1. I dont want to get all into evaluating Zion but i do not see him as a generational talent, he is a generational athelete, but he is no Lebron James.
Zion means more to a small market team than he does to us, because of the money he will bring to a team and I think those teams would be interested in offering assets for that pick. We should AT A MINIMUM look at what those assets are. For us, you have to ask is Zion better than our swapped pick plus whatever asset a team is willing to part with? That could mean swapped pick and a trade or it could mean an additional unprotected pick. Is Zion better then the 2nd -5th pick this year AND and unprotected lotto pick next year (especially if we're trading picks with a west coast team like Phoenix or Memphis? I dont think so. Even for the East coast teams i dont see any team thats going to become a playoff team because they drafted Zion.
I'm just saying we should do our due diligence.
Killa4luv wrote:1. I dont want to get all into evaluating Zion but i do not see him as a generational talent, he is a generational athelete, but he is no Lebron James.Zion means more to a small market team than he does to us, because of the money he will bring to a team and I think those teams would be interested in offering assets for that pick. We should AT A MINIMUM look at what those assets are. For us, you have to ask is Zion better than our swapped pick plus whatever asset a team is willing to part with? That could mean swapped pick and a trade or it could mean an additional unprotected pick. Is Zion better then the 2nd -5th pick this year AND and unprotected lotto pick next year (especially if we're trading picks with a west coast team like Phoenix or Memphis? I dont think so. Even for the East coast teams i dont see any team thats going to become a playoff team because they drafted Zion.
I'm just saying we should do our due diligence.
I'm fine shopping it if it's 2 or below, but if it's number 1, keep it! Drafting zion would hopefully make it easier to recruit the top FA's this summer, plus he fits a need for us (PF), plus he's nice insurance in case we luck out in free agency. The new draft odds are so messed up, it's too much of a gamble to trade Zion for an unprotected pick next year (because it could land anywhere). Could you imagine the backlash if we got the number 1 this year then traded away Zion, drafted a role player this year, and got the number 8 pick next year?
I agree though, about doing our homework and not getting caught up in the hype- I have no scouting skills, but I trust our scouts to make sure Zion is more than hype, and there aren't any better alternatives 2-5.
I actually agree but I would only accept a major package in return. Zion may not be LeBron but he could be LJ and that is still excellent. We can build around that.
could build “With” Zion, don’t have to be “around” him.
Lebron was not Lebron in his rookie year. KObe needed two Years. JOrdan was a high flying volume scorer.
He won’t be a finished product when he steps on the floor.
Free agents wont’ come to play around him, but they have to see they will make a difference and build a new culture here. It might be with chips or not but they have to envision being competitive and the city to round out their lives. Durant has outside interests that NY can compliment. The Heatles were about a juvenile display of physical dominance. I do’t know what makes each potential free agent tick. MOney and winning is important but above all is the relevance that comes with it.
If Zion wasnt a two way player, I would agree about the "small market" comment. Doesnt need to be LeBron James to be an impact player. What I like about Zion, is that he isnt a one trick pony. Like that Williamson is going to Duke to learn how to be a part of an offense without dominating tbe ball.
Believe it would be a mistake to pass on using the number one pick, if its ours. We have plenty of first round picks in tbe coming years, plenty of cap space. Dont want mgmt to get too cute. If Zion is there, make the piick.
GustavBahler wrote:If Zion wasnt a two way player, I would agree about the "small market" comment. Doesnt need to be LeBron James to be an impact player. What I like about Zion, is that he isnt a one trick pony. Like that Williamson is going to Duke to learn how to be a part of an offense without dominating tbe ball. Believe it would be a mistake to pass on using the number one pick, if its ours. We have plenty of first round picks in tbe coming years, plenty of cap space. Dont want mgmt to get too cute. If Zion is there, make the piick.
Agreed. No need to shop it around.
I wouldn’t shop the number one pick. First and foremost the Knicks are going to be investing in players that are in their thirties. Kyrie and Durant and there is no guarantee they are coming aboard. Kyrie has been injured so often your basically ready to give the keys to a broken down player. Durant is a stud but will be 32 come next year. After Durant to me it’s all second tier free agents. Which will basically be going no where if Durant isn’t a Knick. You have a better chance with The number one pick become a superstar then taking on second tier FAs who basically lead the Knicks to mediocrity.
