ramtour420 wrote:Nalod wrote:joec32033 wrote:Nalod wrote:I find a lot of truth in both sides of the argument.
What I don’t understand is the thought that RJ is a finished piece and patience is lost.
I don’t prescribe to NYKM hype machine either so the middle ground is the likely truth.
Seems fans place a premium on potential on players that have yet to prove themselves with big minutes.
Fans then lose patience on RJ or Randle as they can’t see the furture when a player stagnates.
RJ sureged last part of last season to avg. 20 pts a game as the 2nd option. He is doing it as the 3rd option.
Seems to me RJ has more iso playmaking tasks this year and he, like IQ is going thru a learning curve.
Defense sometimes suffers when players are distracted by new tasks.
Seems we spend a lot of time trying to figure things out to suit our agendas?
RJ is the only one that can slam the door to his critics.
He might not make knick fans 100% happy but what do his coaches think of him?
I'm with you 100% on this. The nitpicking is annoying as you pointed out before. I am getting to a point where I hope to see him traded.
Few weeks ago we were arguing about guys on this team with the clutch gene. I know I said RJ had it (other people did too). Total ridicule. In the past 10 games RJ has come on multiple times down the stretch but now the complaint is he didn't start well. While this is an issue that needs to be addressed, everyone is overlooking what he did well.
And the Talen Horton Tucker BS? The only reason you remember that is it was at the end of the game. RJ straight carried the Knicks for first half of the fourth when NO ONE was doing anything. Without him coming through like that-and his clutch 3-and his rebounding-and the fact thenoffense was running directly through him as a Point Forward...
But that doesn't matter. It's RJ. He sucks. Get Herro.
I recall RJ used to guard the best SG or SF on other teams. Now "he can't play defense".
Martin now taking out two month stretch to show he is not avg.?
Yeah, the nitpicking is getting a bit much.
Well with the emergence of Grimes we now actually have someone capable of ACTUALLY guarding the best wing. And IQ. And Deuce. And JHart. So RJ needs to not only say the words but actually perform better than those guys on D. Hasn't been the case this year so far
Deuce great defender. IQ above average. Hart above average.
Sorry, but my eye test shown Grimes as above average at best at least for the first 45 minutes of a game. Then he goes to average. Grimes has made a lot not mistakes I see get overlooked here becausebhe is the new darling on this team.
And I know there are tons of analytics numbers that are going to prove me wrong. So before we start posting them, I am acknowledging that they are going to prove me "wrong" I am also acknowledging I don't give a shit.
Knixkik wrote:martin wrote:Knixkik wrote:martin wrote:Nalod wrote:I recall RJ used to guard the best SG or SF on other teams. Now "he can't play defense".
Martin now taking out two month stretch to show he is not avg.?
Yeah, the nitpicking is getting a bit much.
No I'm taking out a 2+ month stretch to show you how much it skews the other 4 years worth of info, to put everything else into context.
And I’m sure you could take out a cold stretch here and there and have the opposite effect to some degree.
I mean, go for it. I've taken the time to look at the stats differently to see if there is extra information to be found, please do the same.
I could be wrong. I want to be wrong. I want to be at the crow buffet needing to reverse a downward look at RJ's top end potential thread from 2 years ago.
RJ definitely has stretches every year where he is decent. For me, for young players, those flashes are super fantastic occurrences; it means he has the potential to do exactly that. But when does those flashes turn into something different, like just inconsistency?
I’m not going to break down those stats because I’m not interested in manipulating the data in any way. That completely defeats the purpose.
I am not manipulating anything. I'm trying to take a different look at things while being very transparent about it. All the while trying to draw conclusions from it.
martin wrote:Knixkik wrote:martin wrote:Knixkik wrote:martin wrote:Nalod wrote:I recall RJ used to guard the best SG or SF on other teams. Now "he can't play defense".
Martin now taking out two month stretch to show he is not avg.?
Yeah, the nitpicking is getting a bit much.
No I'm taking out a 2+ month stretch to show you how much it skews the other 4 years worth of info, to put everything else into context.
And I’m sure you could take out a cold stretch here and there and have the opposite effect to some degree.
I mean, go for it. I've taken the time to look at the stats differently to see if there is extra information to be found, please do the same.
I could be wrong. I want to be wrong. I want to be at the crow buffet needing to reverse a downward look at RJ's top end potential thread from 2 years ago.
