Knicks · Quickley gonna get paid (page 2)

For good measure, Collin Sexton, after sitting out a year with zero track record for defense (and I don't watch him so this is guess) got a 4 year $70M extension off of rookie contract.

I think the Knicks value IQ more than that and his contract will be in the 4yr $80M range. His intangibles and progress has been outstanding and also hasn't slowed down.

3 big reasons I think IQ will get more from Knicks than we expect.

Without any real look into this, I think he is a gym rat connector: He is a guy who brings the other gym rats to a different level.

Second, his defensive BBallIQ is bonkers and that's what the Knicks value. He is an on-court leader at this end from a guard position.

Third, while not the smoothest PG-type, he brings that invaluable skill and is still growing in that area.

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so pay him.... that's fine. The way he's projecting there's real star potential and that's a great thing. Makes other parts movable also.

franco12 wrote:And this is the challenge of building a winning team in the NBA.

only if you have a bad front office. Remember RJ/Brunson/Randle make less than 2 max guys combined and a LOT less if one is a super max guy.

martin wrote:3 big reasons I think IQ will get more from Knicks than we expect.

Without any real look into this, I think he is a gym rat connector: He is a guy who brings the other gym rats to a different level.

Second, his defensive BBallIQ is bonkers and that's what the Knicks value. He is an on-court leader at this end from a guard position.

Third, while not the smoothest PG-type, he brings that invaluable skill and is still growing in that area.

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omg I saw that... that play alone raised my expectations for this team. The 2 man coverage there was nuts. They looked like NFL defensive backs. I thought IQ got smoked and what happened next literally made me laugh. The last year of "IQ isnt that good, trade Randle and fire Thibs" all flashed before my eyes.

This is a well coached bunch of good ball players. Maybe not stars but we got 5-6 straight up ballers and 3-4 dogs to back them up

fishmike wrote:

martin wrote:3 big reasons I think IQ will get more from Knicks than we expect.

Without any real look into this, I think he is a gym rat connector: He is a guy who brings the other gym rats to a different level.

Second, his defensive BBallIQ is bonkers and that's what the Knicks value. He is an on-court leader at this end from a guard position.

Third, while not the smoothest PG-type, he brings that invaluable skill and is still growing in that area.

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omg I saw that... that play alone raised my expectations for this team. The 2 man coverage there was nuts. They looked like NFL defensive backs. I thought IQ got smoked and what happened next literally made me laugh. The last year of "IQ isnt that good, trade Randle and fire Thibs" all flashed before my eyes.

This is a well coached bunch of good ball players. Maybe not stars but we got 5-6 straight up ballers and 3-4 dogs to back them up

Feel like IQ, Grimes, JHart, and even Deuce are all in the very disruptive and high defensive IQ type of guards. Deuce is just simmering and hopefully getting that shot and dribble-drive worked out

Not sure if IQ signs an extension this summer. It probably makes more sense to hit RFA and see if he can land a bigger deal. Advanced metrics love him and if he just maintains his efficiency, there might be a team looking to play him 36 minutes a night and pay him 30 million a year.

He's top 25 among guards in win shares/ 48 and his next contract will be the prime years of his career. Someone will make him a big offer.

gradyandrew wrote:Not sure if IQ signs an extension this summer. It probably makes more sense to hit RFA and see if he can land a bigger deal. Advanced metrics love him and if he just maintains his efficiency, there might be a team looking to play him 36 minutes a night and pay him 30 million a year.

yes.... the Knicks. If he's Jordan Poole part II that's GREAT. Just so long as Randle doesnt punch him in the face we are great. This is not a problem

Oh, and let's give a shout out for Thibs vision in keeping IQ more or less in the same role since day one. I really thought IQ should have been starting last season since December. Thibs stuck to his guns and we're reaping the benefits of it now. IQ is the Knicks Manu..

