Knicks · Quickley for Portland’s top-1 protected lotto pick? (page 3)
GustavBahler wrote:TPercy wrote:Caseloads wrote:GustavBahler wrote:fishmike wrote:GustavBahler wrote:The OP's proposal would be like winning a million dollars in the lottery. And using the winnings to buy a million lottery tickets.what you are leaving out is we already have a million dollars. IQ plays the same position as Brunson, and Brunson is young. Brandon Miller is a blue chip star prospect with a the physical profile this roster is missing.Bruh, that's the "André" talking lol.
If IQ is traded, it should be for a clear upgrade, not the lotto.
You arent trading IQ for a pick and taking the BPA. You are trading him for a clear shot to draft a star player you have extensively scouted. Nobody is looking back if the guy is the next Paul George or Kris Middleton
Still would be dumb trading a sure thing for a maybe.
That’s how you get value
The issue is that outside of wemby, nobody in this draft is worth the risk. I wouldn't even trade IQ for Henderson.Yup, dont understand why they dont get that part. It would cost a lot more than IQ to nab the first pick.
Beyond the first pick, we would be lucky to draft a prospect and develop him into the player Quickley is now.
…and this
This is not a good draft class. Kind of glad the Dallas pick may get punted to next year
Alpha1971 wrote:joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ and picks for a sign and trade for Jeremi Grant ? Or make a trade for DeRozan or Jimmy Butler ?Butler and Derozan are too old. Grant isn't enough of an upgrade to warrant picks. He is probably on the same level as OG for me.
Just because the market got nuts doesn't mean they have to over pay for everything. I would rather not make a move than one that mortgages the next 5 years just to get to the 2nd round.
None of those players put the Knicks on a tier with the Bucks/Celtics. May even up the talent level with the top end talent of the Cavs a little bit. But,at least with Butler and Derozan, for how long?
Ok so you would do RJ for Grant one for one ? Butler and DD what if they give us 3 good seasons ? We would still have draft picks and free agency over the years to get another wing when their time is up
RJ and Grant are on the same level (Grant however is 7 years older). I would think the Knicks would deserve a little more all things considered. Derozan looked washed in SA for a minute before going nuts in Chicago. I'm not sure he has 3 years. Butler may give 3 years but I am not confident about it. I have been clear my opinion of RJ, but I'm going to be honest, if I am moving RJ I am trading up and not for a rental. Seriously sounds stupid but anyone over 25 or so wouldn't really be a coinsideration for me unless they were light years better and have some tread on the tires.
OG stat line looked like a bad game from RJ and the Raptors lost.
The RJ detractors would be on fire if knicks lost a playin game with that box score line.
I know its one game. I know its the shortest of samples. Just seeing the humor in it.
joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ and picks for a sign and trade for Jeremi Grant ? Or make a trade for DeRozan or Jimmy Butler ?Butler and Derozan are too old. Grant isn't enough of an upgrade to warrant picks. He is probably on the same level as OG for me.
Just because the market got nuts doesn't mean they have to over pay for everything. I would rather not make a move than one that mortgages the next 5 years just to get to the 2nd round.
None of those players put the Knicks on a tier with the Bucks/Celtics. May even up the talent level with the top end talent of the Cavs a little bit. But,at least with Butler and Derozan, for how long?
Ok so you would do RJ for Grant one for one ? Butler and DD what if they give us 3 good seasons ? We would still have draft picks and free agency over the years to get another wing when their time is up
RJ and Grant are on the same level (Grant however is 7 years older). I would think the Knicks would deserve a little more all things considered. Derozan looked washed in SA for a minute before going nuts in Chicago. I'm not sure he has 3 years. Butler may give 3 years but I am not confident about it. I have been clear my opinion of RJ, but I'm going to be honest, if I am moving RJ I am trading up and not for a rental. Seriously sounds stupid but anyone over 25 or so wouldn't really be a coinsideration for me unless they were light years better and have some tread on the tires.
I consider Grant above Barrett. He can score one on one but he’s also a good 3pt shooter and great defender. He’s similar to Anunoby without the fanfare.
I personally would move Barrett and picks for LaVine because I think it can prevent the Knicks from having to trade Quickley, etc, but his price tag will go up after last night.