RJ definitely has stretches every year where he is decent. For me, for young players, those flashes are super fantastic occurrences; it means he has the potential to do exactly that. But when does those flashes turn into something different, like just inconsistency?
I’m not going to break down those stats because I’m not interested in manipulating the data in any way. That completely defeats the purpose.
I am not manipulating anything. I'm trying to take a different look at things while being very transparent about it. All the while trying to draw conclusions from it.
Yes manipulate wasn’t a perfect word for sure. But you’re taking an entire career of numbers, removing the hot streaks, and using that to argue that his numbers are not what they seem. But as you say we don’t need to belabor this, we can just agree he’s streaky and the shooting still needs a lot of improvement.
Knixkik wrote:We can just agree he's streaky and the shooting still needs a lot of improvement.
That's the scary thing about R.J. Barrett's potential moving forward.
If he's able to average 20+ Points Per Game despite not the most efficient Shooter just yet etc.
Just imagine what type of numbers he'll put up once his Shooting Efficiency improves drastically throughout the next 2-4 years by the time he's only 24-26 years of age?
He automatically becomes an NBA PROBLEM @ 25+ Points Per Game (easily).
And that's the envision that I have for R.J. Barrett because being only 22 years of age and already back-2-back years of 20+ PPG really doesn't, lie.
NYKMentality wrote:Knixkik wrote:We can just agree he's streaky and the shooting still needs a lot of improvement.
That's the scary thing about R.J. Barrett's potential moving forward.
If he's able to average 20+ Points Per Game despite not the most efficient Shooter just yet etc.
Just imagine what type of numbers he'll put up once his Shooting Efficiency improves drastically throughout the next 2-4 years by the time he's only 24-26 years of age?
He automatically becomes an NBA PROBLEM @ 25+ Points Per Game (easily).
And that's the envision that I have for R.J. Barrett because being only 22 years of age and already back-2-back years of 20+ PPG really doesn't, lie.
Wait until you figure out what volume shooting means
martin wrote:NYKMentality wrote:Knixkik wrote:We can just agree he's streaky and the shooting still needs a lot of improvement.
That's the scary thing about R.J. Barrett's potential moving forward.If he's able to average 20+ Points Per Game despite not the most efficient Shooter just yet etc.
Just imagine what type of numbers he'll put up once his Shooting Efficiency improves drastically throughout the next 2-4 years by the time he's only 24-26 years of age?
He automatically becomes an NBA PROBLEM @ 25+ Points Per Game (easily).
And that's the envision that I have for R.J. Barrett because being only 22 years of age and already back-2-back years of 20+ PPG really doesn't, lie.
Wait until you figure out what volume shooting means
Wait until we figure out what NBA development of an extremely talented 22 year old kid (who's the youngest player on our entire roster), means.
In all seriousness, R.J. deserves criticism for his off night's but imo it's all apart of the process (bigger picture) and therefore I refuse to watch his every game with both magnifying glasses and microscopes; because I feel like once he improves his IQ + Shooting Efficiency he'll = An NBA All-Star @ 25+ PPG.
NYKMentality wrote:martin wrote:NYKMentality wrote:Knixkik wrote:We can just agree he's streaky and the shooting still needs a lot of improvement.
That's the scary thing about R.J. Barrett's potential moving forward.If he's able to average 20+ Points Per Game despite not the most efficient Shooter just yet etc.
Just imagine what type of numbers he'll put up once his Shooting Efficiency improves drastically throughout the next 2-4 years by the time he's only 24-26 years of age?
He automatically becomes an NBA PROBLEM @ 25+ Points Per Game (easily).
And that's the envision that I have for R.J. Barrett because being only 22 years of age and already back-2-back years of 20+ PPG really doesn't, lie.
Wait until you figure out what volume shooting means
Wait until we figure out what NBA development of an extremely talented 22 year old kid (who's the youngest player on our entire roster), means.
In all seriousness, R.J. deserves criticism for his off night's but imo it's all apart of the process (bigger picture) and therefore I refuse to watch his every game with both magnifying glasses and microscopes; because I feel like once he improves his IQ + Shooting Efficiency he'll = An NBA All-Star @ 25+ PPG.
you forgot handsome and well spoken. Dresses really well
RJ definitely needs to figure things out or he very well could be moved in a trade this offseason or sometime early next year. I have no evidence but suspect he has a nagging back injury. Something about the way certain games he looks much more mobile and other games he appears more robotic. Just a hunch...
jskinny35 wrote:RJ definitely needs to figure things out or he very well could be moved in a trade this offseason or sometime early next year. I have no evidence but suspect he has a nagging back injury. Something about the way certain games he looks much more mobile and other games he appears more robotic. Just a hunch...
