Knicks · We will win this series!! But if we don't... (page 2)
HofstraBBall wrote:Knixkik wrote:On the grimes topic for a minute. Grimes has underperformed offensively no question. Obviously his skill set is still useful though. My thought is this. I believe a package around Barrett, Rose and picks for LaVine is the way to go if it’s possible. LaVine starts at SF with grimes at SG, but Hart is essentially the SF. A lineup of Brunson, LaVine, Hart, Randle and Mitch/ Hartenstein to close games is really good. Grimes and Hart for 48 mins covers the opposing teams best perimeter player.Despite wanting an upgrade at SG prior to trade deadline, I still want to see how Grimes develops. My angle was that he was not ready short term for the playoffs due to lack of experience and proven track record. I am cool with seeing how he develops. But maybe up until the trade deadline.
Feel Lavine would be too costly of a piece that may not fit. Right now we have JB, RJ and Randle that play their best holding on to the ball and taking a lot of shots. Think RJ is the one I would like to see traded out but afraid I am undervaluing his abilities. Trading JB is not going to happen. Despite high usage and having blinders on sometimes, he is money under pressure. Randle can be traded but believe he represents decent value for an All Star who averages a double double and brings some physicality. Like IQ, like Grimes, Like Obi and like JHart but think we need more shooting. I am open to any cost effective upgrades that can shoot the ball and play some defense. Just not into bashing a player, ignoring their strengths and calling for them to be thrown out without a feasible replacement.
If Bulls were interested in a Randle + filler for Lavine we could upgrade our wings with Grimes and Lavine (defense and offense) and keep almost the same production Randle provided. We would def need more rebounding though - as Obi seems more and more like a 3 due to his limited rebounded and toughness. We could then use RJ (and Obi/picks) in a OG or M.Bridges + Cam Johnson type of deal. Idea would be to have 3-4 solid wings to pair with Brunson and a Mitch/Hartenstein type of big man.
Much easier to fill out the roster when you have 3-4 versatile/2way wings.
BigDaddyG wrote:Knixkik wrote:On the grimes topic for a minute. Grimes has underperformed offensively no question. Obviously his skill set is still useful though. My thought is this. I believe a package around Barrett, Rose and picks for LaVine is the way to go if it’s possible. LaVine starts at SF with grimes at SG, but Hart is essentially the SF. A lineup of Brunson, LaVine, Hart, Randle and Mitch/ Hartenstein to close games is really good. Grimes and Hart for 48 mins covers the opposing teams best perimeter player.Zach would be even worse at SF fulltime than RJ. Grimes is a good defender, but not enough to make for Randle, Lavine and Brunson. I think Grimes would have to go if you make that trade.
Whatever the trade you better make sure you have a cheap all world backup for Zach and those knees.
NYKBocker wrote:I still believe. We win game 6 and we good. Go Knicks!
Yeah,
game 7 too
It's one thing to be frustrated at Jules; it's another (unwise) thing to want him off the team. He will probably make his second all pro team in two years.
The answer is not dumping Jules. It's adding shooting and no one has locked down the 2 or 3 spot. I like RJ and Grimes but if we can get a major upgrade at 2 or 3 that's where we need it.
one could argue 5 spot too but to me that's lesser importance at the moment. We need shooting (drawing the distinction from scoring)
HofstraBBall wrote:We will win at home and take the next game in Miami. Several of the Heat no name shooters will come back to earth once they feel some true pressure.
Thus far, we have had three games in which the Knicks have not played well. Having multiple guys that can't hit open looks. We have JR, IQ, Grimes, JB playing at a lower level than during the year. Not exactly putting pressure on these lesser known names. If our guys turn it around and start making shots, that will change.IF we don't turn it around... think we need an upgrade at SG, a true Number ONE and last but not least, an assistant coach that pushes more ball movement.
1) Love Grimes but we need a guy with has more experience and can flat out shoot. Having a second year guy backed up by a hustle guy, who struggles shooting, is not what you need from your SG spot if you want to go deep in the playoffs.
