fishmike wrote:KP? Really? 
KP on a superior team now looks great and since he verbally said nice things he could have been had.
No thoughts to his salary and how that would have fit. would it have affected DDV deal?
Does Holiday have anything to do with Bostons rise this year? You betcha.
Just plug and play and we would have not needed OG?
OG might have missed a lot of games, but KP's don't count?
Do we in fact know if knicks talked to Wiz about KP? or not?
nycericanguy wrote:martin wrote:nycericanguy wrote:martin wrote:nycericanguy wrote:C is also upgradable but because we value defense and rim protection there arent many C's that can do both. KP was really the only one that fit that criteria and we didn't seem interested for whatever odd reason.So SG seems like the best position to upgrade and easiest as you can get away with a dropoff in defense there.
Prob stuck to your reasoning of too injury prone.
but we went after OG who has played even fewer games the past 5 seasons so that doesn't compute for me.
I mean it's all about price and fit. Our C depth is great, could have easily withstood 20-25 missed games from KP. And of course he was dirt cheap.
But trading RJ & IQ makes it hard to withstand those missed games from OG.
Could you imagine
KP
Randle
OG
DDV
Brunson
Now that team could have low key won it all and of course BOS wouldn't have been as formidable.
This FO has been great, but the Obi pick, the CAM trade, and not going after KP are 3 things I still can't wrap my head around.
That's on you, there are PLENTY of really easy reasons you keep purposely ignoring.
You put KP and OG into the same category of injury and that's insane.
we're very likely to watch BOS win the chip this year, with Tatum even saying KP was the missing piece for them.
This FO has largely done a great job, but I'm not going to blindly support everything they do/dont do.
KP going to our division rival BOS for #35 pick and Tyus Jones, after openly stating he would love to come back to NY, while we sat on a boatload of assets was a massive fail that some just don't want to acknowledge for some reason.
The CAM trade was largely inconsequential, but the Obi pick... KP... that's franchise altering.
Knicks identity is largely formed by their C duo. It's not a given that KP makes us better than the Mitch/iHart tandem. We beat the crap out of teams and dominate the offensive boards. That's what we do, and how we win. That goes a way to a large degree by adding a skinny 3 point shooting C.
We have seen how delicate this team's M-O is, it's why Thibs wouldn't play Fournier, or Obi, and it's why Bogs looks like a fish out of water on this team so far. Mixing Randle/KP has potential to backfire in general and messing with our Center duo and offensive rebounding dominance also has potential to backfire. And KP has potential to simply not mesh with Thibs the same way Bogs, who on paper fits this roster perfectly, is having trouble doing.
KP can rim protect and he's not soft but he's not a bull in the paint like all of our big men are and our identity requires.
DLeethal wrote:nycericanguy wrote:martin wrote:nycericanguy wrote:martin wrote:nycericanguy wrote:C is also upgradable but because we value defense and rim protection there arent many C's that can do both. KP was really the only one that fit that criteria and we didn't seem interested for whatever odd reason.So SG seems like the best position to upgrade and easiest as you can get away with a dropoff in defense there.
Prob stuck to your reasoning of too injury prone.
but we went after OG who has played even fewer games the past 5 seasons so that doesn't compute for me.
I mean it's all about price and fit. Our C depth is great, could have easily withstood 20-25 missed games from KP. And of course he was dirt cheap.
But trading RJ & IQ makes it hard to withstand those missed games from OG.
Could you imagine
KP
Randle
OG
DDV
Brunson
Now that team could have low key won it all and of course BOS wouldn't have been as formidable.
This FO has been great, but the Obi pick, the CAM trade, and not going after KP are 3 things I still can't wrap my head around.
That's on you, there are PLENTY of really easy reasons you keep purposely ignoring.
You put KP and OG into the same category of injury and that's insane.
we're very likely to watch BOS win the chip this year, with Tatum even saying KP was the missing piece for them.
This FO has largely done a great job, but I'm not going to blindly support everything they do/dont do.
KP going to our division rival BOS for #35 pick and Tyus Jones, after openly stating he would love to come back to NY, while we sat on a boatload of assets was a massive fail that some just don't want to acknowledge for some reason.
The CAM trade was largely inconsequential, but the Obi pick... KP... that's franchise altering.
Knicks identity is largely formed by their C duo. It's not a given that KP makes us better than the Mitch/iHart tandem. We beat the crap out of teams and dominate the offensive boards. That's what we do, and how we win. That goes a way to a large degree by adding a skinny 3 point shooting C.
When I watch BOS their spacing is incredible now.
