WORST GAME EVER. I think I puked. Twice.
I knew it was game over when Obi missed the alley oop dunk in the third.
Rookie wrote:Atleast we’re not getting beat by random scrubs anymore. That’s progress right?!?
Yeah, it's just the good players who play career best games against us now.
Uptown wrote:The fact that they had 2 days to practice, rectify or address issues from the last two games, and then they play like this?!?! Thibs has to take a lot of the blame...
they held trey in the first half. So what does thibs do after the half,gets away from guarding trey with a larger stronger man ex rj,cam or obi. Thats bad coachimg.
Fire Thibs and trade Fournier.
Lets not forget that wasted pick in the Cam trade helped ATL get Murry.
Clean wrote:Lets not forget that wasted pick in the Cam trade helped ATL get Murry.
It's a trash first-rounder with protections that will make it a second-rounder eventually. The real issue is the Hawks got their assets together and made the best move for them. Many teams have better assets because they tanked correctly for a few years and hit on their picks. This whole team would be miles better if they had chosen, say, Mikal Bridges and Tyrese Haliburton if they had been the first or second pick in 2019.
The bottom line is the knicks aren't lucky, and they are in a holding pattern of half-measures to keep from being an outright lousy team. I mean, it was a solid 1-9 draft last year and they had draft pick #11.
Don't even get me started on the currents team's lack of offensive personality and the level of bad defensive when defense was suppose to be their strength.
wargames wrote:Clean wrote:Lets not forget that wasted pick in the Cam trade helped ATL get Murry.
It's a trash first-rounder with protections that will make it a second-rounder eventually. The real issue is the Hawks got their assets together and made the best move for them. Many teams have better assets because they tanked correctly for a few years and hit on their picks. This whole team would be miles better if they had chosen, say, Mikal Bridges and Tyrese Haliburton if they had been the first or second pick in 2019.
The bottom line is the knicks aren't lucky, and they are in a holding pattern of half-measures to keep from being an outright lousy team. I mean, it was a solid 1-9 draft last year and they had draft pick #11.
Don't even get me started on the currents team's lack of offensive personality and the level of bad defensive when defense was suppose to be their strength.
You say its a trash asset but that trash asset helped them get Murry for a lot less than the Jazz wanted from us to get DM. Funny how every other team can get stars without paying half of what we must to get one.
Clean wrote:wargames wrote:Clean wrote:Lets not forget that wasted pick in the Cam trade helped ATL get Murry.
It's a trash first-rounder with protections that will make it a second-rounder eventually. The real issue is the Hawks got their assets together and made the best move for them. Many teams have better assets because they tanked correctly for a few years and hit on their picks. This whole team would be miles better if they had chosen, say, Mikal Bridges and Tyrese Haliburton if they had been the first or second pick in 2019.
The bottom line is the knicks aren't lucky, and they are in a holding pattern of half-measures to keep from being an outright lousy team. I mean, it was a solid 1-9 draft last year and they had draft pick #11.
Don't even get me started on the currents team's lack of offensive personality and the level of bad defensive when defense was suppose to be their strength.
You say its a trash asset but that trash asset helped them get Murry for a lot less than the Jazz wanted from us to get DM. Funny how every other team can get stars without paying half of what we must to get one.
That’s not funny team's see the knicks as desperate and try to take advantage of it. On the low saying no to Murray might have the next team come with a realistic offer.
Also Murray isn't in the same tier as Mitchell. Atlanta paid a lot for a guy who was a one time all star.
Even with all that said, that asset was trash and the knicks have a whole bunch of equivalent trash picks now they have to move off of.
It's time to say goodbye to Tom Thibs .. Steve Nash was Fired this week in NY.
The 7 game test became an embarrassment in the 3rd game. The Knicks may go 0-7 if they keep this up.
Tomorow, sports announcers will be quick to say. "The Knicks had a 20 pt lead and loss the game. Their 3rd loss in a row.".
It's hard to believe Thibs never wrote a play to get Fournier a couple of open looks from both sides of the perimeter.
I think we ought to give the team 20/30 games before evaluating the season. Every one except Fournier and Toppin are shooting a career low from 3pts territory. That's a temporary situation.
RJ is clearly not an elite shooter but he's neither a 22% 3pts shooter. As for Randle, he has never been a good shooter except for his one good season, I don't understand why he shoots that many 3s.
The bucks are expected to beat us, the cavs are red hot from 3 now but it won't probably last and the hawks game was a horrible second half. It's not like it's a blowout from beginning to end.
We'll be better than we are playing now but there are a lot of teams that should be better than us. Most of the time, we will end up with a defeat in these games.
I only saw the first half so I was able to sleep good with more optimism than some. The box score I was watch was very frustrating to see so I could imagine watching the 2nd half. That first half shows our potential. But they also missed a lot of easy shots. Even if our defense sucked, our offense in the 2nd half, was non existent (Randle scored 2pts). We have a very consistent coach with inconsistent players. So what happens when a coach consistently plays the same inconsistent players? you will most likely be involved in blow outs, blowout the other team or like last night can’t hold onto a 20 pt lead.
I remember in the first half the hawks started to make a run and the lead was cut to 18. Thibs recognized it and immediately called timeout. I don’t know why he calls TO, just to put the same team back on the floor.
Also it’s crazy how Fournier couldn’t take advantage of tre young stature. If EF didn’t know how he could, at a minimum I would’ve told EF to set picks all day and let’s take advantage of his lack of defense.l when they switch. He made EF look very tall but EF is also very easy to guard by anybody. With grimes or even cam in the lineup, hawks would’ve been forced to keep tre on JB and Murray on cam or grimes. We probably win with those matchups.