2) We need a true number one who is a next level player and relishes high pressure situations. Someone who can overcome all the defensive adjustments. Hate to say it but we did not need DM to beat the Cavs but we needed DM to beat the Heat or other higher level teams. Think JB was that during year but against the top teams defensive attention, he is slightly limited physically.
3)Our offense is one dimensional. Always played for good coaches who preached attacking the weak side with ball movement. The theory being that you can't have success trying to score against the first defensive position of the defense. (Strong side) You have to attack the strong side, get the defense to converge then swing the ball around and attack the weak side. If you look at the Heat, they do that extremely well. Drive to strong side, kick out, then swing one or two passes to open players. We have JB, Randle and RJ, our big three, who are called to Iso and attack the strong side. As much as Randle turns the ball over, he is actually the only one out of the three who looks to kick it out to start ball rotation. We need an offensive minded assistant coach who preaches that mindset and keeps the ball from sticking. While still keeping Thibs tough defensive approach.
Will add that despite my call for better ball movement, coaches can't make the shots. The Knicks have shot terribly throughout the playoffs. So too much emphasis on what coaches can do to change our recent outcome would be ignoring that.Imho, we need the above if we want to make deep runs in the playoffs.
As well as ALL our remaining players to improve their many weaknesses.
Knicks vastly exceed expectations and you want to make changes? I think it's far more likely that one of RJ IQ or Grimes pops than a mysterious "true number one option" (who that's supposed to be is always unnamed) comes in to save the day.
I'm very much against any proposals to remake the rotation over the summer based on losing to a team that knocked off the presumptive favorite to win the championship all season. Knicks are still young with key players like Hart Grimes and Robinson making their playoff debut. Knicks control all their major players and should get significant cap room to keep them going forward after Rose and Fournier's contracts expire.
Knicks also showed considerable improvement in Game 4, hanging with the Heat most of the game. To quote Giannis "Just because you lost, doesn't mean you failed." If we get blown out tonight, it's still been a great season to build on for next year.
BigRedDog wrote:Sorry but we aren't winning this series. I don't think we are even winning game 5 and definitely not game 6. This team is mentally defeated, just look at Randle, his words and actions.
Agreed. This series is over. The Knicks even lost the game they won, if that was possible.
Knicks after mostly a healthy reg season are banged up. Heat after a mostly unhealthy season are not.
Heat play great defense and well coached. They do a great job closing passing lanes. We don't pass much anyway, and they are making knicks go very Iso.
They are letting us play to our weakness. We are not executing what they are giving us.
Dudes: It's darkest before the dawn! We win tonight. Miami regresses to the mean some as do we. Grimes Obi and IQ can't suck forever
Chandler wrote:
Dudes: It's darkest before the dawn! We win tonight. Miami regresses to the mean some as do we. Grimes Obi and IQ can't suck forever
I'll be watching as I do. If they die, they die. Its been a great year. Jules was an allstar. Not all NBA caliber. Can carry team on some nights.
RJ been sneaky steady. They all part of the family, even Jules.
Nalod wrote:Chandler wrote:
Dudes: It's darkest before the dawn! We win tonight. Miami regresses to the mean some as do we. Grimes Obi and IQ can't suck foreverI'll be watching as I do. If they die, they die. Its been a great year. Jules was an allstar. Not all NBA caliber. Can carry team on some nights.
RJ been sneaky steady. They all part of the family, even Jules.
I've heard Barkley say more than once he thinks Jules will be all nba again. Why not?
gradyandrew wrote:HofstraBBall wrote:We will win at home and take the next game in Miami. Several of the Heat no name shooters will come back to earth once they feel some true pressure.
Thus far, we have had three games in which the Knicks have not played well. Having multiple guys that can't hit open looks. We have JR, IQ, Grimes, JB playing at a lower level than during the year. Not exactly putting pressure on these lesser known names. If our guys turn it around and start making shots, that will change.IF we don't turn it around... think we need an upgrade at SG, a true Number ONE and last but not least, an assistant coach that pushes more ball movement.
1) Love Grimes but we need a guy with has more experience and can flat out shoot. Having a second year guy backed up by a hustle guy, who struggles shooting, is not what you need from your SG spot if you want to go deep in the playoffs.