Knixkik wrote:joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ and picks for a sign and trade for Jeremi Grant ? Or make a trade for DeRozan or Jimmy Butler ?Butler and Derozan are too old. Grant isn't enough of an upgrade to warrant picks. He is probably on the same level as OG for me.
Just because the market got nuts doesn't mean they have to over pay for everything. I would rather not make a move than one that mortgages the next 5 years just to get to the 2nd round.
None of those players put the Knicks on a tier with the Bucks/Celtics. May even up the talent level with the top end talent of the Cavs a little bit. But,at least with Butler and Derozan, for how long?
Ok so you would do RJ for Grant one for one ? Butler and DD what if they give us 3 good seasons ? We would still have draft picks and free agency over the years to get another wing when their time is up
RJ and Grant are on the same level (Grant however is 7 years older). I would think the Knicks would deserve a little more all things considered. Derozan looked washed in SA for a minute before going nuts in Chicago. I'm not sure he has 3 years. Butler may give 3 years but I am not confident about it. I have been clear my opinion of RJ, but I'm going to be honest, if I am moving RJ I am trading up and not for a rental. Seriously sounds stupid but anyone over 25 or so wouldn't really be a coinsideration for me unless they were light years better and have some tread on the tires.
I consider Grant above Barrett. He can score one on one but he’s also a good 3pt shooter and great defender. He’s similar to Anunoby without the fanfare.
I personally would move Barrett and picks for LaVine because I think it can prevent the Knicks from having to trade Quickley, etc, but his price tag will go up after last night.
Lets be real, who said Lavine is on the block?
If we trade for Lavine, how does that mesh with Brunson? Defensive assignments? His contract is massive. Im assuming Grimes is gone, so where is Quicks minutes coming from? You have a max player in lavine and Brunson? Why would Quick want to stay? Lavine a the 3? I don’t see that.
Can anyone that is promoting Grant please demonstrate his defensive ability via advanced stats say the last 3 years and present the contrast to RJ’s last three years?
Games played?
I know Grant is a better shooter, but thats it.
I read fans comments about how good he is, but why not add more to it and open minds with info than opinion. I have not watched a lot of Detroit and Portland games the last three years. When I look at his stat lines they are good. He is been in the league 8 seasons. He also misses a bit of games and his teams suck. That inflates some numbers and makes others look bad too. So other than being frustrated by RJ and his bad 3pt shooting (he avg’s 5.7 attempts a game) and wanting that changed, his turnovers are the same as last year, what is Grant bringing that is elite and the ramifications of his salary (if different than RJ’s) and perhaps a pick or two as proposed?
How would LIllard take this trade and solve the rebuilding around him? Does he strongly advocate to retain Grant?
Im not against improving the and we are here to exchange ideas and there are details to it that make it interesting.
Knixkik wrote:joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ and picks for a sign and trade for Jeremi Grant ? Or make a trade for DeRozan or Jimmy Butler ?Butler and Derozan are too old. Grant isn't enough of an upgrade to warrant picks. He is probably on the same level as OG for me.
Just because the market got nuts doesn't mean they have to over pay for everything. I would rather not make a move than one that mortgages the next 5 years just to get to the 2nd round.
None of those players put the Knicks on a tier with the Bucks/Celtics. May even up the talent level with the top end talent of the Cavs a little bit. But,at least with Butler and Derozan, for how long?
Ok so you would do RJ for Grant one for one ? Butler and DD what if they give us 3 good seasons ? We would still have draft picks and free agency over the years to get another wing when their time is up
RJ and Grant are on the same level (Grant however is 7 years older). I would think the Knicks would deserve a little more all things considered. Derozan looked washed in SA for a minute before going nuts in Chicago. I'm not sure he has 3 years. Butler may give 3 years but I am not confident about it. I have been clear my opinion of RJ, but I'm going to be honest, if I am moving RJ I am trading up and not for a rental. Seriously sounds stupid but anyone over 25 or so wouldn't really be a coinsideration for me unless they were light years better and have some tread on the tires.
I consider Grant above Barrett. He can score one on one but he’s also a good 3pt shooter and great defender. He’s similar to Anunoby without the fanfare.