Tough game to lose at home.
wargames wrote:Fire Thibs and trade Fournier.
Why stop there.
Fire the dude who came up with this idea to add 2 non defenders in Kemba and EF.l in the back court when the entire nba was going towards tall dynamic guards. Just look at the top picks every year.
It’s like people give thibs all this credit like he can turn a bad defender into a good defender. Thibs needs vets who defend and are consistent on both ends. Thibs needs a perfect roster for Thibs to succeed. And right now this roster and starting unit has too many flaws that Thibs can’t fill. So his coaching flaws don’t get exposed. It’s a chain reaction that starts with the FO who’s job is to add talent (according to Leon). But you need talent that fits the coach and competitive in a league that’s dominated by dynamic wings. We drafted deuce for this reason but he can’t break into the rotation.
But when you have an old school coach like thibs, you need to build a roster to his strengths while not exposing his weaknesses. This roster makeup exposes a lot of the players, coaches and FO weaknesses.
There needs to be some changes regardless. Either we make trades (Obi / cam / IQ)!and build a playoff team of vets or trade the vets (EF / Randle) and let the yoots run wild. Deuce for example, is a top 5 or top 10 defensive guard. Cam is a defensive wing. A healthy grimes is the best 2 way player on the team. Obi is a walking highlight who happens to be our best 3 pt shooter (go figure).
We have the players but with EF and Randle on the team, certain guys are being blocked. And Thibs is a traditional coach that caters to the vets and their contract. Plus if Randle was taken out in the 2nd half and we still lost, Randle will eventually turn into “thumbs down” Randle.
No cred to ATL for being a pretty good team?
Being better than us?
The roster moves they made consolidated into Murray which is something we could have done with DM. Issue was we’d be small.
WE are, and that was apparent last night. Brunson was abused.
Fire the coach, fire the FO……….then what? Trade the picks and then what? “Patience”? What is that?
Knicks come off a 37 win season where we developed yoot, start 3-4 and now “fire the coach”. Last week it was “optimism” time.
3 losses, and we freaking out? We get a free agent to come and help build a culture and after two weeks fans want to blow it up?
Thats not good advice. Last night we sucked but we got outplayed by a better team.
Take it like a man.
Clean wrote:The thing about that Randle steal is he should not have ISO there but RJ was also a problem. He is not a threat from 3 so DJM just doubles off him one pass away without a care in the world. These guys can't be played with each other. They are constantly in each others way.
IMHO neither player has a high level BBIQ, we see it more overtly with Randle and probably on a sliding scale with RJ cause of his age but I just don't think he has it either.
I'll state it emphatically: I think the FO and coaching staff knows this very well but you coach up those guys as best you can and see what unfolds at the right time.
martin wrote:Clean wrote:The thing about that Randle steal is he should not have ISO there but RJ was also a problem. He is not a threat from 3 so DJM just doubles off him one pass away without a care in the world. These guys can't be played with each other. They are constantly in each others way.
IMHO neither player has a high level BBIQ, we see it more overtly with Randle and probably on a sliding scale with RJ cause of his age but I just don't think he has it either.
I'll state it emphatically: I think the FO and coaching staff knows this very well but you coach up those guys as best you can and see what unfolds at the right time.
You are quick with the quotes. I ended up deleting it because I don't want to be the guy who constantly repeats himself. I am trying to be self aware.
The man makes a good point.
This game sucked. We lost a bunch of these last season with losing big leads and I was hoping Brunson would help eliminate these but he can only do so much. But there is simply no excuse for this loss. Not when you're up 23 at home and your hated rival misses a bunch of minutes.
Give the Hawks credit. Especially Murray. He was outstanding. That was one of the best defensive games I have ever seen from a guard. Very Gary Payton-like impact. Sucks the Spurs didn't even give us a chance to negotiate. He's a gamer.
But this was a bad loss! Especially coming off two losses on the road. Can't lose at home up 23! Especially to a hated rival and with them coming off a road trip. This was a total embarrassment. A grant total of 10 points in the 3rd!
It doesn't fall on any one player. Everyone deserves blame. Especially Thibs. You don't sub out Obi in that second quarter after only 6 minutes whene he was playing so well and sparked that big lead. Not for Randle, who is playing more in control this season but still struggling from three (20%). He better be at the gym getting those extra shots cause he needs to pick up his three point shooting.
It's still early and I'm not going to freak out or overreact. Everyone knew this would be a .500 team. So there will be a lot of up's and down's. But these last 3 games are concerning. When a guy like Murray is going off, someone (Brunson, RJ, Randle) needs to counter that production and energy!
Clean wrote:martin wrote:Clean wrote:The thing about that Randle steal is he should not have ISO there but RJ was also a problem. He is not a threat from 3 so DJM just doubles off him one pass away without a care in the world. These guys can't be played with each other. They are constantly in each others way.
IMHO neither player has a high level BBIQ, we see it more overtly with Randle and probably on a sliding scale with RJ cause of his age but I just don't think he has it either.
I'll state it emphatically: I think the FO and coaching staff knows this very well but you coach up those guys as best you can and see what unfolds at the right time.
You are quick with the quotes. I ended up deleting it because I don't want to be the guy who constantly repeats himself. I am trying to be self aware.
No worries. Your tweet above about Randle is even more damning.
He just never plays smart basketball. He has talent but his decision making goes in and out. Gotta make a shot too, same for RJ. Nothing works without those 2 guys being much better.
