Nalod wrote:We don’t trust the knicks so we don’t Ofer the benefit of the doubt. We have never had this inventory of Picks. We are fundamentally doing things differently than before and things other teams did to build a core. MOrris is a a good player having a career year on a bad team. WE got free assets in those picks.
Because we don’t trust given our past we assume it extrapolates into the future. This is human nature. Since we know picks are not a high % want to talent then the more you have the better. 1248 actually wants we have done in the pas which is go for proven commodities. This means you limit your upside by paying a premium for it. There is a time for that but not at this stage. WE don’t have a core yet. KP was regrettable because he was a core talent. Sorry, this is the “express frustration” thread. OK, “I’m frustrated with the level of small thinking by fans at times.” Now I’m compliment.
I'm not quite sure what 1248 wants.
But I appreciate the abundance of draft picks. That is a change. But mostly, I appreciate us keeping our own, so that when we're bad, we're not having another team pick a franchise talent like a LaMarcus Aldridge or Joakim Noah.
When we traded KP, they absolutely had to get draft picks, and those will probably turn out to be pretty poor.
But I don't think it's small thinking to want to keep Morris for his role helping us win games and provide a positive model for players like Knox, who honestly they way he has played this year, might be out of the league soon.
CrushAlot wrote:Sambakick wrote:$15 mil for a pick?No we got a lot of production from Morris. (This isn't the Memphis/Igoudala situation) He was a good player. Players don't play for free. He won us some games. He earned that money.
We got a late 1st and an early 2nd for renting Morris out for a team to use him in the post-season. I am going to root for the Clips because of him at least in the Western Conference playoffs. He wasn't going to the playoffs here. He earned his $15 mil these first 50 games.
This. Breen was raving about Morris’s impact on the young players. Miller raved about his practice habits and how the young players copy his practice habits. Also, the guy they got from the Wiz sounds like a decent prospect.
That's exactly my point, they talk about development and continue to take steps back in that dept. Yeah it's cool to gain additional assets for future moves, but at the same time you stunt the growth of your young players by taking away that leadership, stability, winning culture, chemistry.
I look at like this, if your building a team and you have a star center and pg, but the rest of the roster sucks, trading away your star center to upgrade your SG is not the answer, you can't unplug one leak to fix another..and that's what we have been doing for the longest and that's why we are stuck in position and constantly changing everything..
You lose you change, i keep saying this and you keep seeing it.
knicks1248 wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Sambakick wrote:$15 mil for a pick?No we got a lot of production from Morris. (This isn't the Memphis/Igoudala situation) He was a good player. Players don't play for free. He won us some games. He earned that money.
We got a late 1st and an early 2nd for renting Morris out for a team to use him in the post-season. I am going to root for the Clips because of him at least in the Western Conference playoffs. He wasn't going to the playoffs here. He earned his $15 mil these first 50 games.
This. Breen was raving about Morris’s impact on the young players. Miller raved about his practice habits and how the young players copy his practice habits. Also, the guy they got from the Wiz sounds like a decent prospect.
That's exactly my point, they talk about development and continue to take steps back in that dept. Yeah it's cool to gain additional assets for future moves, but at the same time you stunt the growth of your young players by taking away that leadership, stability, winning culture, chemistry.
I look at like this, if your building a team and you have a star center and pg, but the rest of the roster sucks, trading away your star center to upgrade your SG is not the answer, you can't unplug one leak to fix another..and that's what we have been doing for the longest and that's why we are stuck in position and constantly changing everything..
You lose you change, i keep saying this and you keep seeing it.
no. What you dont understand, what you cant grasp is we dont have assets to plug those holes. That comes from drafting well. But... we are ALL used to you making stuff up and changing your narrative every 20 minutes.
Perhaps I’m guilty to have faith in the open concept that some picks can be Giannis or Donovan mitch but that it takes time.
we got Mitchell Robinson who is a work in progress by one of those “Knicks pick bad” assets. Perry even if average at picking is better than the infrequent picks of the past. Isaiah drafted well because we had picks. Not the Blackman or Frye picks in the dreaded 8th or 9th spot. Because of that we should stop? 10 years later we instead draft really young guys here and they not lighting the world on fire we should stop? While I dont trust the Knicks, I’m not selling Nalod as a better picker. At the same time 1248 does not exactly install confidence half baked thoughts on incomplete facts. So what’s a girl to do? Sit back and relax!