I personally would move Barrett and picks for LaVine because I think it can prevent the Knicks from having to trade Quickley, etc, but his price tag will go up after last night.
He is also 30. His defensive rating was 120.2 (RJ is 117.1) and had a -35 on the season (compared to RJ-62) if you want to stick a measure on it. It was a give and take on the counting stats, where I wouldn't put Grant markedly better at anything but shooting %'s.
Lavine's knees scare the living piss out of me, not to mention the fit issues. He would either have to play SF or you bump Grimes there. Neither situation would be ideal, imo.
Nalod wrote:Knixkik wrote:joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ and picks for a sign and trade for Jeremi Grant ? Or make a trade for DeRozan or Jimmy Butler ?Butler and Derozan are too old. Grant isn't enough of an upgrade to warrant picks. He is probably on the same level as OG for me.
Just because the market got nuts doesn't mean they have to over pay for everything. I would rather not make a move than one that mortgages the next 5 years just to get to the 2nd round.
None of those players put the Knicks on a tier with the Bucks/Celtics. May even up the talent level with the top end talent of the Cavs a little bit. But,at least with Butler and Derozan, for how long?
Ok so you would do RJ for Grant one for one ? Butler and DD what if they give us 3 good seasons ? We would still have draft picks and free agency over the years to get another wing when their time is up
RJ and Grant are on the same level (Grant however is 7 years older). I would think the Knicks would deserve a little more all things considered. Derozan looked washed in SA for a minute before going nuts in Chicago. I'm not sure he has 3 years. Butler may give 3 years but I am not confident about it. I have been clear my opinion of RJ, but I'm going to be honest, if I am moving RJ I am trading up and not for a rental. Seriously sounds stupid but anyone over 25 or so wouldn't really be a coinsideration for me unless they were light years better and have some tread on the tires.
I consider Grant above Barrett. He can score one on one but he’s also a good 3pt shooter and great defender. He’s similar to Anunoby without the fanfare.
I personally would move Barrett and picks for LaVine because I think it can prevent the Knicks from having to trade Quickley, etc, but his price tag will go up after last night.
Lets be real, who said Lavine is on the block?
If we trade for Lavine, how does that mesh with Brunson? Defensive assignments? His contract is massive. Im assuming Grimes is gone, so where is Quicks minutes coming from? You have a max player in lavine and Brunson? Why would Quick want to stay? Lavine a the 3? I don’t see that.
Can anyone that is promoting Grant please demonstrate his defensive ability via advanced stats say the last 3 years and present the contrast to RJ’s last three years?
Games played?
I know Grant is a better shooter, but thats it.
I read fans comments about how good he is, but why not add more to it and open minds with info than opinion. I have not watched a lot of Detroit and Portland games the last three years. When I look at his stat lines they are good. He is been in the league 8 seasons. He also misses a bit of games and his teams suck. That inflates some numbers and makes others look bad too. So other than being frustrated by RJ and his bad 3pt shooting (he avg’s 5.7 attempts a game) and wanting that changed, his turnovers are the same as last year, what is Grant bringing that is elite and the ramifications of his salary (if different than RJ’s) and perhaps a pick or two as proposed?
How would LIllard take this trade and solve the rebuilding around him? Does he strongly advocate to retain Grant?
Im not against improving the and we are here to exchange ideas and there are details to it that make it interesting.
The grass is always greener......#amiright?
joec32033 wrote:Knixkik wrote:joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ and picks for a sign and trade for Jeremi Grant ? Or make a trade for DeRozan or Jimmy Butler ?Butler and Derozan are too old. Grant isn't enough of an upgrade to warrant picks. He is probably on the same level as OG for me.
Just because the market got nuts doesn't mean they have to over pay for everything. I would rather not make a move than one that mortgages the next 5 years just to get to the 2nd round.
None of those players put the Knicks on a tier with the Bucks/Celtics. May even up the talent level with the top end talent of the Cavs a little bit. But,at least with Butler and Derozan, for how long?