Something is not right with him. Certain movements he does look limited.
The fan usually is about replacement. Change coach, change FO, and trade players.
usually teams are “how do we fix this?”.
RJ is a 4 year player now, and 22. Its not like he regressed to this point. I would suspect something is not right.
Team is playing OK.
“JHartMania” by fans and the broadcast team is in full swing.
jskinny35 wrote:RJ definitely needs to figure things out or he very well could be moved in a trade this offseason or sometime early next year. I have no evidence but suspect he has a nagging back injury. Something about the way certain games he looks much more mobile and other games he appears more robotic. Just a hunch...
Good point. RJ looks like he’s playing hurt limping up and down the court. I suspected a leg injury but it could be a back or both.
RJ has sucked lately and that’s ok. He will learn from it grow from it and improve. The FO is committed to RJ for the next few years. By then his contract has started and he may be a more valuable trade commodity.
But for now and even next season, he will be a knick so get used to it. It’s time to stop looking at every single bad game as his worse game and focus on what potential learning opportunities with he gain this season with players like hart for example. Hart wasn’t known for his shooting and he doesn’t have a fancy dribble move. He’s a slasher who gets to the rim. Same with RJ. Do hopefully hart will be an influence on RJ in the short or longterm.
I hope he improves while he’s a knick. If he ever reaches his ceiling before he’s traded, we all will be saying he’s a keeper. He needs to find a role on this new team where he’s impacting the game outside of just scoring.
blkexec wrote:RJ has sucked lately and that’s ok. He will learn from it grow from it and improve. The FO is committed to RJ for the next few years. By then his contract has started and he may be a more valuable trade commodity. But for now and even next season, he will be a knick so get used to it. It’s time to stop looking at every single bad game as his worse game and focus on what potential learning opportunities with he gain this season with players like hart for example. Hart wasn’t known for his shooting and he doesn’t have a fancy dribble move. He’s a slasher who gets to the rim. Same with RJ. Do hopefully hart will be an influence on RJ in the short or longterm.
I hope he improves while he’s a knick. If he ever reaches his ceiling before he’s traded, we all will be saying he’s a keeper. He needs to find a role on this new team where he’s impacting the game outside of just scoring.
He seems a little off. I might bring Melo in just to mentor him a bit.
EwingsGlass wrote:blkexec wrote:RJ has sucked lately and thats ok. He will learn from it grow from it and improve. The FO is committed to RJ for the next few years. By then his contract has started and he may be a more valuable trade commodity. But for now and even next season, he will be a knick so get used to it. Its time to stop looking at every single bad game as his worse game and focus on what potential learning opportunities with he gain this season with players like hart for example. Hart wasnt known for his shooting and he doesn;t have a fancy dribble move. He;s a slasher who gets to the rim. Same with RJ. Do hopefully hart will be an influence on RJ in the short or longterm.
I hope he improves while he;s a knick. If he ever reaches his ceiling before he;s traded, we all will be saying he;s a keeper. He needs to find a role on this new team where he;s impacting the game outside of just scoring.
He seems a little off. I might bring Melo in just to mentor him a bit.
LMFAO
Melo mentor him? What habits do you want him learning from Melo? Jab step? Teach him how *not* to pass better?
blkexec wrote:RJ has sucked lately and that’s ok. He will learn from it grow from it and improve. The FO is committed to RJ for the next few years. By then his contract has started and he may be a more valuable trade commodity. But for now and even next season, he will be a knick so get used to it. It’s time to stop looking at every single bad game as his worse game and focus on what potential learning opportunities with he gain this season with players like hart for example. Hart wasn’t known for his shooting and he doesn’t have a fancy dribble move. He’s a slasher who gets to the rim. Same with RJ. Do hopefully hart will be an influence on RJ in the short or longterm.
I hope he improves while he’s a knick. If he ever reaches his ceiling before he’s traded, we all will be saying he’s a keeper. He needs to find a role on this new team where he’s impacting the game outside of just scoring.