Knicks fixed the parameter 3 defense issues from earlier in the season. Grimes, IQ, and JHart getting it done.
I trust Thibs and Perry in this teams construction.
Will be an interesting summer for sure.
What I don't trust is fans measure of how valuable our guys are in the market.

IQ is going to get paid, but will he start? IQ has shown, he's starter material. Would Quickley be willing to keep coming off the bench going forward?

Im a big fan of Grimes, but he's been showing that he isnt ready for "prime time", as in starting. His minutes are way down since JHart's arrival. Im seeing more PG in Grimes's game, with every game.

IQ's new move is to fake the 3 pt shot by getting up to his tiptoes but turn that into a dribble. Dangerously close to traveling a few times but he used that move pretty nicely last night

gradyandrew wrote:Not sure if IQ signs an extension this summer. It probably makes more sense to hit RFA and see if he can land a bigger deal. Advanced metrics love him and if he just maintains his efficiency, there might be a team looking to play him 36 minutes a night and pay him 30 million a year.

He's top 25 among guards in win shares/ 48 and his next contract will be the prime years of his career. Someone will make him a big offer.

I don't know how players think about it but if someone tells you they will guarantee $80+M to you RIGHT NOW or you have to risk all sorts of things for a year.... thought process may be different.

Quickley is an RFA before the '24-25 season.

Hugely important to note the NBA's current TV deal expires that season as well, as '25-26 is expected to start a new contract that will multiply TV revenue by 2x or even up to 4x.

That means the salary cap IS going to be increasing significantly beginning '25=26 likely for several seasons in row (to 'smooth' out the jump).

This could impact Quickley two ways:

1.) Knicks should be in healthy position to resign him.
2.) The '24-25 RFA class may (if they're bold) want to wait a year to sign long-term deals, as max deals will increase by a nice margin the next season.

Conceptually, the NBA Draft, rookie scale, and the Larry Bird rights are there so teams have the tools to pick, develop, and sign their own players without having to dive in to free agency or make trades. And gives them the ability to circumvent the salary cap while giving loyalty to their own players.

It's been a long time since we've dealt with signing our our draft picks to extensions beyond their rookie deals, so this is a very unnatural feeling for most Knick fans. But consider a scenario where, let's say, Quickley, Obi, Grimes really kill it next year (let's say, average 15ppg on 50% shooting, 40% 3s, 80% FT, look like legit 2-way defenders, and all they need is 5-10 more minutes per game to look like legit all-star contenders).

It means 1) you probably have a really good team and 2) in terms of the future, as the management team, you can choose to go WAAAY over the cap give all of them max deals if that's what it takes to keep them in Knick uniforms.

That option is there for you. And once you're over the cap, you can still continue to draft and develop. I mean, this is the NBA's ideal state for the fans - as you build loyalty to your young'uns.

The reality of course is that few players turn into all-stars (As good as Josh Hart has been, a lot right would need to happen for him to sniff an all-star berth or max contract).

Players also have choices to make - it's not all about money. Jordan Poole could have gone to another team to become a legit all-star contender and run his own team. But he had to be sold on the idea that Steph and Klay are aging and that 2-3 years down the line, it'll be his team. And in the meantime, he'd play as a key spot starter/super sub and earn a lot of money regardless. Some players will choose like him. Others will insist they have more opportunity elsewhere.

Based on how the Knick use him, Obi's kind of like a $5-8m/yr replacement player. The Knicks can overpay him as insurance in case Randle breaks down. But If Obi were on another team, I think we can look at Aaron Gordon's success in Denver for an idea of what he could do if given real responsibility and starter-like minutes. (Gordon's on a $87m/4yr deal)

So back to Quickley, sure. I'm fine if he gets paid. I'm fine if all of our players get paid if they're all productive and the Knicks have a winning, title contending product.