Ok so you would do RJ for Grant one for one ? Butler and DD what if they give us 3 good seasons ? We would still have draft picks and free agency over the years to get another wing when their time is up
RJ and Grant are on the same level (Grant however is 7 years older). I would think the Knicks would deserve a little more all things considered. Derozan looked washed in SA for a minute before going nuts in Chicago. I'm not sure he has 3 years. Butler may give 3 years but I am not confident about it. I have been clear my opinion of RJ, but I'm going to be honest, if I am moving RJ I am trading up and not for a rental. Seriously sounds stupid but anyone over 25 or so wouldn't really be a coinsideration for me unless they were light years better and have some tread on the tires.
I consider Grant above Barrett. He can score one on one but he’s also a good 3pt shooter and great defender. He’s similar to Anunoby without the fanfare.
I personally would move Barrett and picks for LaVine because I think it can prevent the Knicks from having to trade Quickley, etc, but his price tag will go up after last night.
He is also 30. His defensive rating was 120.2 (RJ is 117.1) and had a -35 on the season (compared to RJ-62) if you want to stick a measure on it. It was a give and take on the counting stats, where I wouldn't put Grant markedly better at anything but shooting %'s.
Lavine's knees scare the living piss out of me, not to mention the fit issues. He would either have to play SF or you bump Grimes there. Neither situation would be ideal, imo.
A couple of things. Grant isn’t 30, he just turned 29. LaVine or Grimes can play SF no problem in todays NBA. In fact I’m not opposed to grimes at SF and Quickley at SG long term. I think their length and defensive ability is more important than height. We could just stand pat and try for internal improvement year over year. That’s fine too.
Knixkik wrote:joec32033 wrote:Knixkik wrote:joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ and picks for a sign and trade for Jeremi Grant ? Or make a trade for DeRozan or Jimmy Butler ?Butler and Derozan are too old. Grant isn't enough of an upgrade to warrant picks. He is probably on the same level as OG for me.
Just because the market got nuts doesn't mean they have to over pay for everything. I would rather not make a move than one that mortgages the next 5 years just to get to the 2nd round.
None of those players put the Knicks on a tier with the Bucks/Celtics. May even up the talent level with the top end talent of the Cavs a little bit. But,at least with Butler and Derozan, for how long?
Ok so you would do RJ for Grant one for one ? Butler and DD what if they give us 3 good seasons ? We would still have draft picks and free agency over the years to get another wing when their time is up
RJ and Grant are on the same level (Grant however is 7 years older). I would think the Knicks would deserve a little more all things considered. Derozan looked washed in SA for a minute before going nuts in Chicago. I'm not sure he has 3 years. Butler may give 3 years but I am not confident about it. I have been clear my opinion of RJ, but I'm going to be honest, if I am moving RJ I am trading up and not for a rental. Seriously sounds stupid but anyone over 25 or so wouldn't really be a coinsideration for me unless they were light years better and have some tread on the tires.
I consider Grant above Barrett. He can score one on one but he’s also a good 3pt shooter and great defender. He’s similar to Anunoby without the fanfare.
I personally would move Barrett and picks for LaVine because I think it can prevent the Knicks from having to trade Quickley, etc, but his price tag will go up after last night.
He is also 30. His defensive rating was 120.2 (RJ is 117.1) and had a -35 on the season (compared to RJ-62) if you want to stick a measure on it. It was a give and take on the counting stats, where I wouldn't put Grant markedly better at anything but shooting %'s.
Lavine's knees scare the living piss out of me, not to mention the fit issues. He would either have to play SF or you bump Grimes there. Neither situation would be ideal, imo.
A couple of things. Grant isn’t 30, he just turned 29. LaVine or Grimes can play SF no problem in todays NBA. In fact I’m not opposed to grimes at SF and Quickley at SG long term. I think their length and defensive ability is more important than height. We could just stand pat and try for internal improvement year over year. That’s fine too.
I am with the internal improvement unless we are talking a monster upgrade. I have mentioned Jaylen Brown before. Ingram too.
Guys like OG, Grant....etc... I think it is more prudent to stick with a younger RJ and not give up the extra picks for what I view as a minimal improvement. In all honesty I think the hardest one to trade, if not now, eventually, will be Brunson. I think that he made this team his and his impact is much bigger than just counting stats on the court.
