drama has on a team. You think players just block it out and go about their business.
2 yrs in the league, same team, but has already had 25 different teammates, utter confusion, and losing.
Some of you are so immune to the losing and drama, that you can't believe any player, vet, or youngster should have the audacity to complain. I guess they're suppose to shut and play and enjoy losing..
Which means Phil is asking for too much.
Meaning he is either trying to set up the Knicks exceptionally well with 3 young players on one night (such as Booker, Fox at 4, Markannen at 8) or he's trying to send a message to KP.
Who would argue against a roster that had a starting lineup that featured Willy, Markannen, Booker and Fox?
It won't happen because no team is paying that much for Kristaps as good as he may be.
It's a good a kick in the butt for KP to show him he is not untouchable and he can not just skip an exit meeting without consequences.
newyorknewyork wrote:Booker and Markannen would provide no defense. And Willy isn't exactly Gasol out there defensively either.
It's a rebuild and you're aiming for a top 5 pick next year in this scenario.
You're talking about maximizing your assets.
Is KP that guy to build around?
If so, he needs to act like it.
He's acting like a little brat.
Get your butt in the gym all summer (which I think he is doing).
Get a few go to moves like Dirk has.
Establish a comfort zone in the post (gym work is vital to get post base).
Get more arc on your 3 ball like Horny suggets as it's too flat right now to be a consistent weapon.
I love KP and think he has that talent to become a franchise player.
It will never happen if he plays for Latvia every summer, follows Melo's example/lead and only listens to his brother.
If he's going to be like that, the last sentence I wrote, as much as it pains me to write this, I rather trade him for two young star prospects like Booker and Tatum/Fox/JJ (whatever 4th pick we would take). Ofcourse there's no way the Suns do that. Why? KP is not on the level of Kevin Durant, Lebron or Westbrook. He's still got to do lots of work and needs to listen to coaches like Phil and Horny who have played/coached in the NBA Finals and know what it takes to be a great player.
His brother has not played in the NBA or coached at a high level. He does not know what it takes to go from a good pro to great. Phil and Horny the advice they are givig him, the coaching, it may not be what KP wants to hear but it is what will get him to the next level. The fancy dribbling, cross overs, hanging way back and pulling up for 3 pointers it's nice to have all that. It'll make a you a good exciting role player to watch. At 7'3 he needs to also have a mid-range game and a few go to moves. He does not have this and needs to focus on it.
nyknickzingis wrote:newyorknewyork wrote:Booker and Markannen would provide no defense. And Willy isn't exactly Gasol out there defensively either.
It's a rebuild and you're aiming for a top 5 pick next year in this scenario.
You're talking about maximizing your assets.Is KP that guy to build around?
If so, he needs to act like it.
He's acting like a little brat.Get your butt in the gym all summer (which I think he is doing).
Get a few go to moves like Dirk has.
Establish a comfort zone in the post (gym work is vital to get post base).
Get more arc on your 3 ball like Horny suggets as it's too flat right now to be a consistent weapon.
I love KP and think he has that talent to become a franchise player.
It will never happen if he plays for Latvia every summer, follows Melo's example/lead and only listens to his brother.If he's going to be like that, the last sentence I wrote, as much as it pains me to write this, I rather trade him for two young star prospects like Booker and Tatum/Fox/JJ (whatever 4th pick we would take). Ofcourse there's no way the Suns do that. Why? KP is not on the level of Kevin Durant, Lebron or Westbrook. He's still got to do lots of work and needs to listen to coaches like Phil and Horny who have played/coached in the NBA Finals and know what it takes to be a great player.
His brother has not played in the NBA or coached at a high level. He does not know what it takes to go from a good pro to great. Phil and Horny the advice they are givig him, the coaching, it may not be what KP wants to hear but it is what will get him to the next level. The fancy dribbling, cross overs, hanging way back and pulling up for 3 pointers it's nice to have all that. It'll make a you a good exciting role player to watch. At 7'3 he needs to also have a mid-range game and a few go to moves. He does not have this and needs to focus on it.