2) We need a true number one who is a next level player and relishes high pressure situations. Someone who can overcome all the defensive adjustments. Hate to say it but we did not need DM to beat the Cavs but we needed DM to beat the Heat or other higher level teams. Think JB was that during year but against the top teams defensive attention, he is slightly limited physically.
3)Our offense is one dimensional. Always played for good coaches who preached attacking the weak side with ball movement. The theory being that you can't have success trying to score against the first defensive position of the defense. (Strong side) You have to attack the strong side, get the defense to converge then swing the ball around and attack the weak side. If you look at the Heat, they do that extremely well. Drive to strong side, kick out, then swing one or two passes to open players. We have JB, Randle and RJ, our big three, who are called to Iso and attack the strong side. As much as Randle turns the ball over, he is actually the only one out of the three who looks to kick it out to start ball rotation. We need an offensive minded assistant coach who preaches that mindset and keeps the ball from sticking. While still keeping Thibs tough defensive approach.
Will add that despite my call for better ball movement, coaches can't make the shots. The Knicks have shot terribly throughout the playoffs. So too much emphasis on what coaches can do to change our recent outcome would be ignoring that.Imho, we need the above if we want to make deep runs in the playoffs.
As well as ALL our remaining players to improve their many weaknesses.
Knicks vastly exceed expectations and you want to make changes? I think it's far more likely that one of RJ IQ or Grimes pops than a mysterious "true number one option" (who that's supposed to be is always unnamed) comes in to save the day.I'm very much against any proposals to remake the rotation over the summer based on losing to a team that knocked off the presumptive favorite to win the championship all season. Knicks are still young with key players like Hart Grimes and Robinson making their playoff debut. Knicks control all their major players and should get significant cap room to keep them going forward after Rose and Fournier's contracts expire.
Knicks also showed considerable improvement in Game 4, hanging with the Heat most of the game. To quote Giannis "Just because you lost, doesn't mean you failed." If we get blown out tonight, it's still been a great season to build on for next year.
Would agree. Not complaining about where we are or what we did.
Post based on how do we become a team that can go deeper.
Okay waiting to see how some progress while adding some smaller pieces.
Where that number one comes from, you are right, no one knows. Think the FO will be looking though.
Just stating it's obvious we need one.
Probably the smaller move that FO will try to do is the addition of better shooters.
Adding a SF or SG, I feel will happen.
Do feel the FO and coaching staff see some redundancy with RJ, JB and JR.
HofstraBBall wrote:gradyandrew wrote:HofstraBBall wrote:We will win at home and take the next game in Miami. Several of the Heat no name shooters will come back to earth once they feel some true pressure.
Thus far, we have had three games in which the Knicks have not played well. Having multiple guys that can't hit open looks. We have JR, IQ, Grimes, JB playing at a lower level than during the year. Not exactly putting pressure on these lesser known names. If our guys turn it around and start making shots, that will change.IF we don't turn it around... think we need an upgrade at SG, a true Number ONE and last but not least, an assistant coach that pushes more ball movement.
1) Love Grimes but we need a guy with has more experience and can flat out shoot. Having a second year guy backed up by a hustle guy, who struggles shooting, is not what you need from your SG spot if you want to go deep in the playoffs.
2) We need a true number one who is a next level player and relishes high pressure situations. Someone who can overcome all the defensive adjustments. Hate to say it but we did not need DM to beat the Cavs but we needed DM to beat the Heat or other higher level teams. Think JB was that during year but against the top teams defensive attention, he is slightly limited physically.
3)Our offense is one dimensional. Always played for good coaches who preached attacking the weak side with ball movement. The theory being that you can't have success trying to score against the first defensive position of the defense. (Strong side) You have to attack the strong side, get the defense to converge then swing the ball around and attack the weak side. If you look at the Heat, they do that extremely well. Drive to strong side, kick out, then swing one or two passes to open players. We have JB, Randle and RJ, our big three, who are called to Iso and attack the strong side. As much as Randle turns the ball over, he is actually the only one out of the three who looks to kick it out to start ball rotation. We need an offensive minded assistant coach who preaches that mindset and keeps the ball from sticking. While still keeping Thibs tough defensive approach.