We can’t draft and develop all these picks so in part 1248 will get his wish. Also we can combine picks to move up. Its not just one thing it will lots of small ones. They add up. Its not very sexy or starphuckish like. When the time is right a free agent will come and complete the team. Like LA did with its young assets they can be combined for a trade. Let’s be real, Ingram and Ball did not exactly light it up in LA. They are doing much better now. So either by trade or patience things develop. Its why I’m patient with Frank, KNox and Dennis. I doubt all three return next year but they will matter.
fishmike wrote:knicks1248 wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Sambakick wrote:$15 mil for a pick?No we got a lot of production from Morris. (This isn't the Memphis/Igoudala situation) He was a good player. Players don't play for free. He won us some games. He earned that money.
We got a late 1st and an early 2nd for renting Morris out for a team to use him in the post-season. I am going to root for the Clips because of him at least in the Western Conference playoffs. He wasn't going to the playoffs here. He earned his $15 mil these first 50 games.
This. Breen was raving about Morris’s impact on the young players. Miller raved about his practice habits and how the young players copy his practice habits. Also, the guy they got from the Wiz sounds like a decent prospect.
That's exactly my point, they talk about development and continue to take steps back in that dept. Yeah it's cool to gain additional assets for future moves, but at the same time you stunt the growth of your young players by taking away that leadership, stability, winning culture, chemistry.
I look at like this, if your building a team and you have a star center and pg, but the rest of the roster sucks, trading away your star center to upgrade your SG is not the answer, you can't unplug one leak to fix another..and that's what we have been doing for the longest and that's why we are stuck in position and constantly changing everything..
You lose you change, i keep saying this and you keep seeing it.
no. What you dont understand, what you cant grasp is we dont have assets to plug those holes. That comes from drafting well. But... we are ALL used to you making stuff up and changing your narrative every 20 minutes.
what hole are we filling with the 27th pick in the draft? Will we find someone as good as Morris?
My main frustration with the Knicks over recent years have been the hiring of people who don't have actual expierience for the job that they've been hired for. Jackson, Fizdale, Fisher, and now Rose.
knicks1248 wrote:franco12 wrote:fishmike wrote:knicks1248 wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Sambakick wrote:$15 mil for a pick?No we got a lot of production from Morris. (This isn't the Memphis/Igoudala situation) He was a good player. Players don't play for free. He won us some games. He earned that money.
We got a late 1st and an early 2nd for renting Morris out for a team to use him in the post-season. I am going to root for the Clips because of him at least in the Western Conference playoffs. He wasn't going to the playoffs here. He earned his $15 mil these first 50 games.
This. Breen was raving about Morris’s impact on the young players. Miller raved about his practice habits and how the young players copy his practice habits. Also, the guy they got from the Wiz sounds like a decent prospect.
That's exactly my point, they talk about development and continue to take steps back in that dept. Yeah it's cool to gain additional assets for future moves, but at the same time you stunt the growth of your young players by taking away that leadership, stability, winning culture, chemistry.
I look at like this, if your building a team and you have a star center and pg, but the rest of the roster sucks, trading away your star center to upgrade your SG is not the answer, you can't unplug one leak to fix another..and that's what we have been doing for the longest and that's why we are stuck in position and constantly changing everything..
You lose you change, i keep saying this and you keep seeing it.
no. What you dont understand, what you cant grasp is we dont have assets to plug those holes. That comes from drafting well. But... we are ALL used to you making stuff up and changing your narrative every 20 minutes.
what hole are we filling with the 27th pick in the draft? Will we find someone as good as Morris?
I'll wait for his answer
You do realize that Morris could have walked for nothing right? Look we understand that you don’t believe in draft picks/youth UNLESS we trade all them for veterans. The problem is we did that for over a decade with awful results. Accumulating as many assets as we can will help down the road when we do want to acquire certain players without giving up everything we have like we did so many times before. By the way we can easily resign Morris this summer in fact it wouldn’t surprise me
franco12 wrote:fishmike wrote:knicks1248 wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Sambakick wrote:$15 mil for a pick?No we got a lot of production from Morris. (This isn't the Memphis/Igoudala situation) He was a good player. Players don't play for free. He won us some games. He earned that money.
We got a late 1st and an early 2nd for renting Morris out for a team to use him in the post-season. I am going to root for the Clips because of him at least in the Western Conference playoffs. He wasn't going to the playoffs here. He earned his $15 mil these first 50 games.
