I say the answer is a 100% chance of no. The players and picks required are just not there. Miami's package is not even worth considering for a team wanting to rebuild and giving up a HOF Allstar player. Even if the Nets will help by taking on Hero, it's still not even worth discussing for Portland. Even if Lillard sits out I don't see how that can harm Portland, call it a stealth tank. Time is going to be on Portland's side. I don't think even the players union has a leg to stand on with Lillard demanding only the Miami Heat and Goodwin, his agent, telling teams if they trade for Lillard, he won't show up. Even League President Silver can't support such a position as much of a box office draw Lillard's star power has.
However, I do see a path. Miami is going to have to awake to the reality of moving Jimmy Buttler to acquire the necessary picks and young players for a Portland deal. This would allow them to at least keep Adabayo and build from there. Ah, but this is not so fun for Miami you say? Yes but it is the reality they are in. I don't expect Portland to be under any pressure to give Lillard away for any deal that hurts the franchise and sets them back. It's just business.
Rookie wrote:I say the answer is a 100% chance of no. The players and picks required are just not there. Miami's package is not even worth considering for a team wanting to rebuild and giving up a HOF Allstar player. Even if the Nets will help by taking on Hero, it's still not even worth discussing for Portland. Even if Lillard sits out I don't see how that can harm Portland, call it a stealth tank. Time is going to be on Portland's side. I don't think even the players union has a leg to stand on with Lillard demanding only the Miami Heat and Goodwin, his agent, telling teams if they trade for Lillard, he won't show up. Even League President Silver can't support such a position as much of a box office draw Lillard's star power has. However, I do see a path. Miami is going to have to awake to the reality of moving Jimmy Buttler to acquire the necessary picks and young players for a Portland deal. This would allow them to at least keep Adabayo and build from there. Ah, but this is not so fun for Miami you say? Yes but it is the reality they are in. I don't expect Portland to be under any pressure to give Lillard away for any deal that hurts the franchise and sets them back. It's just business.
Honestly, I hope you are right. I think he ends up in San Antonio next to Wemby. Give Wemby some breathing room and some easy buckets. Extra assists. Its best for everyone if he goes to play in San Antonio and helps Wemby become a star.
I hope not. It’s not good for the league and Portland shouldn’t be forced to take a package they don’t want. KD to the suns was different because of the great package they were had and were willing to move. Not the case here. The best asset the heat have is Martin at this current point.
Sick of the super friends bullshit. Only positive is mostly they spit the bit.
I've honestly lost all respect for Dame and I hope he realizes that ring will be another tainted and cheap KD type ring that means shit. But if he is traded to another team and he refuses to report, his contract should be voided and he should be banned from the league.
I likewise hope that he can't force his way to Miami without Riley and the Heat having to give up fair assets.
These players get obscene, generational wealth to play ball. Maybe total free agency- like at will employment for the rest of us- would be good for player movement- but I think the union wants to spread the wealth a bit, as opposed to a player like LeBron being able to get $100M a year to play for a team, which he would with no cap and salary structure.
League parity- at least how it has been structured, I think has worked well.
Dame traded the ability to move anywhere for the obscene wealth he is going to continue to accrue. Maybe he could agree to a buyout? I mean, could he let Portland and agree to take a $1 instead?
Sit him at home and don't pay him
franco12 wrote:I likewise hope that he can't force his way to Miami without Riley and the Heat having to give up fair assets.
These players get obscene, generational wealth to play ball. Maybe total free agency- like at will employment for the rest of us- would be good for player movement- but I think the union wants to spread the wealth a bit, as opposed to a player like LeBron being able to get $100M a year to play for a team, which he would with no cap and salary structure.
League parity- at least how it has been structured, I think has worked well.
Dame traded the ability to move anywhere for the obscene wealth he is going to continue to accrue. Maybe he could agree to a buyout? I mean, could he let Portland and agree to take a $1 instead?