We've seen what replacing RJ with OG spacing wise has done, can you imagine a C that draws out the opposing big man 30 feet out? I actually heard a crazy stat that KP's AVERAGE 3pt made distance is 27 feet, 4 feet out from the 3pt line. You have opposing bigs having to guard him close to halfcourt.
anyone this got derailed, my main point was SG is the easiest spot to upgrade.
nycericanguy wrote:DLeethal wrote:nycericanguy wrote:martin wrote:nycericanguy wrote:martin wrote:nycericanguy wrote:C is also upgradable but because we value defense and rim protection there arent many C's that can do both. KP was really the only one that fit that criteria and we didn't seem interested for whatever odd reason.So SG seems like the best position to upgrade and easiest as you can get away with a dropoff in defense there.
Prob stuck to your reasoning of too injury prone.
but we went after OG who has played even fewer games the past 5 seasons so that doesn't compute for me.
I mean it's all about price and fit. Our C depth is great, could have easily withstood 20-25 missed games from KP. And of course he was dirt cheap.
But trading RJ & IQ makes it hard to withstand those missed games from OG.
Could you imagine
KP
Randle
OG
DDV
Brunson
Now that team could have low key won it all and of course BOS wouldn't have been as formidable.
This FO has been great, but the Obi pick, the CAM trade, and not going after KP are 3 things I still can't wrap my head around.
That's on you, there are PLENTY of really easy reasons you keep purposely ignoring.
You put KP and OG into the same category of injury and that's insane.
we're very likely to watch BOS win the chip this year, with Tatum even saying KP was the missing piece for them.
This FO has largely done a great job, but I'm not going to blindly support everything they do/dont do.
KP going to our division rival BOS for #35 pick and Tyus Jones, after openly stating he would love to come back to NY, while we sat on a boatload of assets was a massive fail that some just don't want to acknowledge for some reason.
The CAM trade was largely inconsequential, but the Obi pick... KP... that's franchise altering.
Knicks identity is largely formed by their C duo. It's not a given that KP makes us better than the Mitch/iHart tandem. We beat the crap out of teams and dominate the offensive boards. That's what we do, and how we win. That goes a way to a large degree by adding a skinny 3 point shooting C.
When I watch BOS their spacing is incredible now.
We've seen what replacing RJ with OG spacing wise has done, can you imagine a C that draws out the opposing big man 30 feet out? I actually heard a crazy stat that KP's AVERAGE 3pt made distance is 27 feet, 4 feet out from the 3pt line. You have opposing bigs having to guard him close to halfcourt.
I agree on paper. But Thibs has shown that spacing is kind of a secondary philosophy to him behind power, force, rebounding etc. Bogs brings spacing too and can't really figure out how to help us. Adding KP would certainly take away from some of the things that make this team hum. It's not guaranteed to be a huge net positive.
I'm not really sure why we are talking about a trade from last year at this point though, at some point just move on and talk about current/recent events.
DLeethal wrote:nycericanguy wrote:DLeethal wrote:nycericanguy wrote:martin wrote:nycericanguy wrote:martin wrote:nycericanguy wrote:C is also upgradable but because we value defense and rim protection there arent many C's that can do both. KP was really the only one that fit that criteria and we didn't seem interested for whatever odd reason.So SG seems like the best position to upgrade and easiest as you can get away with a dropoff in defense there.
Prob stuck to your reasoning of too injury prone.
but we went after OG who has played even fewer games the past 5 seasons so that doesn't compute for me.
I mean it's all about price and fit. Our C depth is great, could have easily withstood 20-25 missed games from KP. And of course he was dirt cheap.
But trading RJ & IQ makes it hard to withstand those missed games from OG.
Could you imagine
KP
Randle
OG
DDV
Brunson
Now that team could have low key won it all and of course BOS wouldn't have been as formidable.
This FO has been great, but the Obi pick, the CAM trade, and not going after KP are 3 things I still can't wrap my head around.
That's on you, there are PLENTY of really easy reasons you keep purposely ignoring.
You put KP and OG into the same category of injury and that's insane.
we're very likely to watch BOS win the chip this year, with Tatum even saying KP was the missing piece for them.
This FO has largely done a great job, but I'm not going to blindly support everything they do/dont do.
KP going to our division rival BOS for #35 pick and Tyus Jones, after openly stating he would love to come back to NY, while we sat on a boatload of assets was a massive fail that some just don't want to acknowledge for some reason.
The CAM trade was largely inconsequential, but the Obi pick... KP... that's franchise altering.
Knicks identity is largely formed by their C duo. It's not a given that KP makes us better than the Mitch/iHart tandem. We beat the crap out of teams and dominate the offensive boards. That's what we do, and how we win. That goes a way to a large degree by adding a skinny 3 point shooting C.