This. Breen was raving about Morris’s impact on the young players. Miller raved about his practice habits and how the young players copy his practice habits. Also, the guy they got from the Wiz sounds like a decent prospect.
That's exactly my point, they talk about development and continue to take steps back in that dept. Yeah it's cool to gain additional assets for future moves, but at the same time you stunt the growth of your young players by taking away that leadership, stability, winning culture, chemistry.
I look at like this, if your building a team and you have a star center and pg, but the rest of the roster sucks, trading away your star center to upgrade your SG is not the answer, you can't unplug one leak to fix another..and that's what we have been doing for the longest and that's why we are stuck in position and constantly changing everything..
You lose you change, i keep saying this and you keep seeing it.
no. What you dont understand, what you cant grasp is we dont have assets to plug those holes. That comes from drafting well. But... we are ALL used to you making stuff up and changing your narrative every 20 minutes.
what hole are we filling with the 27th pick in the draft? Will we find someone as good as Morris?
This is not a zero sum game though where you need to equate the 27th pick with Morris's production. Unfortunately it just doesn't work that way.
You want his production back? We just have to offer him a contract, and then you get the addition of having a cost controlled contract.
Lots of fans were hot and heavy over Shamet.... who was drafted 26th.
martin wrote:franco12 wrote:fishmike wrote:knicks1248 wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Sambakick wrote:$15 mil for a pick?No we got a lot of production from Morris. (This isn't the Memphis/Igoudala situation) He was a good player. Players don't play for free. He won us some games. He earned that money.
We got a late 1st and an early 2nd for renting Morris out for a team to use him in the post-season. I am going to root for the Clips because of him at least in the Western Conference playoffs. He wasn't going to the playoffs here. He earned his $15 mil these first 50 games.
This. Breen was raving about Morris’s impact on the young players. Miller raved about his practice habits and how the young players copy his practice habits. Also, the guy they got from the Wiz sounds like a decent prospect.
That's exactly my point, they talk about development and continue to take steps back in that dept. Yeah it's cool to gain additional assets for future moves, but at the same time you stunt the growth of your young players by taking away that leadership, stability, winning culture, chemistry.
I look at like this, if your building a team and you have a star center and pg, but the rest of the roster sucks, trading away your star center to upgrade your SG is not the answer, you can't unplug one leak to fix another..and that's what we have been doing for the longest and that's why we are stuck in position and constantly changing everything..
You lose you change, i keep saying this and you keep seeing it.
no. What you dont understand, what you cant grasp is we dont have assets to plug those holes. That comes from drafting well. But... we are ALL used to you making stuff up and changing your narrative every 20 minutes.
what hole are we filling with the 27th pick in the draft? Will we find someone as good as Morris?
This is not a zero sum game though where you need to equate the 27th pick with Morris's production. Unfortunately it just doesn't work that way.
You want his production back? We just have to offer him a contract, and then you get the addition of having a cost controlled contract.
Lots of fans were hot and heavy over Shamet.... who was drafted 26th.
Beer listed recent players taken at 27. Siakham, Gobert, Kuzma, Nance and Bogdanovich.
knicks1248 wrote:franco12 wrote:fishmike wrote:knicks1248 wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Sambakick wrote:$15 mil for a pick?No we got a lot of production from Morris. (This isn't the Memphis/Igoudala situation) He was a good player. Players don't play for free. He won us some games. He earned that money.
We got a late 1st and an early 2nd for renting Morris out for a team to use him in the post-season. I am going to root for the Clips because of him at least in the Western Conference playoffs. He wasn't going to the playoffs here. He earned his $15 mil these first 50 games.
This. Breen was raving about Morris’s impact on the young players. Miller raved about his practice habits and how the young players copy his practice habits. Also, the guy they got from the Wiz sounds like a decent prospect.
That's exactly my point, they talk about development and continue to take steps back in that dept. Yeah it's cool to gain additional assets for future moves, but at the same time you stunt the growth of your young players by taking away that leadership, stability, winning culture, chemistry.
I look at like this, if your building a team and you have a star center and pg, but the rest of the roster sucks, trading away your star center to upgrade your SG is not the answer, you can't unplug one leak to fix another..and that's what we have been doing for the longest and that's why we are stuck in position and constantly changing everything..
You lose you change, i keep saying this and you keep seeing it.
no. What you dont understand, what you cant grasp is we dont have assets to plug those holes. That comes from drafting well. But... we are ALL used to you making stuff up and changing your narrative every 20 minutes.
what hole are we filling with the 27th pick in the draft? Will we find someone as good as Morris?