Knixkik wrote:joec32033 wrote:Knixkik wrote:joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ and picks for a sign and trade for Jeremi Grant ? Or make a trade for DeRozan or Jimmy Butler ?Butler and Derozan are too old. Grant isn't enough of an upgrade to warrant picks. He is probably on the same level as OG for me.
Just because the market got nuts doesn't mean they have to over pay for everything. I would rather not make a move than one that mortgages the next 5 years just to get to the 2nd round.
None of those players put the Knicks on a tier with the Bucks/Celtics. May even up the talent level with the top end talent of the Cavs a little bit. But,at least with Butler and Derozan, for how long?
Ok so you would do RJ for Grant one for one ? Butler and DD what if they give us 3 good seasons ? We would still have draft picks and free agency over the years to get another wing when their time is up
RJ and Grant are on the same level (Grant however is 7 years older). I would think the Knicks would deserve a little more all things considered. Derozan looked washed in SA for a minute before going nuts in Chicago. I'm not sure he has 3 years. Butler may give 3 years but I am not confident about it. I have been clear my opinion of RJ, but I'm going to be honest, if I am moving RJ I am trading up and not for a rental. Seriously sounds stupid but anyone over 25 or so wouldn't really be a coinsideration for me unless they were light years better and have some tread on the tires.
I consider Grant above Barrett. He can score one on one but he’s also a good 3pt shooter and great defender. He’s similar to Anunoby without the fanfare.
I personally would move Barrett and picks for LaVine because I think it can prevent the Knicks from having to trade Quickley, etc, but his price tag will go up after last night.
He is also 30. His defensive rating was 120.2 (RJ is 117.1) and had a -35 on the season (compared to RJ-62) if you want to stick a measure on it. It was a give and take on the counting stats, where I wouldn't put Grant markedly better at anything but shooting %'s.
Lavine's knees scare the living piss out of me, not to mention the fit issues. He would either have to play SF or you bump Grimes there. Neither situation would be ideal, imo.
A couple of things. Grant isn’t 30, he just turned 29. LaVine or Grimes can play SF no problem in todays NBA. In fact I’m not opposed to grimes at SF and Quickley at SG long term. I think their length and defensive ability is more important than height. We could just stand pat and try for internal improvement year over year. That’s fine too.
I was just thinking about this- grimes at sf and quick at the 2. Hope they try that in preseason
joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:joec32033 wrote:Alpha1971 wrote:Would you trade RJ and picks for a sign and trade for Jeremi Grant ? Or make a trade for DeRozan or Jimmy Butler ?Butler and Derozan are too old. Grant isn't enough of an upgrade to warrant picks. He is probably on the same level as OG for me.
Just because the market got nuts doesn't mean they have to over pay for everything. I would rather not make a move than one that mortgages the next 5 years just to get to the 2nd round.
None of those players put the Knicks on a tier with the Bucks/Celtics. May even up the talent level with the top end talent of the Cavs a little bit. But,at least with Butler and Derozan, for how long?
Ok so you would do RJ for Grant one for one ? Butler and DD what if they give us 3 good seasons ? We would still have draft picks and free agency over the years to get another wing when their time is up
https://stathead.com/tiny/DmzoB
RJ and Grant are on the same level (Grant however is 7 years older). I would think the Knicks would deserve a little more all things considered. Derozan looked washed in SA for a minute before going nuts in Chicago. I'm not sure he has 3 years. Butler may give 3 years but I am not confident about it. I have been clear my opinion of RJ, but I'm going to be honest, if I am moving RJ I am trading up and not for a rental. Seriously sounds stupid but anyone over 25 or so wouldn't really be a coinsideration for me unless they were light years better and have some tread on the tires.
I compared RJ and Grant's stats and it's pretty clear Grant is better. RJ has better rebounding stats and slightly better assist stats. But, if I want to be a real stickler, I'd point out RJ has a higher useage and more turnovers. Grant averages more steals and blocks. I can also tell you that Grant was a MUCH better defensive player when his offensive role was decreased in Denver. RJ has the edge in defensive win shares, but he's been on better teams. Grants has a better defensive rating, which I think gives a better sense of individual performance. But to be honest, I'm not a big fan of either metric. I think the real point you want to make if you're defending RJ over Grant is that RJ is slightly better at this point in his career than Grant was at the same stage.