Durant is a nice thought but I know he isn’t going to be a Knicks he has way to much of a soft skin to deal with the NY media the first chance the NY media chimps get they will eat him up and leave the Knicks with a shell of a player. I’m a Knicks fan and if I could and I would tell Durant don’t go to the Knicks. I can see Durant making his home in a laid back setting like LA, Dallas, Houston or even San Antonio. I just don’t see him in NY.
Besides Zion is going to be a cash cow for the Knicks he would bring back the buzz that has been missing in NY since the 90’s.
If we get the #1 pick then you pick Zion and roll with it. Dude is Charles Barkley 2.0. As boehiem said he is just like barkley except he is not fat
Allanfan20 wrote:I actually agree but I would only accept a major package in return. Zion may not be LeBron but he could be LJ and that is still excellent. We can build around that.
That actually is a great comparison.
Thinking back to LJ's game back at UNLV is a lot similar to Zion.
StarksEwing1 wrote:GustavBahler wrote:If Zion wasnt a two way player, I would agree about the "small market" comment. Doesnt need to be LeBron James to be an impact player. What I like about Zion, is that he isnt a one trick pony. Like that Williamson is going to Duke to learn how to be a part of an offense without dominating tbe ball. Believe it would be a mistake to pass on using the number one pick, if its ours. We have plenty of first round picks in tbe coming years, plenty of cap space. Dont want mgmt to get too cute. If Zion is there, make the piick.
Agreed. No need to shop it around.
We should always try to gauge the pickd value. But, realistically, what could we get that's of equal value? AD kinda makes sense, because he's arguably the best player in the league. But I agree with most of the forum. Zion is the real deal. I'd easily choose him over any package of nice players and lower value picks.
BigDaddyG wrote:StarksEwing1 wrote:GustavBahler wrote:If Zion wasnt a two way player, I would agree about the "small market" comment. Doesnt need to be LeBron James to be an impact player. What I like about Zion, is that he isnt a one trick pony. Like that Williamson is going to Duke to learn how to be a part of an offense without dominating tbe ball. Believe it would be a mistake to pass on using the number one pick, if its ours. We have plenty of first round picks in tbe coming years, plenty of cap space. Dont want mgmt to get too cute. If Zion is there, make the piick.
Agreed. No need to shop it around.
We should always try to gauge the pickd value. But, realistically, what could we get that's of equal value? AD kinda makes sense, because he's arguably the best player in the league. But I agree with most of the forum. Zion is the real deal. I'd easily choose him over any package of nice players and lower value picks.
Zion would be on a cost control contract and if he doesn’t get injured should have a 12-15 year career where he is a top 15 player for 8-10 of those years.
BigDaddyG wrote:StarksEwing1 wrote:GustavBahler wrote:If Zion wasnt a two way player, I would agree about the "small market" comment. Doesnt need to be LeBron James to be an impact player. What I like about Zion, is that he isnt a one trick pony. Like that Williamson is going to Duke to learn how to be a part of an offense without dominating tbe ball. Believe it would be a mistake to pass on using the number one pick, if its ours. We have plenty of first round picks in tbe coming years, plenty of cap space. Dont want mgmt to get too cute. If Zion is there, make the piick.
Agreed. No need to shop it around.
We should always try to gauge the pickd value. But, realistically, what could we get that's of equal value? AD kinda makes sense, because he's arguably the best player in the league. But I agree with most of the forum. Zion is the real deal. I'd easily choose him over any package of nice players and lower value picks.
Yeah, essentially, AD is all I would take for Zion. If we were to land Kawhi and AD this summer, I would be a very happy Knicks fan. Otherwise, I am happy for the pick.
Allanfan20 wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:StarksEwing1 wrote:GustavBahler wrote:If Zion wasnt a two way player, I would agree about the "small market" comment. Doesnt need to be LeBron James to be an impact player. What I like about Zion, is that he isnt a one trick pony. Like that Williamson is going to Duke to learn how to be a part of an offense without dominating tbe ball. Believe it would be a mistake to pass on using the number one pick, if its ours. We have plenty of first round picks in tbe coming years, plenty of cap space. Dont want mgmt to get too cute. If Zion is there, make the piick.
Agreed. No need to shop it around.
We should always try to gauge the pickd value. But, realistically, what could we get that's of equal value? AD kinda makes sense, because he's arguably the best player in the league. But I agree with most of the forum. Zion is the real deal. I'd easily choose him over any package of nice players and lower value picks.
Yeah, essentially, AD is all I would take for Zion. If we were to land Kawhi and AD this summer, I would be a very happy Knicks fan. Otherwise, I am happy for the pick.