I'll wait for his answer
my answer is a 100%. Also I feel strongly that Trey Burke starting will get us closer to a 50 win team. Oh wait... no, you said that.
knicks1248 wrote:franco12 wrote:fishmike wrote:knicks1248 wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Sambakick wrote:$15 mil for a pick?No we got a lot of production from Morris. (This isn't the Memphis/Igoudala situation) He was a good player. Players don't play for free. He won us some games. He earned that money.
We got a late 1st and an early 2nd for renting Morris out for a team to use him in the post-season. I am going to root for the Clips because of him at least in the Western Conference playoffs. He wasn't going to the playoffs here. He earned his $15 mil these first 50 games.
This. Breen was raving about Morris’s impact on the young players. Miller raved about his practice habits and how the young players copy his practice habits. Also, the guy they got from the Wiz sounds like a decent prospect.
That's exactly my point, they talk about development and continue to take steps back in that dept. Yeah it's cool to gain additional assets for future moves, but at the same time you stunt the growth of your young players by taking away that leadership, stability, winning culture, chemistry.
I look at like this, if your building a team and you have a star center and pg, but the rest of the roster sucks, trading away your star center to upgrade your SG is not the answer, you can't unplug one leak to fix another..and that's what we have been doing for the longest and that's why we are stuck in position and constantly changing everything..
You lose you change, i keep saying this and you keep seeing it.
no. What you dont understand, what you cant grasp is we dont have assets to plug those holes. That comes from drafting well. But... we are ALL used to you making stuff up and changing your narrative every 20 minutes.
what hole are we filling with the 27th pick in the draft? Will we find someone as good as Morris?
I'll wait for his answer
The answer is simple: "Do not show half baked job to the idiot".
Morris trade is maximizing the asset we temporary had.
He was mercenary we get by chance at last moment with clear goal to trade him at deadline.
Morris will sign with 3-state area team this summer (most likely his native Philly).
If he really want to be in NY we can negotiate mutually agreeable contract (if we not did already).
Having him back with playoff experience with great team and already using him to get picks is much better that just get him and gain nothing.
Building a team in pro sports is not gambling in Vegas. Even Dolan unlimited bankroll will lead you nowhere.
Building complicated multiyear process using all available avenues - draft, trades, FA, scouting, development, etc. in the framework of consistent vision.
It is extremely boring and frustrating process fans should know nothing about.
Fans need to enjoy product not get frustrated while is is getting build.
So if some fans have no patience it is time to tone it down and find some other source of instant pleasure.
I personally enjoy the process of building with all ups and downs, drama, and excitement.
The rewards can by huge.
I am in 2nd cycle of this with Rangers and this being great all the way.
CrushAlot wrote:martin wrote:franco12 wrote:fishmike wrote:knicks1248 wrote:CrushAlot wrote:Sambakick wrote:$15 mil for a pick?No we got a lot of production from Morris. (This isn't the Memphis/Igoudala situation) He was a good player. Players don't play for free. He won us some games. He earned that money.
We got a late 1st and an early 2nd for renting Morris out for a team to use him in the post-season. I am going to root for the Clips because of him at least in the Western Conference playoffs. He wasn't going to the playoffs here. He earned his $15 mil these first 50 games.
This. Breen was raving about Morris’s impact on the young players. Miller raved about his practice habits and how the young players copy his practice habits. Also, the guy they got from the Wiz sounds like a decent prospect.
That's exactly my point, they talk about development and continue to take steps back in that dept. Yeah it's cool to gain additional assets for future moves, but at the same time you stunt the growth of your young players by taking away that leadership, stability, winning culture, chemistry.
I look at like this, if your building a team and you have a star center and pg, but the rest of the roster sucks, trading away your star center to upgrade your SG is not the answer, you can't unplug one leak to fix another..and that's what we have been doing for the longest and that's why we are stuck in position and constantly changing everything..
You lose you change, i keep saying this and you keep seeing it.
no. What you dont understand, what you cant grasp is we dont have assets to plug those holes. That comes from drafting well. But... we are ALL used to you making stuff up and changing your narrative every 20 minutes.
what hole are we filling with the 27th pick in the draft? Will we find someone as good as Morris?
This is not a zero sum game though where you need to equate the 27th pick with Morris's production. Unfortunately it just doesn't work that way.
You want his production back? We just have to offer him a contract, and then you get the addition of having a cost controlled contract.
Lots of fans were hot and heavy over Shamet.... who was drafted 26th.