But unlike prior regimes, we can no longer be in the mindset of fan-managing cap for free agency. We are investing in developing our young players and fortunately, we're getting nice results. We enjoy ~4 years of low priced contracts, then it evens out when they get an extension.

defense is stellar
attitude is beyond stellar
he is playing with confidence on both ends of the floor.
leads by example.
he's playing in the 4Q and RJ isn't; it's not who starts; it's who finishes

pay the man. we're not used to ascending players; this is what they look like

martin wrote:

gradyandrew wrote:Not sure if IQ signs an extension this summer. It probably makes more sense to hit RFA and see if he can land a bigger deal. Advanced metrics love him and if he just maintains his efficiency, there might be a team looking to play him 36 minutes a night and pay him 30 million a year.

He's top 25 among guards in win shares/ 48 and his next contract will be the prime years of his career. Someone will make him a big offer.

I don't know how players think about it but if someone tells you they will guarantee $80+M to you RIGHT NOW or you have to risk all sorts of things for a year.... thought process may be different.

Depends on the player. FVV had the bet on himself mentality. Brunson was will to sign a $55M extension with the Mavs (good thing he didn't) before he his FA. If I'm IQs agent, I'm telling him to hold off, but I have no idea what IQ's situation is.

BigDaddyG wrote:<snip>
Depends on the player. FVV had the bet on himself mentality. Brunson was will to sign a $55M extension with the Mavs (good thing he didn't) before he his FA. If I'm IQs agent, I'm telling him to hold off, but I have no idea what IQ's situation is.

Great point here. If you sign them early you can play on loyalty and security ($55m is a lot of money!). But then, look at Brunson now. He left, and now he's pushing his full potential. Not only is he putting up big numbers, but this is the norm now - every game is a big game. I think we all could have seen the failed signing scenario:
If Brunson weren't as good, we could have easily been seeing him continuing the type of numbers we saw in Dallas and playing a platoon with new and improved Quickley. Quickley could have started off the pre-season hot and demanded minutes back then.

I like the way things turned out. RJ got paid - buddy can continue to dream about becoming an all-star (we're going to vote him in next year!), but he no longer has the pressure of playing for a contract. He just needs to chill and be a big contributor (and not the driving force) to our team.

Brunson would have signed for the 55m. Then the playoffs happend and he showed something.
IQ is demonstrating as a very good role player and Im not discounting that, but he is not doing what Bronson proved when Luka was out.
Concept is he can bet on himself and thus force a trade to a team that will pay him. He can tear his knee and be ignored.
So many variables. Im not worried about letting him walk.
Fact is Lakers let Randle walk to create cap space. Shit happens. Things work out.
I trust Leon and Co are not stupid.

3's made during their 1st 3 years (for all 5 players):

#1.) Klay Thompson = 545

#2.) Steph Curry = 372 (but not for long)

#3.) Immanuel Quickley = 361 (and counting).

#4.) Ray Allen = 325

#5.).Reggie Miller = 309.

What Immanuel Quickley is doing is extremely rare (special).

And he's already got absolute elite Defense too

He's 100% going to get paid and become paid big time and I'm just thankful it's he'll become paid (long-term) as a Knick because there's a 0.00% chance Leon Rose doesn't keep him long term for his Coach Thibs.

He's also going to replace Quentin Grimes as our Starting 2G come next year too (imo) but nonetheless he's already our closer (more important).

NYKMentality wrote:3's made during their 1st 3 years (for all 5 players):

#1.) Klay Thompson = 545

#2.) Steph Curry = 372 (but not for long)

#3.) Immanuel Quickley = 361 (and counting).

#4.) Ray Allen = 325

#5.).Reggie Miller = 309.

What Immanuel Quickley is doing is extremely rare (special).

And he's already got absolute elite Defense too

He's 100% going to get paid and become paid big time and I'm just thankful it's he'll become paid (long-term) as a Knick because there's a 0.00% chance Leon Rose doesn't keep him long term for his Coach Thibs.

He's also going to replace Quentin Grimes as our Starting 2G come next year too (imo) but nonetheless he's already our closer (more important).

Wait, so now we have Kobe AND Curry? Look out world!