I wouldn't take AD for the #1 pick because of the cost control nature of a rookie contract, and AD's age vs. a 19 year old who could well be a generational, franchise talent for 10-15 years.
It's fine to shop the pick around but unless someone's blowing us away with an offer don't trade it. Zion is absolutely a generational talent, don't know why you think otherwise. And I'm not trading Zion for AD unless we've already signed other max FA and he's agreeing to an extension as part of the trade.
Killa4luv wrote:1. I dont want to get all into evaluating Zion but i do not see him as a generational talent, he is a generational athlete....
This is an excellent distinction.
Maybe the best I've seen anywhere regarding Zion Williamson. Anywhere.
You may not realize it, but you said maybe the one thing that would get an NBA owner to actually green light a trade from the top overall pick in the draft. It's simple but irrefutable.
Good job. You need to be posting more often on this site.
Jordan, Kobe and Lebron were all generational athletes before the rounded out the talent to be GOATS in their respective eras. Lebron still needed to up his shooting, Kobe was not strong enough and Jordan also needed maturity physically and learn to pace is game. I find it facinationg that Zion is being judged as a finished product. This physicality could still imporove, he could get stronger and faster! At 19 he is not finished.
The is a different type of athlete for sure! I can’t peg him either!
TripleThreat wrote:Killa4luv wrote:1. I dont want to get all into evaluating Zion but i do not see him as a generational talent, he is a generational athlete....
This is an excellent distinction.
Maybe the best I've seen anywhere regarding Zion Williamson. Anywhere.
You may not realize it, but you said maybe the one thing that would get an NBA owner to actually green light a trade from the top overall pick in the draft. It's simple but irrefutable.
Good job. You need to be posting more often on this site.
lol, that statement is the exact opposite of "irrefutable". If you think Zion is just a dunker, which is what I have to assume based on your comment, than you either haven't watched him play or you don't understand basketball.
I’m not trading the first overall pick, which is high quality, for more lower picks, which is quantity. Knicks don’t need quantity. They’ve accomplished that part by not only keeping their picks gathering up 2 more and they have gathered up cost controlled young talented players. Now the Knicks need quality.
If I’m trading the Knicks first this year (in a package) I want back franchise player type shit in return.
Or, just keep it and draft someone you have a conviction on. If you’re picking top 5 that shouldn’t be a difficult thing to come by.
If by some miracle the Knicks land a Durant and Kyrie type haul, they would then likely be faced with the “dilemma” of either using the pick for themselves or packaging said pick along with a boatload of young talent for that 3rd piece. Dare to dream that this is the toughest decision the Knicks have to make this summer....
Killa4luv wrote:1. I dont want to get all into evaluating Zion but i do not see him as a generational talent, he is a generational athelete, but he is no Lebron James.Zion means more to a small market team than he does to us, because of the money he will bring to a team and I think those teams would be interested in offering assets for that pick. We should AT A MINIMUM look at what those assets are. For us, you have to ask is Zion better than our swapped pick plus whatever asset a team is willing to part with? That could mean swapped pick and a trade or it could mean an additional unprotected pick. Is Zion better then the 2nd -5th pick this year AND and unprotected lotto pick next year (especially if we're trading picks with a west coast team like Phoenix or Memphis? I dont think so. Even for the East coast teams i dont see any team thats going to become a playoff team because they drafted Zion.
I'm just saying we should do our due diligence.
My fear is we pass and LOLKnicks stretches on for the next 20 years. If we get the Number 1 pick and trade him we better get Davis and Durant. I can live with that.
Killa4luv wrote:1. I dont want to get all into evaluating Zion but i do not see him as a generational talent, he is a generational athelete, but he is no Lebron James.Zion means more to a small market team than he does to us, because of the money he will bring to a team and I think those teams would be interested in offering assets for that pick. We should AT A MINIMUM look at what those assets are. For us, you have to ask is Zion better than our swapped pick plus whatever asset a team is willing to part with? That could mean swapped pick and a trade or it could mean an additional unprotected pick. Is Zion better then the 2nd -5th pick this year AND and unprotected lotto pick next year (especially if we're trading picks with a west coast team like Phoenix or Memphis? I dont think so. Even for the East coast teams i dont see any team thats going to become a playoff team because they drafted Zion.
I'm just saying we should do our due diligence.
if Zion isn’t a generational pick he minimally makes 5-7 all star games. His presence probably insures an 8 seed in the playoffs. He would have a cost controlled contract. That is a lot to give up for a Trae young type deal.