Beer listed recent players taken at 27. Siakham, Gobert, Kuzma, Nance and Bogdanovich.
madness right? Imagine trying to maximize your ability to acquire high end talent through the draft? Its like they are trying shit that makes sense and the natives just cant phucking cope
there are no shortage of terrible moves to choose from.... trading Morris at the deadline was not one of them
fishmike wrote:there are no shortage of terrible moves to choose from.... trading Morris at the deadline was not one of them
Oh, don't worry. There will be more terrible moves to come as long as Dolan is our owner. We traded Morris only to reroute those assets to the next washed up superstar. This is the way!
BigDaddyG wrote:fishmike wrote:there are no shortage of terrible moves to choose from.... trading Morris at the deadline was not one of them
Oh, don't worry. There will be more terrible moves to come as long as Dolan is our owner. We traded Morris only to reroute those assets to the next washed up superstar. This is the way!
The more I read about Rose the more cautiously optimistic I have become. I do hope he gives Miller a chance.
CrushAlot wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:fishmike wrote:there are no shortage of terrible moves to choose from.... trading Morris at the deadline was not one of them
Oh, don't worry. There will be more terrible moves to come as long as Dolan is our owner. We traded Morris only to reroute those assets to the next washed up superstar. This is the way!
The more I read about Rose the more cautiously optimistic I have become. I do hope he gives Miller a chance.
It's like Berman's last article stated. We've been in bed with CAA for years...no one is surprised by this move. I hope I'm wrong, but I just see a continuation of the past decade. We can't have real change because our owner doesn't know much about basketball and the leeches have stuck on so long that they're grafted.
BigDaddyG wrote:CrushAlot wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:fishmike wrote:there are no shortage of terrible moves to choose from.... trading Morris at the deadline was not one of them
Oh, don't worry. There will be more terrible moves to come as long as Dolan is our owner. We traded Morris only to reroute those assets to the next washed up superstar. This is the way!
The more I read about Rose the more cautiously optimistic I have become. I do hope he gives Miller a chance.
It's like Berman's last article stated. We've been in bed with CAA for years...no one is surprised by this move. I hope I'm wrong, but I just see a continuation of the past decade. We can't have real change because our owner doesn't know much about basketball and the leeches have stuck on so long that they're grafted.
For me this is a no-win situation if you are of the stance that it all starts and ends with the owner. Unfortunately the reality is Dolan is here.
Gotta shrug the shoulders and start one rung down
CrushAlot wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:fishmike wrote:there are no shortage of terrible moves to choose from.... trading Morris at the deadline was not one of them
Oh, don't worry. There will be more terrible moves to come as long as Dolan is our owner. We traded Morris only to reroute those assets to the next washed up superstar. This is the way!
The more I read about Rose the more cautiously optimistic I have become. I do hope he gives Miller a chance.
i am optimistic -- not cautious about it
he won't shyt where he sleeps and hopefully knows the winners versus the lemons
martin wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:CrushAlot wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:fishmike wrote:there are no shortage of terrible moves to choose from.... trading Morris at the deadline was not one of them
Oh, don't worry. There will be more terrible moves to come as long as Dolan is our owner. We traded Morris only to reroute those assets to the next washed up superstar. This is the way!
The more I read about Rose the more cautiously optimistic I have become. I do hope he gives Miller a chance.
It's like Berman's last article stated. We've been in bed with CAA for years...no one is surprised by this move. I hope I'm wrong, but I just see a continuation of the past decade. We can't have real change because our owner doesn't know much about basketball and the leeches have stuck on so long that they're grafted.
For me this is a no-win situation if you are of the stance that it all starts and ends with the owner. Unfortunately the reality is Dolan is here.
Gotta shrug the shoulders and start one rung down
Exactly. Dolan is gonna be here whether we like it or not. The good news is that Perry has done a pretty good job with moves despite all the noise around him. Rose seems to have a better feel with players than Mills ever could. So yeah we wish we could have another owner obviously but that’s not gonna happen. But I do think there is more optimism
There is an old saying that a broken clock is right twice a day. Lets hope Dolan picking Rose is one of those moments. Discouraging that it apoears there was no real search process. Perry wasnt given the season to make a case to be team president. This looks like it was done on an impulse. Maybe as some posters suggested, because of the "sell the team" chants.
The biggest drawback to Dolan owning the team is that he treats the Knicks, and MSG like his toy, where other owners treat their team like its their baby.