What about the owners who don't even play but make a huge profit when they sell? MJ paid 275 million for Hornets and then resold for a 2 billion profit. I'd argue that Dame had more to do with that price increase than Jordan. Dame has done far more to raise the value of the league than anything Jordan did as owner. Plotkin isn't paying 3 billion for the Hornets; he's paying to get into the NBA.
Paul Allen died in 2018 and his will specifically called for the trailblazers to be sold and the money used for charity. Instead his sister has willfully refused to carry out her duties and the franchise is in limbo as a result. Selling the team with or without Dame is pretty big for franchise value. Who knows what her plan is.
gradyandrew wrote:franco12 wrote:I likewise hope that he can't force his way to Miami without Riley and the Heat having to give up fair assets.
These players get obscene, generational wealth to play ball. Maybe total free agency- like at will employment for the rest of us- would be good for player movement- but I think the union wants to spread the wealth a bit, as opposed to a player like LeBron being able to get $100M a year to play for a team, which he would with no cap and salary structure.
League parity- at least how it has been structured, I think has worked well.
Dame traded the ability to move anywhere for the obscene wealth he is going to continue to accrue. Maybe he could agree to a buyout? I mean, could he let Portland and agree to take a $1 instead?
What about the owners who don't even play but make a huge profit when they sell? MJ paid 275 million for Hornets and then resold for a 2 billion profit. I'd argue that Dame had more to do with that price increase than Jordan. Dame has done far more to raise the value of the league than anything Jordan did as owner. Plotkin isn't paying 3 billion for the Hornets; he's paying to get into the NBA.
Paul Allen died in 2018 and his will specifically called for the trailblazers to be sold and the money used for charity. Instead his sister has willfully refused to carry out her duties and the franchise is in limbo as a result. Selling the team with or without Dame is pretty big for franchise value. Who knows what her plan is.
I agree with you! And it is why I think the players should jettison the owners and create a players league. They could raise debt to finance the needed transition and the owners would be left with nothing.
But- in the current situation, if you take long term security, you are giving up the option to play somewhere else.
Miami is still not willing to either include Adebayo or trade Butler for the assets they need to make a trade work. And they are wondering why Portland will not engage? Miami lost all leverage when the commissioner came out and smacked Millard's agent on the pee pee and the players association is dead quiet as expected. If Lillard sits out, Portland saves his max salary and it helps the tank. Miami is going to have to fill out the roster with scraps and no one is going to shed a tear around here for Riley. That roster is paper thin and they are projected ahead of us in the power ranking, I don't think so. The only whining is coming from Miami beat writers at this point.
Barry Jackson: Per source, Portland has remained disinclined to engage Heat in serious trade discussions on Lillard. Blazers acting disinterested about dealing him here. One would think Blazers would get serious about this at some point, but they’re still not engaging Miami in negotiations
KnickDanger wrote:Sick of the super friends bullshit. Only positive is mostly they spit the bit.
me too. Its not how the sport was when I fell in love with it.
I do love what we are building. I think this year is a big test. Year 4 following a 2nd round playoff. Basically running it back and looking to improve from within, Really curious and excited to see where we stand vs. the rest of the NBA. We have a formula and a roster to support it. Now it's measuring stick time.
franco12 wrote:gradyandrew wrote:franco12 wrote:I likewise hope that he can't force his way to Miami without Riley and the Heat having to give up fair assets.
These players get obscene, generational wealth to play ball. Maybe total free agency- like at will employment for the rest of us- would be good for player movement- but I think the union wants to spread the wealth a bit, as opposed to a player like LeBron being able to get $100M a year to play for a team, which he would with no cap and salary structure.
League parity- at least how it has been structured, I think has worked well.
Dame traded the ability to move anywhere for the obscene wealth he is going to continue to accrue. Maybe he could agree to a buyout? I mean, could he let Portland and agree to take a $1 instead?