When I watch BOS their spacing is incredible now.
We've seen what replacing RJ with OG spacing wise has done, can you imagine a C that draws out the opposing big man 30 feet out? I actually heard a crazy stat that KP's AVERAGE 3pt made distance is 27 feet, 4 feet out from the 3pt line. You have opposing bigs having to guard him close to halfcourt.
I agree on paper. But Thibs has shown that spacing is kind of a secondary philosophy to him behind power, force, rebounding etc. Bogs brings spacing too and can't really figure out how to help us. Adding KP would certainly take away from some of the things that make this team hum. It's not guaranteed to be a huge net positive.
I mean I think KP is more physical presence than Precious and Precious has earned Thibs trust because of his defense, rebounding and rim protection.
The reality is Mitch, Ihart... these guys are half a game players, and KP would have been a huge upgrade on both ends over Obi at the backup 4, so there was room for both.
nycericanguy wrote:DLeethal wrote:nycericanguy wrote:DLeethal wrote:nycericanguy wrote:martin wrote:nycericanguy wrote:martin wrote:nycericanguy wrote:C is also upgradable but because we value defense and rim protection there arent many C's that can do both. KP was really the only one that fit that criteria and we didn't seem interested for whatever odd reason.So SG seems like the best position to upgrade and easiest as you can get away with a dropoff in defense there.
Prob stuck to your reasoning of too injury prone.
but we went after OG who has played even fewer games the past 5 seasons so that doesn't compute for me.
I mean it's all about price and fit. Our C depth is great, could have easily withstood 20-25 missed games from KP. And of course he was dirt cheap.
But trading RJ & IQ makes it hard to withstand those missed games from OG.
Could you imagine
KP
Randle
OG
DDV
Brunson
Now that team could have low key won it all and of course BOS wouldn't have been as formidable.
This FO has been great, but the Obi pick, the CAM trade, and not going after KP are 3 things I still can't wrap my head around.
That's on you, there are PLENTY of really easy reasons you keep purposely ignoring.
You put KP and OG into the same category of injury and that's insane.
we're very likely to watch BOS win the chip this year, with Tatum even saying KP was the missing piece for them.
This FO has largely done a great job, but I'm not going to blindly support everything they do/dont do.
KP going to our division rival BOS for #35 pick and Tyus Jones, after openly stating he would love to come back to NY, while we sat on a boatload of assets was a massive fail that some just don't want to acknowledge for some reason.
The CAM trade was largely inconsequential, but the Obi pick... KP... that's franchise altering.
Knicks identity is largely formed by their C duo. It's not a given that KP makes us better than the Mitch/iHart tandem. We beat the crap out of teams and dominate the offensive boards. That's what we do, and how we win. That goes a way to a large degree by adding a skinny 3 point shooting C.
When I watch BOS their spacing is incredible now.
We've seen what replacing RJ with OG spacing wise has done, can you imagine a C that draws out the opposing big man 30 feet out? I actually heard a crazy stat that KP's AVERAGE 3pt made distance is 27 feet, 4 feet out from the 3pt line. You have opposing bigs having to guard him close to halfcourt.
I agree on paper. But Thibs has shown that spacing is kind of a secondary philosophy to him behind power, force, rebounding etc. Bogs brings spacing too and can't really figure out how to help us. Adding KP would certainly take away from some of the things that make this team hum. It's not guaranteed to be a huge net positive.
I mean I think KP is more physical presence than Precious and Precious has earned Thibs trust because of his defense, rebounding and rim protection.
The reality is Mitch, Ihart... these guys are half a game players, and KP would have been a huge upgrade on both ends over Obi at the backup 4, so there was room for both.
I would disagree on the first part. Precious is a banger. KP is a lanky rim protector. It's not really the same. But it's kind of a moot conversation to be had at this point.
DLeethal wrote:nycericanguy wrote:DLeethal wrote:nycericanguy wrote:DLeethal wrote:nycericanguy wrote:martin wrote:nycericanguy wrote:martin wrote:nycericanguy wrote:C is also upgradable but because we value defense and rim protection there arent many C's that can do both. KP was really the only one that fit that criteria and we didn't seem interested for whatever odd reason.So SG seems like the best position to upgrade and easiest as you can get away with a dropoff in defense there.
Prob stuck to your reasoning of too injury prone.
but we went after OG who has played even fewer games the past 5 seasons so that doesn't compute for me.
I mean it's all about price and fit. Our C depth is great, could have easily withstood 20-25 missed games from KP. And of course he was dirt cheap.