Or take some advil, alternate ice and heat?
Maybe he has something he though could tolerate and its degrading to the point he needs to stop?
Maybe season ending procedure but hoping he could finish the season?
He does look like he is pressing. He does look bad at times.
blkexec wrote:RJ has sucked lately and that’s ok. He will learn from it grow from it and improve. The FO is committed to RJ for the next few years. By then his contract has started and he may be a more valuable trade commodity. But for now and even next season, he will be a knick so get used to it. It’s time to stop looking at every single bad game as his worse game and focus on what potential learning opportunities with he gain this season with players like hart for example. Hart wasn’t known for his shooting and he doesn’t have a fancy dribble move. He’s a slasher who gets to the rim. Same with RJ. Do hopefully hart will be an influence on RJ in the short or longterm.
I hope he improves while he’s a knick. If he ever reaches his ceiling before he’s traded, we all will be saying he’s a keeper. He needs to find a role on this new team where he’s impacting the game outside of just scoring.
what's his ceiling? I keep trying to find positives. Usually he's good this time of year. He's shooting below 40% from the field and below 30% from 3 in 6 games this month.
He's easily the most inconsistent player we have and there's zero reason to think we are committed to him past this year. 100% believe he gets traded this summer
Panos wrote:EwingsGlass wrote:blkexec wrote:RJ has sucked lately and thats ok. He will learn from it grow from it and improve. The FO is committed to RJ for the next few years. By then his contract has started and he may be a more valuable trade commodity. But for now and even next season, he will be a knick so get used to it. Its time to stop looking at every single bad game as his worse game and focus on what potential learning opportunities with he gain this season with players like hart for example. Hart wasnt known for his shooting and he doesn;t have a fancy dribble move. He;s a slasher who gets to the rim. Same with RJ. Do hopefully hart will be an influence on RJ in the short or longterm.
I hope he improves while he;s a knick. If he ever reaches his ceiling before he;s traded, we all will be saying he;s a keeper. He needs to find a role on this new team where he;s impacting the game outside of just scoring.
He seems a little off. I might bring Melo in just to mentor him a bit.
LMFAO
Melo mentor him? What habits do you want him learning from Melo? Jab step? Teach him how *not* to pass better?
What could Melo teach RJ that Randle couldn't? Not to spin into jump passes, I suppose.
fishmike wrote:He's easily the most inconsistent player we have and there's zero reason to think we are committed to him past this year. 100% believe he gets traded this summer
Deja vu
You sound exactly the same as all of those Julius Randle non-believers (just last year) which is why I felt the need to create a "LEAVE JULIUS RANDLE ALONE!!! Thread.
Trust me when I say (as I said last year about Julius Randle who everyone was booing) R.J. Barrett isn't going anywhere, anytime soon.
Feels so good when a
kid you BELIEVE IN goes out there and MAKES YOU PROUD!
✨R.J. BARRETT 5 GAMES VS CLEVELAND (@ 4-1)✨
87 POINTS
21 REBOUNDS
14 ASSISTS
6 STEALS
1 BLOCK
FG = 30/68 @ .441%
A+ DEFENSE!
🏆RJ BARRETT (IMO) WAS THE MVP OF THAT KNICKS vs. CAVALIERS SERIES!
NYKMentality wrote:fishmike wrote:He's easily the most inconsistent player we have and there's zero reason to think we are committed to him past this year. 100% believe he gets traded this summer
Deja vu
You sound exactly the same as all of those Julius Randle non-believers (just last year) which is why I felt the need to create a "LEAVE JULIUS RANDLE ALONE!!! Thread.
Trust me when I say (as I said last year about Julius Randle who everyone was booing) R.J. Barrett isn't going anywhere, anytime soon.
I can’t wait until you are banned. Get the fuck out of here with this juvenile bullshit.
NYKMentality wrote:Feels so good when a kid you BELIEVE IN goes out there and MAKES YOU PROUD!✨R.J. BARRETT 5 GAMES VS CLEVELAND (@ 4-1)✨
87 POINTS
21 REBOUNDS
14 ASSISTS
6 STEALS
1 BLOCK
FG = 30/68 @ .441%
A+ DEFENSE!
🏆RJ BARRETT (IMO) WAS THE MVP OF THAT KNICKS vs. CAVALIERS SERIES!
You know what? Imma let you have this. 