What about the owners who don't even play but make a huge profit when they sell? MJ paid 275 million for Hornets and then resold for a 2 billion profit. I'd argue that Dame had more to do with that price increase than Jordan. Dame has done far more to raise the value of the league than anything Jordan did as owner. Plotkin isn't paying 3 billion for the Hornets; he's paying to get into the NBA.
Paul Allen died in 2018 and his will specifically called for the trailblazers to be sold and the money used for charity. Instead his sister has willfully refused to carry out her duties and the franchise is in limbo as a result. Selling the team with or without Dame is pretty big for franchise value. Who knows what her plan is.
I agree with you! And it is why I think the players should jettison the owners and create a players league. They could raise debt to finance the needed transition and the owners would be left with nothing.
But- in the current situation, if you take long term security, you are giving up the option to play somewhere else.
Wasn't there a movie about this recently? The big holdback us our tribal loyalty as fans which is no transferable. The only way it would work is if through collective action the players got together with private equity for a leveraged buy out. I think I read recently about a proposed law that whenever ownership wants to sell out, workers should get government funding to enact a buy out. The problem is, all changes in ownership require board approval and as soon as one team did it, the rest of the league would quickly follow suit. Owners would never approve it.
Now, a public/ private partnership- where municipalities could co- own franchises might be a more popular way to enact real change. Portland would be an ideal candidate for that kind of experiment.
LOL, the whining is getting louder. I just checked the Trailblazers season ticket website and I see tickets have gone on sale. The website is promoting 'Are You Ready For The Next Chapter' and features a picture of Anfernee Simons. Looks like they are already moving on and trading Lillard is just an eventuality. Even if he shows up I doubt that he will be allowed to play and risk injury. Looks like Lillard and Fournier have more in common than I ever thought possible
Aaron Fentress: I’m told that if he ends up back in camp, he would show up and play. He’s gonna get his money. I mean, he’s not that dumb. But if you play him a twisted ankle or has a calf thing again, or Lord knows what now what are you going to get for him? And if you end up keeping him for the entire season, what are you going to get, three or four first-round picks and something for a 34-year-old Damian Lillard coming off another year with another type of nagging injury? – via Apple Podcasts
league is handling it well in my opinion in that they will back Portland as not to be strong armed into a bad deal.
As for Dame, I give him a pass as its his first gaff and he seemed to have done well with most things up until now.
My take is his agent is "handling it" and will take the heat. Thats why they get paid.
That whole notion of "wanting to play for a winner" is total hype when a guy takes the extension fully knowing the team is handicapped to what can be done. He has 4 years left on is deal and the bottom line is did the team try to accommodate him as much as reasonable. He needs to give a list of 5 teams and give Blazers an opportunity to get a deal done.
he could have left his deal expire and created his freedom. He took the money instead.
Best thing to do is pledge to play and show he is healthy and ready to go. Be a professional. My take is at the end of the day this does not get ugly and he preserves his image.
His agent will take the fall and thats OK.
I'd like to think Dame has integrity like that. Lets see how it plays out.
I still fully expect Dame to end up with the cHeat. Whiney and modern NBA players always get their way. Only hope would be for Adam Silver to veto any and every trade to Miami. That would really send these baby players a message you signed a contract and you're in essence an asset. You do not get to choose where the hell you go with you are under contract! Being a FA is a different thing. Go sign with any team you like for whatever money you can get. Otherwise, STFU and play!
SergioNYK wrote:I still fully expect Dame to end up with the cHeat. Whiney and modern NBA players always get their way. Only hope would be for Adam Silver to veto any and every trade to Miami. That would really send these baby players a message you signed a contract and you're in essence an asset. You do not get to choose where the hell you go with you are under contract! Being a FA is a different thing. Go sign with any team you like for whatever money you can get. Otherwise, STFU and play!
Reality is players do want to move but there is way to do it properly and perhaps with grace.
Vince Carter leaving Toronto as he did was not cool, nor has Harden always handled it well PUBLICALLY.