But trading RJ & IQ makes it hard to withstand those missed games from OG.
Could you imagine
KP
Randle
OG
DDV
Brunson
Now that team could have low key won it all and of course BOS wouldn't have been as formidable.
This FO has been great, but the Obi pick, the CAM trade, and not going after KP are 3 things I still can't wrap my head around.
That's on you, there are PLENTY of really easy reasons you keep purposely ignoring.
You put KP and OG into the same category of injury and that's insane.
we're very likely to watch BOS win the chip this year, with Tatum even saying KP was the missing piece for them.
This FO has largely done a great job, but I'm not going to blindly support everything they do/dont do.
KP going to our division rival BOS for #35 pick and Tyus Jones, after openly stating he would love to come back to NY, while we sat on a boatload of assets was a massive fail that some just don't want to acknowledge for some reason.
The CAM trade was largely inconsequential, but the Obi pick... KP... that's franchise altering.
Knicks identity is largely formed by their C duo. It's not a given that KP makes us better than the Mitch/iHart tandem. We beat the crap out of teams and dominate the offensive boards. That's what we do, and how we win. That goes a way to a large degree by adding a skinny 3 point shooting C.
When I watch BOS their spacing is incredible now.
We've seen what replacing RJ with OG spacing wise has done, can you imagine a C that draws out the opposing big man 30 feet out? I actually heard a crazy stat that KP's AVERAGE 3pt made distance is 27 feet, 4 feet out from the 3pt line. You have opposing bigs having to guard him close to halfcourt.
I agree on paper. But Thibs has shown that spacing is kind of a secondary philosophy to him behind power, force, rebounding etc. Bogs brings spacing too and can't really figure out how to help us. Adding KP would certainly take away from some of the things that make this team hum. It's not guaranteed to be a huge net positive.
I mean I think KP is more physical presence than Precious and Precious has earned Thibs trust because of his defense, rebounding and rim protection.
The reality is Mitch, Ihart... these guys are half a game players, and KP would have been a huge upgrade on both ends over Obi at the backup 4, so there was room for both.
I would disagree on the first part. Precious is a banger. KP is a lanky rim protector. It's not really the same. But it's kind of a moot conversation to be had at this point.
ultimately for the price it was a low risk/high reward worth taking, b/c if it works, the way it has for BOS, they essentially got a 3rd star for nothing and a chance to win it all.
F@#k KP. OG is the bee’s knees.
EwingsGlass wrote:KnickDanger wrote:F@#k KP. OG is the bee’s knees.
This.
And speaking of injury prone KP missed his 20th game tonight.
EwingsGlass wrote:KnickDanger wrote:F@#k KP. OG is the bees knees.
This.
F@#k KP and the horse Janis rode in on.
EwingsGlass wrote:KnickDanger wrote:F@#k KP. OG is the bee’s knees.
This.
Is it possible for Thibs to play OG at center vs. Boston?
JB- Holiday
DDV- White
Hart- Brown
Randle- Tatum
OG- KP
gradyandrew wrote:EwingsGlass wrote:KnickDanger wrote:F@#k KP. OG is the bee’s knees.
This.
Is it possible for Thibs to play OG at center vs. Boston?
JB- Holiday
DDV- White
Hart- Brown
Randle- Tatum
OG- KP
Probably a waste of OG. You could put Precious next to KP and get similar footwork, the same wingspan and would give KP a bit more work with his body strength on the block on offense. Make him move more too. Love this team now and think it’s going to be even better a year or two from now.
EwingsGlass wrote:gradyandrew wrote:EwingsGlass wrote:KnickDanger wrote:F@#k KP. OG is the bee’s knees.
This.
Is it possible for Thibs to play OG at center vs. Boston?
JB- Holiday
DDV- White
Hart- Brown
Randle- Tatum
OG- KP
Probably a waste of OG. You could put Precious next to KP and get similar footwork, the same wingspan and would give KP a bit more work with his body strength on the block on offense. Make him move more too. Love this team now and think it’s going to be even better a year or two from now.
Remember Mitchell in his rookie year leading the league in blocked 3's? I wonder if he still has that in him if he's healthy and matched up?with KP. I see where you're coming from. I just don't know who Randle guards if OG is on Tatum. Maybe Jrue Holiday?
martin wrote:Like it
It’s a really good concept. OG, and to a lesser extent Achiuwa, provide this value, which is why it was the perfect trade.
Knixkik wrote:martin wrote:Like it
It’s a really good concept. OG, and to a lesser extent Achiuwa, provide this value, which is why it was the perfect trade.
Fancy way to say "chemistry?" I'm all for it!