These are all great observations but the section I bolded is precisely how I feel as well.
The Latvian bullshit will make him a local god but it also adds incredible risk of injury and it also prepares him for something other than the NBA. I am not in the least bit a fan of this game he's playing with the organization and its fans - so much so that I think trading him makes a lot of sense. This is the start of a long journey that's going to result in lost seasons, fired coaches, and ever more narcissistic behavior.
He has value today that he won't have tomorrow - dump him.
fwk00 wrote:nyknickzingis wrote:newyorknewyork wrote:Booker and Markannen would provide no defense. And Willy isn't exactly Gasol out there defensively either.
It's a rebuild and you're aiming for a top 5 pick next year in this scenario.
You're talking about maximizing your assets.Is KP that guy to build around?
If so, he needs to act like it.
He's acting like a little brat.Get your butt in the gym all summer (which I think he is doing).
Get a few go to moves like Dirk has.
Establish a comfort zone in the post (gym work is vital to get post base).
Get more arc on your 3 ball like Horny suggets as it's too flat right now to be a consistent weapon.
I love KP and think he has that talent to become a franchise player.
It will never happen if he plays for Latvia every summer, follows Melo's example/lead and only listens to his brother.If he's going to be like that, the last sentence I wrote, as much as it pains me to write this, I rather trade him for two young star prospects like Booker and Tatum/Fox/JJ (whatever 4th pick we would take). Ofcourse there's no way the Suns do that. Why? KP is not on the level of Kevin Durant, Lebron or Westbrook. He's still got to do lots of work and needs to listen to coaches like Phil and Horny who have played/coached in the NBA Finals and know what it takes to be a great player.
His brother has not played in the NBA or coached at a high level. He does not know what it takes to go from a good pro to great. Phil and Horny the advice they are givig him, the coaching, it may not be what KP wants to hear but it is what will get him to the next level. The fancy dribbling, cross overs, hanging way back and pulling up for 3 pointers it's nice to have all that. It'll make a you a good exciting role player to watch. At 7'3 he needs to also have a mid-range game and a few go to moves. He does not have this and needs to focus on it.
These are all great observations but the section I bolded is precisely how I feel as well.
The Latvian bullshit will make him a local god but it also adds incredible risk of injury and it also prepares him for something other than the NBA. I am not in the least bit a fan of this game he's playing with the organization and its fans - so much so that I think trading him makes a lot of sense. This is the start of a long journey that's going to result in lost seasons, fired coaches, and ever more narcissistic behavior.
He has value today that he won't have tomorrow - dump him.
I just want what's best for the Knicks I like kp I wanted to draft him still like him-- but I want the Knicks to win first. I think if we can get josh jackson and extras that's better for the Knicks and their fans
nixluva wrote:The sooner we get past this draft the better. KP was wrong to do what he did but it's also not a felony either. Phil and KP will eventually talk and it will all be over. The only way KP gets traded is in a MONSTER deal that benefits the Knicks. Until that happens KP is a Knick and that's it.
The deal the Suns turned down was far from a monster deal. If Phil has decided he is done with KP like he has with other players the franchise is in big trouble. His track record for those deals has been very bad.
CrushAlot wrote:nixluva wrote:The sooner we get past this draft the better. KP was wrong to do what he did but it's also not a felony either. Phil and KP will eventually talk and it will all be over. The only way KP gets traded is in a MONSTER deal that benefits the Knicks. Until that happens KP is a Knick and that's it.
The deal the Suns turned down was far from a monster deal. If Phil has decided he is done with KP like he has with other players the franchise is in big trouble. His track record for those deals has been very bad.
First off we don't know if that rumor was the entire deal. Most likely they only mentioned the headliners in a possible trade! 2nd PHX sure thought Phil asked for a LOT! PHX called Phil so let's keep that in mind.
Phil didn't just give Melo away and I doubt he gives KP away for a low return.