Will add that despite my call for better ball movement, coaches can't make the shots. The Knicks have shot terribly throughout the playoffs. So too much emphasis on what coaches can do to change our recent outcome would be ignoring that.Imho, we need the above if we want to make deep runs in the playoffs.
As well as ALL our remaining players to improve their many weaknesses.
Knicks vastly exceed expectations and you want to make changes? I think it's far more likely that one of RJ IQ or Grimes pops than a mysterious "true number one option" (who that's supposed to be is always unnamed) comes in to save the day.I'm very much against any proposals to remake the rotation over the summer based on losing to a team that knocked off the presumptive favorite to win the championship all season. Knicks are still young with key players like Hart Grimes and Robinson making their playoff debut. Knicks control all their major players and should get significant cap room to keep them going forward after Rose and Fournier's contracts expire.
Knicks also showed considerable improvement in Game 4, hanging with the Heat most of the game. To quote Giannis "Just because you lost, doesn't mean you failed." If we get blown out tonight, it's still been a great season to build on for next year.
Would agree. Not complaining about where we are or what we did.
Post based on how do we become a team that can go deeper.
Okay waiting to see how some progress while adding some smaller pieces.
Where that number one comes from, you are right, no one knows. Think the FO will be looking though.
Just stating it's obvious we need one.
Probably the smaller move that FO will try to do is the addition of better shooters.
Adding a SF or SG, I feel will happen.Do feel the FO and coaching staff see some redundancy with RJ, JB and JR.
I think you have to keep an eye on Toronto. What do they do with Siakam, Trent Jr., VanVleet and Anunoby. Do they do a rebuild?
Rookie wrote:HofstraBBall wrote:gradyandrew wrote:HofstraBBall wrote:We will win at home and take the next game in Miami. Several of the Heat no name shooters will come back to earth once they feel some true pressure.
Thus far, we have had three games in which the Knicks have not played well. Having multiple guys that can't hit open looks. We have JR, IQ, Grimes, JB playing at a lower level than during the year. Not exactly putting pressure on these lesser known names. If our guys turn it around and start making shots, that will change.IF we don't turn it around... think we need an upgrade at SG, a true Number ONE and last but not least, an assistant coach that pushes more ball movement.
1) Love Grimes but we need a guy with has more experience and can flat out shoot. Having a second year guy backed up by a hustle guy, who struggles shooting, is not what you need from your SG spot if you want to go deep in the playoffs.
2) We need a true number one who is a next level player and relishes high pressure situations. Someone who can overcome all the defensive adjustments. Hate to say it but we did not need DM to beat the Cavs but we needed DM to beat the Heat or other higher level teams. Think JB was that during year but against the top teams defensive attention, he is slightly limited physically.
3)Our offense is one dimensional. Always played for good coaches who preached attacking the weak side with ball movement. The theory being that you can't have success trying to score against the first defensive position of the defense. (Strong side) You have to attack the strong side, get the defense to converge then swing the ball around and attack the weak side. If you look at the Heat, they do that extremely well. Drive to strong side, kick out, then swing one or two passes to open players. We have JB, Randle and RJ, our big three, who are called to Iso and attack the strong side. As much as Randle turns the ball over, he is actually the only one out of the three who looks to kick it out to start ball rotation. We need an offensive minded assistant coach who preaches that mindset and keeps the ball from sticking. While still keeping Thibs tough defensive approach.
Will add that despite my call for better ball movement, coaches can't make the shots. The Knicks have shot terribly throughout the playoffs. So too much emphasis on what coaches can do to change our recent outcome would be ignoring that.Imho, we need the above if we want to make deep runs in the playoffs.
As well as ALL our remaining players to improve their many weaknesses.
Knicks vastly exceed expectations and you want to make changes? I think it's far more likely that one of RJ IQ or Grimes pops than a mysterious "true number one option" (who that's supposed to be is always unnamed) comes in to save the day.I'm very much against any proposals to remake the rotation over the summer based on losing to a team that knocked off the presumptive favorite to win the championship all season. Knicks are still young with key players like Hart Grimes and Robinson making their playoff debut. Knicks control all their major players and should get significant cap room to keep them going forward after Rose and Fournier's contracts expire.