But I agree you sign a contract your bound to it. If a player has leverage and wishes to relocate thats OK but the team gets compensated.
I don't blame Dame for trying and his agent is doing his job. But with it comes the public fall out and if he wants to protect his image he needs to temper it down a bit.
Nalod wrote:SergioNYK wrote:I still fully expect Dame to end up with the cHeat. Whiney and modern NBA players always get their way. Only hope would be for Adam Silver to veto any and every trade to Miami. That would really send these baby players a message you signed a contract and you're in essence an asset. You do not get to choose where the hell you go with you are under contract! Being a FA is a different thing. Go sign with any team you like for whatever money you can get. Otherwise, STFU and play!
Reality is players do want to move but there is way to do it properly and perhaps with grace.
Vince Carter leaving Toronto as he did was not cool, nor has Harden always handled it well PUBLICALLY.
But I agree you sign a contract your bound to it. If a player has leverage and wishes to relocate thats OK but the team gets compensated.
I don't blame Dame for trying and his agent is doing his job. But with it comes the public fall out and if he wants to protect his image he needs to temper it down a bit.
Isn't this similar to the Aaron Rodgers situation last year. No one had a problem with Aaron wanting out after they essentially drafted his replacement instead getting more immediate help. Is the issue that Dame is angling for one team or that the team is Miami? Vince pretty much dogged his way out of Toronto and that left a bad taste. I don't think what Dame has done so far rises to that level. His career is nearing it's end and he wants to compete. I don't think he gives a phuck about his image at this point. Now the money on the other hand...
BigDaddyG wrote:Nalod wrote:SergioNYK wrote:I still fully expect Dame to end up with the cHeat. Whiney and modern NBA players always get their way. Only hope would be for Adam Silver to veto any and every trade to Miami. That would really send these baby players a message you signed a contract and you're in essence an asset. You do not get to choose where the hell you go with you are under contract! Being a FA is a different thing. Go sign with any team you like for whatever money you can get. Otherwise, STFU and play!
Reality is players do want to move but there is way to do it properly and perhaps with grace.
Vince Carter leaving Toronto as he did was not cool, nor has Harden always handled it well PUBLICALLY.
But I agree you sign a contract your bound to it. If a player has leverage and wishes to relocate thats OK but the team gets compensated.
I don't blame Dame for trying and his agent is doing his job. But with it comes the public fall out and if he wants to protect his image he needs to temper it down a bit.
Isn't this similar to the Aaron Rodgers situation last year. No one had a problem with Aaron wanting out after they essentially drafted his replacement instead getting more immediate help. Is the issue that Dame is angling for one team or that the team is Miami? Vince pretty much dogged his way out of Toronto and that left a bad taste. I don't think what Dame has done so far rises to that level. His career is nearing it's end and he wants to compete. I don't think he gives a phuck about his image at this point. Now the money on the other hand...
I mean, for starters, Rodgers is a nutbag and his legacy isn't really impacted by a trade demand to one of the worst teams in the league, specifically where that team had assets it could trade for a 39 year old QB. The NFL pretty much supports old QBs changing teams to win championships with teams that didn't otherwise seem ready (See Manning and Brady).
Lillard built his legacy on loyalty and has a strong reputation as a team player. So, the reputational cost is just much higher because his demand to leave his team is only to the team that just made the Finals and doesn't really have the assets to pay what most of us would deem fair market value for his trade. So, he is trying to trade the reputation for a lower return for his original team. And he might get his wish, but it costs him his reputation. The only issue I see is that by limiting his team to 1 team that made the finals last year and doesn't really have assets to pay fair compensation AND having his agent taint to the pool, he used up that good guy reputation pretty quick. Maybe he got bad advice. Maybe he got emotional. But he slammed a lot of doors to try and get what he wanted and it might not work. So, now he is stuck in Portland for the time being and it feels like he is one step away from eating a tub of vaseline. Not sure there is another player that ripped their brand apart so fast.
