Knicks · I'm not a long term buyer of RJ's high level potential/talent (page 22)

Alpha1971 @ 1/2/2023 8:21 PM
If RJ becomes a dependable, high volumn 3 pt shooter, he becomes unstoppable when he drives and plays mid range as long as he remains a willing passer and plays D. His D hasn't been great but he has been better recently.
martin @ 1/2/2023 9:13 PM
Alpha1971 wrote:If RJ becomes a dependable, high volumn 3 pt shooter, he becomes unstoppable when he drives and plays mid range as long as he remains a willing passer and plays D. His D hasn't been great but he has been better recently.

To be fair, RJ also needs to improve his mid range shooting, finishing 10 feet and in, and also cut down on the TOs, but if he improves on those things plus the ones you mentioned, he’d be unstoppable.

Alpha1971 @ 1/2/2023 10:20 PM
martin wrote:
Alpha1971 wrote:If RJ becomes a dependable, high volumn 3 pt shooter, he becomes unstoppable when he drives and plays mid range as long as he remains a willing passer and plays D. His D hasn't been great but he has been better recently.

To be fair, RJ also needs to improve his mid range shooting, finishing 10 feet and in, and also cut down on the TOs, but if he improves on those things plus the ones you mentioned, he’d be unstoppable.

If he was a automatic outside shooter,his mid range would be easier for him. But let's hope he keeps improving. RJ is the key for the team. Not saying he will ever be Giannis but if he is a Middleton then team can be serious

martin @ 1/2/2023 10:29 PM
Alpha1971 wrote:
martin wrote:
Alpha1971 wrote:If RJ becomes a dependable, high volumn 3 pt shooter, he becomes unstoppable when he drives and plays mid range as long as he remains a willing passer and plays D. His D hasn't been great but he has been better recently.

To be fair, RJ also needs to improve his mid range shooting, finishing 10 feet and in, and also cut down on the TOs, but if he improves on those things plus the ones you mentioned, he’d be unstoppable.

If he was a automatic outside shooter,his mid range would be easier for him. But let's hope he keeps improving. RJ is the key for the team. Not saying he will ever be Giannis but if he is a Middleton then team can be serious

Let’s just make it easier on ourselves and go with: if RJ was a really good shooter, which he is not, he would be a really good player.

technomaster @ 1/2/2023 10:40 PM
RJ has two sets of skills to work on for next season:
1) playing PG - RJ runs the plays, does routine passes. But most of the best players in the league can create a little bit. The top non-PG's in the league have good enough skills/BBall IQ to run the offense through them for stretches. I think it'd be a real baller move of him to ask to play PG in the summer league for a couple of games. (Richard Jefferson did this one year - and he was a dramatically better player after)

2) Post moves - RJ (and most of the rest of the Knicks beyond Brunson) could stand to learn a thing or two about backing their defenders in.

franco12 @ 1/2/2023 10:55 PM
technomaster wrote:RJ has two sets of skills to work on for next season:
1) playing PG - RJ runs the plays, does routine passes. But most of the best players in the league can create a little bit. The top non-PG's in the league have good enough skills/BBall IQ to run the offense through them for stretches. I think it'd be a real baller move of him to ask to play PG in the summer league for a couple of games. (Richard Jefferson did this one year - and he was a dramatically better player after)

2) Post moves - RJ (and most of the rest of the Knicks beyond Brunson) could stand to learn a thing or two about backing their defenders in.

Shouldn’t the skill be shooting proficiently or above from 3?

Like what is the one thing RJ can do to leap into All Star type play?

Damion Lee is shooting .493 from 3. Get to that kind of level and you become lethal.

I think RJ can aim at least to be slightly better than average.

technomaster @ 1/7/2023 9:04 PM
franco12 wrote:
technomaster wrote:RJ has two sets of skills to work on for next season:
1) playing PG - RJ runs the plays, does routine passes. But most of the best players in the league can create a little bit. The top non-PG's in the league have good enough skills/BBall IQ to run the offense through them for stretches. I think it'd be a real baller move of him to ask to play PG in the summer league for a couple of games. (Richard Jefferson did this one year - and he was a dramatically better player after)

2) Post moves - RJ (and most of the rest of the Knicks beyond Brunson) could stand to learn a thing or two about backing their defenders in.

Shouldn’t the skill be shooting proficiently or above from 3?

Like what is the one thing RJ can do to leap into All Star type play?

Damion Lee is shooting .493 from 3. Get to that kind of level and you become lethal.

I think RJ can aim at least to be slightly better than average.

RJ's in a pretty reasonable place for an NBA wing. On SG rankings, RJ is often overlooked - I'm not entirely sure why. There are a lot of really good young SGs with AS potential - not necessarily this season, but perhaps in the near future.

Here are a few (I'm arbitrarily using age 26 so I could include Booker, Brown, and Mitchell):

Legit All-star quality:
Tatum
Jaylen Brown (26)
Ingram
SGA
Booker (26)
Mitchell (26)

Borderline All-stars
RJ Barrett
Anthony Edwards
Tyler Herro
Desmond Bane
Jordan Poole
Jalen Green
Kevin Porter Jr
Anfernee Simons
Gary Trent Jr

I don't think anyone sees any of these guys as surefire superstars yet. The whole bunch is pretty inconsistent to be honest. I think most of these guys are just as likely to score 30 or be held in single digits on any given game. They're all averaging in the 18-22ppg range so they're kind of doing enough that they COULD be voted in or be selected by as subs or replacements and no one would complain too much.

Oddly, of all of these borderline guys, RJ is the biggest, most prototypically-sized player. The rest are kind of small. So no wonder why they seem quicker, shoot better, or have a better handle. Somehow the modern NBA favors these guys.

RJ would have a hard time achieving PG-like skills like these tweeners. I do see these skills improving over time - with Jaylen Brown as a good example of a guy who is still developing his playmaking skills.

RJ's best path to standing out is developing some big man/post up skills and nudge his eFG higher.


Regarding shooting, RJ is a career .353 3p% shooter. He just finished the month of December shooting a sizzling .424 3p%. I don't think he's really a pure shooter - and I expect his shooting to fluctuate... but I think somewhere between 35-40% on any given year is legit.

Let's put this into historical context. That's considerably better than some of the recent benchmarks for wing greatness: Kobe (.329 3p%), Wade (.293 3p%), and even Jordan (32.7 3p%) would be criticized harshly if they played today.

Midway through next season, RJ is on pace to have made more 3pts in his short career than Wade and MJ each made in their careers. Crazy.

Alpha1971 @ 1/8/2023 7:00 AM
RJ just needs to stop keeping the ball on a 3 on one fast break, RJ has to stop closing his eyes, and driving blindly to the basket without passing. If Raj does that and shoots .35 from 3 he will be an all star
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