Knicks also showed considerable improvement in Game 4, hanging with the Heat most of the game. To quote Giannis "Just because you lost, doesn't mean you failed." If we get blown out tonight, it's still been a great season to build on for next year.
Would agree. Not complaining about where we are or what we did.
Post based on how do we become a team that can go deeper.
Okay waiting to see how some progress while adding some smaller pieces.
Where that number one comes from, you are right, no one knows. Think the FO will be looking though.
Just stating it's obvious we need one.
Probably the smaller move that FO will try to do is the addition of better shooters.
Adding a SF or SG, I feel will happen.Do feel the FO and coaching staff see some redundancy with RJ, JB and JR.
I think you have to keep an eye on Toronto. What do they do with Siakam, Trent Jr., VanVleet and Anunoby. Do they do a rebuild?
Rumors Massai could sniff out Wiz position? If so, does Raptors really blow it up?
Nalodian observation: Everything looks so damn hard. Brunson has to dance for 15 seconds to get a shot off, and Randle has to think about it, then juke and jab, then fade away shot.
Is it me or is RJ hitting more and more hard shots now? Some fade aways? Chess bully on the right side?
I'd do a Siakim for Randle thing. Not sure what else we have to give up but if it helps more sunlight in to the yoots, then perhaps its a net win.
Panos wrote:BigRedDog wrote:Sorry but we aren't winning this series. I don't think we are even winning game 5 and definitely not game 6. This team is mentally defeated, just look at Randle, his words and actions.Agreed. This series is over. The Knicks even lost the game they won, if that was possible.
You two missed a good game.
One down, one to go. Then we take it at home.
No names came back down to earth (30% from 3) and will feel even more pressure next two games.
All the bitchin bout Randle (Jackals had their day) yet he is 15 for 25 last two games.
JB won't let us lose.
RJ played well.
We now need our bench to wake up.
All the naysayers, keep movin.
LivingLegend wrote:Ok Hofstra - I’m going with you on this.
Still alive
HofstraBBall wrote:Panos wrote:BigRedDog wrote:Sorry but we aren't winning this series. I don't think we are even winning game 5 and definitely not game 6. This team is mentally defeated, just look at Randle, his words and actions.Agreed. This series is over. The Knicks even lost the game they won, if that was possible.
You two missed a good game.
One down, one to go. Then we take it at home.
No names came back down to earth (30% from 3) and will feel even more pressure next two games.All the bitchin bout Randle (Jackals had their day) yet he is 15 for 25 last two games.
JB won't let us lose.
RJ played well.
We now need our bench to wake up.All the naysayers, keep movin.
Knicks down 10 at end of Q1 as Julius hits bench after another brutal quarter of play.
Obi enters - Knicks go on 13-0 run to stabilize the game.
I thought Julius was sucky tonight - we are lucky Love went 0-7 on the wide open 3’s he took.
LivingLegend wrote:HofstraBBall wrote:Panos wrote:BigRedDog wrote:Sorry but we aren't winning this series. I don't think we are even winning game 5 and definitely not game 6. This team is mentally defeated, just look at Randle, his words and actions.Agreed. This series is over. The Knicks even lost the game they won, if that was possible.
You two missed a good game.
One down, one to go. Then we take it at home.
No names came back down to earth (30% from 3) and will feel even more pressure next two games.All the bitchin bout Randle (Jackals had their day) yet he is 15 for 25 last two games.
JB won't let us lose.
RJ played well.
We now need our bench to wake up.All the naysayers, keep movin.
Knicks down 10 at end of Q1 as Julius hits bench after another brutal quarter of play.
Obi enters - Knicks go on 13-0 run to stabilize the game.
I thought Julius was sucky tonight - we are lucky Love went 0-7 on the wide open 3’s he took.
Yep, Obi saved the day. Randle's 4-7 and getting to the line did not compare.
Agree though. Randle started slow. Hit some threes and got to the line in the third.
JB getting hot was the difference. But you are right, Obi was on the floor during that. He also got a couple of rebounds.
Obi was also on the floor when we lost the big lead.
Hoping both Randle and Obi do well next game. We need them both.
Also hoping IQ is back and gets it going along with Grimes.