EwingsGlass wrote:BigDaddyG wrote:Nalod wrote:SergioNYK wrote:I still fully expect Dame to end up with the cHeat. Whiney and modern NBA players always get their way. Only hope would be for Adam Silver to veto any and every trade to Miami. That would really send these baby players a message you signed a contract and you're in essence an asset. You do not get to choose where the hell you go with you are under contract! Being a FA is a different thing. Go sign with any team you like for whatever money you can get. Otherwise, STFU and play!
Reality is players do want to move but there is way to do it properly and perhaps with grace.
Vince Carter leaving Toronto as he did was not cool, nor has Harden always handled it well PUBLICALLY.
But I agree you sign a contract your bound to it. If a player has leverage and wishes to relocate thats OK but the team gets compensated.
I don't blame Dame for trying and his agent is doing his job. But with it comes the public fall out and if he wants to protect his image he needs to temper it down a bit.
Isn't this similar to the Aaron Rodgers situation last year. No one had a problem with Aaron wanting out after they essentially drafted his replacement instead getting more immediate help. Is the issue that Dame is angling for one team or that the team is Miami? Vince pretty much dogged his way out of Toronto and that left a bad taste. I don't think what Dame has done so far rises to that level. His career is nearing it's end and he wants to compete. I don't think he gives a phuck about his image at this point. Now the money on the other hand...
I mean, for starters, Rodgers is a nutbag and his legacy isn't really impacted by a trade demand to one of the worst teams in the league, specifically where that team had assets it could trade for a 39 year old QB. The NFL pretty much supports old QBs changing teams to win championships with teams that didn't otherwise seem ready (See Manning and Brady).
Lillard built his legacy on loyalty and has a strong reputation as a team player. So, the reputational cost is just much higher because his demand to leave his team is only to the team that just made the Finals and doesn't really have the assets to pay what most of us would deem fair market value for his trade. So, he is trying to trade the reputation for a lower return for his original team. And he might get his wish, but it costs him his reputation. The only issue I see is that by limiting his team to 1 team that made the finals last year and doesn't really have assets to pay fair compensation AND having his agent taint to the pool, he used up that good guy reputation pretty quick. Maybe he got bad advice. Maybe he got emotional. But he slammed a lot of doors to try and get what he wanted and it might not work. So, now he is stuck in Portland for the time being and it feels like he is one step away from eating a tub of vaseline. Not sure there is another player that ripped their brand apart so fast.
I don't think he's that far gone, but I would watch that shit if it happened. 
I don't buy the argument about this dinging his legacy too much. It's the timing of the move that makes more in line with the Garnett and Ray Allen maneuverings than the KD shenanigans. Dame wants a title chance late in his career. It happens all the time. People have been wondering for years when Dame would force his way out and the Blazers have been steadily building their roster up with young guards. That's an indication right there that your employer is pushing you out the door. Lillard built his legacy on being damn good. A future HOFer. Now, did he and is agent handle this the wrong way? Yeah. He's signed to a multi-year deal and he's old. I'm sure they felt some measure of desperation, but they simply have no leverage.
So many scoffed at the Beal trade initially but I ended up pretty impressed.
I think they ultimately ended up with ~ Poole, Shamet, 2030 1st, 4 1st round swaps and 7 seconds - not awful IMO.
Key to Dame trade is what can Portland get for Herro and can they also get C Martin because I think they’ll get whatever picks Heat can give.
I’m a Herro fan - Portland should fight to get more than say a lotto protected 1 for him or just keep him - he’s a bucket.
Its entirely about Lillard convincing the Heat that he's worth the King's ransom. Thats the only way this trade will likely happen. Portland isnt doing Lillard any favors when it comes to a trade. Not like Garnett to Boston.
I dont believe Dame's rep will take a hit in Portland. Been there too long, is considered a pillar of the community. Employs a lot of people. They know the clock is ticking on Lillard having enough left in the tank to win as a starter.
